EPISODE SUMMARY:
Trust isn’t a tactic — it’s a strategy.
This week on The Happy Spot, marketing visionary Rai-mon Nemar Barnes shares how conscious businesses can build lasting trust, market without fear, and grow in alignment with their values.
"How do we do better?" For Rai-mon Nemar Barnes, founder of Consciously™, that question has been the heartbeat of his life and business. In this episode, we explore how brands can build authentic trust, market without fear and scarcity, and align their business practices with their deepest values.
Rai-mon shares why conscious marketing isn’t just good ethics — it’s good strategy. We talk about how to waste less time and money on marketing that doesn’t work, how poly identity informs his leadership, and how business owners can “biohack” their mindset for clarity and integrity. If you’re craving a fresh, values-led approach to business growth, this one’s for you.
Learn more about Rai-mon at consciouslyinc.com.
consciouslyinc.com https://www.linkedin.com/in/raimonnemarbarnes/
#counsciousmarketing #polyidentity #neurodivergent #happyspot #Trust
In this insightful opening segment of The Happy Spot, Jack Thomas and Clementina Esposito introduce guest Rai-mon Neymar Barnes, a marketing visionary whose work centers around trust, values, and conscious leadership. Rai-mon shares how his upbringing—shaped by a preacher, an entrepreneur, and an artist—fostered a lifelong pursuit of doing better and building meaningful, values-based connections. He explains that trust in branding isn’t just about authenticity, but about aligning your core values with the value you bring—creating not just utility, but lasting resonance with your audience.
In this powerful segment of The Happy Spot, Rai-mon Nemar Barnes explains how building trust in branding starts by aligning your values with your true value—what you actually deliver. He illustrates how integrity in business means being consistent across every environment, living and working from the same core self. Drawing from his own journey, Rai-mon shares how discovering he’s more “Malcolm X than MLK” helped him embrace that his voice and message aren’t for everyone—and that’s okay. What matters most is being honest, specific about your goals, and willing to say no rather than betray trust.
In this deeply relatable segment of The Happy Spot, Clementina Esposito opens up about her struggle with traditional marketing, describing it as formulaic, manipulative, and often triggering for those with trauma or a strong sense of integrity. Rai-mon Nemar Barnes validates her discomfort, distinguishing between harmful fear-based tactics and healthy urgency grounded in honesty and respect. He explains that true marketing isn’t about convincing—it’s about resonance, commitment, and visibility so that when the right people are ready, they choose you naturally, without pressure or scarcity energy.
In this final segment of The Happy Spot, Rai-mon Nemar Barnes shares a practical and inspiring example of abundant marketing through his company, Consciously. Instead of relying on pressure tactics, they focus on clarity, alignment, and a unique kind of “call to action”—not to buy now, but to “do it consciously.” He explains how understanding your subconscious scripts and embodying your values builds lasting trust, even if it means not being liked by everyone. Clementina echoes this by sharing how stepping into her so-called “villain era” was the key to becoming the hero in her own story—a powerful reminder that authentic branding starts with owning who you really are.
00:00:29.680 --> 00:00:31.210 JACK THOMAS : Good evening, everybody.
00:00:31.750 --> 00:00:44.959 JACK THOMAS : I'd like to welcome you to the happy spot. This is Jack Thomas. We are fortunate to meet a man that was kind, generous, and then I found out he thinks like me
00:00:45.690 --> 00:01:01.839 JACK THOMAS : on Sunday, celebrating father's day, just walking into the local coffee shop in Montclair at Sonoca, and there are 8 men sitting there in a private circle, and I'm with Clementina, who's doing the interview today, and we walk around them.
00:01:01.980 --> 00:01:04.069 JACK THOMAS : and they approach us and said.
00:01:04.190 --> 00:01:07.080 JACK THOMAS : It's father's day. We would like to treat you to coffee.
00:01:07.310 --> 00:01:16.790 JACK THOMAS : and that's the old school energy that I grew up with, and I was so grateful that I walked over to get coffee, and then the owner goes her, too.
00:01:17.170 --> 00:01:30.970 JACK THOMAS : and I'm sitting there going. Wow! Who are these men? And I walked over into the circle of men. They greeted me with warmth, charm. And we're sitting here with Ramon Neymar Barnes. He is of consciousness.
00:01:32.680 --> 00:01:57.070 JACK THOMAS : excuse me, marketing consciously, and it just played into my personal arena as I explored his website, and I teased with him about the people in the marketing world, and I believe he has turned me the other way. The goal is to learn more today. And Clementina, so grateful, look forward to learning and hearing more at the happy spot just to let every know everybody know
00:01:57.070 --> 00:02:12.689 JACK THOMAS : this is international. I am an international Chief happiness officer. I was talking with Dr. Perry Knoppert, and the world is here, everybody, the world is here, and I look forward to learning more. I'll be ducking out and coming back a little later on. Thank you. Everyone.
00:02:13.240 --> 00:02:16.920 clementinaesposito: Thanks, Jack, so how do we do better?
00:02:17.050 --> 00:02:38.869 clementinaesposito: This is kind of the grounding question of this of this show, and for some people a question like that is a passing curiosity, and for others they're lifelong companions. Today's guest, Ramon Neymar Barnes, has built an entire career company and community around answering the question, How do we do better?
00:02:39.190 --> 00:02:47.900 clementinaesposito: As the founder of consciously marketing, Ruman helps conscious businesses deepen audience connection and create alignment around shared values
00:02:48.160 --> 00:03:02.770 clementinaesposito: when those 2 things are in place. They grow holistically. He's worked with influential brands, like GM. Red Bull, Etsy, Airbnb, and vitamin water. But his true passion is building ecosystems of integrity and trust in business.
00:03:03.120 --> 00:03:30.429 clementinaesposito: So today we're going to talk about how business can build genuine trust, how to move beyond fear and scarcity in our marketing something I've been just cringing at for years how to waste less time and money trying to be everywhere, and what it means to lead consciously, so I can't wait to tap into your insights on poly identity, wellness, and embracing complexity. I'm so glad you're here.
00:03:31.150 --> 00:03:36.839 Rai-mon Nemar Barnes: Thank you. I I need to have you around all the time for that kind of an intro. I love it. Great.
00:03:37.220 --> 00:03:38.520 Rai-mon Nemar Barnes: Yeah, I'm excited.
00:03:39.220 --> 00:03:50.369 clementinaesposito: Great. So so it's funny, because, as I was preparing for this show, and I and I was thinking about what the 1st question I wanted to ask you was.
00:03:50.520 --> 00:04:12.530 clementinaesposito: I don't know why, and I know I did have the pleasure of meeting you in person, so maybe it was some kind of energy that I picked up on, but I had a feeling, and I kind of hoped that there would be a grandma involved in one of these stories, and just before the show, so I don't know if it's going to be here. But I had a hunch I had a hunch, and just before the show we were chatting.
00:04:12.530 --> 00:04:33.279 clementinaesposito: and I think we almost went there. So my 1st question to you, Ramon, is, you have this this beautiful through line in your life. How can we do better? And you know I'm curious where it came from when it when you 1st realized it, was this sort of North star in your life, and you know where it came from.
00:04:35.070 --> 00:04:44.829 Rai-mon Nemar Barnes: You know it's a great question. I would say. You know my my grandmother was had a big influence on my life.
00:04:44.930 --> 00:05:07.749 Rai-mon Nemar Barnes: but I would say that that question and that through line is really my dad, via my grandfather, via my great grandfather, and that's because my great grandfather, going back down was a preacher. My grandfather was an entrepreneur, and my dad was an artist, and they really kind of gave me this trifecta of.
00:05:07.750 --> 00:05:12.170 clementinaesposito: Wow! What a great combination! We let's slow that down. So it was preacher
00:05:12.856 --> 00:05:19.443 clementinaesposito: and artist, I mean, that's everything right there, right? That's like the Holy Trinity of marketing, isn't it.
00:05:19.810 --> 00:05:25.040 Rai-mon Nemar Barnes: And you know I will say, you know, as a young person it it was
00:05:25.070 --> 00:05:32.680 Rai-mon Nemar Barnes: not quite honed into an asset just yet. Right to have kind of all of those things in you and and being.
00:05:32.680 --> 00:05:57.409 Rai-mon Nemar Barnes: I would say, spiritual, not necessarily religious, even though we went to church, and definitely always had an entrepreneurial bone. I was the kid that had a lemonade stand, and I still remember to this day my parents being like you can't do it on that street. That's the busy street. And I'm like, Yeah, but that's where all the people are like, I'm like, I can't make money over there. I have to be over here on the busy street, and my dad, you know, really like we were literally in the living
00:05:57.410 --> 00:06:02.290 Rai-mon Nemar Barnes: room doing like Bob Ross paintings together. I think it's Bob Ross with the red hair.
00:06:02.290 --> 00:06:04.179 clementinaesposito: Yeah, yeah, totally. Totally. I was totally trying.
