In this powerful conversation with behavioral psychologist and communication designer Anshar Seraphim, listeners will discover how connection and communication aren't just natural gifts—they're skills that can be learned and built with intention.
Anshar was 75% nonverbal as a child and had to reverse-engineer human communication from the ground up. Through his journey, he learned to turn autism from a barrier into a lens for understanding how we all connect, survive, and find joy.
Listeners will walk away with:
A deeper understanding of the real challenges people with autism face in communication and social connection
Practical strategies for overcoming feelings of disconnection and misunderstanding
Tools for creating emotional safety in conversations—whether you're neurodivergent or not
A fresh perspective on empathy, listening, and what it truly means to make someone feel heard
This episode is for anyone who has ever felt misunderstood, struggled to express themselves, or wants to build more authentic connections with the people around them. Anshar's story proves that with awareness and practice, we can all bridge the gap between silence and true understanding.
Have you ever felt misunderstood or struggled to connect with someone truly? In this deeply moving episode, Jacinta sits down with Anshar Seraphim—a man who was 75% nonverbal as a child and had to learn communication like a foreign language. What he discovered on that journey will change the way you think about connection forever. Anshar shares the real challenges people with autism face—from decoding laughter to understanding eye contact—and reveals how those same struggles taught him something powerful: that authentic connection isn't something we're born with, it's something we build. His story is a testament to resilience, and his insights offer practical wisdom for anyone who has ever felt like they're speaking but not being heard.
Whether you're navigating your own communication challenges, supporting someone with autism, or simply want to create deeper, more meaningful connections in your life, this conversation offers hope and clarity. Anshar breaks down how to create emotional safety in conversations, what real listening actually looks like, and why empathy is a skill we can all develop—not just a feeling we either have or don't. This isn't just a story about overcoming obstacles; it's a roadmap for building bridges between hearts and minds. Tune in for an episode that reminds us all: your voice matters, your experience is valid, and connection is always possible when we're willing to truly understand one another.
https://linqapp.com/anshar_seraphim
In this episode of Beneath the Calm, host Jacinta Yang introduces her guest, Anshar Seraphim, to share his story of living with autism and overcoming communication challenges. Anshar recounts being mostly nonverbal through childhood and only forming his first friendship at 25, describing how sensory issues, synesthesia, and language processing shaped his understanding of the world. He discusses misconceptions about autism, the diversity of experiences within the spectrum, and how society often misunderstands or stereotypes autistic individuals
The second segment begins with Jacinta speaking with Anshar about his journey with autism, from being mostly nonverbal as a child to becoming a clear and articulate communicator. Anshar explains how heightened sensory sensitivity and social challenges shaped his experiences, leading him to develop coping strategies like scripting speech and studying facial expressions. He also shares how self-acceptance, understanding the brain, and learning to communicate authentically helped him build meaningful connections and resilience.
Jacinta and Anshar dive into the challenges and beauty of communicating while living with autism. They explore how people experience listening, emotion, and connection in different ways — from closing one’s eyes to truly hear, to understanding that facial expressions don’t always tell the full story. Together, they remind us that real communication starts with honesty, empathy, and embracing our differences.
Jacinta and Anshar wrap up the episode by discussing the importance of community, mental health support, and resources like TEVA for non-speaking people, as well as Anshars' own project “Ask Anshar,” a tool that helps decode social interactions. Their heartfelt conversation highlights resilience, understanding, and the power of sharing stories to help others navigate life’s challenges.
00:00:36.130 --> 00:00:39.750 Jacinta Yang: Hello, and welcome to Beneath the Calm.
00:00:39.880 --> 00:00:43.930 Jacinta Yang: Thank you for joining us today, and the space.
00:00:44.460 --> 00:00:50.610 Jacinta Yang: was created… For all of us together to share a story.
00:00:50.830 --> 00:00:53.600 Jacinta Yang: And insights about life matters.
00:00:54.280 --> 00:01:02.419 Jacinta Yang: My name is Jacintha Yang, I'm the host of also podcast Self-Aware Soul.
00:01:02.570 --> 00:01:10.490 Jacinta Yang: And my YouTube channel, Jacinta Healing Arts, where I share content for personal and spiritual growth.
00:01:11.790 --> 00:01:15.429 Jacinta Yang: I offer healing journey services, so where…
00:01:15.720 --> 00:01:22.360 Jacinta Yang: I have… I help my clients with tools and insight to navigate through life.
00:01:23.020 --> 00:01:30.960 Jacinta Yang: Life itself, I think, is a school. There are so many people in the world that
00:01:31.530 --> 00:01:38.299 Jacinta Yang: Everyone has a different… Life struggle, challenges that we go through.
00:01:38.480 --> 00:01:45.639 Jacinta Yang: And it is very, very difficult for us to really understand everything and everyone.
00:01:45.960 --> 00:01:50.109 Jacinta Yang: And I think life is a continuous
00:01:50.590 --> 00:01:54.469 Jacinta Yang: learning, and, even though I've…
00:01:54.670 --> 00:01:57.479 Jacinta Yang: Work with clients and help them through.
00:01:57.650 --> 00:02:02.620 Jacinta Yang: many challenges. I still find I'm learning everything new.
00:02:03.190 --> 00:02:13.120 Jacinta Yang: And, it's just… Mind-boggling to know that there's so much that we can learn from life.
00:02:13.770 --> 00:02:16.730 Jacinta Yang: Every day, we learn something new.
00:02:17.220 --> 00:02:21.110 Jacinta Yang: And today, I've invited Anshar Serafim.
00:02:21.260 --> 00:02:26.179 Jacinta Yang: Our very special guest, and when I met him.
00:02:26.630 --> 00:02:29.540 Jacinta Yang: I knew there was so much he has.
00:02:30.060 --> 00:02:33.220 Jacinta Yang: to offer that I could learn from.
00:02:33.460 --> 00:02:37.010 Jacinta Yang: And I would like to introduce you.
00:02:37.370 --> 00:02:40.700 Jacinta Yang: To him, to share his story.
00:02:41.550 --> 00:02:46.310 Jacinta Yang: when I met Anshar, he… Told me that he…
00:02:47.250 --> 00:02:52.280 Jacinta Yang: Was not, verbal for 25 years.
00:02:52.500 --> 00:02:58.370 Jacinta Yang: But when I just… Hear him communicate, it is so hard to believe.
00:02:58.540 --> 00:03:05.150 Jacinta Yang: That someone who did not communicate for so many years of his life, It's communicating so well.
00:03:05.330 --> 00:03:13.149 Jacinta Yang: So, I'd like to introduce you to Anshar. Anshar, please, I'd like to thank you for joining
00:03:13.440 --> 00:03:16.030 Jacinta Yang: Joining us today, and…
00:03:16.220 --> 00:03:23.730 Jacinta Yang: being open to share your story. So, could you please tell us, about yourself? I'm gonna leave…
00:03:24.040 --> 00:03:25.779 Jacinta Yang: Leave it to you to share.
00:03:26.840 --> 00:03:33.840 Jacinta Yang: The challenges that you… Went through so that, people can learn
00:03:34.040 --> 00:03:39.160 Jacinta Yang: Where they're at the journey, and perhaps your story can…
00:03:39.610 --> 00:03:45.339 Jacinta Yang: help many of those people that may have a similar struggle. Anshar?
00:03:46.360 --> 00:03:48.429 Anshar Seraphim: Hi, thanks so much for having me.
00:03:48.860 --> 00:03:56.129 Anshar Seraphim: So, I… I was actually 75% or so nonverbal with autism until age 11.
00:03:56.330 --> 00:04:00.899 Anshar Seraphim: 25 years old was actually when I got my first friend.
00:04:01.300 --> 00:04:10.659 Anshar Seraphim: I used to watch social relationships from the outside, like an observer. I never thought that they would happen to me. That was my whole childhood.
00:04:10.790 --> 00:04:16.209 Anshar Seraphim: I had a lot of difficulty interacting with the other kids. I didn't have any siblings.
