The Hard Skills

Tuesday, April 23, 2024
Facebook Live Video from 2024/04/23 - Strategically Designing A Career That Matters: A Lifetime Toolkit

Facebook Live Video from 2024/04/23 - Strategically Designing A Career That Matters: A Lifetime Toolkit


2024/04/23 - Strategically Designing A Career That Matters: A Lifetime Toolkit

[NEW EPISODE] Strategically Designing A Career That Matters: A Lifetime Toolkit

Tuesdays 5:00pm - 6:00pm (EDT)                              


Listeners will get a roadmap for how to face any career decision and make choices that support them and their stakeholders throughout the course of their lifetime. We’ll also cover practical tips for what to do when there are competing things that matter to you and your stakeholders, and how to resolve those conflicts in the best way possible.

Have you faced a really difficult career decision and found it challenging to figure out which path to take? If so, this is the episode for you. Our guest, Dr. Sharon Hull, will offer a roadmap she has successfully used with hundreds of clients for how to think through what matters most and how to use that information to intentionally design your career. By focusing on what matters most to you in any given season of your life, you make room for the personal to come into harmony with the professional, and can maximize career satisfaction for that season. Being able to approach career decisions in a dynamic and personal-value-driven way allows flexibility and empowers people to make the best choices for them at any given moment. 

Sharon K. Hull MD, MPH, author of the upcoming book, Professional Careers by Design™: A Handbook for the Bespoke Life [Fall 2024], is a professional executive and leadership coach since 2011 has been a family physician for over 30 years and is dually board certified in both family medicine and in general preventive medicine and public health. Her clinical and academic medicine career spans roles in solo rural private practice, academic and organizational practice, and administrative leadership as a member of the Dean’s staff, an active teaching faculty member, a clinical division chief and a department chair. Sharon is also the founder of Metta Solutions, which offers professionals the tools they need to achieve a balanced life with authenticity, integrity and purpose.

#mettasolutions #ProfessionalCareersbyDesign #careerdevelopment #professionaldevelopment 

Tune in for this empowering conversation at

Show Notes

Segment  1

Dr. Mira Brancu introduced Sharon K. Hull, MD, MPH, the author of the upcoming book “Professional Careers by Design”. Sharon conveyed that during her career search, she realized the importance of receiving guidance and making intentional decisions aligned with her passions. She emphasized that her book aims to provide support for individuals who require courage to enact changes in their careers. Sharon highlighted common challenges people face, such as timing dilemmas when considering whether to remain in or depart from a company, and the journey toward finding peace in their career paths.

Segment 2

Sharon underscored the importance of courage, grounding, and clarity in career decision-making, which are central themes in her book. She emphasized the need to have a sense of direction and to be open to recognizing milestones in one's career journey, from the initial entry into a position through to retirement or transitioning to a new company. This includes navigating mid-career challenges and considering external factors beyond the workplace that may influence career choices.

Segment 3

Sharon discussed her method for creating a list to break through obstacles and achieve balance between personal and professional priorities. By listing these aspects, individuals can gain a fresh perspective. She also suggested involving loved ones in this process to foster reconciliation and strengthen relationships. Furthermore, she encouraged identifying priorities in one's own life, within their family, and within their organization.

Segment 4

In concluding the podcast episode, Sharon stressed that individuals aren't confined to a single career path and that they have the power to make intentional choices. Mira provided the availability of resources, including where to access Sharon’s book and join her book club.


00:00:34.300 --> 00:00:41.600 Mira Brancu: Ever faced a really difficult career decision and found it challenging to figure out which path to take.

00:00:42.400 --> 00:00:45.639 Mira Brancu: Is it happening to you right now, if so.

00:00:45.890 --> 00:00:48.060 Mira Brancu: this is the right episode for you.

00:00:48.170 --> 00:00:59.079 Mira Brancu: or are you a coach, a mentor, a supervisor, looking for a great book, recommendation, and some ideas for your own clients or employees who are doing some career soul searching.

00:00:59.200 --> 00:01:01.669 Mira Brancu: This is also the episode for that.

00:01:01.910 --> 00:01:05.019 Mira Brancu: while the good news is that there are more

00:01:05.069 --> 00:01:08.469 Mira Brancu: options for career paths than ever before.

00:01:09.390 --> 00:01:10.930 Mira Brancu: which is really nice.

00:01:11.263 --> 00:01:40.719 Mira Brancu: For us in this day and age, career, decision making has also become more challenging than ever before. As a result, we have so many internal and external competing priorities between what we want or think we want, or what we think we are supposed to do, or should do what our loved ones say about that? What our stakeholders at work say about that. All of those kinds of things. It makes it really difficult. So that's what we're really talking about today. With Dr. Sharon Hall, so

00:01:41.020 --> 00:01:43.279 Mira Brancu: welcome to the hard skills show

00:01:43.360 --> 00:01:48.270 Mira Brancu: where we discuss how to develop the most nuanced and challenging soft skills

00:01:48.480 --> 00:01:53.379 Mira Brancu: needed to drive significant systemic change and make a real impact through your leadership

00:01:53.550 --> 00:01:55.930 Mira Brancu: and your leadership and career development.

00:01:56.360 --> 00:02:10.120 Mira Brancu: I'm your host, Dr. Mirabu, and today's guest is Dr. Sharon Hall, who was a family physician for over 30 years, duly board, certified in family medicine and general preventative medicine and public health

00:02:10.520 --> 00:02:17.370 Mira Brancu: was an academic medicine, clinical and research faculty member had multiple leadership roles in academic medicine at universities.

00:02:17.520 --> 00:02:24.980 Mira Brancu: had a rural private practice at 1 point, and has been a professional executive and leadership coach since 2,011

00:02:25.230 --> 00:02:26.999 Mira Brancu: before it was cool.

00:02:27.060 --> 00:02:32.000 Mira Brancu: right? Ultimately founding her company, Meta Solutions.

00:02:32.270 --> 00:02:41.809 Mira Brancu: She recently authored the upcoming book, professional Careers by design, a handbook for the bespoke life. Yes, I do have it.

00:02:41.950 --> 00:02:44.359 Mira Brancu: It's all tagged up already.

00:02:44.370 --> 00:02:56.580 Mira Brancu: I love it. So today she's going to be sharing with us how to design a career that's meaningful to you, how to reconcile those competing internal and external priorities and expectations.

00:02:56.620 --> 00:03:00.699 Mira Brancu: And so really great topic for Seasons three's 3,

00:03:00.720 --> 00:03:05.029 Mira Brancu: which is a focus on mapping, a leadership and career strategy for yourself.

00:03:05.410 --> 00:03:06.220 Mira Brancu: Now

00:03:06.730 --> 00:03:11.990 Mira Brancu: I have had the chance to read this advanced copy right next to me, and I have to tell you

00:03:12.476 --> 00:03:16.130 Mira Brancu: you should all know be by now I'm skeptical

00:03:16.270 --> 00:03:23.210 Mira Brancu: of career and coaching self-help books because so many of them skim the surface and are so basic.

00:03:23.240 --> 00:03:27.509 Mira Brancu: But this one, I have to say is really good. I mean.

00:03:27.630 --> 00:03:31.769 Mira Brancu: I'm not surprised. Sharon does high level work, but still

00:03:31.790 --> 00:03:50.949 Mira Brancu: it's super comprehensive. It's not just about decision making about whether to stay or go. It's got stuff in it about search firms and negotiating tactics and communicating when you're leaving, and when you're entering onboarding offboarding stages, ages, seasonal transition experiences readiness for various professional levels and stages.

00:03:51.150 --> 00:03:53.989 Mira Brancu: It is a complete handbook plus a workbook.

00:03:54.280 --> 00:03:56.210 Mira Brancu: So be ready.

00:03:56.750 --> 00:03:59.940 Mira Brancu: Take notes. I always do reflect deeply

00:04:00.100 --> 00:04:07.910 Mira Brancu: and be ready to identify at least one small step to further develop your hard skills muscles when it comes to career development.

00:04:08.200 --> 00:04:10.100 Mira Brancu: Great to have you on the show, Sharon.

00:04:10.630 --> 00:04:14.578 Sharon Hull: Oh, Mira, after that introduction and that music that I wanted to dance to.

00:04:14.860 --> 00:04:15.820 Mira Brancu: What a delay!

00:04:15.820 --> 00:04:18.430 Sharon Hull: Light to be with you. Thank you for

00:04:18.510 --> 00:04:24.090 Sharon Hull: being a great champion for my work, and I'm delighted to be here and talk with your you and your audience.

00:04:24.540 --> 00:04:29.500 Mira Brancu: Absolutely absolutely. So let's let's start on something a little bit light.

00:04:30.820 --> 00:04:40.380 Mira Brancu: Was there a career detour? You weren't expecting or designing intentionally for yourself, and if so, what was it? And it could be good or bad.

00:04:42.190 --> 00:04:55.759 Sharon Hull: well, if, as I listen to describe my career, I thought, there have been a lot of sort of flight of the bumblebee decisions, and I have a lot of clients who tell me I don't know how I got here. I just went where the current took me.

00:04:56.660 --> 00:05:01.039 Sharon Hull: I don't think that's exactly what happened to me. I did come to a place where I got intentional.

