Thursdays 5:00pm - 6:00pm (EDT)
EPISODE SUMMARY:
The audience will get an expansion of the show from last week where David Yang and I reflected on the main healthcare disruptors mentioned in Marschall Runge's Book The Great Healthcare Disruption.
In the 3rd installment of this book promotion, this episode of Frank About Health aims to expand on a very informative interview held last week with David Yang and Myself and in this instance Dr. Marschall Runge will also be in attendance.
Last week's episode brought to light the need for Next Generation Therapies, GLP1 drugs, Artificial Intelligence as well a detailed discussion on how the Pharmacies post pandemic are being redesigned to also do the diagnosing and testing especially with the various healthcare cuts that we are faced with in the current administration.
In this installment we talk more in-depth about CRISPR gene therapy as well as continue to take on additional questions from the listeners and viewers.
Dr. Marschall Runge
Website: https://drmarschallrunge.com/
LinkedIN: https://www.linkedin.com/in/marschallsrunge/
Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/people/Marschall-Runge-MD-PhD/61552211200167/
Books: https://drmarschallrunge.com/books/
David Yang
LinkedIN: https://www.linkedin.com/in/drdavidlyang/
Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/dlyang
Most Recent Professional Site: https://seegeneus.com/staff-member/david-yang/
#Healthcaredisruption, #CRISPR, #vaccines
Tune in for this healthy conversation at TalkRadio.nyc
In this fourth installment on The Great Healthcare Disruption, host Frank R. Harrison welcomes back Dr. Marschall Runge and David Yang, PhD, for a deep dive into vaccine innovation and the potential of CRISPR gene editing. David shares insights from his career in medical technology and emphasizes the transformative role mRNA played during COVID-19, while Dr. Runge reflects on Operation Warp Speed’s groundbreaking coordination and impact. Together, they argue that disruption is not only inevitable in healthcare—it’s essential for innovation, resilience, and future readiness.
Frank R. Harrison, Dr. Marschall Runge, and David Yang continue their conversation on healthcare disruption by exploring the lasting impact of mRNA vaccine innovation on diseases like HIV, cancer, and even hard-to-treat illnesses like pancreatic cancer. They also highlight the benefits and concerns surrounding the decentralization of care—such as CVS-administered vaccines—and how convenience, access, and equity intersect in today's health system. The discussion ends with a passionate case for reintegrating health education into K–12 curricula to inspire the next generation of medical professionals amid ongoing industry burnout.
Dr. Marschall Runge and David Yang join Frank R. Harrison to discuss how future pandemics are a real possibility and how political and financial forces may hinder scientific progress in mRNA research, vaccine access, and medical preparedness. They emphasize that effective healthcare decisions must come from firsthand provider experience—not top-down, disconnected policymaking—and stress the urgency of clear public health communication to prevent misinformation. For those feeling vulnerable in the face of healthcare disruption, they recommend trusted sources like Sanjay Gupta and Eric Topol for accurate, accessible information that empowers individuals to stay grounded and proactive.
Frank, Dr. Marschall Runge, and David Yang close their four-part series by spotlighting CRISPR, a groundbreaking gene-editing innovation that has already saved an infant's life and marks a leap toward personalized medicine. They emphasize that this breakthrough—made possible through advanced manufacturing, next-gen sequencing, and AI—signals the beginning of scalable, patient-specific treatment for genetic diseases. Despite systemic healthcare disruptions, the conversation ends with optimism that scientific collaboration, adaptability, and emerging tools like CRISPR will reshape healthcare accessibility and outcomes for the better.
00:00:53.450 --> 00:01:17.090 Frank R. Harrison: Good afternoon, everybody, and welcome to another episode of Frank about health and the 4th installment of the great healthcare disruption, as you see on your upper left or upper right, depending on which portion of zoom you're looking at. You can see that this book is still on sale@amazon.com. Please feel free during the hour to use the QR. Code right there. A lot of you have been doing it already on Linkedin.
00:01:17.090 --> 00:01:39.889 Frank R. Harrison: I want to thank you all for that, and at the same time I'm pleased to bring back Marshall Runji, who had been here during week, one with Phyllis Quinlan, and I'm also pleased to bring back David Yang, who was here last week to cover the book in detail, because I've already read the book 4 times, and I was able at the same time to really go into not a debate, but a real full length discussion
00:01:39.890 --> 00:01:42.640 Frank R. Harrison: about chapters 2, 4, and 6 last week.
00:01:42.640 --> 00:02:12.260 Frank R. Harrison: So tonight we have brought Marshall back because we understand from all you out there that you really learned a lot from what we discussed. But now you're going to get even in more enhanced information from the author himself. So we had to do this show. There was no question. Simultaneously we're going to add a special bonus. And that is the topic of Crispr, a gene editing technology which can help a lot of individuals depending on their illness, depending on what part of stage of life they're in. But that's the best for less. So, more on that later
00:02:12.580 --> 00:02:16.419 Frank R. Harrison: I always issue a disclaimer on Frank about health, because obviously
00:02:16.820 --> 00:02:31.609 Frank R. Harrison: this is not a political show. I do not wish to bring up any political debate or anything that would be controversial in nature. I also don't want to violate hipaa laws. So there's a lot of other reasons why we do not advocate specific issues that might
00:02:31.840 --> 00:02:43.100 Frank R. Harrison: affects someone personally. So that being said, these are not the views of Talkradio, Dot, Nyc. Or of Frank about health, but they are the views mentioned in this very important book.
00:02:43.320 --> 00:03:00.840 Frank R. Harrison: So if there are things that you just don't agree with. You're obviously not going to buy the book. Therefore all I can say is for everyone out there who has a lot to learn who has already been learning and will learn even more. Today I promise you that you will find that this show is going to be as thoughtful and as
00:03:00.870 --> 00:03:26.220 Frank R. Harrison: real information presented to you as possible. And of course it's open to debate. So feel free if you're watching on Linkedin twitch. Facebook or Youtube feel free to ask us questions, live at any time during the hour Marshall and myself and David are here to answer them as best as we can, but we all know that the person that will definitely get the information on point is Dr. Marshall Runji.
00:03:26.220 --> 00:03:37.730 Frank R. Harrison: David, I have not done you the service of fully talking about your background, and I know that I leave that just up to you to handle and manage as you see fit. But.
00:03:37.730 --> 00:03:38.320 David Yang: Sure.
00:03:38.320 --> 00:04:02.739 Frank R. Harrison: Everyone knows that you and I went to high school together. That was your introduction to Frank about health, but simultaneously they have begun to learn that you're also a very innovative medical technology expert. You worked with a company that I will leave nameless until you choose to mention it, and at the same time you have years of experience, and a Phd. I might add, from the Albert Einstein School of Medicine here in New York City.
00:04:02.740 --> 00:04:12.659 David Yang: No, no, no, no, no! So after Brooklyn Tech I actually spent college. I went to Brooklyn College, but I wound up going to Emory University in Atlanta.
00:04:12.850 --> 00:04:16.070 David Yang: and my Phd. Is in physical chemistry.
00:04:16.180 --> 00:04:20.079 David Yang: It was funded by NASA. We're looking at the atmosphere of Titan
00:04:20.290 --> 00:04:24.030 David Yang: so completely different than I'm doing today.