00:04:16.570 --> 00:04:29.340 Anshar Seraphim: My mother and my grandmother raised me, they, they were music teachers, so we had, like, 40 families a week in the, in the house, lots of… lots of people murdering songs on the violin, but I,
00:04:29.700 --> 00:04:37.070 Anshar Seraphim: I never really had the ability to relate to anyone. I always felt like I was from a different planet. I remember when I was…
00:04:37.220 --> 00:04:46.640 Anshar Seraphim: 8 years old or so, I got into trouble, because I was running around the school after the other kids trying to kiss them. I didn't understand human relationships. It was really confusing to me.
00:04:47.010 --> 00:05:00.379 Anshar Seraphim: And, there are a lot of challenges with, with autism, and there's a big spectrum, right? So it's… there's all kinds of different ways that it can manifest in different people's lives. It's a developmental disability.
00:05:00.690 --> 00:05:03.430 Anshar Seraphim: And, for some people.
00:05:03.690 --> 00:05:09.820 Anshar Seraphim: you know, who have higher support needs, you know, I consider myself lucky. You know, there are…
00:05:09.990 --> 00:05:18.040 Anshar Seraphim: physical disadvantages that can go along with the condition, and just because things are shared on certain genes. You know, like when I was born, I had
00:05:18.170 --> 00:05:31.970 Anshar Seraphim: one of my eyes turned all the way into my nose, like a really severe strabismus that I had to have corrected with surgery. I have, differences in my facial structure with the bones that are underneath, some other medical conditions that kind of go on the same gene, so…
00:05:32.180 --> 00:05:38.190 Anshar Seraphim: Those were their own challenges, but my biggest challenge was with connecting to other people.
00:05:38.670 --> 00:05:44.120 Anshar Seraphim: as I got older, I started to realize just how different I was from everyone.
00:05:44.270 --> 00:05:45.390 Anshar Seraphim: And
00:05:46.720 --> 00:05:59.020 Anshar Seraphim: In psychology, there's this interesting thing called the Sapier-Whorf hypothesis, this idea that the way that we acquire language changes the way that we think and process the world, or even experience time.
00:05:59.230 --> 00:06:06.610 Anshar Seraphim: And for me, Developing a relationship with the written word first, lexical first.
00:06:06.850 --> 00:06:12.179 Anshar Seraphim: And having aphantasia, meaning I don't have, like, a mental blackboard in my mind.
00:06:12.560 --> 00:06:21.239 Anshar Seraphim: I found myself processing my world in symbols and text, when I started to get better at speaking.
00:06:22.350 --> 00:06:36.940 Anshar Seraphim: It was because I was able to recognize two things. One of them was that my own voice was giving me sensory issues. My natural speaking voice is, like, an octave and a half lower than this. I had to learn how to speak in a different octave.
00:06:37.250 --> 00:06:39.530 Anshar Seraphim: And then, on top of that.
00:06:39.790 --> 00:06:45.390 Anshar Seraphim: You know, because that was sensory processing issues. You know, I have synesthesia, so when I hear…
00:06:45.500 --> 00:06:51.710 Anshar Seraphim: certain ranges and frequencies of sound, I feel it all over my entire body, my skin. It was one of the reasons I didn't get
00:06:51.840 --> 00:06:54.950 Anshar Seraphim: my driver's license until I was 37 years old.
00:06:56.610 --> 00:07:02.489 Anshar Seraphim: as I got older, you know, I came from that generation before we were passing out a diagnosis to kids.
00:07:02.820 --> 00:07:08.140 Anshar Seraphim: They weren't even diagnosing kids with ADHD when I was in school. You know, they only came out with
00:07:08.620 --> 00:07:15.379 Anshar Seraphim: Asperger's, which is, you know, kind of a legacy term now, because they've changed that and incorporated it into the spectrum in the DSM, but…
00:07:15.760 --> 00:07:20.310 Anshar Seraphim: They only came out with that 2 years before I graduated high school, so…
00:07:20.480 --> 00:07:25.739 Anshar Seraphim: By contrast, you know, because I got my diagnosis at 19 years old when I tried to join the military.
00:07:25.920 --> 00:07:29.820 Anshar Seraphim: Your average kid today gets diagnosed around 4 years old.
00:07:30.180 --> 00:07:35.560 Anshar Seraphim: So… You know, there's a… There's a lot of different…
00:07:36.560 --> 00:07:40.420 Anshar Seraphim: ways that autism can touch people's lives.
00:07:40.650 --> 00:07:44.170 Anshar Seraphim: And for me, as, like, a cognitive savant, I…
00:07:45.170 --> 00:07:49.909 Anshar Seraphim: I have to always kind of stand in awe, you know, as many challenges as I've had.
00:07:50.200 --> 00:07:58.780 Anshar Seraphim: Other people have way more challenges than me, and because my… my cognitive skills can sometimes attract attention.
00:07:59.030 --> 00:08:01.709 Anshar Seraphim: It's important to me to…
00:08:02.430 --> 00:08:13.959 Anshar Seraphim: kind of toss out that whole autism as a superpower idea. You know, there are those of us who can really excel at certain things because of the way that we process information, but
00:08:14.780 --> 00:08:23.839 Anshar Seraphim: You know, really, autism is about having challenges, and learning how to overcome those challenges, and learning how to accept and live with others.
00:08:24.010 --> 00:08:26.120 Anshar Seraphim: I think one of the things that
00:08:26.530 --> 00:08:29.249 Anshar Seraphim: Depressed me most after my diagnosis.
00:08:29.520 --> 00:08:34.099 Anshar Seraphim: Was the realization that Many of my symptoms…
00:08:34.380 --> 00:08:38.020 Anshar Seraphim: would be seen as character traits by other people. That…
00:08:38.299 --> 00:08:46.400 Anshar Seraphim: just like a person with ADHD, you know, might be unfairly called lazy, or disorganized, or impulsive,
00:08:46.540 --> 00:08:56.170 Anshar Seraphim: I had my own challenges with autism, and people would think that I didn't care, because I couldn't show empathy, on my face, or,
00:08:56.320 --> 00:08:59.990 Anshar Seraphim: that I was being dishonest with them, because I couldn't give them eye contact.
00:09:00.390 --> 00:09:10.550 Anshar Seraphim: And the list just goes on and on. You know, there's a lot of things that I can't do, and I think one of the things that surprises most people when they meet me is that I'm still mostly
00:09:10.750 --> 00:09:21.000 Anshar Seraphim: nonverbal in person. I can't handle all the sensory input and communicate, so the internet has provided kind of an interesting scaffold for me.
00:09:21.330 --> 00:09:29.840 Anshar Seraphim: To be able to interact with people, because I can… I mean, I've got a volume control for the world, it's right here on my headset. If the light's too bright, I can turn it down.
00:09:29.980 --> 00:09:31.550 Jacinta Yang: I can…
00:09:31.550 --> 00:09:33.040 Anshar Seraphim: create a system
00:09:33.220 --> 00:09:49.450 Anshar Seraphim: of expected sensory experiences so that I have the ability to cope, but it's taken a whole lot of work, and I still have a lot of work to do. You know, just like every other person, I have a lot of work to do on myself, so… I think that it's been a humbling experience, but…
00:09:49.710 --> 00:10:04.580 Anshar Seraphim: seeing the way that other people react, it's taught me a lot of really important lessons about mistakes that we all make, you know, when we're dealing with challenges or when we're interacting with other people. So, I hope that I have some insight that I can share.
00:10:05.450 --> 00:10:07.740 Jacinta Yang: I know we…
00:10:08.440 --> 00:10:24.219 Jacinta Yang: human has a tendency to make assumptions, okay? I don't know too much about autism, I just, I guess you can say I have, some friends, a friend that has a son
00:10:24.270 --> 00:10:32.749 Jacinta Yang: who's autistic, but I've not actually met him in person, and another friend whose son is autistic as well, but
00:10:33.220 --> 00:10:40.499 Jacinta Yang: I don't… I don't see that, you know, how it's portrayed on TV.