00:06:04.180 --> 00:06:04.570 Rai-mon Nemar Barnes: Oh!
00:06:04.570 --> 00:06:05.510 clementinaesposito: Yes, yes, yes.
00:06:05.510 --> 00:06:11.579 Rai-mon Nemar Barnes: So, yeah, like, you know, the kind of learning to balance these things is my life. But I would say
00:06:11.700 --> 00:06:30.370 Rai-mon Nemar Barnes: that last one, that artist piece. Right? You you kind of can't have a creative in you at all, and not be looking for the next thing and trying to do something deeper and try to do something different, and then move on to that, and then you figure it out only to go. I don't know anything. I have to do more, and I have to do better. So yeah.
00:06:30.370 --> 00:06:49.729 clementinaesposito: Yeah, yeah, I mean, it's really interesting. Because the artist, you know. Yes, that's true. I totally. I totally agree that when you realize you know, you're creating a life. Really, you're creating a life when you're creating a business like ours. You know, you're creating a life. You're creating a lifestyle.
00:06:49.730 --> 00:07:04.029 clementinaesposito: And you're also helping other, you know, giving other people permission to do the same. And you know that's a big responsibility. Right? And and so then there's also, you know, you have too much artist and not enough, you know, entrepreneur.
00:07:04.030 --> 00:07:04.589 Rai-mon Nemar Barnes: That's right.
00:07:04.590 --> 00:07:10.954 clementinaesposito: I don't know. I you know I can't. I can't shake my, the old roots of my Catholicism, you know a little fear of God never hurt.
00:07:12.120 --> 00:07:13.419 Rai-mon Nemar Barnes: Yes, right?
00:07:13.420 --> 00:07:21.324 clementinaesposito: I'm teasing. But but yeah, I I love that. That's great. That's that's really great. So
00:07:22.332 --> 00:07:32.380 clementinaesposito: so what it so we talk about trust when I talk to you about what you really wanted to talk about today. That was the 1st word.
00:07:32.720 --> 00:07:38.490 clementinaesposito: That was the 1st word. So let's talk about trust framework. Let's do it. Let's it's talking.
00:07:38.490 --> 00:07:39.529 clementinaesposito: Talk about trust.
00:07:39.790 --> 00:07:46.399 Rai-mon Nemar Barnes: It's it's. It's a very important thing to talk about today. You know, there's so much so.
00:07:46.650 --> 00:07:51.919 clementinaesposito: Yeah, so so what's the what's the single most
00:07:52.040 --> 00:07:55.279 clementinaesposito: important thing a brand can do
00:07:55.620 --> 00:07:57.790 clementinaesposito: to build trust with its audience.
00:07:58.693 --> 00:08:04.769 Rai-mon Nemar Barnes: I'm gonna start off with the cliche answer, because I do think it's the right answer. And that is just be authentic. Right? Be true.
00:08:04.770 --> 00:08:09.029 Rai-mon Nemar Barnes: Easier said than done. Right?
00:08:09.030 --> 00:08:19.849 Rai-mon Nemar Barnes: Like, yeah, yeah. Tell us something we don't know be authentic. Great but I I do think. And this is what has really driven me. At some point
00:08:20.100 --> 00:08:33.699 Rai-mon Nemar Barnes: I figured out along with my partner, Shannon. I do have a partner of my business, Shannon. We met this total Kismet. That's a whole other story I'll tell later. But I'd say the the gist really is in today's world where
00:08:35.380 --> 00:08:37.039 Rai-mon Nemar Barnes: there are a lot of voices.
00:08:37.220 --> 00:08:45.839 Rai-mon Nemar Barnes: You didn't have to listen. There were always a lot of voices, but you didn't have to listen to them all right. Now we talk about this often about how.
00:08:46.600 --> 00:08:51.839 Rai-mon Nemar Barnes: when you think about high school, any school. But we'll take high school such a formative time
00:08:52.550 --> 00:09:17.099 Rai-mon Nemar Barnes: after you leave high school generally, unless you stayed at home in the same town, and kind of still know the same people. Those are generally voices you didn't keep with you. There might be someone's face, you remember, and things you remember, but you didn't have to hear from them. You didn't know what they thought about politics. You didn't have to hear their thoughts on something that you were doing. And now
00:09:17.770 --> 00:09:35.769 Rai-mon Nemar Barnes: all you have to do is share something about your kid, or go on one of your platforms anywhere in any way, shape or form, and you have to keep these voices with you. They're with you all the time. And now that's also the case with companies talking with you, and it's the same case with so many different voices. And the question becomes.
00:09:36.000 --> 00:09:40.759 Rai-mon Nemar Barnes: in that world, why is what you have to say important at all?
00:09:40.930 --> 00:09:45.010 Rai-mon Nemar Barnes: Why is what? Why is someone stopping to listen to you?
00:09:45.010 --> 00:09:45.770 clementinaesposito: Hmm.
00:09:45.770 --> 00:09:49.410 Rai-mon Nemar Barnes: And so this thing around trust.
00:09:49.640 --> 00:10:02.019 Rai-mon Nemar Barnes: I know I'm talking about communication, and I'm talking about these things. But when it comes to trust, that's really what trust comes from is communication, whether you're communicating through action, whether you're communicating with the things that you say.
00:10:02.470 --> 00:10:08.000 Rai-mon Nemar Barnes: the question is, what do you have to say, and why should anybody care?
00:10:08.620 --> 00:10:12.160 Rai-mon Nemar Barnes: And so, that being the case, what we've come to is
00:10:12.670 --> 00:10:21.579 Rai-mon Nemar Barnes: if you can figure out what your values are. In the 1st place, do you have values? And when we say that what we mean are the things you stand on.
00:10:22.280 --> 00:10:39.200 Rai-mon Nemar Barnes: Maybe someone met you years and years and years ago. And you say, I believe in blank and they go. Yeah, that's the person I knew. Maybe in high school, maybe in college. Maybe you work with him, and they go. Yep. He never told me that in those words. But yeah, that's definitely something that person is about your values. If you can figure those out.
00:10:39.450 --> 00:10:47.479 Rai-mon Nemar Barnes: and because that's only half of it, then you can figure out the value that you bring.
00:10:47.900 --> 00:10:48.290 clementinaesposito: 2.
00:10:48.290 --> 00:10:56.080 Rai-mon Nemar Barnes: Whoever you don't even have to figure out who you bring it to. But you do need to figure out the value that you bring, and if you can make them one thing.
00:10:56.840 --> 00:10:59.810 Rai-mon Nemar Barnes: that's the hard part. That's where the magic happens.
00:10:59.810 --> 00:11:00.830 clementinaesposito: Hmm.
00:11:00.830 --> 00:11:04.980 Rai-mon Nemar Barnes: Because there are lots of companies. There are lots and lots of companies
00:11:05.230 --> 00:11:08.749 Rai-mon Nemar Barnes: that bring great value to the world.
00:11:10.250 --> 00:11:13.449 Rai-mon Nemar Barnes: and the ones that are resonant
00:11:13.720 --> 00:11:16.619 Rai-mon Nemar Barnes: are the ones that do both in such a way.
00:11:16.930 --> 00:11:19.730 Rai-mon Nemar Barnes: So, and I'll I'll give an example. I'll give.
00:11:19.730 --> 00:11:20.410 clementinaesposito: Yay!
00:11:20.410 --> 00:11:41.180 Rai-mon Nemar Barnes: Example, so that people can get a clear through line of what this looks like, because just because you can't be authentic, or just because you can't do both does not mean you can't be successful. It's just a certain kind of successful. It's not necessarily the successful you might be looking for. So the one I love to use is Amazon. And that's because Amazon people. If you were to ask
00:11:41.260 --> 00:11:56.499 Rai-mon Nemar Barnes: most people, do you trust Amazon, they'd say, get out. I don't trust Amazon as far as I can throw them. Those guys do wrong by people all the time. You're always hearing about how their workers are unhappy or this or that, and if you just flip that over and ask, well.
00:11:56.630 --> 00:12:09.189 Rai-mon Nemar Barnes: let's just say you needed a house delivered. I don't think that's a thing. I think you can take a house somewhere. But let's just say you needed a house delivered, or any other thing at all. Who would you trust more to get it where it needs to get on time?
00:12:10.010 --> 00:12:22.119 Rai-mon Nemar Barnes: Absolutely no one not ups not the Federal service, not the brown bag. Nobody. You trust nobody. Deliver a thing on time, or even before you need it more than them.
00:12:22.280 --> 00:12:30.539 Rai-mon Nemar Barnes: Right? So it's about the ways in which we trust as well. What's the context of the trust that you're looking for? And so
00:12:31.070 --> 00:12:42.449 Rai-mon Nemar Barnes: to bring that back around, we'll take apple. They're the good example or a good example. I could also take someone like Ben and Jerry's, though, when we talk about Apple, or we talk about Ben and Jerry's. Now we're talking about resonant trust.
00:12:42.700 --> 00:12:45.959 Rai-mon Nemar Barnes: I would kind of trust Ben and Jerry's with a daycare.