00:05:01.200 --> 00:05:04.270 Sharon Hull: but there were a couple of times when

00:05:04.290 --> 00:05:08.780 Sharon Hull: I was learning to be intentional. That life sort of surprised me.

00:05:09.100 --> 00:05:16.969 Sharon Hull: and one of them was when a mentor of mine, and I'm going to name him in case he happens to drop by and hear this. Podcast

00:05:16.990 --> 00:05:22.210 Sharon Hull: Dr. Jerry Cruz is now the dean of my school of Medicine at Southern Illinois University.

00:05:22.440 --> 00:05:26.449 Sharon Hull: Jerry was my department chair at the time, and

00:05:26.920 --> 00:05:28.959 Sharon Hull: I was early in my career

00:05:29.040 --> 00:05:31.080 Sharon Hull: when he met me the first time.

00:05:31.300 --> 00:05:35.790 Sharon Hull: he said, what does your heart want to do more than anything.

00:05:36.780 --> 00:05:40.439 Sharon Hull: It was one of the most powerful questions anybody asked me

00:05:41.230 --> 00:05:42.110 Sharon Hull: ever

00:05:42.520 --> 00:05:49.269 Sharon Hull: what happened as a result of that is, he and I had a conversation that began with his career in family medicine and public health.

00:05:49.610 --> 00:05:58.779 Sharon Hull: and led to my deciding to pursue public health as a way to have a greater impact than just being a one on one physician. And I don't say just

00:05:58.800 --> 00:06:03.239 Sharon Hull: lightly, but that was a very positive thing, just from one

00:06:03.530 --> 00:06:07.270 Sharon Hull: really good mentoring question that somebody asked me. So

00:06:07.410 --> 00:06:08.499 Sharon Hull: that's my best answer.

00:06:08.500 --> 00:06:09.110 Mira Brancu: Added.

00:06:09.500 --> 00:06:12.099 Mira Brancu: that is really, really powerful.

00:06:12.680 --> 00:06:16.955 Mira Brancu: And it's making me recall

00:06:18.490 --> 00:06:25.280 Mira Brancu: a colleague of ours. I'll be okay with sharing her name, Kathy Siders who

00:06:26.338 --> 00:06:42.449 Mira Brancu: planted a a seed well before it was ready to bloom just yet when I was getting, you know, leadership coaching very early in my career. And you know. She looked at my assessment results and listened to me. And she said.

00:06:42.890 --> 00:06:55.440 Mira Brancu: Have you ever thought about executive coaching someday, being an executive coach, and I was like, what is that? Besides what you are doing with me right now. I don't know anything about it. But that

00:06:55.790 --> 00:07:06.270 Mira Brancu: see just continued to grow over time. As I began to realize that some of the things that I was most interested in in developing other people.

00:07:06.320 --> 00:07:12.590 Mira Brancu: We're related to that. And well, here, you here, here we are doing that

00:07:13.070 --> 00:07:15.080 Mira Brancu: right. So so.

00:07:15.080 --> 00:07:20.969 Sharon Hull: Without saying much more. I I know Kathy, and I joke with her that she is persistent like water on rock.

00:07:21.370 --> 00:07:26.027 Sharon Hull: It's gentle, but it's effective.

00:07:27.890 --> 00:07:34.870 Mira Brancu: So now that you're you've been working with clients for quite a while since 2,011. I didn't even realize it's been that

00:07:35.230 --> 00:07:46.520 Mira Brancu: you know long for for you as a coach. What are you seeing now? More than ever as common challenges among your clients when it comes to career decision making.

00:07:48.670 --> 00:07:52.340 Sharon Hull: It's a really good question, and I will say that

00:07:52.910 --> 00:07:56.200 Sharon Hull: the predictable answer is that a lot changed with Covid?

00:07:56.320 --> 00:08:00.470 Sharon Hull: And I do think that's true, but I think it was underway before then.

00:08:00.830 --> 00:08:08.130 Sharon Hull: I think some of the generational shifts about how people look at work and what the commitment is for work.

00:08:08.796 --> 00:08:15.569 Sharon Hull: Have been coming, I think, Covid and the pandemic and the changes to the work world that that brought

00:08:15.960 --> 00:08:20.230 Sharon Hull: accelerated what was already underway, which is that people are

00:08:20.530 --> 00:08:24.780 Sharon Hull: asking more of their work than just a paycheck.

00:08:25.340 --> 00:08:27.340 Sharon Hull: It either has meaning

00:08:27.500 --> 00:08:29.650 Sharon Hull: and gives them a path to grow.

00:08:30.090 --> 00:08:32.549 Sharon Hull: or they look for something that does.

00:08:32.940 --> 00:08:34.010 Sharon Hull: And

00:08:35.549 --> 00:08:42.840 Sharon Hull: sometimes I look at myself. And when when the younger folks say, Oh, Boomer, or Okay, boomer, I'm the boomer.

00:08:42.880 --> 00:08:48.890 Sharon Hull: But they're right about some of this right. They're, I think, healthier in their approach to work.

00:08:49.120 --> 00:08:54.369 Sharon Hull: and I think we can learn a lot from them. So the the things that I'm seeing

00:08:54.560 --> 00:08:58.139 Sharon Hull: are that people are making decisions more frequently

00:08:58.310 --> 00:09:00.289 Sharon Hull: because they're willing to be more mobile.

00:09:01.330 --> 00:09:02.300 Sharon Hull: And

00:09:02.690 --> 00:09:07.369 Sharon Hull: sometimes the work world hasn't caught up with that shift

00:09:07.900 --> 00:09:16.619 Sharon Hull: right. There are some organizations, some firms that really want to get on board with what I think of as the new world of work.

00:09:17.100 --> 00:09:20.759 Sharon Hull: And there are some who aren't ready to do that, and I think there is attention

00:09:20.780 --> 00:09:28.280 Sharon Hull: for a lot of the clients I talk with about. They're ready to to think about things differently. And maybe they're in an organization that isn't.

00:09:29.100 --> 00:09:33.340 Sharon Hull: Or maybe they see people around them making decisions. And they're like.

00:09:33.510 --> 00:09:37.579 Sharon Hull: I want to do this this way, but it takes courage, and I don't know how.

00:09:38.270 --> 00:09:41.399 Sharon Hull: So those are the people that I wrote this book for

00:09:41.450 --> 00:09:44.570 Sharon Hull: the people who have the courage and the people who want the courage.

00:09:46.320 --> 00:09:48.680 Mira Brancu: Yeah, and

00:09:49.250 --> 00:09:51.012 Mira Brancu: along those lines,

00:09:52.010 --> 00:09:56.640 Mira Brancu: how or where are they getting stuck? So let's say they have the courage

00:09:56.910 --> 00:10:00.270 Mira Brancu: right? Where? Where might they get stuck?

00:10:02.730 --> 00:10:03.120 Sharon Hull: So

00:10:03.490 --> 00:10:09.110 Sharon Hull: one of the common things I see is people trying to decide when it's time to look

00:10:09.740 --> 00:10:12.320 Sharon Hull: and when it is time, how do I get started?

00:10:12.770 --> 00:10:18.989 Sharon Hull: Some of my clients who are in my generation say, I haven't looked for a job for 20 years. I don't know how to do this anymore.

00:10:19.350 --> 00:10:24.070 Sharon Hull: And some of the people who are younger and probably wiser than me

00:10:24.220 --> 00:10:25.210 Sharon Hull: say.

00:10:25.660 --> 00:10:34.619 Sharon Hull: I know I need to look. But how long do I need to stay in one place so that it looks right on my resume, so that the timing is one of the places people get stuck.

00:10:35.270 --> 00:10:39.229 Sharon Hull: One of the other places that people get stuck is.

00:10:40.200 --> 00:10:44.590 Sharon Hull: I know I need to do something different, or I want to do something different.

00:10:44.820 --> 00:10:49.300 Sharon Hull: But my life is requiring that I stay put. Maybe I have

00:10:49.370 --> 00:10:54.169 Sharon Hull: children in Junior High, and I don't want to move till they're out of high school, or

00:10:54.180 --> 00:10:58.930 Sharon Hull: I need to stay in this job because it pays college tuition for my my

00:10:59.250 --> 00:11:02.710 Sharon Hull: child, and I don't want to give that up, or I have caretaking

00:11:02.790 --> 00:11:04.779 Sharon Hull: responsibilities for my family.

00:11:05.320 --> 00:11:09.389 Sharon Hull: Those kinds of competing personal demands

00:11:09.450 --> 00:11:12.130 Sharon Hull: are the things I see a lot of people trying to resolve.

00:11:13.550 --> 00:11:15.910 Mira Brancu: Yeah, absolutely. And

00:11:16.280 --> 00:11:17.960 Mira Brancu: I think timing

00:11:18.880 --> 00:11:21.075 Mira Brancu: is interacts with.

00:11:24.280 --> 00:11:28.134 Mira Brancu: the personal demands right? Like they might be ready. But

00:11:29.600 --> 00:11:34.689 Mira Brancu: personal demands are are making it difficult or just doesn't make sense like if

00:11:35.118 --> 00:11:36.631 Mira Brancu: I remember one time

00:11:37.420 --> 00:11:40.699 Mira Brancu: you know, being offered a really high level leadership role

00:11:40.730 --> 00:11:45.220 Mira Brancu: and saying, I can't uproot my family for this. We're not moving, you know.