00:10:41.080 --> 00:10:50.029 Jacinta Yang: you know, some… when you see a TV show, how they portray some, people with autistic, condition.
00:10:52.590 --> 00:11:00.800 Jacinta Yang: Can you say, is that a… Correct projection of… what… autistic…
00:11:01.780 --> 00:11:10.309 Jacinta Yang: I guess when somebody who has autism, is that a correct projection that is shown on TV?
00:11:10.970 --> 00:11:20.330 Anshar Seraphim: Well, I mean, as recently as the 80s, you know, a lot of people, unless they had it directly affect their lives or touch a relative or something like that.
00:11:20.500 --> 00:11:32.889 Anshar Seraphim: there would be, like, common references to, to, like, Rain Man, Dustin Hoffman. And then, as things moved forward and people started to learn more about autism.
00:11:34.500 --> 00:11:47.320 Anshar Seraphim: certain autistic traits that people would notice would start getting written into characters, but it would often tokenize the people that they're trying to point it at.
00:11:47.820 --> 00:11:54.349 Anshar Seraphim: you know, an example might be Sheldon Cooper on The Big Bang Theory. Now, that would be an example of someone
00:11:54.450 --> 00:11:58.469 Anshar Seraphim: with lower support needs. And…
00:11:58.700 --> 00:12:05.710 Anshar Seraphim: they're kind of playing up that person's quirks, because it's a comedy show. You know, there is a… a vector of…
00:12:06.290 --> 00:12:08.579 Anshar Seraphim: How do we make things entertaining?
00:12:09.160 --> 00:12:11.139 Anshar Seraphim: And I get that, but…
00:12:11.270 --> 00:12:21.279 Anshar Seraphim: When most of the public doesn't inform themselves on disabilities, you know, there's always going to be a really big difference between the reality, you know, for people who actually have a disability.
00:12:21.390 --> 00:12:37.819 Anshar Seraphim: And what things look like on TV, whether you've got, you know, dwarfism, or you're in a wheelchair, or you're, you know, struggling with diabetes, or whatever, those things aren't really properly going to be represented unless
00:12:37.990 --> 00:12:43.899 Anshar Seraphim: It's, like a medical program, and maybe they're trying to have some interesting medical cases
00:12:44.110 --> 00:12:49.010 Anshar Seraphim: When you move into… more modern entertainment.
00:12:49.470 --> 00:12:54.360 Anshar Seraphim: You see series like The Good Doctor, or,
00:12:55.030 --> 00:12:58.509 Anshar Seraphim: you know, there's a… there's one on Netflix, I think, with a…
00:12:58.860 --> 00:13:02.169 Anshar Seraphim: with a guy who has a special interest in penguins.
00:13:02.780 --> 00:13:15.099 Anshar Seraphim: those can be representative of certain people on the spectrum, but you also have to consider that you're picking one color out of an entire rainbow. You know, that there are people out there that have
00:13:15.420 --> 00:13:23.030 Anshar Seraphim: Really, really significant challenges, and those aren't gonna be properly represented, because it's not entertaining.
00:13:23.160 --> 00:13:33.229 Anshar Seraphim: It's… it's just as not entertaining to watch a person have to deal with, you know, sores on a prosthetic leg, or, you know,
00:13:33.800 --> 00:13:46.579 Anshar Seraphim: what it's like to, to have your wheelchair break down in a public place when you don't have, you know, have a friend around. Those kinds of situations that people who actually have disabilities have to deal with on a regular basis.
00:13:46.960 --> 00:13:56.580 Anshar Seraphim: they're not things that people like to think about, so you're not going to get to see that peek behind the curtain. So I think that's one of the things that you're going to see in difference, you know, maybe after we,
00:13:56.830 --> 00:14:02.700 Anshar Seraphim: after we do our commercial break or whatever, we can go further into that, or I could talk a little bit more about what I've chosen to do with my career.
00:14:03.190 --> 00:14:04.000 Jacinta Yang: Okay.
00:14:04.200 --> 00:14:12.189 Jacinta Yang: So… Actually, what I'd like to ask you, are we time for a break now?
00:14:13.250 --> 00:14:17.559 Jacinta Yang: Okay, so we'll go on a break, and then we'll come back and ask you some more questions.
00:14:17.560 --> 00:14:18.409 Anshar Seraphim: Sure, of course.
00:16:04.720 --> 00:16:09.209 Jacinta Yang: Welcome back to Beneath the Calm. Thank you for joining us.
00:16:09.320 --> 00:16:21.879 Jacinta Yang: And I'm so grateful to, Anshar Sarafim for joining us today to share his story, on autism from non-verbal communication to fully.
00:16:22.140 --> 00:16:27.740 Jacinta Yang: communicating, I think, I would never have guessed That,
00:16:28.420 --> 00:16:34.840 Jacinta Yang: I'm sure never communicated for 25 years, just from…
00:16:34.960 --> 00:16:39.029 Jacinta Yang: Our first meeting. He's so articulate and…
00:16:39.220 --> 00:16:42.930 Jacinta Yang: In… in the topic that he's talk about.
00:16:43.130 --> 00:16:52.370 Jacinta Yang: and Unchart, you mentioned that you were diagnosed with autism at age 19, is that correct?
00:16:55.640 --> 00:17:01.139 Jacinta Yang: I… I don't have a lot of understanding about autism, which is why I…
00:17:01.370 --> 00:17:13.940 Jacinta Yang: I, I was happy to ask you to join so that I can learn a little bit more, and also our audience can learn more about, autism and
00:17:14.569 --> 00:17:16.839 Jacinta Yang: From what I understand,
00:17:17.250 --> 00:17:26.880 Jacinta Yang: When you, have autism, you are hyper-sensitive, like, sense… your senses are hyper… hyper, is that correct?
00:17:27.660 --> 00:17:30.110 Anshar Seraphim: Yeah, there is a…
00:17:30.910 --> 00:17:38.909 Anshar Seraphim: It's kind of like a volume control on your senses, and I would say that the volume is just set abnormally high.
00:17:39.090 --> 00:17:42.030 Anshar Seraphim: With autism, so much so that…
00:17:42.540 --> 00:17:47.310 Anshar Seraphim: Your sensitivity to different things, depending on what you're sensitive to.
00:17:47.450 --> 00:17:57.529 Anshar Seraphim: can be overwhelming. They can cause, you know, dysregulation, emotional dysregulation. You know, a lot of people with autism have meltdowns, I know I have.
00:17:57.830 --> 00:18:06.039 Anshar Seraphim: There's… there's those challenges. It's kind of like everything in your brain being connected involuntarily.
00:18:06.210 --> 00:18:12.950 Anshar Seraphim: So… There's a lot of, there's a lot of things that go on with the brain that… are…
00:18:15.070 --> 00:18:20.529 Anshar Seraphim: Automatically related to one another, whether or not you want them to be, and that can cause
00:18:20.990 --> 00:18:29.510 Anshar Seraphim: Strange association of, of topics, interesting differences in thinking,
00:18:30.260 --> 00:18:34.689 Anshar Seraphim: But also, the overwhelming nature of the world around you.
00:18:35.110 --> 00:18:37.249 Anshar Seraphim: Tends to make you go inward.
00:18:37.520 --> 00:18:45.920 Anshar Seraphim: And that is one of those things that… it's that inward focus that gives autism its name, you know, auto from the self.
00:18:46.070 --> 00:18:47.090 Anshar Seraphim: So…
00:18:47.370 --> 00:19:06.009 Anshar Seraphim: Yeah, you know, going to… trying to go to a restaurant and having to listen to all 13 conversations that are going on in the room at the same time, because your brain can't filter them, so it just sounds like a bunch of noise, feeling overwhelmed from anything from the texture of a fabric to the food that you're trying to eat.
00:19:06.360 --> 00:19:11.039 Anshar Seraphim: It can be really challenging, and those challenges vary for people that are on the spectrum.
00:19:11.720 --> 00:19:15.449 Jacinta Yang: So is it common across the board for,
00:19:15.590 --> 00:19:19.380 Jacinta Yang: People with autism to have that hypersensitivity.