00:12:46.160 --> 00:12:55.109 Rai-mon Nemar Barnes: those guys. They they had values like, and they stand by them, and I would trust that they, they would probably take pretty good care of a kid. They might.
00:12:55.110 --> 00:12:56.280 clementinaesposito: My friend.
00:12:56.280 --> 00:13:00.729 Rai-mon Nemar Barnes: Right, and I can trust that apple is at the very least going to put
00:13:00.890 --> 00:13:16.180 Rai-mon Nemar Barnes: very easy to use things in front of people and not take advantage. So that's the real difference is being resonant versus being of utility. If you want to be resonant and stick with people, you got to figure out both your values and your value. Not just one.
00:13:16.360 --> 00:13:21.669 clementinaesposito: Awesome. I love that. We're gonna go to break in a minute. But when we come back
00:13:22.070 --> 00:13:31.939 clementinaesposito: you know, we're gonna talk about why, this we're gonna talk a little bit more about, you know, how do we get to this resonance that equals trust? Essentially, if I'm understanding you right.
00:13:31.940 --> 00:13:32.680 Rai-mon Nemar Barnes: You got it.
00:13:32.680 --> 00:13:37.449 clementinaesposito: And and and how do we give it to people who are watching?
00:13:37.931 --> 00:13:44.999 clementinaesposito: And and why isn't that? Isn't that just nice to have, or something to aspire to, but really essential.
00:13:45.000 --> 00:13:45.660 Rai-mon Nemar Barnes: Hmm!
00:13:46.150 --> 00:13:47.230 Rai-mon Nemar Barnes: Love that.
00:13:47.230 --> 00:13:52.500 clementinaesposito: Alright! Alright! So we'll be back in a minute. Thank you, and go on a break.
00:15:20.880 --> 00:15:44.469 clementinaesposito: All right. We are back with Ramon Barnes of consciously marketing. So oh, my gosh! Things were just getting juicy. So we were talking about how how to do the thing right, which is build trust with our our clients through our marketing. And you know you were talking about the ways that tapping into our values
00:15:44.932 --> 00:15:58.559 clementinaesposito: allows us. Let me make sure I get this right. Really, getting clear on our own values helps us also isolate, and I guess, market. The value that we bring is that right?
00:15:59.080 --> 00:16:04.500 Rai-mon Nemar Barnes: Yeah. Because in in today's world the trick of of things is that
00:16:05.460 --> 00:16:08.410 Rai-mon Nemar Barnes: unlike before no one could talk back
00:16:08.720 --> 00:16:21.869 Rai-mon Nemar Barnes: before we were all getting told things, and we couldn't really say anything back. We believed they're not really about that, but we couldn't say anything. Well, now people can talk back. And so if you promise that you're going to do things or say you're going to do things that you can't follow through on.
00:16:22.010 --> 00:16:28.139 Rai-mon Nemar Barnes: you're going to lose trust pretty fast, which is why you don't see Amazon doing a lot of
00:16:28.390 --> 00:16:37.369 Rai-mon Nemar Barnes: values based marketing right? They say we're going to deliver a thing, and they show you a bunch of pictures, and say we can deliver that thing better to you, and we have the most things
00:16:37.700 --> 00:16:40.039 Rai-mon Nemar Barnes: they can deliver on that every day.
00:16:40.040 --> 00:16:46.290 clementinaesposito: Right. They can also make it easier for us to, you know, find and consume them.
00:16:46.470 --> 00:17:10.929 Rai-mon Nemar Barnes: Right, right. The the gist, though, is, we're all looking for more than that, especially coming out of pandemic or just life, or just all the things that you're looking for. We're looking for more than that in other. In cases where it's I don't want my toothbreak a new toothbrush tomorrow, or I don't want something delivered in my house. Well, then, what? Well, now, I need to know that I can at the very least just trust what you're saying.
00:17:10.940 --> 00:17:19.010 Rai-mon Nemar Barnes: or there's a possibility of that, and you can deliver on it. So the gist here is, it's it's actually a lot easier
00:17:19.319 --> 00:17:21.109 Rai-mon Nemar Barnes: in today's world if
00:17:21.579 --> 00:17:26.389 Rai-mon Nemar Barnes: you can kind of figure out who you are, because then, like right now, when you ask me about these things.
00:17:26.680 --> 00:17:32.790 Rai-mon Nemar Barnes: I'm just telling you about the values that were passed down to me for my family.
00:17:32.790 --> 00:17:33.160 clementinaesposito: Right.
00:17:33.160 --> 00:17:51.310 Rai-mon Nemar Barnes: I learned to put into a business, so I don't have to live like someone else. I don't have to live in a business world or a personal world. I'm not trying to figure out where it needs to go. I am always where I am and how I need to be at all times, and
00:17:51.570 --> 00:17:55.650 Rai-mon Nemar Barnes: I can always deliver on that that only breeds trust.
00:17:56.500 --> 00:18:13.259 clementinaesposito: Right? Right? So it's so interesting. Because, you know, in my, in my business I co-create books and speeches with people. And I've been a writing teacher. My entire life, and one of the things I love to do in my private classes is teach memoir. I'm writing my own.
00:18:13.260 --> 00:18:13.730 Rai-mon Nemar Barnes: From here.
00:18:13.730 --> 00:18:32.390 clementinaesposito: Completion. And it's the most interesting thing, because when someone starts, they're so they're so scared. They think so many of the things that have had such impact on them are shameful, or writers have this unbelievable complexity of at once thinking they have something to say.
00:18:32.590 --> 00:18:50.370 clementinaesposito: and also having the biggest imposter syndrome, and many of them have have come from. They may not realize this consciously, but what in in writing, what they're trying to do is is, try to heal that wound of feeling like they didn't belong.
00:18:51.330 --> 00:19:02.740 clementinaesposito: or healing shame, or so many other things, and it's like when they first, st you know, in my presence. One of the things I try to do is create a safe container for them. To
00:19:03.270 --> 00:19:06.970 clementinaesposito: tell the truth self, reflect.
00:19:07.570 --> 00:19:12.360 clementinaesposito: And also be witnessed by me in a nonjudgmental capacity.
00:19:12.360 --> 00:19:12.800 Rai-mon Nemar Barnes: Yeah.
00:19:12.800 --> 00:19:36.160 clementinaesposito: It's just unbelievable what that can do. So you know, for example, when I went to your website, you were just you were talking. You know, you were talking about neurodivergence. You were talking about poly identity you were talking about, you know, it's a much more nuanced, more complex version of you know. Bring your whole self to work, you know.
00:19:36.160 --> 00:19:37.610 Rai-mon Nemar Barnes: Kind of thing.
00:19:37.610 --> 00:20:05.250 clementinaesposito: So can you talk more about that? And also what was the moment you discovered, you know? Have you all as a marketing student first, st did you? You know. Have you always known this? Or was there an epiphany for you? Was there a time when this being one of your core values to live seamlessly. Was there a time when you felt like you were closeted, or, you know, hiding something? Please tell me every.
00:20:05.250 --> 00:20:26.667 Rai-mon Nemar Barnes: This is, this is good. This is actually good, because I can also say, outside of being professional, like, I've only recently found my voice, Ramon's voice outside of consciously right like, what do I want to say? If we're not talking about Brand, we're not talking about marketing, and we're not talking about in the context of business.
00:20:27.030 --> 00:20:54.569 Rai-mon Nemar Barnes: and I think it really comes from butting my head in every different way against all the things. So in being in large corporations like inside of them, working with them, being in very small businesses, being in all these different places, and I think probably the easiest way I could explain. It is, I'll use my own context, and that is, knowing the difference between Mlk. Martin Luther King and Malcolm X.
00:20:55.010 --> 00:20:57.419 Rai-mon Nemar Barnes: I came to this recently with my coach
00:20:58.740 --> 00:21:05.420 Rai-mon Nemar Barnes: in in the world, when you're trying to really find your voice, and you're trying to be all things meaning
00:21:05.550 --> 00:21:08.059 Rai-mon Nemar Barnes: showing up with all the things inside of you.
00:21:08.300 --> 00:21:23.220 Rai-mon Nemar Barnes: You still have to kind of hone your voice like, how are you going to share that great? You know who you are, you know. Maybe you're a dad and an entrepreneur, and you're a blah blah. You're a mom, and you're this. And you're this, and okay, great, wonderful. You figured all of that out, how are you going to share it?
00:21:23.440 --> 00:21:34.629 Rai-mon Nemar Barnes: And at some point you just kind of have to decide who you're gonna be. And I had woke. I'll use my own experience here and say I realized
00:21:34.950 --> 00:21:42.220 Rai-mon Nemar Barnes: fairly early that I am not Martin Luther King. I can. I can go out in the world and be liked.
00:21:42.610 --> 00:21:47.629 Rai-mon Nemar Barnes: but I can't be me, and always be liked, and some people can.