00:04:24.130 --> 00:04:26.249 Frank R. Harrison: And it was very exciting.
00:04:26.600 --> 00:04:29.199 David Yang: And I still wish I was doing that
00:04:29.310 --> 00:04:45.579 David Yang: field a little bit of astronomy, a little bit of gas based kinetics. But what I wound up doing was applying some of the techniques that we use specifically, laser induced fluorescence for those studies for life sciences. So I.
00:04:45.580 --> 00:04:46.300 Frank R. Harrison: Interesting.
00:04:46.300 --> 00:04:51.119 David Yang: Yep. I moved to California and I started working in a company called Beckman Coulter.
00:04:51.776 --> 00:04:58.600 David Yang: and we built a DNA sequencer based on laser induced fluorescence technology back in the nineties.
00:04:59.540 --> 00:04:59.960 Frank R. Harrison: Christ.
00:04:59.960 --> 00:05:11.359 David Yang: Back. Then Marshall will get a kick out of this. One of our biggest achievements was we were able to sequence 500 bases at 98% accuracy in 2 h.
00:05:11.360 --> 00:05:11.980 Marschall Runge: Wow!
00:05:12.260 --> 00:05:21.889 David Yang: Yes, now you can do that same thing in nanoseconds, in picoseconds. It's gone. The rate of sequencing has gone up
00:05:22.290 --> 00:05:37.360 David Yang: 10 orders, 15 orders of magnitude in my life, so that you can actually now sequence the whole genome in 2 h rather than 500 bases. But back then the state of the art was not what it is today.
00:05:37.360 --> 00:05:38.499 Frank R. Harrison: That's true. That's true.
00:05:39.250 --> 00:05:45.839 David Yang: And anyway, so I worked with a company called Beckman Coulter. It was acquired by Danaher Corporation.
00:05:46.080 --> 00:05:53.499 David Yang: and during the course of my career there I was really building a medical devices.
00:05:54.090 --> 00:06:00.930 David Yang: And then, towards the latter part of the career there I was looking at disruptive technologies.
00:06:01.050 --> 00:06:20.219 David Yang: the great healthcare disruption. So one of my jobs, ironically, was figuring out, how could we break our company if someone was going to come in and take away our business? It's better for us to figure out what that is rather than somebody else, so that we can react to it. So I had actually a fun job.
00:06:20.470 --> 00:06:23.049 Frank R. Harrison: That's all. I was form of preventative medicine in a.
00:06:23.050 --> 00:06:24.540 David Yang: No, that's right. That's right.
00:06:25.300 --> 00:06:26.060 Frank R. Harrison: And.
00:06:26.060 --> 00:06:44.740 David Yang: And as we'll talk about it later, Danaher played a critical role in the recent Crispr breakthrough that was actually in the news literally a week ago when it 1st hit the news. But the last thing I want to know I want to let people know is that I retired from Danaher on my 10,000th day.
00:06:45.140 --> 00:06:55.479 David Yang: So I challenge anyone to plan your career to end on 10,000 point 0 days. There's a funny story around that, and how I
00:06:55.600 --> 00:07:10.159 David Yang: came to that. But it turns out that I was able to retire from that company at 10,000 days to look for, to do other things, really, because it's getting a little tired of being the same place. So so that's what I've been. That's what I had been doing. Yep.
00:07:10.360 --> 00:07:20.880 Frank R. Harrison: Forgive me. I don't know where Albert Einstein medicine came from. It's probably something I was reading in in. I looked up Google, and I got that as a search engine, so I apologize.
00:07:20.880 --> 00:07:21.940 Frank R. Harrison: Not that smart.
00:07:22.678 --> 00:07:29.460 David Yang: I know a lot of people who went to Einstein. These are brilliant people. Yes, I just have a Phd. So yes.
00:07:29.460 --> 00:07:31.901 Frank R. Harrison: That's awesome. So you're also a doctor.
00:07:32.250 --> 00:07:42.295 David Yang: I am a doctor, but, as my daughter says, I'm not a real doctor as opposed to Marshall, someone as well. Someone has a heart attack. I think I know what to do, but I can't diagnose anything.
00:07:43.013 --> 00:07:43.919 Frank R. Harrison: Well, David.
00:07:43.920 --> 00:07:56.120 Marschall Runge: Your quote about looking forward with Nanneher reminds me of that famous quote. I think it's about Smith Corona, typewriters that they perfected the perfect typewriter. At about the time the PC. Came along
00:07:57.090 --> 00:07:58.510 Marschall Runge: we weren't thinking ahead.
00:07:58.510 --> 00:07:58.840 David Yang: Yes.
00:07:58.840 --> 00:08:00.070 Marschall Runge: You obviously were.
00:08:00.290 --> 00:08:02.889 David Yang: Yes, you, incredible. Yeah.
00:08:03.280 --> 00:08:27.320 Frank R. Harrison: Well, you know, come to think of it, even from what the both of you just said, it kind of fits the title of this show. I think we were following up David on vaccines and pharmacies, and of course introducing Crispr, but I also did a subtitle disruptor or or disruptor. ER. And you can see that the introductions that are in itself show that, especially in the field of health and wellness.
00:08:27.550 --> 00:08:45.999 Frank R. Harrison: we end up naturally, being disrupted by circumstances, life, events, we all were disrupted by Covid, so forth, and so on. So it becomes a mother of invention, necessity, while at the same time it. And like I said, I think on the show we did with Phyllis Marshall, that healthcare is probably the most entrepreneurial
00:08:46.000 --> 00:09:09.610 Frank R. Harrison: profession that anyone can be in, whether it's a business orientation, or whether it's just professionally in the way you think and the way you have to multitask, and things like that. So disruption in health and wellness is actually a necessity. That's what I that's what I view. But more later on the show about the disruptor aspects of things which, of course, this book is hoping, or to help us mitigate.
00:09:09.620 --> 00:09:23.420 Frank R. Harrison: All right. So I think that was a 5 min introduction to this show, but I think it was very fitting. It gave us a chance to meet David much more in depth. And of course, Marshall, you are a regular on Frank about health at this point.
00:09:23.820 --> 00:09:46.519 Frank R. Harrison: So I'm looking forward to following up on the conversations that we had with David last week, and for him to ask additional questions that he didn't probably didn't have the chance that I know you could better qualify. And again, all of you out there. Please get ready to ask us questions, because this book is very important, and we want to do what we can to help drive traffic to Amazon, as well as
00:09:46.960 --> 00:10:00.550 Frank R. Harrison: all of us understanding how to manage the great healthcare, so that, all being said, both of you welcome to Frank about health. And I guess, why don't we just start talking about vaccines, because I think vaccines was where we left off last week. David.
00:10:01.590 --> 00:10:23.219 David Yang: Yeah. So you know, preventative care, as Marshall talked about in the book is really, you know, is really should be a cornerstone, you know wellness, care rather than reactive to a disease or some illness. You know, that hits you so so vaccinations have played a critical role in the past.
00:10:23.820 --> 00:10:27.249 David Yang: and should and will continue to play a critical role.