00:19:19.850 --> 00:19:28.000 Anshar Seraphim: I would say that an increased sensitivity to things is one of the few things that you can count on when someone's on the spectrum.
00:19:28.040 --> 00:19:40.060 Anshar Seraphim: Because it can look so different for so many different people. You know, you have some comorbidities, too, because anywhere from 40 to 60% of people with autism also have ADHD.
00:19:40.110 --> 00:19:44.640 Anshar Seraphim: There's, there's some dopaminergic involvement there.
00:19:45.960 --> 00:19:50.979 Anshar Seraphim: You know, whether or not the symptoms of that problem. End up.
00:19:51.420 --> 00:20:04.089 Anshar Seraphim: taking the limelight away from some of the other challenges, or vice versa, it really depends on the individual person to help decide what it looks like. You know, people can be sensory avoidant, like I am.
00:20:04.280 --> 00:20:12.580 Anshar Seraphim: Or they can be sensory-seeking, you know, that intense desire for novelty and new stimulation from the ADHE brain.
00:20:12.730 --> 00:20:14.000 Anshar Seraphim: can end up…
00:20:14.400 --> 00:20:20.649 Anshar Seraphim: Leading people, you know, from one thing to another, and almost giving them a kind of,
00:20:20.980 --> 00:20:27.069 Anshar Seraphim: intense, focused extroversion, but only with that thing that's currently catching their focus, so…
00:20:27.240 --> 00:20:33.320 Anshar Seraphim: It's… it's gonna look so different, you know, and I think one of the reasons that they unified things the way that they did.
00:20:33.530 --> 00:20:41.459 Anshar Seraphim: on the, on the spectrum is to be able to give people more support and medical recognition, but I would argue that
00:20:41.860 --> 00:20:50.449 Anshar Seraphim: The condition itself probably needs to be subdivided into some smaller categories so that we have a little bit more focus for
00:20:50.570 --> 00:20:55.259 Anshar Seraphim: For treatment, and… I think one issue is because there is a…
00:20:55.550 --> 00:20:59.930 Anshar Seraphim: Social component, you know, where your symptoms are being seen as character traits.
00:21:00.630 --> 00:21:03.210 Anshar Seraphim: There is a desire for,
00:21:03.470 --> 00:21:22.249 Anshar Seraphim: For people on the spectrum to be able to kind of unify together, and to have a social identity, and that can sometimes be at ends with the, the kind of segregation that might need to happen to be able to address individual issues, because so many people found out
00:21:22.370 --> 00:21:40.580 Anshar Seraphim: from being diagnosed, you know, hey, all the stuff that I'm going through is actually very normal for this condition, and it's very validating. And separating medical diagnostics from social validation, you know, that's something that has to happen as a cultural process, because understanding that as a part of your identity is a process.
00:21:41.740 --> 00:21:54.550 Jacinta Yang: So, you mentioned that you found comfort, in being able to come online. That's your, way you can actually manage the, volume.
00:21:54.550 --> 00:21:55.550 Anshar Seraphim: I…
00:21:56.090 --> 00:22:07.839 Jacinta Yang: like, for me, I'm an empath, and I can feel and sense people's energies, pain, emotions.
00:22:08.180 --> 00:22:10.330 Jacinta Yang: Just as if it was my own.
00:22:10.710 --> 00:22:13.670 Jacinta Yang: And, like…
00:22:14.260 --> 00:22:27.040 Jacinta Yang: like you, I also find it overwhelming to be in a crowd with people, even though I may not be hypersensitive to touch, but I'm still sensitive
00:22:27.220 --> 00:22:31.080 Jacinta Yang: To the energy around me, right?
00:22:31.770 --> 00:22:35.200 Jacinta Yang: But yet, at the same time,
00:22:35.680 --> 00:22:38.860 Jacinta Yang: I can still feel things through…
00:22:39.530 --> 00:22:58.869 Jacinta Yang: the online. I can still feel the energy, but you find that that's, you… you're able to protect. I mean, I found my coping skills to protect myself from absorbing the energy. The other thing that I wanted to ask, I mean, this is something that…
00:22:59.120 --> 00:23:11.910 Jacinta Yang: I guess, can set us apart from other people that are not super sensitive to energy. And, of course, there are times growing up
00:23:12.070 --> 00:23:22.530 Jacinta Yang: People call you crazy, or something is wrong with you, right? Before understanding that, it's like, it used to… it used to feel hurtful.
00:23:22.840 --> 00:23:27.370 Jacinta Yang: But having a better understanding of who I am, and…
00:23:27.490 --> 00:23:36.600 Jacinta Yang: what I feel, what I sense, and having accepted that, right, I'm able to say, okay, tell me something I don't know, and somebody called me crazy.
00:23:36.950 --> 00:23:43.190 Jacinta Yang: So, in your journey, like, when you felt that you were different.
00:23:43.660 --> 00:23:47.849 Jacinta Yang: From, your peers in school.
00:23:48.860 --> 00:23:50.979 Jacinta Yang: What were your struggles?
00:23:53.960 --> 00:24:02.420 Anshar Seraphim: I mean… The social issues with autism are so strong, for me at least, that
00:24:02.710 --> 00:24:08.439 Anshar Seraphim: I would have difficulty speaking up, even if someone was standing on my foot. You know, the…
00:24:10.150 --> 00:24:14.049 Anshar Seraphim: The chasm between me and other people was just too far to cross.
00:24:14.400 --> 00:24:22.989 Anshar Seraphim: And, when I finally did get my diagnosis, when I went into the military, because, you know, wanted to try to get some autonomy and some direction for myself, and…
00:24:23.380 --> 00:24:30.020 Anshar Seraphim: Ended up having some of the same social problems I had earlier, but this time I had all that access to medical care and all of that, so…
00:24:30.280 --> 00:24:35.870 Anshar Seraphim: when I got that diagnosis, my first reaction was not empowering at all. I felt like…
00:24:36.240 --> 00:24:50.509 Anshar Seraphim: the things that I was working on and trying to move away from, it made me feel like those were challenges that I was going to be stuck with for my whole life. And part of having a disability, whether you lose a hand in an accident or you're born with a, you know, a difference.
00:24:50.810 --> 00:24:56.050 Anshar Seraphim: is starting to learn acceptance about that. You know, I have to accept that
00:24:56.290 --> 00:24:58.569 Anshar Seraphim: There are times that,
00:24:59.150 --> 00:25:04.039 Anshar Seraphim: Being in a friendship or a relationship with me is gonna take more energy from someone.
00:25:04.200 --> 00:25:08.410 Anshar Seraphim: And, I have to… choose people.
00:25:08.760 --> 00:25:15.329 Anshar Seraphim: Who understand that that's not my fault and don't point that frustration that's very valid for them to feel.
00:25:15.330 --> 00:25:16.120 Jacinta Yang: at me.
00:25:16.320 --> 00:25:22.599 Anshar Seraphim: Because our natural tendency when people frustrate us is to direct that energy at them.
00:25:22.890 --> 00:25:26.599 Anshar Seraphim: For being the source, but if that's beyond someone's control.
00:25:26.910 --> 00:25:35.769 Anshar Seraphim: You know, it's still a valid emotion, but it has to be processed differently, and not everyone's emotionally immature enough to do that, which means that that greatly narrows
00:25:36.150 --> 00:25:41.519 Anshar Seraphim: my ability to have friendships. You know, I have to choose a subsect of people that are able to handle that.
00:25:41.720 --> 00:25:46.980 Anshar Seraphim: There's… there's a lot of challenges, and I… for me.
00:25:47.130 --> 00:25:58.020 Anshar Seraphim: you know, by the time that I was in my early 20s, I'd had, like, 50 or so different autistic special interests, you know, where I would just learn everything about something and dive into it and disappear.
00:25:59.090 --> 00:26:05.769 Anshar Seraphim: And, one day I read the, The Dragons of Eden by Carl Sagan, and in that book, he talks about…
00:26:06.020 --> 00:26:10.489 Anshar Seraphim: The evolutionary significance of how the brain
00:26:10.730 --> 00:26:15.069 Anshar Seraphim: Works as a result of the systems that it was built on over time.