00:11:45.220 --> 00:11:45.670 Sharon Hull: Feet.

00:11:46.030 --> 00:11:46.420 Sharon Hull: Yes.

00:11:46.420 --> 00:11:49.110 Mira Brancu: And I was perfectly okay with that at that time.

00:11:50.291 --> 00:11:59.070 Mira Brancu: Maybe it would have been a different decision. Different time, you know. Whatever. But those are really hard decisions to make. But.

00:11:59.070 --> 00:11:59.440 Sharon Hull: Yes.

00:11:59.440 --> 00:12:03.669 Mira Brancu: You know, in my situation I was so resolute about that one thing

00:12:03.690 --> 00:12:06.869 Mira Brancu: that I was not going to approve my family, that

00:12:06.950 --> 00:12:17.769 Mira Brancu: it made the decision much easier once I was clear on that, on those things. Right? So I'm curious for you like what helps people get unstuck like those kinds of things.

00:12:20.030 --> 00:12:22.660 Sharon Hull: Clarity. The thing that you just brought up

00:12:22.800 --> 00:12:23.700 Sharon Hull: is

00:12:23.950 --> 00:12:29.570 Sharon Hull: what helps you can stand firm in a courageous decision about your life.

00:12:29.890 --> 00:12:33.010 Sharon Hull: If you're absolutely clear as to why you're making it.

00:12:33.070 --> 00:12:39.649 Sharon Hull: And a similar. And I don't wanna make this an episode all about our collective stories between you and me. But

00:12:39.840 --> 00:12:46.029 Sharon Hull: I have a time when I said no to applying for a high level job. At a university and

00:12:46.653 --> 00:12:53.750 Sharon Hull: there was a lot of pressure because everybody thought that I had come to that institution to apply for that job when it became available.

00:12:54.220 --> 00:12:56.110 Sharon Hull: and when I chose not to

00:12:57.640 --> 00:13:01.049 Sharon Hull: the leadership, sent the chair at a search committee to talk to me.

00:13:01.530 --> 00:13:05.400 Sharon Hull: Who said, Are you absolutely sure you don't want to apply?

00:13:06.090 --> 00:13:08.690 Sharon Hull: And we had this conversation? I was clear.

00:13:08.870 --> 00:13:13.360 Sharon Hull: and then he said, I want you to come and talk to the search committee about what's needed for this role.

00:13:13.600 --> 00:13:22.729 Sharon Hull: So I agreed relatively, naively, and I sat before the entire 20 Person search committee, and they said, Are you absolutely sure

00:13:22.990 --> 00:13:25.240 Sharon Hull: you don't want to apply for this job?

00:13:26.770 --> 00:13:34.940 Sharon Hull: And I had to? I in the moment had to say, Okay, you've you've made a clear decision. What are you gonna say to these high level people?

00:13:35.400 --> 00:13:39.580 Sharon Hull: And I remember saying to them. I am at peace with my decision.

00:13:41.200 --> 00:13:45.579 Sharon Hull: and that's what I think people are looking for is enough clarity to be a piece.

00:13:46.360 --> 00:13:47.450 Mira Brancu: Umhm, sure.

00:13:48.500 --> 00:13:50.800 Sharon Hull: Even if it's counterintuitive, right?

00:13:51.020 --> 00:13:55.209 Sharon Hull: I've made a lot of counterintuitive decisions about my career.

00:13:55.440 --> 00:14:00.230 Sharon Hull: And on some level. This book is without being about my story.

00:14:01.560 --> 00:14:08.410 Sharon Hull: If you know me, you can read between the lines and see that it's how I came to make those counterintuitive decisions.

00:14:09.140 --> 00:14:09.740 Mira Brancu: Yeah.

00:14:10.600 --> 00:14:13.220 Mira Brancu: we are reaching an ad break.

00:14:13.450 --> 00:14:17.670 Mira Brancu: So we're leaving people to sit with.

00:14:17.800 --> 00:14:20.480 Mira Brancu: What might it take to feel at peace

00:14:20.630 --> 00:14:46.439 Mira Brancu: with my decision. And then when we come back from the ad break, we'll get into some frameworks for how to get there right? So you're listening to the hard skills with me, Dr. Mira Branco and our guest, Dr. Sharon Hall. We air on Tuesdays at 5 Pm. Eastern. If you'd like to join our online audience and ask any questions you can. You can find us at Linkedin or at Youtube, at talk radio, Nyc, and we'll be right back with our guest in just a moment.

00:16:58.720 --> 00:17:05.199 Mira Brancu: Welcome back to the hard skills with me, Dr. Mira Broncou and our guest today, Dr. Sharon Hall.

00:17:05.760 --> 00:17:15.680 Mira Brancu: and we just got done talking about why people might get stuck with career decision making and kind of where it's coming from. And

00:17:15.720 --> 00:17:25.359 Mira Brancu: you know some of the most common challenges are, how do I even get started looking for opportunities or my next steps? Especially if I haven't done this for a long time?

00:17:25.430 --> 00:17:26.125 Mira Brancu: And

00:17:26.980 --> 00:17:28.660 Mira Brancu: Is it the right time.

00:17:29.021 --> 00:17:32.039 Mira Brancu: What will it take to help me feel at peace

00:17:32.330 --> 00:17:34.210 Mira Brancu: within any decision

00:17:34.220 --> 00:17:43.324 Mira Brancu: right? Which I really love? Thinking about like that's the end goal. The end goal in the decision making process is, what will it take to help me feel at peace? So

00:17:43.700 --> 00:17:50.299 Mira Brancu: One of the things that I really found interesting in your book is that you applied a design thinking framework.

00:17:50.911 --> 00:18:00.390 Mira Brancu: Why did you choose to decide to include a design thinking framework? What is it for people who don't know what that is? How does it help?

00:18:06.630 --> 00:18:08.030 Mira Brancu: And you're you're on mute.

00:18:08.180 --> 00:18:08.880 Mira Brancu: Sorry.

00:18:10.630 --> 00:18:12.970 Sharon Hull: My apologies. I am.

00:18:13.230 --> 00:18:25.010 Sharon Hull: I have done podcast before, but it doesn't necessarily show today. Thanks for putting up with that. So I chose this framework because it gives people permission to experiment.

00:18:25.580 --> 00:18:30.430 Sharon Hull: at least in their mind, before they have to execute right.

00:18:30.560 --> 00:18:31.390 Sharon Hull: And

00:18:31.530 --> 00:18:34.599 Sharon Hull: the idea behind design thinking is that you

00:18:34.620 --> 00:18:37.010 Sharon Hull: put together an idea.

00:18:37.950 --> 00:18:40.180 Sharon Hull: You try it.

00:18:40.340 --> 00:18:41.870 Sharon Hull: You learn from

00:18:41.910 --> 00:18:43.200 Sharon Hull: the trying.

00:18:43.420 --> 00:18:48.179 Sharon Hull: and you iterate and get better with the idea of what you're creating.

00:18:48.630 --> 00:18:53.509 Sharon Hull: Now. It's kind of hard to keep iterating in real time in your career.

00:18:53.880 --> 00:18:55.910 Sharon Hull: But the idea that you could

00:18:56.470 --> 00:18:57.760 Sharon Hull: imagine

00:18:57.830 --> 00:19:00.299 Sharon Hull: an iterative process for your career

00:19:00.380 --> 00:19:06.230 Sharon Hull: try on an idea with a trusted colleague or an advisor like a coach like you did with Kathy.

00:19:07.230 --> 00:19:09.970 Sharon Hull: or that you could even think

00:19:10.120 --> 00:19:12.439 Sharon Hull: radically outside the box

00:19:12.660 --> 00:19:13.720 Sharon Hull: for what

00:19:14.170 --> 00:19:17.019 Sharon Hull: really might light you up, light your brain up.

00:19:17.970 --> 00:19:19.610 Sharon Hull: try it mentally.

00:19:20.110 --> 00:19:26.490 Sharon Hull: and then figure out whether you want to try it in real life. That's how I came to use design thinking. And for me

00:19:26.690 --> 00:19:31.949 Sharon Hull: it's probably the core of the book is that we get to experiment with our lives

00:19:32.890 --> 00:19:36.860 Sharon Hull: if we are courageous. And if we are grounded and have clarity.

00:19:37.930 --> 00:19:39.039 Sharon Hull: yeah. So I.

00:19:39.040 --> 00:19:41.570 Mira Brancu: I think a lot of people come to

00:19:42.728 --> 00:19:46.619 Mira Brancu: their career decision making process and

00:19:46.800 --> 00:19:48.559 Mira Brancu: go to coaching.

00:19:48.920 --> 00:19:53.619 Mira Brancu: seeking a very specific path like there's there's there must be a clear answer.

00:19:53.990 --> 00:19:58.749 Mira Brancu: and I just I'm missing what that answer is right, and I think the

00:19:58.840 --> 00:20:00.170 Mira Brancu: design, thinking

00:20:01.069 --> 00:20:06.820 Mira Brancu: gives them permission. If you're willing to. It gives you permission to

00:20:07.490 --> 00:20:10.020 Mira Brancu: Say, I don't have to have all the answers.