00:10:27.400 --> 00:10:49.249 David Yang: And one of the things that Marshall. Now, you know, it's kind of funny I'm speaking for Marshall, because he's right here. But the Mrna, you know, vaccinations are really really is a game changer. Everything associated with Mrna is a game changer, because that even during covid
00:10:49.280 --> 00:10:59.779 David Yang: without the Mrna diagnostic tools. If you used. If you rely on an immuno response and measuring immuno, we probably couldn't diagnose Covid
00:10:59.990 --> 00:11:12.540 David Yang: definitively for many many months, and similarly for the vaccinations. If we had relied on, you know, growing the antibodies to it.
00:11:12.800 --> 00:11:13.400 Frank R. Harrison: Right.
00:11:13.400 --> 00:11:13.990 David Yang: Yep.
00:11:14.970 --> 00:11:17.113 Frank R. Harrison: I mean that that was in itself
00:11:17.800 --> 00:11:37.389 Frank R. Harrison: an interesting time, you know. New York was the epicenter for the Covid pandemic here in the States, and all I could say is that those 5 months of lockdown were in itself traumatic. But at the same time we're probably my most innovative and creative. That's when I chose to come back to Frank about health after being on the show in 20, I mean on the network in 2016.
00:11:37.390 --> 00:11:48.930 Frank R. Harrison: But simultaneously I found myself being a caregiver, while also getting covid and trying to incubate myself from being the transmitter to a recovering cancer patient, and not to mention
00:11:48.980 --> 00:12:13.289 Frank R. Harrison: 2 elderly parents that you know it was. It was a scary time, but the thing is is when operation warp speed took effect. I was like on a mission to make sure that everyone was getting their vaccine. I I signed them all up, including myself. I even said, Give me all my prerequisites, because I'm not of their age yet, or they were going, you know, from top down age category. But I made sure I got it when they got it because I was in the home
00:12:13.410 --> 00:12:31.870 Frank R. Harrison: doing caregiving so to become almost like militant about it, if that's the right word to use. It just showed me that I had to be a fighter and a healthcare advocate, you know for myself as well as for my family and everyone else. But when we're all turned into
00:12:31.870 --> 00:12:44.720 Frank R. Harrison: those kind of robots just to fight for each day at a time. That kind of puts you on a mercy mission, and, like you said, without any quick diagnosis or without the Mrna vaccine.
00:12:44.800 --> 00:13:09.689 Frank R. Harrison: We're all left to fend for ourselves continuously, you know, and and I think that's why I love this book so much, because, even if we do face God forbid another pandemic, we at least have a manual to guide us into, where to look and and what it is we need to do. Wow! I can't believe it. 2 min to break. Is there anything else you were going to say about vaccines before we go to the break, and then we can continue on when we return.
00:13:10.230 --> 00:13:13.923 David Yang: I was gonna defer to Marshall, because I know he's got a lot to say.
00:13:14.170 --> 00:13:18.860 Marschall Runge: Oh, I'll make a I'll make a less than 2 min comment. Frank and David.
00:13:19.420 --> 00:13:30.880 Marschall Runge: you know, operation on warp speed, which was largely directed by a fantastic person named Paul Mango, who unfortunately passed away. He was deputy chief of staff for policy.
00:13:31.420 --> 00:13:32.970 Marschall Runge: and Hhs.
00:13:33.110 --> 00:13:45.060 Marschall Runge: In the Trump administration. He had a background that led him to be able to bring together the forces to make this entirely novel. Take this entirely novel approach to making vaccines.
00:13:45.230 --> 00:13:57.809 Marschall Runge: The technology was there, but it never been actualized, and they did that in operation warp speed, and it was transformative. And I think a lesson learned as there's now talk about. Well, should we
00:13:58.030 --> 00:14:01.370 Marschall Runge: use the conventional method of testing vaccines?
00:14:01.750 --> 00:14:17.730 Marschall Runge: We no longer have the conventional method of making vaccines. So we need to think about in the future. What's the appropriate approach to testing Rna vaccines? And they have been? They were highly efficacious, worldwide in terms of covid and really much of that
00:14:17.940 --> 00:14:19.939 Marschall Runge: attributed to operation, warp, speed.
00:14:20.380 --> 00:14:50.099 Frank R. Harrison: Well, when we return, I want to continue upon what you said, because what I was interested in finding out is that Mrna was still going to be used to finding cures for things like we mentioned last week, David HIV Aids, or even cancer. And I would hate to think that that in itself is going to be prevented going forward. So, ladies and gentlemen, please stay tuned right here on Frank, about health, as we continue with both Dr. Marshall Runji and David Yang, Phd. So that we could be able to advocate, not only for
00:14:50.110 --> 00:14:57.800 Frank R. Harrison: our nation's health care, but our own health care. And remember by this book. I'm going to make sure you see the QR. Code
00:14:58.380 --> 00:15:05.390 Frank R. Harrison: break. So there's no escaping this episode of Frank about health without buying the book that all being said, please stay tuned. We'll be back in a few.
00:16:49.510 --> 00:17:00.370 Frank R. Harrison: Hey, everybody! Welcome back! I'm sorry for the slight delay. I just saw a comment, and I quote, I gotta save money for my move. I don't have a choice but to escape without buying the book.
00:17:01.690 --> 00:17:20.369 Frank R. Harrison: Thank you out there, for whoever said that. But either way again, this book isn't is hot off the presses. Actually, if you don't mind a little self. Promo, Marshall, I think you had notified me that during the show that David and I did last week that you noticed a spike on Amazon during the hour we were broadcasting.
00:17:21.170 --> 00:17:22.500 Frank R. Harrison: Oh, unmute! First.st
00:17:22.500 --> 00:17:33.510 Marschall Runge: Yes, absolutely and I think you know, the goal is to have a book that is approachable, and
00:17:33.620 --> 00:17:34.540 Marschall Runge: to
00:17:34.690 --> 00:17:46.069 Marschall Runge: people who are interested in health care. You don't have to be a healthcare expert to. And this is as Frank said. To start with, the idea is to stimulate conversation around health
00:17:46.180 --> 00:17:52.260 Marschall Runge: in all of our communities across the United States. And I I hope it's successful doing that so that we can be healthier.
00:17:52.630 --> 00:18:15.179 Frank R. Harrison: Exactly, and speaking about being healthier. You were talking there about vaccines, and I was talking with you about how I saw it as a disruptor, meaning something positive for finding cures for long, long considered fatal illnesses, especially the epidemic we went through in the eighties, David, the HIV Aids pandemic. What do you have to say, Marshall, about
00:18:15.340 --> 00:18:22.549 Frank R. Harrison: how Mrna may continue to thrive, which I'm hoping, considering all of legislation that's being passed.
00:18:22.550 --> 00:18:32.649 Marschall Runge: Oh, I think I think, Mnr. Mrna, in terms of development, rapid development of vaccines, excuse me, is a real game changer, and
00:18:33.160 --> 00:18:39.359 Marschall Runge: for some illnesses that have been particularly resistant. Like HIV.
00:18:40.120 --> 00:18:44.860 Marschall Runge: The development of a vaccine vaccines are inexpensive, and
00:18:45.220 --> 00:19:08.419 Marschall Runge: are a great way to improve public health, not just in the United States globally. So when you think about HIV, that has been a real, difficult problem for scientists who are experts in that area. Yet, as I understand it, and I'm not an expert in that area. But I think HIV vaccination is much closer than it ever was before, and is being studied.
00:19:08.880 --> 00:19:14.489 Frank R. Harrison: Interesting. And then I guess, what what about cancer? I keep getting stuff from actually mass. Gen.