00:26:15.360 --> 00:26:20.159 Anshar Seraphim: And I related so much to that, and it got me fascinated with this notion that
00:26:20.730 --> 00:26:27.849 Anshar Seraphim: maybe I could pick a special interest. If I could make a special interest out of psychology and cognitive neuroscience and
00:26:28.190 --> 00:26:31.520 Anshar Seraphim: Would it change anything with people?
00:26:31.710 --> 00:26:44.070 Anshar Seraphim: you know, would understanding the way that the brain works helped me understand other people? And, it became a gigantic passion of mine. And, I've been doing behavioral psychology now for, like, over 2 decades. So…
00:26:44.730 --> 00:26:49.079 Anshar Seraphim: it's been that process, and it's been fraught with failure. You know, there's a,
00:26:50.060 --> 00:26:53.650 Anshar Seraphim: there's an imperative, I feel, to…
00:26:54.670 --> 00:26:58.629 Anshar Seraphim: constructively use your failures to succeed. And…
00:26:58.830 --> 00:27:07.299 Anshar Seraphim: we're in a society that tries to sell us everything under the moon, based on fear of failure. So we place this giant social…
00:27:07.580 --> 00:27:13.760 Anshar Seraphim: Judgment on failure, even though there's no person out there that acquired a skill without failing to acquire it.
00:27:13.950 --> 00:27:16.170 Anshar Seraphim: It's very paradoxical to me, but…
00:27:16.620 --> 00:27:19.189 Anshar Seraphim: I think it's significant just because
00:27:19.500 --> 00:27:29.810 Anshar Seraphim: Living with a disability teaches you how to overcome challenge. You have to. You… you don't want to, you don't try to schedule it, you don't… you have to.
00:27:29.950 --> 00:27:34.529 Anshar Seraphim: It's like going to another country and having to learn the language. You know, it's a necessity.
00:27:34.750 --> 00:27:41.130 Anshar Seraphim: And… So I find that people who have overcome challenge have a lot of differences in their traits, and…
00:27:41.280 --> 00:27:47.690 Anshar Seraphim: From the different things that they tried first and failed, they've grown a lot, and that's definitely happened for me.
00:27:49.430 --> 00:27:55.680 Jacinta Yang: So, when you said you have an Spoken for 25 years.
00:27:55.680 --> 00:28:01.349 Anshar Seraphim: I didn't say that. I said I was 75% nonverbal at age 11, and that I got my first friend at 25.
00:28:01.690 --> 00:28:07.880 Jacinta Yang: Okay, so how… How did, you overcome that?
00:28:08.380 --> 00:28:16.339 Jacinta Yang: challenge of not being verbal. What was it that actually got you started to being verbal.
00:28:17.670 --> 00:28:22.160 Anshar Seraphim: when I realized that I could write everything out ahead of time.
00:28:22.830 --> 00:28:24.560 Anshar Seraphim: And look at it and practice.
00:28:25.250 --> 00:28:27.420 Anshar Seraphim: That was the first step.
00:28:27.640 --> 00:28:30.689 Anshar Seraphim: It was getting a sense of…
00:28:31.260 --> 00:28:33.530 Anshar Seraphim: What it was gonna look like.
00:28:33.990 --> 00:28:35.350 Anshar Seraphim: when I was good at it.
00:28:35.470 --> 00:28:48.850 Anshar Seraphim: And I… I had to take hundreds of pictures of my face, trying to figure out what facial expressions they're supposed to look like, because… and, you know, think about this, when you can't give people eye contact when they're talking, if that's overwhelming to you.
00:28:49.110 --> 00:28:54.140 Anshar Seraphim: you never really learn how to reciprocate facial expressions or recognize them. And,
00:28:54.590 --> 00:29:02.169 Anshar Seraphim: you know, and that happens to me all the time, you know, that's a constant challenge, because I have to emulate eye contact.
00:29:02.310 --> 00:29:08.050 Anshar Seraphim: To try and, try and give people the social attention that they deserve, because they're looking for signals.
00:29:08.410 --> 00:29:09.270 Anshar Seraphim: And…
00:29:09.480 --> 00:29:19.199 Anshar Seraphim: that's one element of communication. I think there's a difference between communication and masking, right? If masking is pretending I'm neurotypical when I'm not.
00:29:19.610 --> 00:29:23.439 Anshar Seraphim: But communication is about the person that you're communicating to. What…
00:29:23.690 --> 00:29:27.509 Anshar Seraphim: What do you need to do so that they're able to understand you?
00:29:27.650 --> 00:29:38.600 Anshar Seraphim: And you have to modify your strategy accordingly. That's not masking, that's meeting someone at the communication table. And I had to take some time to figure out what belongs to those two different groups.
00:29:39.020 --> 00:29:45.280 Anshar Seraphim: as far as answering your question in the modern sense, I encode an entire paragraph that I'm gonna say.
00:29:45.750 --> 00:29:53.319 Anshar Seraphim: textually, in my field of vision, I'll look through, like, a blank space or something like that, and then I have my own little punctuation and notation that I put on it.
00:29:53.490 --> 00:30:03.809 Anshar Seraphim: That tells me when to do different facial expressions, different gesticulations with my hands, and then I… I basically write out that script, and then I follow it like a program.
00:30:04.800 --> 00:30:09.179 Jacinta Yang: Okay, so we're going to go on to a break, and we'll come back soon. Thank you.
00:31:57.830 --> 00:32:04.909 Jacinta Yang: Welcome back to Beneath the Kong. Thank you for joining us. Today, we are,
00:32:05.210 --> 00:32:09.949 Jacinta Yang: Talking about the different challenges, that
00:32:10.700 --> 00:32:18.400 Jacinta Yang: we go through with autism, or how to overcome that. Seraphim is… Answers.
00:32:18.560 --> 00:32:22.109 Jacinta Yang: I'm sure… am I pronouncing your name correctly?
00:32:22.110 --> 00:32:24.239 Anshar Seraphim: OnStar. Sounds like OnStar, but with an H in it.
00:32:24.240 --> 00:32:37.690 Jacinta Yang: Anshar is, sharing us his story of his, journey dealing with autism. So, Anshar, I, I was just listening to what you were saying about,
00:32:38.660 --> 00:32:46.510 Jacinta Yang: You know, having been able to share the facial expression or understanding,
00:32:48.120 --> 00:32:55.859 Jacinta Yang: I have to say that just recently, I was in a workshop, and the topic was about active listening.
00:32:56.710 --> 00:33:01.939 Jacinta Yang: And as you mentioned, that people expect that certain expression from your face.
00:33:02.140 --> 00:33:05.910 Jacinta Yang: So that they understand that you're listening to them.
00:33:06.120 --> 00:33:13.489 Jacinta Yang: Even though I don't have autism, I am an empath, and even my,
00:33:13.830 --> 00:33:21.370 Jacinta Yang: My way of receiving things, or… Hearing things is different than…
00:33:21.470 --> 00:33:24.839 Jacinta Yang: Most, so it was quite interesting, because
00:33:24.950 --> 00:33:39.110 Jacinta Yang: you know, it is understood that if you're looking person directly to the eye, and they think that you're actually paying attention, but for me, when I pay attention, it's actually… I close my eyes.
00:33:39.270 --> 00:33:49.600 Jacinta Yang: So that I'm really listening to what they're saying. So, again, like you said, they can probably misunderstand you and think that, oh, you're not interested.
00:33:50.050 --> 00:34:06.679 Jacinta Yang: Right? So, it was quite interesting that you mentioned that, because I actually never thought about that, but I know that I just wanted to be able to really understand what a person is saying, so I often did that. It never occurred to me that,
00:34:06.800 --> 00:34:12.769 Jacinta Yang: the other person might be thinking differently. But what I have done, though, is…
00:34:12.969 --> 00:34:17.710 Jacinta Yang: when I am talking to people, and I notice, that I am…
00:34:17.940 --> 00:34:34.099 Jacinta Yang: I have my eyes closed, or my head down, so I don't have any other distraction, so I always would tell them from the beginning that, don't mind me, I'm really paying attention, and I just have my eyes closed so I can really hear you.