00:20:10.080 --> 00:20:12.380 Mira Brancu: I just need to know what my next step is

00:20:12.900 --> 00:20:15.790 Mira Brancu: yeah, to try something. What? That something would be.

00:20:16.650 --> 00:20:17.940 Sharon Hull: That very nice.

00:20:17.940 --> 00:20:24.820 Mira Brancu: Right like hopefully, that would be liberating for people. But, like you ha! You have to be okay with

00:20:25.960 --> 00:20:26.590 Mira Brancu: that might. So.

00:20:26.590 --> 00:20:36.930 Sharon Hull: Well, I think you're right, and that brings up an important point. Not all the clients I coach about careers want to be this iterative or experimental.

00:20:37.040 --> 00:20:40.490 Sharon Hull: and for them they need to know what's the next thing I need to do.

00:20:41.200 --> 00:20:48.000 Sharon Hull: And that's part of the reason there is kind of this handbook for how to do a search. And that's that's tactical information.

00:20:48.040 --> 00:20:50.670 Sharon Hull: You know where you want to go.

00:20:50.990 --> 00:20:53.260 Sharon Hull: and you just need to know how to get there.

00:20:53.460 --> 00:20:54.400 Sharon Hull: That's

00:20:55.210 --> 00:20:56.150 Sharon Hull: for you.

00:20:56.690 --> 00:21:01.319 Sharon Hull: I think people come to different places in their career at different seasons.

00:21:01.380 --> 00:21:04.240 Sharon Hull: So sometimes people come in there, they just need the

00:21:04.270 --> 00:21:06.840 Sharon Hull: the nuts and bolts of how do I do this?

00:21:07.430 --> 00:21:11.749 Sharon Hull: Sometimes they go. Okay, I'm really ready to rethink what I'm doing

00:21:11.780 --> 00:21:14.560 Sharon Hull: for them. The discernment part of the book

00:21:14.750 --> 00:21:22.719 Sharon Hull: was appropriate, and sometimes and I see this more commonly on the front end of a career with trainees or very young people in a profession.

00:21:23.140 --> 00:21:28.710 Sharon Hull: and with people who are ready to close out a chapter of their professional life in how, whatever fashion

00:21:28.770 --> 00:21:31.270 Sharon Hull: they're the ones who want to see the big picture

00:21:31.500 --> 00:21:41.399 Sharon Hull: and that section of the book that talks about the life course of a career from trainee through what I call the capstone. I don't call it retirement, because it's not for everybody.

00:21:41.840 --> 00:21:47.600 Sharon Hull: Sometimes there are seasons where we want to see that big picture. Say, where am I on this roadmap?

00:21:48.380 --> 00:21:51.160 Sharon Hull: And sometimes we just need to see. How do I get to the next step?

00:21:52.830 --> 00:21:58.010 Mira Brancu: Yeah, can you describe that life course of a career? I think people would be really interested in

00:21:58.070 --> 00:22:05.360 Mira Brancu: hearing and thinking like listeners. Just think about. Use this to think about like, where am I right now? And what does that mean for my next step.

00:22:06.860 --> 00:22:14.170 Sharon Hull: So this is a framework that comes from I won't go into the academic basis for. But there is one

00:22:14.220 --> 00:22:28.149 Sharon Hull: about how humans organize their lives, and we have different seasons in our lives and at different seasons. We have different things to learn you. If you're a parent or you have been around, young children, you'll know that they have to learn to walk

00:22:28.390 --> 00:22:35.490 Sharon Hull: and to say a few words, and then put sentences together, and then tie their shoes, and we're doing all this to get them ready to go out into the world.

00:22:36.450 --> 00:22:43.280 Sharon Hull: Well, as a family physician, we had this chart where you knew what the milestones were through about age 18.

00:22:44.240 --> 00:22:48.389 Sharon Hull: What I've done in this section is to say, what are the milestones for adults

00:22:49.330 --> 00:22:52.429 Sharon Hull: around work, and I've set out.

00:22:53.420 --> 00:22:54.210 Sharon Hull: Really

00:22:55.140 --> 00:22:56.940 Sharon Hull: several stages

00:22:56.990 --> 00:23:04.739 Sharon Hull: that I think we all go through. And it's not linear. We go through one and we go back and say I didn't learn how to do that. I gotta figure that out before I move forward.

00:23:05.020 --> 00:23:11.799 Sharon Hull: And I wanted to give a framework of what are the primary learnings. What is it like tying your shoe as a child

00:23:11.940 --> 00:23:15.309 Sharon Hull: that you need to learn when you're brand new in a career?

00:23:15.610 --> 00:23:17.929 Sharon Hull: What do you need to learn at mid-career.

00:23:18.300 --> 00:23:21.849 Sharon Hull: and if you've been thinking about that all the way along

00:23:22.370 --> 00:23:27.550 Sharon Hull: the capstone, whether it's retirement or planning an encore career or something else.

00:23:27.780 --> 00:23:32.100 Sharon Hull: comes naturally, and we don't have to be afraid of it. So my real goal

00:23:32.270 --> 00:23:45.210 Sharon Hull: is to get that model into the hands of people as early in their careers as possible, so that each stage they kind of have a sense of. Yeah. Other people have walked this path, and I can, too. And I don't have to be afraid. I can be really

00:23:45.500 --> 00:23:46.450 Sharon Hull: intentional

00:23:46.670 --> 00:23:47.819 Sharon Hull: going forward.

00:23:48.990 --> 00:23:51.190 Sharon Hull: I'm not sure I answer the question you asked.

00:23:51.680 --> 00:23:56.740 Mira Brancu: Yeah are, are each how are each stages tied

00:23:56.910 --> 00:23:58.190 Mira Brancu: to

00:23:58.360 --> 00:24:01.980 Mira Brancu: seasons or phases or experiences in people's lives?

00:24:03.640 --> 00:24:05.040 Sharon Hull: So I

00:24:05.480 --> 00:24:12.130 Sharon Hull: in a generic fashion, and this doesn't apply explicitly to everybody. Everybody will have their own nuances.

00:24:12.440 --> 00:24:13.200 Sharon Hull: But.

00:24:13.360 --> 00:24:17.799 Sharon Hull: for example, a new person in a profession has been through their training.

00:24:18.060 --> 00:24:25.449 Sharon Hull: They've been given some sort of certification or impromador from some organization. They're ready to be in that profession.

00:24:26.310 --> 00:24:34.349 Sharon Hull: but they've never done it except as a training, and they have to learn how to actually be the person responsible, not just the student.

00:24:34.960 --> 00:24:39.839 Sharon Hull: And if they're trying to take their first job at the place that train them.

00:24:40.300 --> 00:24:44.529 Sharon Hull: They have to sort of differentiate from the people that train them and be seen as

00:24:45.800 --> 00:24:49.569 Sharon Hull: an adult and not a trainee. So that's one example.

00:24:50.469 --> 00:24:54.330 Sharon Hull: Mid career is fraught with a lot of seasonality.

00:24:54.460 --> 00:24:59.839 Sharon Hull: Sometimes it's different for men and women not always. But whenever children come along

00:25:00.080 --> 00:25:02.899 Sharon Hull: in a person's life, man or woman.

00:25:03.070 --> 00:25:05.100 Sharon Hull: it changes. What

00:25:05.820 --> 00:25:06.920 Sharon Hull: matters.

00:25:07.710 --> 00:25:11.649 Sharon Hull: and it brings them back to what really is important to me right now.

00:25:11.890 --> 00:25:14.619 Sharon Hull: I had a woman once tell me that

00:25:16.240 --> 00:25:19.679 Sharon Hull: she wasn't sure what mattered, but her kids were really upset.

00:25:20.760 --> 00:25:23.910 Sharon Hull: and I said, What if you ask them what mattered to them.

00:25:25.100 --> 00:25:28.410 Sharon Hull: She went home and asked them, and

00:25:28.550 --> 00:25:31.070 Sharon Hull: for one of her children she just wanted

00:25:31.350 --> 00:25:33.210 Sharon Hull: the daughter wonder that

00:25:33.370 --> 00:25:38.449 Sharon Hull: a weekly lunch with Mom, and that was that would take care of what was upsetting her.

00:25:39.980 --> 00:25:42.460 Sharon Hull: The other child said, Mom.

00:25:42.940 --> 00:25:48.440 Sharon Hull: one day a week, I want to not be the last person picked up after school.

00:25:50.670 --> 00:25:56.599 Sharon Hull: and she said, when he told me that my heart broke, but I realized I could fix it.

00:25:57.510 --> 00:26:00.150 Sharon Hull: That's those are examples of mid-career.

00:26:00.340 --> 00:26:02.560 Sharon Hull: What matters? Questions?

00:26:03.360 --> 00:26:14.749 Sharon Hull: Other examples are learning to say yes and no. I have a friend who's a coach, who says you have to learn to say No, with a period so that you can say yes with an exclamation point.

00:26:15.330 --> 00:26:20.359 Sharon Hull: and I think in the heart of our careers learning how to parse that out is an example.