00:21:47.630 --> 00:21:48.359 clementinaesposito: Whoa! Whoa!
00:21:48.360 --> 00:21:49.209 Rai-mon Nemar Barnes: People can go.
00:21:49.210 --> 00:21:52.990 clementinaesposito: That's why it's not worthy right? Can you say that again? Because.
00:21:52.990 --> 00:21:56.449 Rai-mon Nemar Barnes: So some people can go out into the world
00:21:57.060 --> 00:22:02.289 Rai-mon Nemar Barnes: and be liked, and be themselves at the same time, and I realize that I cannot.
00:22:02.290 --> 00:22:02.990 clementinaesposito: Right.
00:22:02.990 --> 00:22:05.290 Rai-mon Nemar Barnes: I had. And, moreover.
00:22:05.430 --> 00:22:16.299 Rai-mon Nemar Barnes: when I try to say things in a way that everybody will both like it and understand it, it doesn't feel right to me. It doesn't hit right, and I leave the entire experience going.
00:22:16.780 --> 00:22:39.399 Rai-mon Nemar Barnes: That's no good. However, when I switch my context, shout out to my coach, Ariana Ruiz. She is amazing big shout to her because she helped me come to terms with this. I realized I'm Malcolm X. Not everybody's gonna like me, not everybody's gonna like what I say. My message isn't for everybody. How I say it isn't for everybody, and that is okay.
00:22:39.670 --> 00:22:45.830 Rai-mon Nemar Barnes: But here's what you're never going to say about me that I told that you saw me do it one way over here and another way over there.
00:22:45.830 --> 00:22:58.209 clementinaesposito: Right, right? Right? And and you have your, you know, when you're when you're looking to, but great, because we ultimately we spend our money where we spend our money is an expression of our values.
00:22:58.210 --> 00:22:58.950 Rai-mon Nemar Barnes: Yes.
00:22:58.950 --> 00:23:16.729 clementinaesposito: Right. And and so, you know, it's we want to give money. You know, we need a thing like we need that thing. We're going to need that thing regardless right? But it's like now, with so many choices of where we can fulfill that need.
00:23:17.050 --> 00:23:17.580 Rai-mon Nemar Barnes: Yes.
00:23:17.580 --> 00:23:43.949 clementinaesposito: We want to spend our money, especially when it's going to be a substantial amount, right with with people who share aligned values. And and what I'm finding, and what you know. More and more I think I see this in marketing. I see this in my personal life, you know, when people are forthright about who they are and some of those things that maybe they will. You know they were, you know, when Jack said to me, I'm neurodivergent. And that's when I told him my name right like, not because.
00:23:43.950 --> 00:23:44.680 Rai-mon Nemar Barnes: Yes, yes.
00:23:44.680 --> 00:23:56.350 clementinaesposito: Right. You know, because I I could relate to that. You know, I could relate to discovering that late in life and feeling like, you know, so suddenly. This was, you know, there was something that we had some common ground right.
00:23:56.350 --> 00:23:56.800 Rai-mon Nemar Barnes: Yes.
00:23:57.180 --> 00:24:03.640 clementinaesposito: So you know, and and I think in today's world so many of us have been.
00:24:03.710 --> 00:24:15.750 clementinaesposito: you know, coupling for whatever, in whatever way, in business or other ways with people who ultimately the reason it breaks, or the reason they disappear, or the reason whatever is because we weren't aligned.
00:24:15.750 --> 00:24:35.300 clementinaesposito: and we didn't know it right. We finally hire someone to do the marketing and they disappear. And it's like, you know, we weren't a lot where I mean, forget. You know there are rascals out there. We all know it, you know. Whatever I'm not. I'm not even talking about that. I'm talking about. Sometimes, you know, everybody's trying to do the thing, and you know.
00:24:35.300 --> 00:24:47.019 clementinaesposito: when there is an alignment, you know, it just happens so so all right, I got another question for you. So where do you see businesses commonly? You know,
00:24:47.850 --> 00:24:51.230 clementinaesposito: of trust eroding without them even knowing it.
00:24:51.780 --> 00:25:14.200 Rai-mon Nemar Barnes: That's a great question, and and I will answer it in the same vein of what we're talking about. And I also want to make real and deliver on this Martin versus Malcolm thing. It's not about right, it's all about identity and race can be a part of that and all that. But it's not about that at all. It's about business. Still, in that context around.
00:25:14.910 --> 00:25:25.709 Rai-mon Nemar Barnes: I can imagine someone came to Jack. They've come to you. They go to lots of people. They say you need more leads. You want more business, you. You want to grow your business, don't you? Who doesn't want to grow their business.
00:25:26.270 --> 00:25:51.269 Rai-mon Nemar Barnes: We're talking about Martin right now. I have a dream, right? Everybody wants that thing growth. You have a business. You need revenue. Great. They come to you. They say that. Or maybe maybe you see, growth on the other side of a new website. Growth is on the other side of making content. Growth is on the other side of blank fill in whatever the blank is right. And they talk to you about that. And they say, Okay, well, you need this thing.
00:25:51.860 --> 00:26:00.019 Rai-mon Nemar Barnes: and they do or don't deliver, but what they never did they never stopped. And this, in my opinion, is the real goal of
00:26:00.240 --> 00:26:09.499 Rai-mon Nemar Barnes: well, any person that that you're doing business with, but especially someone who's doing marketing with you is to figure out what is your goal. Growth is not your goal.
00:26:09.750 --> 00:26:11.020 clementinaesposito: Right, right.
00:26:12.090 --> 00:26:30.239 Rai-mon Nemar Barnes: But what's your? You can grow a million different ways. Do you want to grow your audience? You want to grow your revenue? Do you want to grow your per transaction revenue? Do you want to grow lifecycle? Do you want to? What do you want to grow? What? What let's get into that. Let's figure that out. And then after that, if we can tell you well, you're not set up for that kind of growth. Oh, here comes the
00:26:31.000 --> 00:26:53.850 Rai-mon Nemar Barnes: we have to. We got to disappoint you in like 5 different ways before we're ever going to be able to get you to that place, and the Trust gets eroded to answer your question directly when you keep saying things that you simply cannot deliver. On going back to figuring out what is your what are your values and what is the true value you bring? For instance, we do not do Pr.
00:26:53.860 --> 00:27:08.929 Rai-mon Nemar Barnes: For folks. We have clients all the time. Ask us like, can you just do the Pr for us? And we always say No, because if we tell them well, yeah, we can deliver, and then we don't, or we say we know what we're doing, and we kind of do.
00:27:09.210 --> 00:27:18.799 Rai-mon Nemar Barnes: But we don't. They're going to start losing trust. Blah blah! All the things start to fall in place. So this is how we came to the whole like, if we just stick to our own values.
00:27:19.180 --> 00:27:24.039 Rai-mon Nemar Barnes: if we just remember the value we bring, which is not the same value everybody else brings.
00:27:25.150 --> 00:27:26.189 Rai-mon Nemar Barnes: We'll be okay.
00:27:26.360 --> 00:27:30.269 clementinaesposito: Yeah. Yeah. And so it's so important, right? Like, it's like.
00:27:30.770 --> 00:27:32.869 clementinaesposito: if you don't have a no.
00:27:33.030 --> 00:27:35.169 clementinaesposito: you don't have a yes, either.
00:27:35.410 --> 00:27:39.450 Rai-mon Nemar Barnes: Yeah, we we tell folks all the time we'd rather lose a client than lose their trust.
00:27:39.710 --> 00:27:58.860 clementinaesposito: Right? Right? That's great. I love that we'd rather lose the client and lose their trust. Right? You see that all the time to like back in my old neighborhood. The restaurants, you know, like they the ones that just stuck to the thing they did. Well, you know, sometimes you'd see them like expand and try to get trendy on the restaurant. Next thing you know, they were like out of business, right.
00:27:59.165 --> 00:27:59.470 Rai-mon Nemar Barnes: Yeah.
00:27:59.470 --> 00:28:26.029 clementinaesposito: You know, right? It's like trying to be all, all things to all people, and you know that is just exhausting waters down, whatever it is that you do well, and that has been one of the blessings I have to say of you know, discovering. And we can talk more about this when we come back from an upcoming break in 1 min, you know, really coming out and being like, Yeah, you know, I have Adhd. So I'm freaking genius at XY and Z.
00:28:26.030 --> 00:28:37.009 clementinaesposito: But like, no, I'm not. Gonna do you know, and I and I realize all the ways in my past career that, you know I came off as aloof, or thinking I was above some task. It's like, Oh, no, I'm not above it, I can't do it.
00:28:37.841 --> 00:28:41.639 clementinaesposito: And if I and if I can, you really don't want me to. You know what I mean.
00:28:41.640 --> 00:28:43.010 Rai-mon Nemar Barnes: 100%. Yeah.