00:34:34.540 --> 00:34:43.080 Jacinta Yang: So, it's… it's quite interesting that, you know, there's a common… Perception
00:34:43.199 --> 00:34:47.269 Jacinta Yang: Of, facial expression that people are expecting.
00:34:47.420 --> 00:34:51.409 Jacinta Yang: But yet, you know, we have a different way of communicating.
00:34:51.920 --> 00:35:00.649 Anshar Seraphim: Well, even two people, even two neurotypical people don't experience emotions the same way. You know, that's part of the research of Lisa Phelp and Barrett.
00:35:00.850 --> 00:35:05.659 Anshar Seraphim: Is this idea that the experience of emotions in the body.
00:35:06.560 --> 00:35:11.559 Anshar Seraphim: different for everyone. You know, with autism, you know, you have all those,
00:35:11.730 --> 00:35:25.000 Anshar Seraphim: You have a lot of, a tendency toward more connectivity in the white matter tracks of the brain, corpus callosum, you know, really all of the highways of the brain that allow interconnectivity, and
00:35:25.320 --> 00:35:28.610 Anshar Seraphim: That can be hard, because it means that.
00:35:29.430 --> 00:35:33.490 Jacinta Yang: You know, for example, with synesthesia, when someone's talking, you feel it on your skin.
00:35:33.720 --> 00:35:37.329 Anshar Seraphim: What are the things that I teach in communication?
00:35:37.670 --> 00:35:45.919 Anshar Seraphim: you know, and it was from some of my early failures with masking, is to positively share your challenges. You know, positively share how you're different.
00:35:46.000 --> 00:36:03.529 Anshar Seraphim: don't apologize. You know, apologizing creates the wrong framework, but, oh, you know, I'm so excited, I want to share with you, you know, just to let you know, I've got autism, I've got sensory processing disorder, I'm a really deep thinker, and sometimes, because I'm thinking so deeply and connecting it to so many things, I might say.
00:36:03.530 --> 00:36:20.429 Anshar Seraphim: speak too much, you know, and if that happens, or I'm getting off on a tangent, or I'm info-dumping, then just hold up a finger, so, you know, that way I don't have to wait until after it happens to recognize it, and I would really appreciate that. Is there anything about the way that you communicate that I should know? And it gives you an opportunity to create a bridge with someone else.
00:36:20.430 --> 00:36:29.019 Anshar Seraphim: Because even if you don't have a developmental disability, some people are really bad with connecting stories. Some people are bad with metaphors. Some people are…
00:36:29.080 --> 00:36:47.420 Anshar Seraphim: are really fact-based people, and they need to be able to have a framework to file what you're about to tell them, and if you don't get to the point until the very end, it can be very dysregulating and frustrating. And that's if you don't have a developmental disability. So, I think there are some positive lessons to learn there about communication.
00:36:47.660 --> 00:36:52.970 Anshar Seraphim: When it comes to active listing, though, In particular,
00:36:53.110 --> 00:36:57.439 Anshar Seraphim: There was this whole phenomenon of active listing in the 90s.
00:36:57.730 --> 00:37:02.409 Anshar Seraphim: And it was a lot of nodding and regurgitating what the other person is saying.
00:37:02.570 --> 00:37:19.239 Anshar Seraphim: I think that the goal of good listening is to transmit to the other person that you understand how they got there, how they… how they drew the conclusions that they did. You might have different data, you might have different experiences, but that you can follow their reasoning and their experience, and…
00:37:19.380 --> 00:37:23.110 Anshar Seraphim: That you should be able to explain
00:37:23.310 --> 00:37:26.290 Anshar Seraphim: what they're saying, and have them agree with you.
00:37:26.640 --> 00:37:29.980 Anshar Seraphim: And that's the point with listing. So…
00:37:30.170 --> 00:37:37.649 Anshar Seraphim: However you choose to achieve that goal can look different for different people, and even if it was a certain way for you, communications about
00:37:37.780 --> 00:37:41.559 Anshar Seraphim: Connecting to another person, so you gotta find a way that works with working with them.
00:37:42.800 --> 00:37:49.340 Jacinta Yang: So, I think there's… sometimes people have the perception that if I'm listening to you.
00:37:49.660 --> 00:37:58.389 Jacinta Yang: I cannot be able to hear what someone else is saying, okay? That's self-perception.
00:37:58.570 --> 00:38:01.829 Jacinta Yang: But I… Personally, I know that
00:38:02.140 --> 00:38:07.230 Jacinta Yang: Let's say I'm having a communication with you, but somebody just wanted to quickly say something to me.
00:38:07.480 --> 00:38:08.320 Jacinta Yang: Right?
00:38:08.440 --> 00:38:15.189 Jacinta Yang: I'm still able to hear, even though I may not stop the communication I'm having with you.
00:38:15.430 --> 00:38:17.839 Jacinta Yang: I still hear everything they say.
00:38:17.840 --> 00:38:18.710 Anshar Seraphim: Right?
00:38:18.850 --> 00:38:33.469 Jacinta Yang: So, the only thing is, I cannot respond to them right away, but I always get back to them and say, you know what, I did hear you, I know… I will repeat what I heard from them. So, I don't know whether that's,
00:38:35.390 --> 00:38:36.930 Jacinta Yang: That's common. It's called.
00:38:36.930 --> 00:38:41.450 Anshar Seraphim: bias, right? What's that? It's a bias. So what happens is.
00:38:41.770 --> 00:38:48.949 Anshar Seraphim: The human mistake, the common human mistake, is to look at the behaviors and actions and words of other people
00:38:49.200 --> 00:38:55.830 Anshar Seraphim: And to assume that their intention, or their… the way that their brain works.
00:38:55.970 --> 00:39:00.720 Anshar Seraphim: Is the way that yours would be if you were doing the same thing.
00:39:00.720 --> 00:39:01.900 Jacinta Yang: If…
00:39:01.900 --> 00:39:08.450 Anshar Seraphim: You're the kind of person who would only set something down to talk to someone else if you were being rude.
00:39:08.740 --> 00:39:16.439 Anshar Seraphim: Then, if you see someone else do that, you will have the impression that they're being rude, because you look at their behavior.
00:39:16.640 --> 00:39:25.990 Anshar Seraphim: And then you try to process it through your own experience. And that's a fundamental mistake in all communication, to look at the behaviors and words of others.
00:39:26.110 --> 00:39:28.200 Anshar Seraphim: And to assume their motives.
00:39:28.250 --> 00:39:34.380 Jacinta Yang: Based on what you would be doing if you did that behavior. And that's something… it's a trap. It's a total trap.
00:39:35.190 --> 00:39:45.749 Jacinta Yang: So, would you say, since you are also hypersensitive, Would you be able to… Do the same.
00:39:46.000 --> 00:39:54.480 Jacinta Yang: as I do, like, I may be having communication with you, but meanwhile somebody's trying to talk to me, yet I was able to get the full.
00:39:55.190 --> 00:39:55.750 Anshar Seraphim: That's okay.
00:39:55.750 --> 00:39:57.529 Jacinta Yang: gist of everything they tell me.
00:39:57.530 --> 00:40:06.710 Anshar Seraphim: So, you have two different kinds of processing. You have cognitive processing, and you have somatic processing. Cognitive processing is active, right? It's what you're thinking.
00:40:07.000 --> 00:40:13.589 Anshar Seraphim: Whereas somatic processing, you're actually doing a kind of pattern recognition with your body.
00:40:13.780 --> 00:40:20.469 Anshar Seraphim: You're seeing… your brain sees the patterns, and then it generates a feeling. Some people call this energy, some people call it whatever.
00:40:20.800 --> 00:40:28.320 Anshar Seraphim: But if you're highly attuned to that, if your brain recognizes patterns, then if a person comes up to you to interrupt.