00:26:20.370 --> 00:26:21.350 Sharon Hull: something that

00:26:22.190 --> 00:26:23.440 Sharon Hull: it's kind of seasonal.

00:26:24.220 --> 00:26:24.640 Mira Brancu: Yeah.

00:26:24.640 --> 00:26:26.450 Sharon Hull: I could go on, but I probably.

00:26:26.450 --> 00:26:28.857 Mira Brancu: Yeah, no, I and and

00:26:29.750 --> 00:26:32.339 Mira Brancu: the most common

00:26:33.310 --> 00:26:38.639 Mira Brancu: challenges I often see with people who come to me because I work so much on

00:26:38.720 --> 00:26:48.849 Mira Brancu: the intersection of identity and leadership. Development is mid career. Women who have gotten so good

00:26:49.020 --> 00:26:50.100 Mira Brancu: at

00:26:50.180 --> 00:26:54.369 Mira Brancu: understanding the needs of all the people around them that

00:26:54.973 --> 00:27:08.770 Mira Brancu: they serve and and been socialized to serve others and nurture others in various ways. That they've gotten lost in what do I want. What do I need? Where am I going? I've gotten everybody else

00:27:08.800 --> 00:27:17.779 Mira Brancu: to get to where they need to go and want to go. I'm really good at understanding what other people in need and want, and how to help them get there. But what about me?

00:27:18.510 --> 00:27:21.710 Mira Brancu: And sort of reconnecting to?

00:27:21.930 --> 00:27:25.889 Mira Brancu: Where's my path? What is my path? What does that mean for me? Who am I?

00:27:26.472 --> 00:27:31.540 Mira Brancu: And you know I I really love that kind of work. Because

00:27:31.590 --> 00:27:32.776 Mira Brancu: it just

00:27:33.450 --> 00:27:37.269 Mira Brancu: helps people find themselves all over again in mid-career, you know.

00:27:38.730 --> 00:27:42.460 Mira Brancu: and then, and people don't talk about that like people talk about like adolescents

00:27:42.490 --> 00:27:47.781 Mira Brancu: and their identity development. Right? We never talk about mid career identity, development, redevelopment.

00:27:49.010 --> 00:27:58.460 Sharon Hull: Well, I think it happens at mid career. I think there's a phase that happens after training when you're sort of really jumping in, there's a phase that happens that you're talking about a mid career.

00:27:58.720 --> 00:28:06.990 Sharon Hull: and I work with a number of people who are trying to approach retirement. And all of us know, including those with physicians, that physicians don't do that very well.

00:28:07.400 --> 00:28:11.730 Sharon Hull: and there really is an identity development for people who are reaching

00:28:11.970 --> 00:28:13.790 Sharon Hull: a place where they want

00:28:13.900 --> 00:28:16.459 Sharon Hull: a portion of their career to be done.

00:28:18.400 --> 00:28:24.730 Sharon Hull: It's the reason I wrote that third section about developmental stages because they don't stop

00:28:24.960 --> 00:28:26.130 Sharon Hull: with children

00:28:26.300 --> 00:28:28.220 Sharon Hull: and we go through them.

00:28:28.240 --> 00:28:37.549 Sharon Hull: What you're describing for women leaders in mid-career is so common. And it's the reason I offer the 5 hip pocket questions.

00:28:38.420 --> 00:28:42.999 Sharon Hull: The one question that you can always come back to as a touchstone hit that

00:28:43.250 --> 00:28:47.820 Sharon Hull: it's what matters most to me personally and professionally.

00:28:48.050 --> 00:28:50.429 Sharon Hull: At this season

00:28:51.850 --> 00:28:57.399 Sharon Hull: we all come. If we go into professional training, it's such a long and arduous course for many of us

00:28:57.750 --> 00:29:01.540 Sharon Hull: that we think we can't get out or get off the train.

00:29:02.620 --> 00:29:05.180 Sharon Hull: and we forget that it is seasonal.

00:29:05.280 --> 00:29:09.410 Sharon Hull: and there are times when that first career choice really serves us.

00:29:09.800 --> 00:29:11.679 Sharon Hull: But there may come a point where it doesn't.

00:29:12.320 --> 00:29:26.070 Sharon Hull: and giving people permission and a structure and a framework to say what really does matter. I don't have to decide to delete my job. I don't have to uproot my family. I used to say, you know, what would you do if somebody offers you a job in Fiji?

00:29:26.470 --> 00:29:29.149 Sharon Hull: There was a time in my life when I would have jumped at that.

00:29:29.617 --> 00:29:32.489 Sharon Hull: I've never been to Fiji. It's on my lifeless. But

00:29:32.860 --> 00:29:41.459 Sharon Hull: I'm not sure I would jump it working in Fiji, and I'm not sure that there's much call, much Internet service to let me do my work there. But I could be wrong.

00:29:42.158 --> 00:29:48.970 Sharon Hull: But this is a season. We're probably not gonna go to a remote place to live a part of my life.

00:29:49.890 --> 00:29:55.039 Sharon Hull: There's a time when it might have fit, and I think this framework gives people the chance to say

00:29:55.230 --> 00:29:56.869 Sharon Hull: what's needed right now?

00:29:57.070 --> 00:29:58.079 Sharon Hull: Yeah, right now.

00:29:58.510 --> 00:30:25.000 Mira Brancu: So let's move into the ad break thinking about what matters most to you right now in this season, as your first question, and when we come back to after the ad break, we'll talk about those the rest of those hip pocket questions as Sharon reference them. You're listening to the hard skills with me, Dr. Mira Branco and our guest, Dr. Sharon Hall, and we'll be right back in just a moment.

00:32:27.190 --> 00:32:33.099 Mira Brancu: Welcome back to the hard skills with me, Dr. Mirabu and our guest today, Dr. Sharon Hall.

00:32:33.535 --> 00:32:46.300 Mira Brancu: Sharon, just started talking about for what she calls for hip pocket questions, the 5 questions you should be asking yourself at whenever you're thinking through a career decision making

00:32:46.330 --> 00:32:55.620 Mira Brancu: transition. And obviously the first one is what matters most to me. But she adds, right now, in this season I think a lot of people get wrapped up

00:32:55.630 --> 00:32:59.720 Mira Brancu: and like the big. What matters most to me like you're supposed to only have

00:32:59.820 --> 00:33:15.599 Mira Brancu: one thing that matters for your entire life, and that should be the guiding thing. But the reality is that our values interest needs all of those things change over time. So it's really important to think like right now, what do I need to be prioritizing and thinking about

00:33:16.495 --> 00:33:18.619 Mira Brancu: Sharon. What? What's next?

00:33:18.690 --> 00:33:21.470 Mira Brancu: What? Actually, before we go to what's next?

00:33:21.570 --> 00:33:25.760 Mira Brancu: I know a lot of people find this actually quite challenging to answer.

00:33:25.890 --> 00:33:27.889 Mira Brancu: what what do you think helps

00:33:27.910 --> 00:33:29.889 Mira Brancu: some folks get unstuck

00:33:29.900 --> 00:33:31.430 Mira Brancu: to get clarity around that.

00:33:32.770 --> 00:33:41.990 Sharon Hull: So there are 2 things I do to help folks not be afraid to answer the question first is, it's not one thing I ask them to make their top 10 list.

00:33:42.330 --> 00:33:44.440 Sharon Hull: And the second thing I say is.

00:33:44.720 --> 00:33:53.929 Sharon Hull: you must. The only rule is, you must include both personal and professional things in your top 10 list, but there's no right proportion.

00:33:54.810 --> 00:33:55.910 Sharon Hull: and so

00:33:56.570 --> 00:34:00.299 Sharon Hull: that they can get their heads around. It's like, Okay, if I can list 10 things

00:34:00.850 --> 00:34:02.780 Sharon Hull: I can. I don't have to

00:34:03.250 --> 00:34:08.364 Sharon Hull: hone in on one. It's not like a values exercise where we say this is the value that drives me

00:34:09.210 --> 00:34:10.960 Sharon Hull: when they come back.

00:34:11.120 --> 00:34:13.069 Sharon Hull: I asked them what surprised them.

00:34:13.620 --> 00:34:16.610 Sharon Hull: and almost invariably they tell me

00:34:16.699 --> 00:34:19.299 Sharon Hull: my top 7 were personal

00:34:19.560 --> 00:34:22.190 Sharon Hull: work didn't come up till the last 3.

00:34:22.570 --> 00:34:30.049 Sharon Hull: Occasionally somebody will be at a season in their career where work is top of mind, and those are the top things. Neither is wrong.

00:34:30.870 --> 00:34:38.099 Sharon Hull: but that opening it up to personal and professional, and giving yourself a chance to make a list is how I have people start.

00:34:38.780 --> 00:34:39.860 Mira Brancu: Absolutely and

00:34:41.760 --> 00:34:43.793 Mira Brancu: you know, just sort of

00:34:44.770 --> 00:34:48.370 Mira Brancu: I'm not doing this to do a shameless plug here for coaching, but

00:34:48.400 --> 00:34:50.870 Mira Brancu: the the one value here

00:34:51.040 --> 00:34:57.639 Mira Brancu: is when we talk about these things with our friends and family and people at work.