00:19:14.600 --> 00:19:25.400 Frank R. Harrison: Mrna summits that they're doing up in Boston trying to find Mrna vaccines for prostate cancer, liver, cancer, stomach cancer. What can you say about that?
00:19:25.970 --> 00:19:31.440 Marschall Runge: Yeah, I think the same thing. It's interesting. It was interesting to me that the idea of a vaccination
00:19:31.640 --> 00:19:34.910 Marschall Runge: against specific pathways for cancer.
00:19:35.386 --> 00:19:39.190 Marschall Runge: But that is becoming a reality. And you mentioned some common ones
00:19:39.360 --> 00:19:49.320 Marschall Runge: prostate cancer, and another that is very resistant. That people are looking for vaccines in is pancreatic cancer. Because right now, pancreatic cancer.
00:19:49.560 --> 00:19:58.409 Marschall Runge: unless it's almost unless it's caught. Incidentally, looking for something else. It's almost impossible to cure cancer.
00:19:58.940 --> 00:19:59.600 Frank R. Harrison: Yes.
00:19:59.720 --> 00:20:13.389 Frank R. Harrison: David, when you were talking about vaccinations last week. Besides, Mrna, was there something else that you were also saying needs to be understood about vaccinations like maybe access? Or was it in relation to how the pharmacies are taking over.
00:20:13.730 --> 00:20:20.460 David Yang: Yeah, so I think I was just generally touching on on access to care.
00:20:20.690 --> 00:20:27.770 David Yang: And you know all these subjects, every sentence that I think, is in Marshall's book, really has a lot of different
00:20:28.300 --> 00:20:31.140 David Yang: attitudes, different points of view that you can.
00:20:31.220 --> 00:20:55.910 David Yang: You can attach but one of the biggest problems, I think in the United States is equity, and access to care and vaccinations is something that I think has become distributed much better. I think that one of the rare successes in the retail medicine business has been the fact that you can get vaccinations at the Cvs. That you don't need to make a special
00:20:55.910 --> 00:21:13.140 David Yang: appointment at your, you know, local government healthcare area, or go to your doctor. But you can actually go to Cvs and get the vaccination. This is really true, for for rural areas where people aren't.
00:21:13.390 --> 00:21:25.049 David Yang: you know, necessarily can get to their doctor easily, but they have to go grocery, shopping, or whatever every week. So, having this distributed model for some things, I think, makes a lot of sense.
00:21:25.690 --> 00:21:36.429 Marschall Runge: Yeah, David, I think that's a great point, and I'm glad you brought it up in a case in point I mentioned before we started the show that I just had my, the most recent Covid vaccination that you can get
00:21:37.050 --> 00:21:48.180 Marschall Runge: last week, and I did it at Cvs. I work for a big health system, but it's so convenient. There's a Cvs. On my way home, and I just dropped in. 10 min later I was done. I could probably
00:21:48.520 --> 00:21:51.050 Marschall Runge: front. I didn't have to park in a deck and walk in so.
00:21:51.410 --> 00:21:52.170 David Yang: That's right.
00:21:52.170 --> 00:22:02.639 Marschall Runge: I think that is a really positive disruption, and we kind of learned that during the Covid pandemic I don't know how it was where you lived. But here in
00:22:02.990 --> 00:22:08.120 Marschall Runge: Central Michigan we set up drive-thrus, you know, there's like a drive-through
00:22:08.310 --> 00:22:13.720 Marschall Runge: Mcdonald's or a drive-through bank window, and you could drive through, get your shot took no time. Drive on!
00:22:14.300 --> 00:22:16.009 David Yang: That's right. Yeah.
00:22:17.230 --> 00:22:41.299 Frank R. Harrison: New York. It was such a tiered system. I remember it was Pfizer versus Moderna, and I think Moderna was through our Northwell health system in New York, and then they brought Pfizer to the Mount Sinai health system. And then I know Nyu Langone, which is where all my primary care and specialists are. They were still testing. They were not interested in being a wide distributor until they saw the efficacy that was going on with both
00:22:41.400 --> 00:22:58.220 Frank R. Harrison: Moderna and Pfizer. In those 2 other systems, with the exception of our public hospital system, H. And H. Or Health and Human services, which would include Bellevue in Manhattan or Einstein in the Bronx, or I think, even
00:22:58.620 --> 00:23:06.090 Frank R. Harrison: well, I don't know. All of the hospitals in the 5 boroughs, but all I can say is is that there was no real public
00:23:06.290 --> 00:23:35.819 Frank R. Harrison: vaccination schedule until the javits center opened up for everybody, and that was like 6 months after the 1st vaccines rolled out. And then, like you said both both of you said with the the Aetnas, not the Aetnas, the Cvs's of the world. The Duane reads of the world, the Walgreens of the world. They started taking over pretty much after we got to the omicron variant. And now what I notice is that if I'm going to get a booster like I was mentioning earlier. Like in the case of my father.
00:23:36.140 --> 00:23:57.880 Frank R. Harrison: I have to go to those drugstores instead of the hospital systems. They now are all closed about it, and I think that I don't know if that has to do with the hospital management, or if that has to do with whatever the State or Federal systems are mandating. So on one level, it is a positive disruption. But it I think I'm worried about the potential for a restriction.
00:23:57.990 --> 00:24:01.540 Frank R. Harrison: And and that's what I'd like to hear on both your points of view. One.
00:24:02.760 --> 00:24:27.749 David Yang: Yeah, I mean, just I want to follow up on a comment that Marshall made about just the convenience of it. I think that we're we're reaching. I think the newer generation is expecting convenience. I once made a joke to some of my executives that if my daughter can buy Boba drinks and get it delivered to our house in 30 min. Why can't we do that with things that improve our life.
00:24:27.950 --> 00:24:33.469 David Yang: you know, like vaccinations? Okay, this is far off right. But maybe it's tomorrow.
00:24:34.084 --> 00:24:42.580 David Yang: You know, medical testing. You know, prescription drugs are being delivered a little bit more. So I think there's an expectation.
00:24:42.820 --> 00:25:01.730 David Yang: And I also think that I envy Marshall's position because in my position at Danaher we actually wanted we needed to talk to clinicians. One of the biggest problems any innovator makes is they solve a problem.
00:25:01.970 --> 00:25:04.470 David Yang: They find a solution to something that's not a problem.
00:25:04.840 --> 00:25:05.290 Frank R. Harrison: Hmm.
00:25:05.290 --> 00:25:06.349 David Yang: And I think that
00:25:06.730 --> 00:25:23.660 David Yang: winding through Marshall's book is his experience with clinicians who these are well stated problems, and I'm going to digress a little bit again. But your whole chapter, Marshall, on Emergency Health Records and removing the burden of writing.
00:25:24.570 --> 00:25:31.650 David Yang: You hear that everywhere. Forget about the new drug, you know, just for a minute forget about the new drug. The new test.
00:25:32.390 --> 00:25:37.473 David Yang: Decrease my paperwork so I can spend more time with patients absolutely right.
00:25:40.070 --> 00:26:04.050 Frank R. Harrison: Yes, no. But then, also, what I'm finding is that, like you mentioned with the show on with Phyllis Marshall, that the doctors and the nurses. They're all aging out, and we have to reach to the middle school level and to the secondary school level to start getting people interested in becoming doctors and nurses, and really repopulating the health profession. But if there is such a dearth.