00:28:43.010 --> 00:28:56.919 clementinaesposito: Or the energy of myself after I have done. It is not good for anyone. You know what I mean. Right? So it's like, right, you know. How do we? I think that I think that's what you're talking about, too. It's like, it's an energetic thing. It's like, if I
00:28:57.840 --> 00:29:01.103 clementinaesposito: right, if I start going off and
00:29:02.050 --> 00:29:06.460 clementinaesposito: doing things that I don't that don't light me up.
00:29:06.820 --> 00:29:30.050 clementinaesposito: you know. Yes. Can I do them? And and is that what you know talk about the trifecta right? Is that really what I'm supposed to be doing is that you know what the best use of my instrument is, and you know, and yes, there are other people out there where that is what they should be doing. Let's just find all the right people. Put them in all the right places, and be honest
00:29:30.220 --> 00:29:40.079 clementinaesposito: and back to trust, right, communicate, and be forthcoming, and everybody will be all right. You know better than all right, right. Everybody can trust.
00:29:40.080 --> 00:29:40.800 Rai-mon Nemar Barnes: Thrive.
00:29:40.800 --> 00:29:51.290 clementinaesposito: You can thrive in that kind of environment. Yeah, that's amazing. I love that. So all right. So we're gonna go to break. And when we come back we're gonna talk about fear and scarcity. And oh, my God, I love this conversation.
00:29:51.290 --> 00:29:52.070 Rai-mon Nemar Barnes: Yeah.
00:29:52.070 --> 00:29:54.199 clementinaesposito: All right. Take it away.
00:31:34.080 --> 00:31:36.399 clementinaesposito: Hello! And welcome back.
00:31:37.320 --> 00:31:43.800 clementinaesposito: Alright! So this is such a great conversation. I'm I'm having so much fun.
00:31:43.800 --> 00:31:44.919 Rai-mon Nemar Barnes: Yeah. Back, how are you?
00:31:46.344 --> 00:31:47.109 clementinaesposito: So
00:31:47.300 --> 00:31:57.039 clementinaesposito: let's talk about it right? I mean, I'm so I mean, I think one of the reasons I've had so much trouble with my own marketing, I mean, it
00:31:57.821 --> 00:32:00.078 clementinaesposito: is sorry about that.
00:32:00.680 --> 00:32:08.629 clementinaesposito: Well, there's lots of there's lots of reasons for it. But but one of the one of them is really I I feel
00:32:10.070 --> 00:32:11.170 clementinaesposito: icky.
00:32:11.563 --> 00:32:36.319 clementinaesposito: You know, when you're learning how you know I was an academic, you know, and so talk about having to free your voice. You know you you write in, even though I was in English and writing, you know you write with your hands tied up behind your back. You know you can't. You know they can't see evidence of a human feeling human being in your work, you know. That's not what it's about, right. But I got some great chops. I got some great skills, but I had to unlearn that.
00:32:36.320 --> 00:32:48.359 clementinaesposito: and then trying to learn marketing. I just there's a there's a part, you know, every I would go to courses and workshops with, you know the gurus of marketing, you know. I even. Oh, my gosh! I even
00:32:48.560 --> 00:33:16.489 clementinaesposito: got involved with co-creating a book with a marketer, and you know, so I learned it. I know it, but I haven't been able to shake it like the formula of it, wanting to make me throw up more often than not at some point, you know, and I think, as a sensitive soul, and maybe it has to do with, you know, surviving some some trauma early on.
00:33:17.000 --> 00:33:21.040 clementinaesposito: I feel gross exploiting people's fears
00:33:21.763 --> 00:33:30.380 clementinaesposito: and insecurities, and you know it's it's it's just not in. It feels like it's not in my nature.
00:33:32.392 --> 00:33:51.409 clementinaesposito: So so talk to me about what you know as an as a real expert, you know, on you know the whole, the whole fear and scarcity. And and you know, are we really moving away from traditional marketing. And and
00:33:51.690 --> 00:33:59.199 clementinaesposito: and so so first, st I guess, why is that approach been so prevalent? It actually does work is the other thing I noticed.
00:33:59.530 --> 00:33:59.860 Rai-mon Nemar Barnes: Percent.
00:34:00.206 --> 00:34:11.279 clementinaesposito: You know, and and what. So what's the cost? Because it seems like everybody who can do it is winning so talk to me about all all that, all that stuff.
00:34:11.280 --> 00:34:22.190 Rai-mon Nemar Barnes: Yeah, I mean, I I do think this is less a matter of what works and what doesn't, and more a matter of what works for you, and what works for people. You know the way that you.
00:34:22.199 --> 00:34:24.519 clementinaesposito: Message again. There's that message again.
00:34:25.469 --> 00:34:36.199 Rai-mon Nemar Barnes: I think how a person wants to move. And I say a person, because I do think it's entrepreneurs as business people, even people that run very large companies. We forget that
00:34:36.339 --> 00:34:43.959 Rai-mon Nemar Barnes: companies aren't real things. They are groups of people. They are basically just communities that interact with other communities. So
00:34:44.499 --> 00:34:49.079 Rai-mon Nemar Barnes: figuring out how you want to move in the world, and what you want to be known for in the world
00:34:49.279 --> 00:34:55.459 Rai-mon Nemar Barnes: is very important, right? It's it's just. It's important. It's so important that
00:34:55.599 --> 00:35:03.769 Rai-mon Nemar Barnes: people are going to know you for that. And again, if you're Amazon, it doesn't mean people aren't going to do business with you, even though know you do some things that are unsavory.
00:35:04.599 --> 00:35:10.419 Rai-mon Nemar Barnes: And there are other people that are not going to do business with you. So part of it is just 1st recognizing.
00:35:10.819 --> 00:35:18.139 Rai-mon Nemar Barnes: at least from my standpoint. I'm not trying to judge you all day. Great! You're not going to get my dollars, but I don't have any need to do that.
00:35:18.509 --> 00:35:24.719 Rai-mon Nemar Barnes: because on this road of how do I figure out, where does this go
00:35:25.019 --> 00:35:26.779 Rai-mon Nemar Barnes: on the side of what to do
00:35:26.939 --> 00:35:29.909 Rai-mon Nemar Barnes: which I'll hold off for a second. We'll talk about improvisation.
00:35:30.469 --> 00:35:33.639 Rai-mon Nemar Barnes: It's the most important word I could teach you. Anyone.
00:35:33.640 --> 00:35:35.599 clementinaesposito: Always down to that improv.
00:35:35.600 --> 00:35:43.290 Rai-mon Nemar Barnes: About what about being authentic, about how do? How do I know what to say when it when the time comes
00:35:43.550 --> 00:35:45.649 Rai-mon Nemar Barnes: on the scarcity and fear piece.
00:35:46.390 --> 00:35:57.750 Rai-mon Nemar Barnes: I think there's kind of only a few ways to to avoid that. And also there are times to lean into it. There is a there is a such thing as healthy fear
00:35:58.530 --> 00:36:08.320 Rai-mon Nemar Barnes: to be absolutely clear. We are not a cheap agency, and we are not not busy meaning. We don't have infinite slots.
00:36:08.540 --> 00:36:31.850 Rai-mon Nemar Barnes: So if I send you a pitch, you do not have a year to decide. You do not have 6 months to decide. You have about a month or 2, maybe 3, before there's probably someone else who's going to take that spot. And so I am sending you an email to let you know that if I don't hear from you by this time you will probably not have that slot, and I am not using fear. I am letting you know.
00:36:32.270 --> 00:36:33.440 clementinaesposito: Right. You get first.st
00:36:33.440 --> 00:36:44.280 Rai-mon Nemar Barnes: I'm giving you information that will probably evoke some amount of anxiety in you, because if you want to work with us, you don't want to see that slot go away. I do think there's a such thing as appropriate fear. Yeah.
00:36:44.280 --> 00:36:50.839 Rai-mon Nemar Barnes: that's and I'm not using it in a nefarious way, with bad intent, right, however.
00:36:50.840 --> 00:37:04.610 clementinaesposito: Yeah, I'd even argue that, you know. Sometimes I I know someone like myself. I can become, you know. I can become overwhelmed, excited. All the things. And then, you know, taking that, I need that push to take that action right.
00:37:04.610 --> 00:37:05.420 Rai-mon Nemar Barnes: 100%.
00:37:05.420 --> 00:37:11.569 clementinaesposito: And I and and I actually feel in retrospect, like sometimes people fail me if
00:37:11.890 --> 00:37:16.699 clementinaesposito: they don't give me that push. If it's honest and genuine right? And it's coming
00:37:17.360 --> 00:37:34.689 clementinaesposito: right. We had this meeting. We were on fire, you know. We both know. You know, you're the best thing that's gonna happen to my business, you know, in the next 5 years, and I should act on it. But then, you know, after so, yeah, yeah, I got you.
00:37:34.760 --> 00:37:42.630 Rai-mon Nemar Barnes: And that lead, you know, it leads right into the other part. And we actually get this a lot. When we 1st started, people would call us brand therapists, they would say, you
00:37:43.180 --> 00:37:56.229 Rai-mon Nemar Barnes: sign up for this like this seems a little bit too deep. And frankly, I don't want this, and that's another reason why we actually push people to find out. Are they ready to do the work that we're gonna have to do.