00:40:28.440 --> 00:40:38.350 Anshar Seraphim: based on their body language, their facial expression, the energy that you're feeling from them, you're already gonna have a very good idea of what they're gonna say. And so, for you.
00:40:38.500 --> 00:40:44.379 Anshar Seraphim: You're primed so that when that person says one sentence to you, it's actually a paragraph.
00:40:44.590 --> 00:40:51.349 Anshar Seraphim: to another person, that might be a complete disruption. So, again, it's really about
00:40:52.120 --> 00:41:01.639 Anshar Seraphim: Finding the way that the people that are… that you're… the person that you're interacting with, how they process things. And if you're communicating with someone who really needs
00:41:01.950 --> 00:41:05.770 Anshar Seraphim: You know, that kind of attention from you.
00:41:05.990 --> 00:41:07.630 Anshar Seraphim: You know, some people have trauma.
00:41:08.050 --> 00:41:16.129 Anshar Seraphim: You know, if a person was raised by maybe an anxious, avoidant relationship with a parent, maybe…
00:41:16.510 --> 00:41:26.320 Anshar Seraphim: When they were told just a second, or, hey, just, you know, a quick interruption, what it really meant was something else, and then they're putting that pattern on you.
00:41:26.630 --> 00:41:29.300 Anshar Seraphim: There's a lot of different ways
00:41:29.540 --> 00:41:37.300 Anshar Seraphim: To broaden your understanding when it comes to other people, and knowing how your behavior is going to be taken by them.
00:41:37.370 --> 00:41:54.199 Anshar Seraphim: So the truth of it is, is that while we all should be accounting for our own bias, not everyone does. And there are people in your life who can affect the outcome of your life, whether you want to have close social relationships with them or not, that are going to use logical fallacy and bias
00:41:54.340 --> 00:42:00.220 Anshar Seraphim: And looking at you, and being aware of those common missteps with those people who aren't putting in that work.
00:42:00.740 --> 00:42:19.710 Anshar Seraphim: That's a… that's a challenge, and, you know, it is a challenge that we all have to navigate. How do you… how do you deal with people who haven't learned certain life lessons that you have? And whether or not you can do that with kindness, and be firm with, you know, boundaries and all of that, that's part of what good personal management and social relationship management is all about.
00:42:20.550 --> 00:42:30.519 Jacinta Yang: So what I do do is I do, actually, when I'm meeting with new people, and, you know, it's gonna be, how do you call it, a continuous…
00:42:31.340 --> 00:42:43.809 Jacinta Yang: interaction. I do give them a little heads up of how I operate, you know, with the way I communicate, or my abilities, and things like that, so they…
00:42:43.990 --> 00:42:49.020 Jacinta Yang: They have a better understanding when they're dealing with, you know, a certain situation.
00:42:49.490 --> 00:42:53.120 Jacinta Yang: So, now… would you…
00:42:53.460 --> 00:43:00.479 Jacinta Yang: like, I think you mentioned that when you're communicating with somebody, you'll let them know as well, right?
00:43:00.710 --> 00:43:04.610 Anshar Seraphim: Right, right away. And I used to wait, and that was a mistake. You know, if you wait…
00:43:05.570 --> 00:43:21.259 Anshar Seraphim: however long, in order to be able to tell someone, you know, what you need and who you are, then the only thing that you're really doing is luring them into a sense of false security. You know, if you waited 6 months, for example, to tell someone what you really needed in a relationship.
00:43:21.390 --> 00:43:24.160 Anshar Seraphim: You're only sparing yourself
00:43:24.300 --> 00:43:29.850 Anshar Seraphim: You're not doing that for their benefit. You know, waiting until you quote-unquote trust someone enough
00:43:30.150 --> 00:43:38.229 Anshar Seraphim: The only thing that really does is not take advantage of that initial positive energy that you have when you're first interacting with someone, and instead.
00:43:38.560 --> 00:43:52.960 Anshar Seraphim: it's putting them in a position to make mistakes, and to also feel like they're destabilized. You know, I thought everything was going great, and now all of a sudden here are all these new expectations. So, learning to get over that fear.
00:43:53.060 --> 00:44:01.420 Anshar Seraphim: of talking about what you actually need is a really, really important part of personal development, just right alongside of setting boundaries.
00:44:02.330 --> 00:44:09.600 Jacinta Yang: And also, I guess basically sharing on how you communicate as well, so they have an understanding.
00:44:09.860 --> 00:44:10.820 Anshar Seraphim: Yeah, absolutely.
00:44:10.820 --> 00:44:16.120 Jacinta Yang: Not… not to take, how do you say… not to make, assumption of
00:44:16.910 --> 00:44:21.869 Jacinta Yang: how you communicate. That takes away the, misunderstanding.
00:44:22.200 --> 00:44:37.779 Anshar Seraphim: Yeah, I mean, as an autistic lexical first person, for example, when I send a message to someone, and then they don't message me back, I find that socially painful. The amount of delay, it's called cranemic delay, that it takes for them to get back to me, it…
00:44:37.900 --> 00:44:51.380 Anshar Seraphim: to me, I would only be doing that if I didn't care about someone. So, I have to step away from what my framework is, and recognize that someone else is not the same as me, and that I can't take their behavior to signal the things that it would mean for me.
00:44:52.500 --> 00:44:55.099 Jacinta Yang: Okay, we're gonna go into break and come back. Thank you.
00:46:29.900 --> 00:46:46.980 Jacinta Yang: Welcome back to Beneath the Calm. Thank you all for joining us and being with us today. As I mentioned earlier on when we first came on, that in life, we face so many different challenges.
00:46:47.180 --> 00:46:55.590 Jacinta Yang: It doesn't matter. Could be challenges with work, challenges with life challenges, with health, struggles.
00:46:55.930 --> 00:46:59.630 Jacinta Yang: And everyone goes through different…
00:47:00.130 --> 00:47:08.680 Jacinta Yang: Life challenges, and this space was created so we can share stories, share insights and tools.
00:47:08.800 --> 00:47:13.789 Jacinta Yang: To help each other, to navigate through different challenges, and
00:47:14.280 --> 00:47:19.980 Jacinta Yang: Hopefully, that this space can give you some insights and tools
00:47:20.090 --> 00:47:24.059 Jacinta Yang: For you to deal with yours that you can relate to.
00:47:24.360 --> 00:47:32.660 Jacinta Yang: When we all come… The challenges that we are faced with, we become stronger.
00:47:32.800 --> 00:47:38.089 Jacinta Yang: And… Better able to navigate through life much easier.
00:47:38.320 --> 00:47:47.750 Jacinta Yang: Today we are sharing, stories on the challenges, with autism, and Ansha are here…
00:47:47.900 --> 00:47:53.700 Jacinta Yang: sharing his story. I have to say that when I first met him, I…
00:47:53.830 --> 00:48:02.590 Jacinta Yang: had no idea that he actually had autism until he told me, but what I found in him, he's so intelligent.
00:48:02.770 --> 00:48:12.850 Jacinta Yang: And the way he articulate, about different life matters. This is what this space is about, a conversation about life matters.
00:48:13.080 --> 00:48:23.449 Jacinta Yang: And I just feel so happy that he was so willing to come and share his story about the challenges that he went through.
00:48:23.620 --> 00:48:30.279 Jacinta Yang: Dealing with this, odd, or how do you call it, unsure, and…
00:48:31.250 --> 00:48:36.010 Jacinta Yang: what do you call that? Neurodivergent? Is that the…
00:48:36.010 --> 00:48:40.449 Anshar Seraphim: Being neurodiver just means, you know, being different.
00:48:40.880 --> 00:48:41.520 Jacinta Yang: Yeah.
00:48:41.660 --> 00:48:45.859 Jacinta Yang: So, I… I'm really, really impressed.
00:48:46.650 --> 00:48:56.620 Jacinta Yang: By, your life story, because it's… it just shows that, you know, in spite of the challenges you've dealt with.