00:26:04.110 --> 00:26:24.590 Frank R. Harrison: is that because there's just a lot of standback or pushback because of the pandemic? Or is it that people are being misguided, or are patients being forced to mandate their own care? What would you say? Is the is the big lever there that's creating such a fragmentation.
00:26:24.970 --> 00:26:36.189 Marschall Runge: I think it's multifactorial, and I think that, depending on who a young person talks to, they may hear. Wow! I'm just drowning in paperwork. And why did I go into healthcare at all?
00:26:36.420 --> 00:26:44.029 Marschall Runge: And certainly there are people who feel that way, and it's hard to blame them. And as David mentioned with some of the new AI technology.
00:26:44.490 --> 00:26:52.189 Marschall Runge: I think that's going to help healthcare providers so much. And as I think we talked about before, Frank. But I can't remember. For sure.
00:26:52.930 --> 00:27:05.150 Marschall Runge: I don't see any possibility that AI is going to replace healthcare providers, doctors, nurses, therapists, social workers, because that human contact is just something that AI cannot.
00:27:05.990 --> 00:27:19.220 Frank R. Harrison: Right. I mean, it's good to use while you're with your doctor, like I've had to actually do that while discussing my father's Psa lab results. And when I saw a high number for a 94 year old man, I thought, that's okay
00:27:19.230 --> 00:27:34.130 Frank R. Harrison: versus if he was 64, you know. So it's good for your own emotional support mechanism when you're getting news that is scary. But you still need to communicate to a human being the human element of AI that is missing in healthcare
00:27:34.130 --> 00:27:51.059 Frank R. Harrison: is where it's a good disruption, especially to condense records, David, but it's not a good replacement for a medical professional. I think it helps you work with your medical professional like a colleague of sorts rather than feeling like oh, my God, what news are you going to tell me. And what do I have to worry about?
00:27:51.220 --> 00:27:57.460 Marschall Runge: You know. And I think one. Another thing we did talk about with Phyllis is the
00:27:57.570 --> 00:28:21.150 Marschall Runge: education, and we've gone away from health care, health education. K. Through 12, and I think we must put that back in. People will be healthier if they understand. Children will be healthier. Children often bring things home to their parents. I remember in my era classmates would go home and tell their parents to stop smoking because there was no ban on smoking. I'm a little older than both of you.
00:28:21.700 --> 00:28:28.000 Marschall Runge: and but I think that's a great positive, and in addition, I think exposing
00:28:28.720 --> 00:28:42.439 Marschall Runge: children to health care in their education will recruit lots of people. We have an event once a year that's in the big house. That's where the University of Michigan football is played. The biggest football stadium in the United States.
00:28:42.770 --> 00:28:43.370 Frank R. Harrison: Nice.
00:28:43.370 --> 00:28:54.880 Marschall Runge: We bring in this year about 350 young people who are middle school, and we have booths set up, all of our departments set up booths so they can
00:28:55.260 --> 00:29:00.639 Marschall Runge: learn things from people in emergency medicine, learn things from physical therapy, and they
00:29:00.780 --> 00:29:07.749 Marschall Runge: are they. They represent a broad spectrum of people from broad economic backgrounds, some
00:29:07.980 --> 00:29:27.419 Marschall Runge: more disadvantaged, some not. And just to see those young people so engaged they spend about half a day there, and if we do more of that, I am sure that we'll get a lot more people interested in some aspect of health care. They don't have to be anything. One thing in particular they may. In fact, the speaker was somebody who came from a
00:29:28.140 --> 00:29:41.829 Marschall Runge: living in a a trailer park, a very poor background. 1st college graduate his family went through and is a fantastic physician. Now he wants to go into biotech, and he's going to. He's going to be an entrepreneur. So.
00:29:41.830 --> 00:29:42.550 Frank R. Harrison: Very nice.
00:29:42.550 --> 00:29:59.529 Marschall Runge: And and I thought that, too, was great to have these young people here so broad horizons in healthcare. We just have to get the word out, and I think Phyllis was equally enthusiastic. As I was about trying to reintroduce health into the curriculum for K through 12.
00:29:59.980 --> 00:30:22.899 Frank R. Harrison: Well, we're about to take our next break, but I have a definite comment on that which David, I know you and I can relate to. So when we return, I will share with everyone what that comment is about, especially with reaching out to the younger set to get into the healthcare space, and then we will talk about the disruptor portion of the great healthcare disruption. So remember, buy the book, and we'll see you in a few.
00:32:00.510 --> 00:32:04.989 Frank R. Harrison: Hey, everybody, and welcome back to our engineer out there. No worries
00:32:05.484 --> 00:32:09.699 Frank R. Harrison: we're in sync with each other. Everything is so far like clockwork. So
00:32:09.820 --> 00:32:25.030 Frank R. Harrison: again, like what Marshall David and I said, I hope your ear improves. But right now we're having an excellent conversation, and I wanted to comment, Marshall, on what you said about your event. 1st of all, I'd like to know when that is, maybe I could come and actually see it.
00:32:25.030 --> 00:32:48.440 Frank R. Harrison: But second of all Brooklyn Tech, where we graduated from, started a program. I mean, when we were there, we had limited majors, a lot of them engineering oriented except he was a chemistry major. I ended up their second class of the Math Science Institute, and that same year, when I was in that class, they created the biomedical major. So they were starting to get on the cusp
00:32:48.480 --> 00:33:17.520 Frank R. Harrison: or at least edge in to the life sciences as an engineering school. But today you can actually get as a major a concentration in pharmacological engineering and then end up with a Phd. From. I think it's Long Island University which is up the block from the High School in pharmacy management. And I don't know, David. Do you know, if they even have preparation for Mds. Or or nursing degrees there, or do they go to another medical system from there.
00:33:17.850 --> 00:33:27.420 David Yang: Yeah, you know, I think they used to have a Pre Med program. But, to be honest, I'm just not sure I'm 2,500 miles away, now in California.
00:33:27.740 --> 00:33:54.719 Frank R. Harrison: True. True, I totally understand. Either way. I think Brooklyn Tech has definitely proven to remain on the cusp of innovation by welcoming the life sciences into their field of study for the secondary school prior to college, I mean, and those people end up, I mean, I was fortunate to go to Nyu, and I know David like you said you went to Brooklyn College, but today a lot of people are going straight to Harvard Medical School, or they're going to Cornell.
00:33:55.107 --> 00:34:02.459 Frank R. Harrison: medical School and studying at Weill Cornell health system here in in New York, you know. So it's definitely
00:34:02.460 --> 00:34:30.029 Frank R. Harrison: upped its I don't want to say game, but it's upped its focus on using technology and engineering as a tool set, a skill set, a unique skill set to get involved in all of the necessary professions that we have today, especially health sciences and medicine. So that, all being said, I'd like to say that Brooklyn Tech is definitely a disruptor, a very positive one. But bringing us to our now 3rd section about the disruptor
00:34:30.139 --> 00:34:50.399 Frank R. Harrison: without getting into politics and stuff like that, I'm sure you've seen in the media recent bills that have been passed by the House, as well as cutbacks that are slated for Medicaid and Medicare, and even the restrictions being placed on the covid vaccine. Now, without getting again into the social issues surrounding it, what do you think
00:34:51.159 --> 00:35:17.889 Frank R. Harrison: the patients, the professionals, are going to be potentially faced with, are we going to see delays in all the research and testing that had been promised with things like Mrna vaccines? Are we going to see problems that we are unexpected. And better yet, are we open to a potential new pandemic? So I just give the floor for this section to you, Marshall, to really tell me what your points of view are on, what's going on currently in our country.