00:37:56.230 --> 00:37:56.820 clementinaesposito: This.
00:37:56.820 --> 00:37:58.669 Rai-mon Nemar Barnes: The improv side right like.
00:37:58.900 --> 00:38:09.333 clementinaesposito: It's so. It's so important for for all that. I just had a conversation with one of my my business partnerships, where, you know, I. I get frustrated because you know, we we
00:38:11.770 --> 00:38:32.269 clementinaesposito: we sell the thing. And then the person is, you know, we're all ready to write a book and writing a book with someone is, no, you know, I tell. I tell people I'm like you are. You are renting a space in my heart and mind. Yes, I can clock the hours that I'm actually in your work, and I'm meeting with you, or whatever. But I'm thinking about it on my walks. I'm thinking about it in the shower. I'm thinking about it in my relationships.
00:38:32.820 --> 00:39:00.069 clementinaesposito: Right like writing a book is a, you know. So you go on again off again, or you commit to the thing I have to have space or make space for you, and you know so many people even pull the trigger even by the thing, and then they don't, you know, show up. So there's a level of commitment. So I'm wondering now this is a common theme coming up in my day, you know. How do you get?
00:39:00.600 --> 00:39:02.929 clementinaesposito: How do you get people to commit.
00:39:04.400 --> 00:39:04.970 Rai-mon Nemar Barnes: We.
00:39:04.970 --> 00:39:07.670 clementinaesposito: Trust right? It's connected.
00:39:07.670 --> 00:39:08.380 Rai-mon Nemar Barnes: He!
00:39:08.380 --> 00:39:10.460 clementinaesposito: Right, or vice versa.
00:39:10.460 --> 00:39:14.860 Rai-mon Nemar Barnes: I think part of it is, I'll speak for us and say we've just learned to not
00:39:14.980 --> 00:39:20.910 Rai-mon Nemar Barnes: get people to commit. We we find the people who are already committed, and they just want to do the work.
00:39:21.170 --> 00:39:23.709 Rai-mon Nemar Barnes: cause it's it is what it is right like.
00:39:23.710 --> 00:39:24.560 clementinaesposito: They can't force.
00:39:24.560 --> 00:39:26.820 Rai-mon Nemar Barnes: People into it. They they
00:39:26.990 --> 00:39:40.429 Rai-mon Nemar Barnes: they might want to do it, and they might have the best of intentions, but they're not ready until they're ready, and there's nothing anybody can do. This is the thing I'm always trying to talk to our clients about who are like we need more sales. And we're we're telling them. Listen.
00:39:40.690 --> 00:39:47.090 Rai-mon Nemar Barnes: if you think that we are actually convincing people to buy your thing.
00:39:47.090 --> 00:40:11.939 Rai-mon Nemar Barnes: you were absolutely wrong. If we could convince people to buy things we wouldn't be selling to any of our current clients we would call Oprah Winfrey, and say, Oprah, we know how to make people do the things they don't actually want to do, and we take all of our checks and be rich right now, if we could do that like, we wouldn't be working with everyone else. Right? But that's not what we do, and that's not what most marketers do. In the
00:40:11.940 --> 00:40:17.240 Rai-mon Nemar Barnes: 1st place, what we do is find what Linkedin and other folks who've done studies have found
00:40:17.430 --> 00:40:23.090 Rai-mon Nemar Barnes: of the entire market for any particular product. There's generally 95
00:40:23.300 --> 00:40:26.900 Rai-mon Nemar Barnes: percent of that market doesn't need it right then.
00:40:27.180 --> 00:40:33.960 Rai-mon Nemar Barnes: in any particular moment. In time they don't need your product. There's about 5% of that market that needs what you have right now.
00:40:34.250 --> 00:40:45.919 Rai-mon Nemar Barnes: Your job is to make sure you address 100% of the market as much as you can, so that when the other 5% change their mind and decide they need it. You're there, and you're who they choose.
00:40:45.920 --> 00:41:05.670 clementinaesposito: Isn't that so? Even just listening to that? The energy of that is so different. You actually, you actually oh, my God! This is such a marketing epiphany I'm having now. You actually don't want the people who need you right now, cause it's too desperate. It's too crazy. It's too Harry Carey, right.
00:41:05.670 --> 00:41:18.629 Rai-mon Nemar Barnes: You, hey? For us? You might need them. You might want them. It's just that you don't know who they are. So you just sound desperate, trying to even everybody. It's it's the. It's the it's the sale that's always happening right?
00:41:18.880 --> 00:41:21.460 Rai-mon Nemar Barnes: We're selling. We got money off well.
00:41:21.940 --> 00:41:27.549 Rai-mon Nemar Barnes: either those people are always only looking for sales, or they're only buying because there is a sale.
00:41:28.070 --> 00:41:31.279 Rai-mon Nemar Barnes: The people who actually need what you have.
00:41:32.000 --> 00:41:33.450 Rai-mon Nemar Barnes: They'll buy it regardless
00:41:33.560 --> 00:41:39.720 Rai-mon Nemar Barnes: if they actually need it, they'll they'll get it. They'll figure it out. But what you want to do is make sure that
00:41:40.090 --> 00:41:45.370 Rai-mon Nemar Barnes: regardless. And this is why I said, regardless whether it's 95% or the 5%. Just make sure everybody knows who you are.
00:41:45.840 --> 00:42:00.779 Rai-mon Nemar Barnes: And that's the hard part that takes resources. It takes time. You can't say it the same way all the time. You have to say it in different ways. You have to say it over time. You have to do it in all these different ways. And so that's really the hard piece around
00:42:01.380 --> 00:42:11.979 Rai-mon Nemar Barnes: being able to to reach audiences and and get them to connect with you in a way that that at least means something. And then you know this.
00:42:12.600 --> 00:42:21.530 Rai-mon Nemar Barnes: This idea of reaching folks and having them choose you
00:42:22.240 --> 00:42:27.819 Rai-mon Nemar Barnes: is, then comes back to well, was your was what you communicated resonant? Did it stick with them?
00:42:28.010 --> 00:42:28.930 clementinaesposito: Right, right.
00:42:28.930 --> 00:42:29.990 Rai-mon Nemar Barnes: To the beginning.
00:42:29.990 --> 00:42:38.250 clementinaesposito: Right? So we're gonna go to another break. But we're really now we're on the cusp. I feel like we are the breaking wave of abundance. Right here we are.
00:42:38.250 --> 00:42:39.170 Rai-mon Nemar Barnes: Yes.
00:42:39.170 --> 00:42:55.590 clementinaesposito: About to talk about, you know. So I feel like, just even as I noted that shift in energy is the difference between scarcity energy in the buy and abundant energy like, yep, I like this guy when I need that thing. I'm going to call him
00:42:55.880 --> 00:43:06.569 clementinaesposito: right. And you know, it's like when it's like I I look, you know, if I see a dress that I absolutely love, and I don't. You know. The best time to buy a dress is when you don't need a dress. You know what I mean like, who wants.
00:43:06.570 --> 00:43:07.670 Rai-mon Nemar Barnes: Yes, yes.
00:43:07.670 --> 00:43:12.280 clementinaesposito: They're like, Oh, my God! Right! And then you go out, and it's never quite right, you know it's not.
00:43:12.430 --> 00:43:20.600 clementinaesposito: You're just doing the or, you know, having to get a gift for someone because you have to as opposed to like an inspired. You know, it's it's very different.
00:43:20.710 --> 00:43:38.800 clementinaesposito: right? So I love this. You're putting so many of the pieces together for me. So thank you so much, and we're going to go to break now. And when we come back we're gonna I'd love to have an example from you of what what this abundant marketing looks, looks and sounds and feels and smells like. All right.
00:43:38.800 --> 00:43:39.260 Rai-mon Nemar Barnes: Yes.
00:43:39.260 --> 00:43:42.129 clementinaesposito: All right. Take us to break. Thank you.
00:45:13.360 --> 00:45:14.410 clementinaesposito: All right.
00:45:18.500 --> 00:45:21.230 clementinaesposito: Comment back online. Now, oops.
00:45:29.640 --> 00:45:39.690 clementinaesposito: All right, Raimon. We are back and we're talking about. Well, we're moving from scarcity marketing into abundant marketing.
00:45:39.930 --> 00:45:43.490 clementinaesposito: and I do want to get an example from from you.
00:45:44.068 --> 00:45:50.480 clementinaesposito: About. You know what abundant marketing looks like. Can you give me an example.
00:45:51.230 --> 00:45:53.930 Rai-mon Nemar Barnes: I can. I'll actually, I think I'll use
00:45:54.030 --> 00:46:01.159 Rai-mon Nemar Barnes: us as an example, my company, just because and I'll use us because it's more of a real world, I find.