00:34:57.890 --> 00:35:01.220 Mira Brancu: they're the the response that they give you

00:35:01.640 --> 00:35:03.230 Mira Brancu: is from their

00:35:03.330 --> 00:35:08.030 Mira Brancu: what they value. Right? They're like. And so then you feel like

00:35:08.330 --> 00:35:11.550 Mira Brancu: the list you need to give them are the shoulds.

00:35:11.940 --> 00:35:18.490 Mira Brancu: or like speaking to their hopes and expectations of you. So so it complicates the picture.

00:35:18.500 --> 00:35:27.209 Mira Brancu: And when you see, when you talk with it, a more objective person who doesn't have a stake in the game. You're able to be a little bit more honest with yourself about those things.

00:35:27.880 --> 00:35:31.740 Sharon Hull: I think that is a role that the coach can play. If you have a coach.

00:35:31.800 --> 00:35:34.049 Sharon Hull: Is that neutral sounding board

00:35:34.080 --> 00:35:37.039 Sharon Hull: place where you can experiment with your thoughts

00:35:37.210 --> 00:35:43.629 Sharon Hull: without having to put them in action in the world, and without having to worry about who's going to be afraid of your thoughts

00:35:43.960 --> 00:35:44.500 Sharon Hull: right.

00:35:44.500 --> 00:35:48.290 Mira Brancu: Right, and you could also do that with a colleague who doesn't have a stake in the game right.

00:35:48.480 --> 00:35:53.829 Sharon Hull: Yes, it doesn't have to be a coach, but it is one of the things coaches do, and trusted friends can sometimes do that.

00:35:55.590 --> 00:35:57.640 Sharon Hull: I will say the second question.

00:35:58.110 --> 00:36:00.700 Sharon Hull: and it is second for a reason that it is

00:36:01.070 --> 00:36:06.880 Sharon Hull: who are my stakeholders? Who would care if I were gonna uproot my life and move to Fiji right?

00:36:07.320 --> 00:36:13.470 Sharon Hull: And what matters most to them? Answer that first question. You can't answer it for them.

00:36:13.570 --> 00:36:20.370 Sharon Hull: What I will often do with couples, or with people who have children of an age where they can handle the question.

00:36:21.180 --> 00:36:23.470 Sharon Hull: say, Give them, question one.

00:36:24.050 --> 00:36:27.840 Sharon Hull: and leave them alone. Do not compare, answers

00:36:27.940 --> 00:36:30.770 Sharon Hull: all of you. Do your top 10 list.

00:36:31.260 --> 00:36:32.629 Sharon Hull: and then have a meeting

00:36:33.000 --> 00:36:40.010 Sharon Hull: and say, what's on your top? 10 list? What's on yours? And how do we, as a unit, if it's family.

00:36:40.030 --> 00:36:41.200 Sharon Hull: reconcile that?

00:36:41.460 --> 00:36:42.560 Sharon Hull: I love it? Thanks for so.

00:36:42.560 --> 00:36:44.340 Mira Brancu: Love it also, because

00:36:47.570 --> 00:36:57.510 Mira Brancu: often, when you're seeing a coach like you, it's just like one on one. This is a way for you to access like, what is the system around you?

00:36:57.750 --> 00:37:05.775 Mira Brancu: Right? What's happening in the system around you and the pressures and the you know information that you need and speaking of

00:37:06.430 --> 00:37:16.430 Mira Brancu: stakeholders for those of you who are not sure what that means, or how to apply it in this context of for your decision making. Who should they be thinking about.

00:37:17.790 --> 00:37:27.199 Sharon Hull: I think there's the close in circle, and there's the broader public circle, and the close in circle is often a significant other. If there is one in the picture.

00:37:27.939 --> 00:37:34.390 Sharon Hull: Sometimes it's children, and parents usually know if their children can handle these questions and are ready for them.

00:37:36.420 --> 00:37:41.670 Sharon Hull: Stakeholders don't have to answer the question. So sometimes, if I'm caretaking my parents.

00:37:41.850 --> 00:37:52.370 Sharon Hull: my parents are stakeholders, but I may or may not go ask them what matters to them. But I'm thinking about what matters to me about them. Right? So there's stakeholders in that sense.

00:37:52.620 --> 00:38:00.099 Sharon Hull: There are also professional stakeholders. If I'm going to uproot myself. Who do I leave my work to?

00:38:00.660 --> 00:38:04.800 Sharon Hull: Who will carry on? What's the impact on the organization? If I go.

00:38:05.060 --> 00:38:08.789 Sharon Hull: or if I change roles and don't leave the organization. Just change roles.

00:38:09.200 --> 00:38:10.400 Sharon Hull: What happens.

00:38:10.660 --> 00:38:21.200 Sharon Hull: And those people can be stakeholders. Sometimes it's like, it doesn't matter what happens at my organization. I am going to go for good or ill, and

00:38:22.380 --> 00:38:28.500 Sharon Hull: they're kind of on their own. But most of us think about, and most women frankly, are acculturated to think about

00:38:28.850 --> 00:38:32.529 Sharon Hull: what's the impact of my decision on everybody around me?

00:38:32.800 --> 00:38:36.450 Sharon Hull: That's the reason the first question is, what matters most to me?

00:38:37.683 --> 00:38:48.279 Sharon Hull: Answer that. First, then think about your stakeholders. It's built to deal with that acculturation that many of us have not just women, but it is much more common.

00:38:49.470 --> 00:38:51.460 Mira Brancu: Love it? What's the third question.

00:38:51.780 --> 00:38:54.290 Sharon Hull: The third question is.

00:38:54.980 --> 00:38:57.539 Sharon Hull: what matters to the organization you're in?

00:38:58.060 --> 00:39:02.580 Sharon Hull: If you're working for somebody, what are your priorities? What is it? Value?

00:39:03.210 --> 00:39:06.779 Sharon Hull: What are their stated goals and their unstated goals?

00:39:07.170 --> 00:39:11.930 Sharon Hull: It's a way to say, well, I'll come to in a minute. Why, I ask it that way.

00:39:11.990 --> 00:39:20.710 Sharon Hull: But if you're thinking about changing organizations, you could ask those questions about the organization you're thinking about going to. Maybe you're interviewing.

00:39:20.920 --> 00:39:25.459 Sharon Hull: These are questions you want to know about the organization you're considering.

00:39:26.220 --> 00:39:27.160 Sharon Hull: So

00:39:27.510 --> 00:39:30.140 Sharon Hull: you start with what matters here to you?

00:39:30.400 --> 00:39:36.489 Sharon Hull: Then you go to your close in circle of stakeholders, and if you want the public facing stakeholders.

00:39:37.010 --> 00:39:41.430 Sharon Hull: and then, unless you work for yourself. And even if you do frankly.

00:39:41.550 --> 00:39:45.759 Sharon Hull: there's an organizational set of values and goals and priorities.

00:39:46.350 --> 00:39:51.459 Sharon Hull: and the idea is to look at all 3 sets of priorities and then ask question 4.

00:39:52.580 --> 00:39:54.479 Sharon Hull: Is there alignment

00:39:54.610 --> 00:39:56.949 Sharon Hull: between question, one for me

00:39:57.610 --> 00:39:59.989 Sharon Hull: and everybody else's priority.

00:40:01.570 --> 00:40:04.939 Sharon Hull: If there is good alignment, what do I want to do about that?

00:40:06.300 --> 00:40:09.429 Sharon Hull: And if there's not good alignment, what am I

00:40:09.590 --> 00:40:12.730 Sharon Hull: ready, willing, and able to do

00:40:13.480 --> 00:40:14.370 Sharon Hull: about it?

00:40:14.500 --> 00:40:15.869 Sharon Hull: Those are the 5 questions.

00:40:16.930 --> 00:40:20.560 Mira Brancu: That's fantastic. Yeah, it really considers

00:40:23.860 --> 00:40:29.059 Mira Brancu: the complexity that is probably happening inside of you. But you don't know how to tease it out

00:40:29.230 --> 00:40:34.320 Mira Brancu: until you realize, like there's not only my voice inside my head.

00:40:34.380 --> 00:40:36.249 Mira Brancu: there's lots of voices.

00:40:36.310 --> 00:40:41.369 Mira Brancu: and when I understand what those voices are, it will help me better understand?

00:40:43.160 --> 00:40:44.113 Mira Brancu: You know

00:40:45.330 --> 00:40:48.110 Mira Brancu: what, how how to think about like

00:40:48.220 --> 00:40:52.309 Mira Brancu: reconcile? If there, if I need to reconcile, where am I reconciling.

00:40:53.743 --> 00:41:05.056 Sharon Hull: And sometimes you do need to reconcile, and there is a conflict of of alignment that has to be dealt with. It might be personal. I have to take care of my parents. But I really have a dream job offer in Fiji.

00:41:05.470 --> 00:41:06.749 Sharon Hull: What am I gonna do?

00:41:06.860 --> 00:41:12.199 Sharon Hull: Or can I move my dog to Fiji, you know. Sometimes the the stakes are higher than others.