00:35:18.720 --> 00:35:25.170 Marschall Runge: Well, I'll start with the last part of your comment, Frank, and that is, are we going to see another pandemic? And we could.
00:35:26.150 --> 00:35:28.690 Marschall Runge: who could have predicted COVID-19. Nobody.
00:35:29.000 --> 00:35:33.439 Marschall Runge: But as we become more globally connected, I think that
00:35:33.670 --> 00:35:39.140 Marschall Runge: we, we all the United States and the world, runs the risk of
00:35:39.390 --> 00:35:41.640 Marschall Runge: transmitting something to a new area
00:35:41.920 --> 00:35:47.169 Marschall Runge: having outbreaks. So I think we need to be prepared for that. I think we have the technology to be prepared for that.
00:35:47.480 --> 00:35:51.109 Marschall Runge: and I I have to believe in my heart that
00:35:51.220 --> 00:35:53.290 Marschall Runge: if something like that should happen
00:35:53.640 --> 00:35:56.799 Marschall Runge: just as it happened in Covid, despite the
00:35:56.930 --> 00:36:01.370 Marschall Runge: the broad discussion on whether it's good or bad to have
00:36:01.980 --> 00:36:07.110 Marschall Runge: covid-nineteen vaccines and therapies. I think those will again come to the surface.
00:36:07.420 --> 00:36:14.090 Marschall Runge: I also heard an interesting quote at a meeting, attended a meeting, and
00:36:14.310 --> 00:36:19.770 Marschall Runge: George W. Bush was the sort of guest speaker, and he talked about
00:36:20.450 --> 00:36:24.860 Marschall Runge: sort of the pendulum of sway of opinions in
00:36:25.270 --> 00:36:34.429 Marschall Runge: from Washington, DC. And that there's a pendulum. It definitely goes one direction, another direction. We're seeing some of that happen today, and I think that.
00:36:34.950 --> 00:36:41.480 Marschall Runge: But my one hope is that the decisions that involve people's health
00:36:41.730 --> 00:36:58.539 Marschall Runge: can be influenced by people who, by care, providers who have been personally engaged, and, for example, with COVID-19, our hospital had wasn't as bad as New York, but we we basically had to stop almost everything we did. And the hospital was almost full of COVID-19.
00:36:58.730 --> 00:37:05.409 Marschall Runge: And it wasn't just old people or frail people. It was people of every age, and it was just heartbreaking.
00:37:05.690 --> 00:37:13.030 Marschall Runge: And finally, when we developed some therapies, we had one very advanced therapy at Michigan medicine.
00:37:14.010 --> 00:37:21.010 Marschall Runge: which is called Ecmo. It's it's a way to basically
00:37:21.280 --> 00:37:28.430 Marschall Runge: support people whose blood pressure is so low they can't be supported otherwise. And we we had about a 30%,
00:37:28.850 --> 00:37:33.180 Marschall Runge: save of people who, almost 100%
00:37:33.694 --> 00:37:53.469 Marschall Runge: were destined to not survive. And so, you know, did everybody live who was on Ecmo? Well, no. But a 3rd of them did. And I think that's an example of how we took a existing technology used it in a new way. We weren't the only people to do it, but we had more capacity than most hospitals. So
00:37:53.700 --> 00:38:02.639 Marschall Runge: I'm giving. And and I was here every day during the pandemic here, and not here at home. I was here in the hospital, and
00:38:02.880 --> 00:38:09.760 Marschall Runge: it's striking as a care provider. And so I think we need some of that input as people think about health decisions.
00:38:10.440 --> 00:38:11.150 David Yang: Amazing.
00:38:11.150 --> 00:38:20.879 David Yang: Yeah, if I can just add one thing, I mean, I I can't agree more. We used to have a saying that if a decision. If we were in the healthcare industry.
00:38:21.820 --> 00:38:27.619 David Yang: We had a saying that if there was a carpet under your feet when you're making a decision you're in the wrong place.
00:38:27.680 --> 00:38:52.529 David Yang: The idea, indirectly is that if you're making decisions about a clinical lab about a doctor's office, you better get to a doctor's office and go see what they're doing. And to a clinical lab, what are the problems that clinicians actually see before you make a decision, so that you understand what the implications are and what the impact is. So I think these examples are exactly, you know, I'm hoping that these decisions are based on
00:38:52.620 --> 00:39:03.859 David Yang: consensus of, you know, healthcare providers, comments, you know, kind of an ensemble opinion on on how to handle things rather than simply based on dollar and cents.
00:39:04.870 --> 00:39:05.540 Frank R. Harrison: Hmm.
00:39:05.860 --> 00:39:06.550 Marschall Runge: Very quick.
00:39:06.750 --> 00:39:19.290 Frank R. Harrison: Amazing. You know, it's very funny. You talk about Ecmo, and I hate to point out into pop culture how I learned all about it, but I think it was during that time, and I'm an avid watcher of Grey's anatomy.
00:39:19.360 --> 00:39:45.899 Frank R. Harrison: She was 17 when Meredith Gray was going through Covid, and they kept talking about the testing to bring her out of her coma Remdesivir, you putting her on Ecmo, giving her like Iv. Treatments of whatever medication was available to boost her immune system. I mean, I thought that that show was putting me in medical school, but via via ABC.
00:39:46.090 --> 00:39:48.679 Marschall Runge: They? They were very current, extremely.
00:39:48.680 --> 00:40:14.689 Frank R. Harrison: Were they were. That's probably why the show is still lasting after all of these years. But yet the thing that I really hate is the idea that in order for people to reach out to the level of seriousness and understanding of that particular pandemic, or even any other kind of illness is to actually engage in a TV program to rather than get it from from our officials.
00:40:14.770 --> 00:40:42.659 Frank R. Harrison: you know. So that communication gap is still what is distracting to me. I think that was more of the fuel that made me launch this podcast I wanted, I mean, I tell this all the time to my, my viewers. This was not going to be frank about health. This was going to be called the Cadre report, all about covid-nineteen. I was going to do an entire podcast on Covid, and the irony is when it was ready to launch, all the mandates were lifted. So I thought, okay, go back to frank about health. But here we are
00:40:42.660 --> 00:40:51.190 Frank R. Harrison: kind of revisiting that whole notion, because you could see, as I'm mentioning, the disruption at this point is that
00:40:51.270 --> 00:41:12.989 Frank R. Harrison: lack of communication, misinformation, fragmentation of information, if if any like. What Phyllis said, pulling down the information from the websites, what David has said, research funding cut, you know on needed things, and I hear it every day, and I got to be honest with you. I'm at a point feeling not not scared, but vulnerable.
00:41:13.000 --> 00:41:32.209 Frank R. Harrison: you know, because I've been spending the last 3 years while doing the show. Being a caregiver and an advocate for a cousin who's now in a nursing home. I actually got a call from the nursing home today, you're thinking, oh, is this the call where she passes? They said. We just want your permission to give her her covid vaccine, I said, you've got it. Thank you for the call.