00:46:01.310 --> 00:46:03.449 Rai-mon Nemar Barnes: you know, sometimes when you're using
00:46:03.590 --> 00:46:07.409 Rai-mon Nemar Barnes: Amazon and Apple and Ben and Jerry's, it's just too far to really.
00:46:07.410 --> 00:46:10.809 clementinaesposito: It's too far removed from like real everyday people.
00:46:10.810 --> 00:46:20.669 Rai-mon Nemar Barnes: And what's going on. So I'll use us as an example, and the name of our company is consciously so. The 1st thing that you can probably tell about me is I'm a thinker.
00:46:20.790 --> 00:46:28.410 Rai-mon Nemar Barnes: and I think things through quite a bit, and that should probably resonate when we talk about
00:46:28.860 --> 00:46:34.103 Rai-mon Nemar Barnes: consciously and the the goal for us is to really think about
00:46:35.230 --> 00:46:40.219 Rai-mon Nemar Barnes: being conscious the literal meaning of the word consciously. And so
00:46:40.400 --> 00:46:42.690 Rai-mon Nemar Barnes: what we do to kind of
00:46:43.220 --> 00:47:07.369 Rai-mon Nemar Barnes: come through like, what's the formula? I'll couch it in. What's the formula in this example and the formula for us, and what we teach our clients is to come up with what is called a call to action, and not the kind of call to action we're used to on, say, an e-commerce site by now. Click this button read more. We're talking about a call to action that your company has upon the world, or that your person has upon the world.
00:47:07.410 --> 00:47:19.079 Rai-mon Nemar Barnes: What is it you would tell everybody. So this is the big brand version, right? Nike's call to action is, do it, or just do it, or whatever. But our call to action is, do it consciously.
00:47:20.180 --> 00:47:29.599 Rai-mon Nemar Barnes: And how does so? How does that apply? What does that mean? So when we talk to our clients, we say, do it consciously, they say, Well, what do you mean? What should we do? Consciously? And we're like, yes.
00:47:31.420 --> 00:47:32.689 Rai-mon Nemar Barnes: think it through.
00:47:32.870 --> 00:47:40.160 Rai-mon Nemar Barnes: You want to do a campaign. Let's think it through. You want to rebrand your website. Let's think it through. Let's measure
00:47:40.250 --> 00:48:04.990 Rai-mon Nemar Barnes: twice and cut once, as I told you before, like this is not the New York way of New Yorkers. Let's be clear about that. The average New Yorker is going to say, please get it. Now we measured already. We're not measuring again. Let's go. Do the thing. Please stop stalling. Let's go. And our job is to say we heard you. We do hear you. We get. You're in a rush. We need to slow down
00:48:05.220 --> 00:48:11.660 Rai-mon Nemar Barnes: just a little bit, not forever. But right now we need to slow down, measure again and make sure this is what we want
00:48:12.050 --> 00:48:14.540 Rai-mon Nemar Barnes: before we do the thing. Because
00:48:16.320 --> 00:48:23.870 Rai-mon Nemar Barnes: when you ask for the right thing, we're going to go back to values and value when you ask for the right thing, and you're able to. And we're able to say, Call upon the world
00:48:24.010 --> 00:48:27.510 Rai-mon Nemar Barnes: consciously, yes, we would go.
00:48:36.710 --> 00:48:38.389 Rai-mon Nemar Barnes: You can. Told me over again.
00:48:39.670 --> 00:48:43.280 Rai-mon Nemar Barnes: Yeah, where can I just come in? I should not be.
00:48:43.600 --> 00:48:44.320 Rai-mon Nemar Barnes: Yep.
00:48:45.120 --> 00:48:50.809 Rai-mon Nemar Barnes: Well, she and she and maybe he yeah call him back do it.
00:48:52.800 --> 00:49:02.340 Rai-mon Nemar Barnes: but I should have brought, like my my and
00:49:02.460 --> 00:49:07.309 Rai-mon Nemar Barnes: the fashion design book that Miss Elvis gave me to put all my fashion design.
00:49:08.000 --> 00:49:16.900 Rai-mon Nemar Barnes: I should have brought it to after, because I was kind of bored. Oh, by the way, I forgot about this, I forgot about this, but but in Africa. I fell in the bathroom and got it.
00:49:17.100 --> 00:49:18.020 JACK THOMAS : Well, we're in a break.
00:49:18.020 --> 00:49:21.449 Rai-mon Nemar Barnes: Go grab your journal. The beauty of.
00:49:21.450 --> 00:49:21.960 JACK THOMAS : Conscious.
00:49:21.960 --> 00:49:22.640 Rai-mon Nemar Barnes: And I'm gonna finish.
00:49:22.640 --> 00:49:25.090 JACK THOMAS : Is it? We could see the beautiful young lady.
00:49:25.685 --> 00:49:26.280 Rai-mon Nemar Barnes: Oh!
00:49:26.830 --> 00:49:28.999 JACK THOMAS : If we could see this beautiful young lady.
00:49:29.060 --> 00:49:30.449 Rai-mon Nemar Barnes: This is Zady.
00:49:30.840 --> 00:49:31.840 JACK THOMAS : What's what's your name?
00:49:32.870 --> 00:49:34.050 Rai-mon Nemar Barnes: Zady.
00:49:34.050 --> 00:49:34.939 JACK THOMAS : Zady, so.
00:49:34.940 --> 00:49:35.740 clementinaesposito: Love, that.
00:49:35.740 --> 00:49:43.790 JACK THOMAS : You're beautiful, are you the future marketeer that gonna help all of us to consciously be as beautiful as you
00:49:47.790 --> 00:49:50.370 JACK THOMAS : can. We have permission to finish up with that.
00:49:51.510 --> 00:49:56.390 Rai-mon Nemar Barnes: Yeah, can we finish our call what we're gonna finish our call? Yeah? All right. Thank you.
00:49:57.360 --> 00:49:58.780 clementinaesposito: Thank you, Zadie.
00:50:01.580 --> 00:50:03.020 clementinaesposito: I love that name.
00:50:03.310 --> 00:50:06.884 clementinaesposito: I know one awesome writer, Zady.
00:50:07.700 --> 00:50:08.730 Rai-mon Nemar Barnes: Lady Smith.
00:50:08.730 --> 00:50:10.990 clementinaesposito: Is, that was that the was that the inspiration.
00:50:10.990 --> 00:50:12.320 Rai-mon Nemar Barnes: Jamie Smith. Yeah, it was.
00:50:12.320 --> 00:50:14.709 clementinaesposito: I prove wholeheartedly, wholeheartedly.
00:50:14.710 --> 00:50:17.620 Rai-mon Nemar Barnes: Amazing, and so is my daughter. Yes, it's amazing.
00:50:17.630 --> 00:50:18.900 Rai-mon Nemar Barnes: Alright! Where were we.
00:50:18.900 --> 00:50:22.330 clementinaesposito: Alright. So we were talking about you know.
00:50:23.230 --> 00:50:24.560 clementinaesposito: Well, who are we talking.
00:50:24.560 --> 00:50:27.750 Rai-mon Nemar Barnes: We? Oh, we were just talking about the call to action, and.
00:50:27.750 --> 00:50:31.309 clementinaesposito: Right, not not a call to action like by now.
00:50:31.700 --> 00:50:33.970 Rai-mon Nemar Barnes: A call to action upon the world, because what.
00:50:34.460 --> 00:50:55.189 clementinaesposito: Example of that. How would you say what is your your call is? Do it consciously right? Don't market consciously, and and I guess that can have a dual meaning right like both. Don't, don't you know? Don't sell your marketing unconscious, you know, unconsciously be conscious about yourself and your consumers right, and and also
00:50:55.578 --> 00:51:06.979 clementinaesposito: when you're the one branding and creating right like, it's better to do it consciously, because we're doing it right. We talk, you know Jack and I were talking about the subconscious a lot last weekend right?
00:51:07.340 --> 00:51:10.670 clementinaesposito: Your subconscious is running the show, anyway.
00:51:11.310 --> 00:51:24.469 Rai-mon Nemar Barnes: Yes, yes, and this, this takes us back to the values right? If you can figure out the scripts running, this is a great way to say it even better way to say, if you can figure out the scripts running in your subconscious and sell that to folks.
00:51:24.650 --> 00:51:41.009 Rai-mon Nemar Barnes: Guess what. One day. There's a script that they don't know about. That's gonna run, and all you're going to do is follow through on something you already told them. That's why we say do it consciously, because for us all we're doing is saying, Oh, you wanted to go fast. Yeah. Remember, we said, we do it consciously.
00:51:41.010 --> 00:51:41.450 clementinaesposito: Right.
00:51:41.450 --> 00:51:55.610 Rai-mon Nemar Barnes: Works. It cuts the other way, too. So we talk about trust. All this stuff. It definitely cuts the other way from the standpoint of when we say we're going to do it consciously, and we just throw something out to the world and don't think about it. We lose trust.
00:51:55.910 --> 00:52:01.029 Rai-mon Nemar Barnes: We are now showing up how we said we were not going to show up. We are now being who we said we were not.