00:41:12.570 --> 00:41:19.110 Sharon Hull: Sometimes it's okay. We have 2 really good opportunities here, but they pull on different

00:41:19.630 --> 00:41:23.630 Sharon Hull: pieces. Of what matters? How do we reconcile that as a couple

00:41:24.880 --> 00:41:29.470 Sharon Hull: sometimes there is no conflict, and you're actually perfectly happy where you are.

00:41:29.950 --> 00:41:32.659 Sharon Hull: Then the question is, how do you thrive?

00:41:33.760 --> 00:41:35.210 Sharon Hull: What would help you

00:41:35.490 --> 00:41:39.229 Sharon Hull: thrive right where you are? And that's part of the

00:41:39.270 --> 00:41:45.310 Sharon Hull: conversation about staying versus going that I know you had some interest in talking about.

00:41:45.310 --> 00:41:52.440 Mira Brancu: Yes, let's talk about the state and go grid. I love this grid that you created. Share a little bit more about that.

00:41:53.090 --> 00:42:05.090 Sharon Hull: Sure. So I am trained in public health. So if there is an epidemiologist out there listening, this is a 2 by 2 table. Nobody else needs to care about what that means. But basically it's a a

00:42:05.140 --> 00:42:07.880 Sharon Hull: 2 rows and 2 columns table

00:42:08.270 --> 00:42:09.739 Sharon Hull: with 4 sections.

00:42:10.500 --> 00:42:15.929 Sharon Hull: stay and survive, go and survive, stay and thrive, go and thrive.

00:42:16.770 --> 00:42:23.010 Sharon Hull: And the question is, do I stay or go? And you have to say, am I surviving or thriving where I am.

00:42:24.010 --> 00:42:25.780 Sharon Hull: And which way do I want to move?

00:42:26.200 --> 00:42:32.089 Sharon Hull: Sometimes you're in survival mode, but you've got to stay and keep your head down and get through it.

00:42:32.890 --> 00:42:39.099 Sharon Hull: those depending on the level of toxicity those can be really tough situations to be in.

00:42:39.440 --> 00:42:45.979 Sharon Hull: Suppose you have great opportunities where you are and you're staying, but you want to move up the ladder, and you're looking for a way to thrive and learn something new.

00:42:47.200 --> 00:42:52.730 Sharon Hull: Sometimes things are really bad in those toxic situations, and you've got to go. Even if you're not ready.

00:42:53.200 --> 00:42:56.990 Sharon Hull: It's so bad you've got to get out. That's the go and survive Quadrant.

00:42:57.920 --> 00:42:59.640 Sharon Hull: Sometimes you have a great offer.

00:42:59.720 --> 00:43:05.140 Sharon Hull: and you have an opportunity to go somewhere else and thrive. You might not even have been looking for a job.

00:43:05.820 --> 00:43:10.729 Sharon Hull: But there's a thriving that you can see that is different than where you are.

00:43:11.060 --> 00:43:14.222 Sharon Hull: and that grid, and the way to think about it is

00:43:14.860 --> 00:43:17.249 Sharon Hull: Where am I? Which quadrant am I in?

00:43:17.500 --> 00:43:19.290 Sharon Hull: And which one do I want to move to?

00:43:19.910 --> 00:43:23.750 Sharon Hull: And then I ask my favorite question, which is, what's the very next action?

00:43:24.360 --> 00:43:26.819 Sharon Hull: Take not the 10 steps to get there.

00:43:27.600 --> 00:43:29.530 Sharon Hull: Start with the very next step.

00:43:29.890 --> 00:43:30.939 Sharon Hull: just one step.

00:43:31.240 --> 00:43:33.099 Sharon Hull: and that to me, is a

00:43:33.130 --> 00:43:37.909 Sharon Hull: key way to help people deal with the chaos these questions and often bring up.

00:43:38.020 --> 00:43:39.669 Sharon Hull: we get so overwhelmed.

00:43:40.250 --> 00:43:43.629 Sharon Hull: And that's why I bring people back to okay. Knowing what you now know.

00:43:44.070 --> 00:43:47.510 Sharon Hull: what is the very next action you need to take

00:43:48.530 --> 00:43:51.579 Sharon Hull: only one that you can do in the next week.

00:43:52.590 --> 00:43:54.320 Sharon Hull: It's a way to cut through that

00:43:55.260 --> 00:43:56.260 Sharon Hull: overwhelm.

00:43:57.380 --> 00:43:59.760 Mira Brancu: Yeah, I think that's really important, you know.

00:44:00.070 --> 00:44:02.240 Mira Brancu: especially because sometimes

00:44:02.420 --> 00:44:05.900 Mira Brancu: you do need to choose the stay and survive

00:44:05.990 --> 00:44:12.943 Mira Brancu: because of the timing aspect and values aspect that we talked about. For example, if you know if

00:44:13.470 --> 00:44:18.579 Mira Brancu: you're doing it because of very practical, you know, home life reasons.

00:44:18.965 --> 00:44:28.459 Mira Brancu: But that does not mean that you need to stay stuck. You can stay and survive and identify the very next step to keep moving towards

00:44:28.620 --> 00:44:33.239 Mira Brancu: what can happen over time to set yourself up for success when you're ready

00:44:33.510 --> 00:44:35.420 Mira Brancu: to go and thrive.

00:44:35.670 --> 00:44:36.360 Mira Brancu: Life.

00:44:36.360 --> 00:44:43.420 Sharon Hull: And you know yes, I see people who come to me during or after what I call a career trauma.

00:44:43.580 --> 00:44:48.330 Sharon Hull: something that happened that really survived that really surprised them, and that was painful.

00:44:48.740 --> 00:44:57.839 Sharon Hull: and they come in lots of forms. If you are in or have been through a career trauma, sometimes you don't want to just move within a day.

00:44:57.900 --> 00:44:58.940 Sharon Hull: You can't.

00:44:59.580 --> 00:45:06.130 Sharon Hull: So the first trick is, what does it take to survive and protect myself and and deal with my acute needs.

00:45:06.220 --> 00:45:09.669 Sharon Hull: And then what steps can I take to leave on my terms?

00:45:09.980 --> 00:45:16.619 Sharon Hull: And how? Where are the bright red lines that might make me have to be in that. Go and survive. I gotta get out of here. Mode.

00:45:17.190 --> 00:45:20.280 Sharon Hull: Yeah. Hopefully, the grid makes room for all of that.

00:45:21.110 --> 00:45:21.890 Sharon Hull: Hold on.

00:45:22.030 --> 00:45:25.270 Sharon Hull: And yeah, the truth is, most of us face

00:45:25.330 --> 00:45:29.700 Sharon Hull: all of those kinds of decisions over a lifetime in a professional career.

00:45:30.420 --> 00:45:31.180 Mira Brancu: Absolutely.

00:45:31.180 --> 00:45:31.560 Sharon Hull: So.

00:45:31.560 --> 00:45:41.700 Mira Brancu: So we're moving into an ad break and you're listening to the hard skills with me, Dr. Mayor Bronku and our guest, Dr. Sharon Hall. When we come back

00:45:41.790 --> 00:45:50.419 Mira Brancu: we'll pull all of this together. To identify maybe a few next steps for you to consider, so we'll be right back in just a moment.

00:47:56.680 --> 00:48:14.084 Mira Brancu: Welcome back to the hard skills with me. Dr. Mira Bronku and our guest, Dr. Sharon Hall. Sharon, has shared a lot of different kinds of ways to think about career decision making we've talked about the life cycle, the seasons, the

00:48:14.820 --> 00:48:18.737 Mira Brancu: app of the back pocket. How? What was it? Questions? The

00:48:19.390 --> 00:48:21.270 Sharon Hull: Pocket question, hip pocket.

00:48:21.270 --> 00:48:21.880 Mira Brancu: But don't.

00:48:21.880 --> 00:48:30.969 Sharon Hull: I know why I call them that. I call them that, because you keep those questions in your hip pocket all the time, and when an opportunity or a crisis comes up.

00:48:31.290 --> 00:48:33.449 Sharon Hull: or when your life changes.

00:48:33.490 --> 00:48:35.829 Sharon Hull: or when world events happen.

00:48:36.660 --> 00:48:39.420 Sharon Hull: pull them out of your hip pocket and just review them.

00:48:39.790 --> 00:48:40.230 Mira Brancu: Awesome.

00:48:40.230 --> 00:48:43.210 Sharon Hull: It's a good way to ground yourself with hip pocket questions.

00:48:43.210 --> 00:48:51.106 Mira Brancu: Pocket questions. Yes, so we the stay or go grid. You know we we've covered a lot of different kinds of tools.

00:48:51.650 --> 00:48:59.660 Mira Brancu: what would you like people to take away from today? Out of all the things that we talked about.

00:49:01.800 --> 00:49:06.670 Sharon Hull: I think I thought about this a lot. You asked me to think about it before we came together today.

00:49:07.010 --> 00:49:15.380 Sharon Hull: I think the core message is that we are not locked in to a path from one career decision.

00:49:16.200 --> 00:49:19.489 Sharon Hull: We can be intentional and choose

00:49:20.310 --> 00:49:28.400 Sharon Hull: almost all the time. Sometimes the choices aren't what we want to have, not the ideal choices, but we almost always have a choice.