00:41:32.210 --> 00:41:32.750 Marschall Runge: Great.
00:41:32.750 --> 00:42:00.489 Frank R. Harrison: You know, but to live my life both virtually, or even by watching the show, and then living it in real time, and not get the right source at the right time. That's still very disconcerting. So what would you say as we continue to get disruptive information, what can you tell the listeners and viewers out there, how they can maintain their sense of calm and keep their thinking active, because even if they're not the doctor, they could at least
00:42:00.500 --> 00:42:06.510 Frank R. Harrison: do their best to mitigate whatever the real issue is versus their their fears.
00:42:07.060 --> 00:42:16.199 Marschall Runge: I'm going to give a couple of suggestions. Okay? And you know, I think it is most difficult to follow healthcare in snippets
00:42:16.714 --> 00:42:22.380 Marschall Runge: meaning, you know, conventional news, because it's you just can't put it on a bumper sticker.
00:42:22.880 --> 00:42:28.790 Marschall Runge: I'm going to give 2 specific suggestions. Sanjay Gupta, who most people know of actually is a Michigan grad.
00:42:29.250 --> 00:42:36.670 Marschall Runge: He's a physician, he still he still does neurosurgery at Emory University. David and.
00:42:36.670 --> 00:42:37.060 David Yang: Okay.
00:42:37.060 --> 00:42:48.339 Marschall Runge: He has podcasts, he has and his podcasts are both very informative, and they're cataloged through Cnn, they're free. If you're a Cnn subscriber.
00:42:50.200 --> 00:42:52.130 Marschall Runge: there are a bunch of them, and and
00:42:52.290 --> 00:42:58.689 Marschall Runge: he delivers these in a way that is intelligible, but
00:42:59.070 --> 00:43:08.909 Marschall Runge: really grabs your attention. So that's 1. There's a second. And so I'm referring to physicians who are providing healthcare advice. The second is another physician named Eric Topol.
00:43:09.080 --> 00:43:14.470 Marschall Runge: who's very well known and he has a podcast called ground truths.
00:43:14.590 --> 00:43:17.240 Marschall Runge: and he talks about all kinds of
00:43:17.750 --> 00:43:20.869 Marschall Runge: difficult issues in healthcare, and he's much more on the
00:43:21.400 --> 00:43:32.129 Marschall Runge: the sort of research side than Sanjay, but they're both great, and there probably are others. But those are 2 people that I happen to have met through my long career, and
00:43:32.360 --> 00:43:35.160 Marschall Runge: I think they do. An exceptional job had
00:43:35.360 --> 00:43:37.809 Marschall Runge: in topics that are of interest to all of us.
00:43:38.650 --> 00:43:39.070 Frank R. Harrison: Nice.
00:43:39.070 --> 00:43:42.079 Marschall Runge: And really reach, they really reach people. So.
00:43:43.650 --> 00:43:48.940 Frank R. Harrison: It would be basically like what I've been telling everybody continue to research on your own through yes
00:43:48.940 --> 00:43:51.600 Frank R. Harrison: podcasts, especially the ones you've been on.
00:43:51.600 --> 00:43:52.130 Marschall Runge: Oh, of course.
00:43:52.130 --> 00:44:17.859 Frank R. Harrison: But some of the ones that I've actually seen prior to when you came to Frank about health, and you were pretty much on point. Then I think there was something that you did. I don't know if it was on spotify or apple, but it was very informative, and it helped me steer the show when we did the show with Phyllis, you know. So if anything, I can already tell you a little hint that some of my future guests that are being slated for next week and and beyond, have already asked to meet you.
00:44:18.100 --> 00:44:18.430 Marschall Runge: Good.
00:44:18.600 --> 00:44:25.081 Frank R. Harrison: You know. So who knows? Maybe when I have them? Come on, Frank, about health, and also still promote the book.
00:44:25.860 --> 00:44:45.649 Frank R. Harrison: you'll be on their show next, if if it's doable, you know so more of that to follow. So before we go to our final break, everybody. What you've just heard from Marshall is the same advice that myself and David have been saying, when you are dealing with health, information, or misinformation, especially in a disruptive environment, that we are in.
00:44:45.650 --> 00:44:57.959 Frank R. Harrison: go independently and seek out the information. If it's podcasts fine. If it's particular websites, like Phyllis, said Aarp, fine, if it's your own doctor, your Pcp. At
00:44:57.960 --> 00:45:18.129 Frank R. Harrison: whatever hospital system you're part of. Then fine. Don't depend on mass media. Depend on your own instincts. Depend on Chat Gpt, but definitely get at the same time a human to coordinate things with you. So you can keep your mind focused and go through this firestorm together, which we're all doing all right.
00:45:18.440 --> 00:45:44.890 Frank R. Harrison: We're about to take our final break, as you can see, Marshall and David, my device that was promoting the book actually burnt out. So at this point. I hope everyone out there takes a look at this commercial break, and quickly, by the great healthcare disruption on Amazon. And if you're a prime member. You will see it in your mailbox either by tomorrow or Tuesday. Remember, we're headed for Memorial Day weekend that all being said, please stay tuned. We'll be back in a few.
00:47:28.840 --> 00:47:40.969 Frank R. Harrison: Hey, everybody, and welcome to our final section of this episode of Frank about health. We already talked about the disruptors and the disruptors. But now we're going to talk about a very important innovation that is
00:47:40.970 --> 00:47:59.760 Frank R. Harrison: very important for all of us to be aware of and to determine if we are eligible, how we can finance it. So that, all being said, David, this is your section. I want you and Marshall to completely spend the next 13 min talking about that invention, that your company was very instrumental in launching.
00:48:00.362 --> 00:48:01.960 Frank R. Harrison: So go ahead.
00:48:02.630 --> 00:48:25.670 David Yang: So I will start again. I'm not the Md. So Marshall will correct all of my Md. Incorrectness. But everyone's been talking about Crispr. Crispr won the Nobel Prize as a gene editing tool. Crispr was around even before then, as a failed diagnostic tool. I won't get into the reasons why it failed. But it's been reimagined.
00:48:26.030 --> 00:48:55.719 David Yang: And you know, I actually, I have all these quotes about from Marshall's book that I wanted to read, but this one I am going to read. Throughout the writing of this book Marshall writes, I've been bumping up against the challenge of evolutions happening so rapidly that before I can even detail my expectations, for where we'll be 6 months, a year, or 5 years from now, new drugs, surface and new technologies emerge, and prediction all too quickly becomes reality. So absolutely, things are happening faster than we expect.
00:48:55.950 --> 00:49:11.059 David Yang: I actually thought Crispr, technology would start impacting people in about 15 years. Because in general, that's what it takes to get the infrastructure the whole, you know. It's not just the discovery, but it's making sure that discovery is safe for the patient.
00:49:11.510 --> 00:49:34.970 David Yang: So this time last week a report in the New England Journal of Medicine outlined basically a cure using gene editing that occurs within the patient's body. So this was an infant less than one years old, who had a genetic disorder, whose lifespan was probably in months, if not one or 2 years.