00:52:01.720 --> 00:52:20.350 clementinaesposito: So it also, doesn't it sort of when you put your stake in the ground? That also must do something to your own? You know that we all know that at some level, which is why I think some people don't commit to a way of being right, because then they're like I got to be that way all the time.
00:52:21.720 --> 00:52:26.389 Rai-mon Nemar Barnes: Well, and I think it's a matter, though, of yes, but
00:52:26.720 --> 00:52:29.319 Rai-mon Nemar Barnes: is it? Yes, but or yes, and yes, and.
00:52:29.540 --> 00:52:30.269 clementinaesposito: Yes, and.
00:52:30.270 --> 00:52:31.420 Rai-mon Nemar Barnes: Yes, and
00:52:33.500 --> 00:52:50.259 Rai-mon Nemar Barnes: if you have done the job of figuring out you, that's all you were going to do. In the 1st place, you're always going to be that person. That's why it's important. You figure out who you can be, and I'll go back to my analogy. When my younger self I was definitely trying to be more like Martin than Malcolm
00:52:51.000 --> 00:52:51.710 Rai-mon Nemar Barnes: always.
00:52:51.710 --> 00:52:57.210 clementinaesposito: Thought you thought it was better to be like that, or your conditioning. You know what? What, why.
00:52:57.210 --> 00:53:00.270 Rai-mon Nemar Barnes: I mean, I would say simply, who doesn't want to be liked.
00:53:00.530 --> 00:53:01.660 clementinaesposito: Right, right.
00:53:01.660 --> 00:53:07.130 Rai-mon Nemar Barnes: Which we can know. We can know that everyone is not going to like us and still do things
00:53:07.340 --> 00:53:12.590 Rai-mon Nemar Barnes: that make sure we are not. We aren't going to be like no one
00:53:12.960 --> 00:53:28.429 Rai-mon Nemar Barnes: is going to put themselves in a position, you know. Not no one. Obviously lots of people do. But it's not comfortable. And it's not something you usually need into to say. Oh, yeah, people aren't gonna like me. I'm cool with that. It's just it takes a while, I think, to get there. However.
00:53:28.430 --> 00:53:35.499 clementinaesposito: Or some kind of, or some something that I mean. I think for me. It was like, you know, I said, There, there's
00:53:36.050 --> 00:53:47.830 clementinaesposito: you know I was always trying to be the good, the good girl, you know, and and make my papa proud, and not step out of the lines that you know, that were scripted for me, and I've never really been.
00:53:48.488 --> 00:53:58.929 clementinaesposito: you know, as a kid like I would just when I would let something rip. You know they would. Uproarious laughter first, st you know, and then it was put a lid on it. Put a lid on it, you know. You're gonna.
00:53:58.930 --> 00:53:59.410 Rai-mon Nemar Barnes: Right.
00:53:59.410 --> 00:54:07.520 clementinaesposito: You're gonna get in trouble. You're gonna you know. And so that mixed message was really sort of paralyzing right? Right?
00:54:07.520 --> 00:54:09.560 Rai-mon Nemar Barnes: We'll we'll put try to put you back.
00:54:09.560 --> 00:54:16.519 clementinaesposito: Exactly. And so you know, I mean, I think you know in in it took it took me a long time, you know. It took me like, you know.
00:54:16.720 --> 00:54:31.139 clementinaesposito: almost, you know it was my late forties when I was like. Life's too short, you know, and then I went into my villain era like I just started, you know, being, and everybody had something to say about it, and I became the villain in many people's story. But guess what
00:54:31.410 --> 00:54:36.600 clementinaesposito: I couldn't become the hero in my own until I was willing to be the villain in other people.
00:54:36.600 --> 00:54:37.390 Rai-mon Nemar Barnes: Yes.
00:54:37.390 --> 00:55:01.909 clementinaesposito: And and that was such a liberating experience. You know. So but yeah, I hear you. I hear you. That's that's sometimes yeah. And I. And I think we see that. And especially when we go out to market, we, we emulate other companies. And we wanna we're like, oh, I like that, and I like this, and I like that, and we can come off very, you know, stiff and scripted so.
00:55:02.160 --> 00:55:03.369 Rai-mon Nemar Barnes: Yeah, I'm good.
00:55:04.000 --> 00:55:09.860 Rai-mon Nemar Barnes: you know, until I think you get to that point. And I I do think you can. You can
00:55:09.970 --> 00:55:13.137 Rai-mon Nemar Barnes: think it until you make it. I don't necessarily
00:55:13.910 --> 00:55:31.250 Rai-mon Nemar Barnes: try to do that, but I think when you aren't you yet you kind of have no choice. You don't know how to make it, because you don't really know really where you want to be yet, or maybe you don't articulate it. So you just get there is how, however, you can get there, but being on this side of it, I will say 100%
00:55:32.050 --> 00:55:37.929 Rai-mon Nemar Barnes: I love when I meet people that don't necessarily dig me and my message, because now I can move on.
00:55:38.160 --> 00:55:38.780 clementinaesposito: Right.
00:55:38.910 --> 00:55:42.030 Rai-mon Nemar Barnes: Not waste their time. Not waste my time. We're both going to win.
00:55:42.030 --> 00:55:51.264 clementinaesposito: Ex 100%. Alright. We only have a few minutes left, and oh, my gosh! I have so many more questions I want to ask you. But I'm gonna just I'm gonna ask you one more, and then we'll we'll we'll
00:55:51.810 --> 00:55:57.900 clementinaesposito: will say Chivadiamo, which in Italian means will until I see you again. Basically.
00:55:57.900 --> 00:55:58.740 Rai-mon Nemar Barnes: I love it! Oh.
00:55:58.740 --> 00:56:21.279 clementinaesposito: This is definitely not our last conversation. So at the hoppy spot we talk a lot about biohacking, which, when you really look, you know, maybe sounds all scientific and neurosciency. But when you really break it down, it's about, you know how you can optimize your body and mind. And the more this becomes a thing, the more
00:56:22.470 --> 00:56:42.020 clementinaesposito: interesting things are fitting into that. You know, a biohack kind of thing. So I'm curious. Have you noticed ways? Entrepreneurs can biohack their marketing mindset? Or are there little business rituals you've seen help people market with more clarity, or really kind of.
00:56:42.210 --> 00:56:47.140 clementinaesposito: you know, land in their own bodies and selves, and you know what what.
00:56:47.140 --> 00:56:47.650 Rai-mon Nemar Barnes: Yes.
00:56:47.650 --> 00:56:49.500 clementinaesposito: Yeah, so share. Please.
00:56:49.790 --> 00:57:08.489 Rai-mon Nemar Barnes: I would say, picking things that they've said all their lives or things. They wear a lot, and using that as a tactic. I know a gentleman who wears a red jacket like everywhere, and people know him for it. I know people that will just always say a certain thing. I always say like word. It's from
00:57:09.050 --> 00:57:12.050 Rai-mon Nemar Barnes: from the hip. Hop times like I, you know, you just say word, and
00:57:12.470 --> 00:57:35.300 Rai-mon Nemar Barnes: that's what you say, and people kind of know that about me. There's just things that you can say or do, or wear, and make it yours. You have a style that you had when I 1st met you, and you have now, like, I think, making those things. Yours is just as important as like your values is just as important as your value, and all the other things we talked about. They all kind of go hand in hand.
00:57:35.910 --> 00:57:43.480 clementinaesposito: Yeah, that's awesome. All right. So you've given us so much wisdom today. And for anyone who is listening that wants to
00:57:43.600 --> 00:57:48.399 clementinaesposito: make one meaningful change. What can they do immediately.
00:57:49.390 --> 00:57:55.269 Rai-mon Nemar Barnes: Oh, man, speak your truth, find it, grab it, say it.
00:57:55.890 --> 00:58:10.050 clementinaesposito: That's awesome. I love it. I love it. I love it, everybody you can. You can find Ramon and his team@consciouslyinc.com the links to him there, and to Linkedin, or in the show notes. Jack, do you want to say anything to wrap us up.
00:58:14.430 --> 00:58:29.169 JACK THOMAS : I'm just so grateful for the energy. The 2 of you, and the marketing, and and still having hope and prayer that there are people out there like Ramon that still give me value and belief that we can be saved in our marketing lives.
00:58:29.170 --> 00:58:49.719 JACK THOMAS : With that being, said Ramon hopefully. Later this week we can get together for that drink we talked about. I look to go even deeper in the conversation. Clementina. We're sitting here in New York City. We have 3 engineers, 2 are in training, and we're just sitting here just smiling with glee when you make reference to
00:58:49.720 --> 00:59:00.179 JACK THOMAS : your New York style while we have Ramon's patients coming to us with that being said from the happy spot, Jack Thomas, so grateful for everybody.
00:59:00.320 --> 00:59:01.670 JACK THOMAS : live conscious.
00:59:03.370 --> 00:59:04.210 Rai-mon Nemar Barnes: Thank you.
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