00:49:29.170 --> 00:49:32.980 Sharon Hull: and the book that I've written is a way to navigate those choices

00:49:33.360 --> 00:49:35.430 Sharon Hull: and to help you think about them

00:49:35.820 --> 00:49:38.160 Sharon Hull: before you have to put them into action.

00:49:38.280 --> 00:49:42.529 Sharon Hull: So it's a model for managing your career over a lifetime.

00:49:43.270 --> 00:49:47.600 Sharon Hull: and that's what I hope people take away is that it is a lifetime dynamic process.

00:49:48.440 --> 00:49:51.079 Mira Brancu: It is, it is. And especially these days.

00:49:52.350 --> 00:49:54.930 Mira Brancu: people really do change.

00:49:55.150 --> 00:49:58.159 Mira Brancu: not just jobs, but careers.

00:49:58.160 --> 00:49:59.649 Sharon Hull: Viewers, yeah.

00:49:59.650 --> 00:50:13.819 Mira Brancu: Times. It's okay. That's you know. That's a that's a thing that we do now. And it can be quite scary. But it can be quite exciting as well, and this offers you a way to really think about it in a way that is maybe less scary.

00:50:15.090 --> 00:50:19.129 Sharon Hull: That's my goal is that things become less scary when we have

00:50:19.530 --> 00:50:25.519 Sharon Hull: a set of tools, a framework to think about it, and this is intended to be a framework of

00:50:25.820 --> 00:50:27.120 Sharon Hull: intentionality.

00:50:28.370 --> 00:50:39.649 Mira Brancu: Yeah. So let's let's talk about a a couple of resources that you'd like to share with people. I'm gonna share my screen for those of you who are sort of watching live or

00:50:40.004 --> 00:50:58.799 Mira Brancu: watching the recording later. I'll show you it while we're also talking through. So the first is just reminding you that the name of the book is professional ke careers by design, a handbook for the bespoke life by Sharon Hall, and you can find it right there on Amazon.

00:51:00.083 --> 00:51:02.500 Mira Brancu: The second is if

00:51:02.530 --> 00:51:09.659 Mira Brancu: tell. Tell us a little bit about the book club like not not everybody has a book club. You know, along with their book. Tell us a little bit about that.

00:51:10.730 --> 00:51:25.650 Sharon Hull: So. You'll notice the subtitle of the book is a handbook for the bespoke life that really means an intentionally created life, personally and professionally. And so I have created an online platform called the Bespoke Life. Community

00:51:25.880 --> 00:51:29.047 Sharon Hull: membership is free. And I think you have the

00:51:29.500 --> 00:51:35.629 Sharon Hull: web address that you can give people to go, explore, and decide if they want to join that community. I'd love to have you there.

00:51:35.720 --> 00:51:40.420 Sharon Hull: We have ongoing conversations about what it means to have an intentionally created life

00:51:40.710 --> 00:51:45.649 Sharon Hull: within that space. There is another free space that is dedicated as a book club

00:51:45.750 --> 00:51:49.770 Sharon Hull: for conversation about this book. Professional careers by design.

00:51:49.960 --> 00:51:51.800 Sharon Hull: and if you join the Book club.

00:51:52.140 --> 00:51:58.799 Sharon Hull: you have the ability to download every tool that is in the book in a Pdf format that you can work with.

00:51:59.090 --> 00:52:00.640 Sharon Hull: and if you do that.

00:52:00.650 --> 00:52:10.570 Sharon Hull: it really turns the book into a workbook. Now all the tools are printed in the book, but it's a 6 by 9 inch book. It's hard to read and work with those

00:52:10.740 --> 00:52:13.229 Sharon Hull: I want to make the Pdf.

00:52:13.720 --> 00:52:16.480 Sharon Hull: Versions available to people.

00:52:16.720 --> 00:52:18.410 Sharon Hull: And all of this is free.

00:52:18.730 --> 00:52:24.540 Sharon Hull: and I would like to invite everybody to join, first, the primary community, but second book club. Within there.

00:52:25.260 --> 00:52:38.529 Mira Brancu: That's awesome, and it's free. Did you hear that folks, probably for a limited time offer? So you better hop on if if you're just sort of listening, watching, just wanting to hop on members dot

00:52:38.540 --> 00:52:41.510 Mira Brancu: meta solutions. METT. A

00:52:41.520 --> 00:52:43.940 Mira Brancu:

00:52:44.657 --> 00:52:54.589 Mira Brancu: and if you're interested in more of Sharon's services Sharon. Share with us your meta information here. What what can they

00:52:55.860 --> 00:52:58.089 Mira Brancu: learn more about from you?

00:52:58.430 --> 00:53:03.590 Sharon Hull: Sure. So what you're showing them now is our primary website for the company Meta Meta solutions.

00:53:03.860 --> 00:53:07.349 Sharon Hull: And we do professional executive coaching

00:53:07.570 --> 00:53:11.239 Sharon Hull: for a variety of for people in a variety of professions.

00:53:11.310 --> 00:53:19.199 Sharon Hull: We do training and consulting around the things we've talked about today as well as other leadership skills, building and

00:53:19.300 --> 00:53:27.680 Sharon Hull: the other sort of passion topic for me is time and energy management. A lot of people think of it as work, life balance. But to me. It's about managing your time and energy.

00:53:28.110 --> 00:53:32.240 Sharon Hull: Those are our 3 kind of big areas leadership, coaching.

00:53:33.085 --> 00:53:33.840 Sharon Hull: career

00:53:33.950 --> 00:53:35.480 Sharon Hull: support and coaching

00:53:35.540 --> 00:53:41.559 Sharon Hull: and then consulting about time and energy management and the other 2 things.

00:53:41.710 --> 00:53:50.840 Sharon Hull: So all that is described on our website and be happy to have you drop by. There's also a page on the website for the book and all the ways you could get it.

00:53:50.870 --> 00:53:53.679 Sharon Hull: It is on pre-order till April thirtieth

00:53:53.800 --> 00:54:00.839 Sharon Hull: and April thirtieth. It goes live. So we're getting close. This is part of our launch effort, and thank you for helping me to do that.

00:54:00.840 --> 00:54:03.160 Mira Brancu: Absolutely excellent! How exciting!

00:54:03.200 --> 00:54:06.399 Mira Brancu: It's coming out in 2 weeks, folks, April thirtieth.

00:54:06.550 --> 00:54:11.069 Mira Brancu: as a reminder, April thirtieth, and you can preorder it now. So.

00:54:11.370 --> 00:54:19.380 Mira Brancu: audience listeners, what did you take away? And, more importantly, what is one small next step

00:54:19.640 --> 00:54:21.140 Mira Brancu: that you can take

00:54:21.320 --> 00:54:34.189 Mira Brancu: this week, based on what you learned from Sharon. Even if you're happy with where you are, how can you continually explore? Consider, prepare for future steps.

00:54:34.320 --> 00:54:42.549 Mira Brancu: share it with us on Linkedin, at Mira Bronku or Sharon Hall, and or at talk radio. Nyc, so we can cheer you on.

00:54:42.810 --> 00:54:52.820 Mira Brancu: We're also on Facebook, Instagram Twitter Twitch all over the place. But Linkedin is where I live. That's where she lives online. So that's where we'll respond.

00:54:52.950 --> 00:54:53.470 Mira Brancu: And.

00:54:53.470 --> 00:54:53.820 Sharon Hull: And I.

00:54:53.820 --> 00:54:54.140 Mira Brancu: Yeah.

00:54:54.140 --> 00:55:04.970 Sharon Hull: You'll find us. You'll find me at Meta solutions on Linkedin, not under my name and on Twitter, or now X at Meta solutions.

00:55:05.520 --> 00:55:15.930 Mira Brancu: Thank you. Great. So in addition to being a live show, we're also on apple podcasts, spotify.

00:55:16.010 --> 00:55:23.010 Mira Brancu: please go, subscribe to the podcast leave a review share with others to help us increase our visibility, reach and impact

00:55:23.370 --> 00:55:38.499 Mira Brancu: the stuff that we talk about on this show is part of our research based strategic leadership, pathway model that we teach in towerscope Leadership Academy, which is a private coaching and learning community for socially conscious leaders in healthcare, academia, tech and stem

00:55:38.830 --> 00:55:41.680 Mira Brancu: industries. Looking to make a greater impact.

00:55:41.900 --> 00:55:49.530 Mira Brancu: to learn more and apply. You can go to go, and click on Leadership Academy

00:55:49.890 --> 00:55:53.480 Mira Brancu: and thank you to Talkradio, dot Nyc. For hosting.

00:55:53.630 --> 00:55:58.679 Mira Brancu: I'm Dr. Mira Branco, your host of the Hard skill show. Thank you for joining us today.

00:55:58.980 --> 00:56:00.460 Mira Brancu: Dr. Sharon hall

00:56:00.580 --> 00:56:01.819 Mira Brancu: for being our guest.

00:56:02.690 --> 00:56:05.060 Sharon Hull: Thank you for the opportunity. It's been a pleasure.

00:56:05.540 --> 00:56:09.870 Mira Brancu: Absolutely, and have a great rest of your day listeners, wherever you're tuning in from

00:56:10.230 --> 00:56:11.000 Mira Brancu: bye all.

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