00:48:56.850 --> 00:49:09.309 Jacinta Yang: And you're doing so great, and you're doing so much for so many people, and I'm so grateful that you are here today to share your story, and
00:49:10.580 --> 00:49:20.609 Jacinta Yang: I'm sure your story will inspire so many people. Not only… only people that has family or friends that,
00:49:20.770 --> 00:49:25.849 Jacinta Yang: That has, someone, with the same challenges.
00:49:26.100 --> 00:49:28.120 Jacinta Yang: As you've gone through.
00:49:28.290 --> 00:49:43.959 Jacinta Yang: But what I would really love for you to share here today with our listeners, hopefully those who are listening, either themselves that are said, facing the same challenges, or they know someone in their family.
00:49:44.040 --> 00:49:49.119 Jacinta Yang: So they can help them. Could you, please share those,
00:49:49.470 --> 00:49:55.070 Jacinta Yang: Insights and tools of how they can Navigate through life.
00:49:55.360 --> 00:49:57.610 Jacinta Yang: Dealing with that, please.
00:49:57.980 --> 00:50:02.590 Anshar Seraphim: Well, if you're… if you're looking to support non-speaking people.
00:50:02.800 --> 00:50:06.550 Anshar Seraphim: There are really great organizations out there.
00:50:06.720 --> 00:50:10.949 Anshar Seraphim: One of them is called TIVA, T-E-V-A, V as in Victor.
00:50:11.180 --> 00:50:16.149 Anshar Seraphim: And, they're building a… A non-speaking community.
00:50:16.360 --> 00:50:20.510 Anshar Seraphim: Giving people equal access to work,
00:50:20.660 --> 00:50:24.820 Anshar Seraphim: You know, if you're looking to reach out to me, specifically.
00:50:24.940 --> 00:50:32.240 Anshar Seraphim: I am the only Anchar Seraphim on LinkedIn, I'm pretty easy to find. I can give you my electronic business card link.
00:50:32.460 --> 00:50:43.549 Anshar Seraphim: I'm the creator of, Ask Onshore, which is, it's a custom GPT that's… that serves as, like, a social decoder for people who are on the spectrum, so that they can…
00:50:44.020 --> 00:50:47.060 Anshar Seraphim: Be able to try to muddle through
00:50:47.170 --> 00:50:55.020 Anshar Seraphim: confusing social situations and understand things. No… nothing clinical there, just, being able to decipher things.
00:50:55.550 --> 00:50:59.760 Anshar Seraphim: Now, there are all kinds of different therapies and support groups
00:51:00.040 --> 00:51:02.170 Anshar Seraphim: I think something that's really important
00:51:02.290 --> 00:51:04.800 Anshar Seraphim: If you're… if you have a child in your life.
00:51:05.080 --> 00:51:20.780 Anshar Seraphim: is to make sure that you're getting good mental health support, and that you're getting community support, because it does take energy, and frustration, and challenge, and, you know, you're going to be teaching that child how to overcome those challenges. And…
00:51:20.900 --> 00:51:32.999 Anshar Seraphim: Making sure that you're not directing that frustration that's gonna come along with those responsibilities, a perfectly valid feeling to have, and making sure that you're directing that energy appropriately.
00:51:33.180 --> 00:51:46.519 Anshar Seraphim: that's a fantastic reason to have access to a mental health professional. You know, I've been studying behavioral psychology for 20 years, but I'm not a clinician. You know, the role of a behaviorist
00:51:46.800 --> 00:51:52.840 Anshar Seraphim: Is to understand response, understand,
00:51:53.460 --> 00:51:57.640 Anshar Seraphim: Why the brain works the way that it does, and that it gives the output that it does.
00:51:57.770 --> 00:51:58.910 Anshar Seraphim: And so…
00:51:59.050 --> 00:52:04.600 Anshar Seraphim: as a result, you know, I'm not very qualified to give any kind of clinical advice, but I know that
00:52:05.040 --> 00:52:16.169 Anshar Seraphim: A proper form of mental health support is crucial. Just because anytime you're going through anything that's going to be a long-term challenge, there are right ways and wrong ways to do that.
00:52:16.360 --> 00:52:20.310 Anshar Seraphim: one of the challenges for people who…
00:52:20.690 --> 00:52:22.760 Anshar Seraphim: Are on the spectrum is employment.
00:52:23.180 --> 00:52:28.149 Anshar Seraphim: Up to 85% of autistic adults are unemployed.
00:52:28.510 --> 00:52:34.960 Anshar Seraphim: And… it is… Partially because of issues like transportation.
00:52:35.930 --> 00:52:42.679 Anshar Seraphim: Making sure that you have access to transportation if you're not able to drive. You know, like, for me, I did get my license until I was almost 40.
00:52:43.210 --> 00:52:50.210 Anshar Seraphim: But also, Because your symptoms can be seen as character traits, There are a lot of…
00:52:50.860 --> 00:52:55.149 Anshar Seraphim: Processes that seem very normal in the job interview process, like an interview.
00:52:55.490 --> 00:52:59.330 Anshar Seraphim: Where, if you don't know about a person's challenges.
00:52:59.650 --> 00:53:09.210 Anshar Seraphim: you're immediately gonna assign a bunch of negative qualifications to that person that don't have anything to do with them as a person. You're literally gonna…
00:53:09.330 --> 00:53:12.480 Anshar Seraphim: Push them out of an opportunity for a job that they would be good at.
00:53:13.090 --> 00:53:17.070 Anshar Seraphim: Based on social symptoms that present as character traits.
00:53:17.230 --> 00:53:23.800 Anshar Seraphim: And there's a paradox there, because employers aren't really able to ask a lot about your medical conditions, so…
00:53:24.010 --> 00:53:34.949 Anshar Seraphim: It's incredibly important for people who have challenges to self-advocate, and to be able to work on their communication skills so that those things can be positively framed.
00:53:35.150 --> 00:53:39.049 Anshar Seraphim: In order to not deny themselves, you know, the situations that…
00:53:39.160 --> 00:53:41.240 Anshar Seraphim: That they can use in order to prosper.
00:53:41.560 --> 00:53:51.680 Anshar Seraphim: there's so many different aspects, but I think one of the things when you have a condition where you only have, you know, maybe 1 out of 44 people who has a condition, is you have to find community.
00:53:51.880 --> 00:53:53.770 Jacinta Yang: You have to find people.
00:53:53.780 --> 00:53:57.279 Anshar Seraphim: That are like yourself, that you can relate and share experiences with.
00:53:57.470 --> 00:54:11.090 Anshar Seraphim: So that you don't feel like an island. And there's a lot of great groups out there for that, and I encourage the people who are affected on the spectrum, just as I am, to seek out those resources, and if you ever want to write me, I'm happy to direct you.
00:54:12.370 --> 00:54:16.470 Jacinta Yang: Thank you so much, Anshar. It's been very enlightening, and I'm…
00:54:16.500 --> 00:54:27.889 Jacinta Yang: I'm so, so grateful for your, insights and your sharing your story, because I am sure it will help many people that,
00:54:27.890 --> 00:54:38.279 Jacinta Yang: don't have as much information on autism. Like I said, I don't know too much. I've seen some, I'm learning more, and I've learned a lot from you in the very…
00:54:38.350 --> 00:54:46.110 Jacinta Yang: short time that we have communication, and I… I really find it very inspiring just listening to you talk.
00:54:46.360 --> 00:54:51.220 Jacinta Yang: So, thank you so, so much again for, being here.
00:54:51.330 --> 00:55:01.540 Jacinta Yang: And I hope that anybody that needs any information related to autism, or how to overcome,
00:55:01.720 --> 00:55:07.289 Jacinta Yang: the challenges, please reach out to Anshar, and he's just amazing.
00:55:07.530 --> 00:55:10.040 Jacinta Yang: And I'm sure you will learn a lot from him.
00:55:10.160 --> 00:55:11.630 Jacinta Yang: Thank you so much.
00:55:14.070 --> 00:55:15.140 Anshar Seraphim: Thanks for having me.
00:55:15.500 --> 00:55:16.490 Jacinta Yang: Thank you.
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