00:49:35.690 --> 00:49:45.779 David Yang: and my former company, Danahert, some of their operating companies. What they did was they actually put in the infrastructure to manufacture the drug for the patient.
00:49:45.980 --> 00:50:00.259 David Yang: Okay, so it's great to have an idea on paper on what it is that will cure the patient, but to actually manufacture it to the quality that's necessary to prevent you from inadvertently causing more harm to the patient is unheard of.
00:50:00.550 --> 00:50:03.227 David Yang: So this is a 1 off drug.
00:50:03.760 --> 00:50:11.340 David Yang: it's really to treat one patient. But I think Marshall is going to talk about this more. But this is really the beginning of personalized healthcare.
00:50:11.460 --> 00:50:14.779 David Yang: Now, what they did now is not sustainable.
00:50:15.890 --> 00:50:24.479 David Yang: The 1st airplane was not sustainable. Right? The 1st anything is not sustainable, but going from 0 to one is an infinite.
00:50:24.830 --> 00:50:43.327 David Yang: difficult challenge going from one to a billion. That's easy compared to a 0 to one. So Aldebaran Idt, the Danaher diagnostics my former colleagues. They put together a triage team that was able to manufacture. So now there's a guideline, there's a foot, there's a
00:50:43.930 --> 00:50:46.790 David Yang: roadmap on. How to do it once
00:50:47.420 --> 00:51:02.599 David Yang: next time will be better. 3rd time will be better and cheaper. 4th time will be Yada Yada! Yada. So this is again an example of a disruptor that has the promise to change people's lives. Marshall, I know you're chomping at the bit to say something.
00:51:02.600 --> 00:51:18.240 Marschall Runge: I agree with everything you've said, David, and you made a comment earlier about a technology that you had been instrumental in developing that enabled the possibility of sequencing 500 nucleotides in 2 h, and
00:51:18.340 --> 00:51:27.180 Marschall Runge: and that was a huge step forward. But within years, and at this point the entire human genome can be sequenced and.
00:51:27.180 --> 00:51:27.590 Frank R. Harrison: Yes.
00:51:27.590 --> 00:51:32.319 Marschall Runge: When the human genome was 1st sequenced back in about 2,000,
00:51:32.480 --> 00:51:56.409 Marschall Runge: I couldn't have ever imagined that we'd be at a point where we could make specific changes in it that would enable a person with a severe genetic disease to live a normal life. So it's and Crispr was being studied back, you know, 15 years ago, as you said, this technology for gene editing. So I think it's enormously exciting. And I do agree.
00:51:56.850 --> 00:52:00.130 Marschall Runge: I think the cost of sequencing the human genome. The 1st time
00:52:00.430 --> 00:52:13.530 Marschall Runge: around 2,000 was 3 billion dollars. Now, if you go to your favorite hospital or health system, you can get your entire genome sequence for about $250. I mean 253 billion to 250.
00:52:13.530 --> 00:52:14.700 Marschall Runge: That's right.
00:52:15.730 --> 00:52:16.470 Marschall Runge: And.
00:52:16.470 --> 00:52:19.429 David Yang: In in a day rather than in 15 years.
00:52:19.430 --> 00:52:20.270 David Yang: Right? Right?
00:52:20.583 --> 00:52:21.210 David Yang: And with.
00:52:21.210 --> 00:52:40.050 Marschall Runge: AI. Now to understand, to look at that entire genome and say, Hey, you've got a mutation that could be fixed, and could really dramatically change your life. Who could have imagined it? We live in such an exciting era, and I hope that we'll continue to develop these advances. I mean, it's just mind boggling.
00:52:40.490 --> 00:52:44.940 Frank R. Harrison: What does the acronym CRIS. PR. Stand for?
00:52:46.410 --> 00:52:48.770 Marschall Runge: Take it away, David.
00:52:49.360 --> 00:52:51.752 Marschall Runge: I don't know, but I know how to get the answer.
00:52:53.130 --> 00:52:53.900 David Yang: Yes.
00:52:54.670 --> 00:53:20.849 Frank R. Harrison: I mean, if anything. When I had heard about it the 1st time it was a couple years ago, I guess it was still in its infancy infancy. And when I heard about Crispr I heard about it as aligned with neurological disease, like epilepsy, autism strokes things like that. But obviously, from what I'm hearing. It's genetic sequencing for illnesses that are caused by genetic mutations. I presume so.
00:53:20.850 --> 00:53:21.330 Marschall Runge: No.
00:53:22.665 --> 00:53:31.370 David Yang: Clustered regularly, interspace short, pandromic, palindromic repeats, I know what the individual words mean.
00:53:31.480 --> 00:53:42.159 David Yang: but I don't. So they must be looking at sequences of DNA that are fairly large, that the enzyme can recognize that are repeating so. But I'm not an expert.
00:53:42.660 --> 00:53:46.818 Marschall Runge: No, I I looked it up the same time you were David. I'm not sure that that full
00:53:47.700 --> 00:53:49.740 Marschall Runge: the full name of it helps. Anybody, doesn't help me.
00:53:49.740 --> 00:53:51.097 David Yang: Right? That's right.
00:53:51.550 --> 00:53:56.679 Frank R. Harrison: But if anything does that mean that it becomes the family of solutions like M. Is Mrna.
00:53:56.680 --> 00:53:57.330 Marschall Runge: Yes.
00:53:57.460 --> 00:54:08.250 Marschall Runge: absolutely absolutely. And to develop the 1st Mrna vaccine took a decade or more. Regeneron was working on that more than a decade before Covid hit. That's right.
00:54:08.250 --> 00:54:08.570 Frank R. Harrison: No.
00:54:08.840 --> 00:54:09.640 David Yang: Technology.
00:54:10.470 --> 00:54:12.019 David Yang: Sorry. Go, ahead, Marshall.
00:54:12.020 --> 00:54:18.240 Marschall Runge: Oh, I was just going to say the technology was there. And I think we will see much more of that rapid evolution
00:54:18.960 --> 00:54:26.730 Marschall Runge: technology being there, and, as I think you all know, the Nobel Prize was given for this Crispr innovation just a few years ago.
00:54:27.020 --> 00:54:30.509 David Yang: 20. And one thing I kind of want to point out is, you know.
00:54:31.260 --> 00:54:53.390 David Yang: none of these things stand alone. There's only one paper that I've ever read that had no references, which was an Einstein paper. But all of these things are based on something else. So even in this Crispr, you know, the Crispr is actually important. They had to do next, Gen. Sequencing to find the mutation in this patient.
00:54:53.550 --> 00:54:56.160 David Yang: and it's a single point mutation.
00:54:56.420 --> 00:55:07.279 David Yang: They had to develop Mrna as a guide for the Crispr. So it's so I'm sure there's AI involved. So it's it's it's an ensemble of things that help.
00:55:07.390 --> 00:55:18.541 David Yang: It's the Crispr part is the new part which gets everyone excited. So your tool chest has a new, you know, screwdriver, a new hammer that can beat down disease. But sorry.
00:55:18.890 --> 00:55:26.590 Frank R. Harrison: No, no, this is excellent, because then with AI it'll make whatever warp speed we were in in 2020 exponential.
00:55:26.790 --> 00:55:43.909 Frank R. Harrison: and probably even more cost effective like you were talking about how it went down to $250. That must be because of the volume participation of diseases as well as patients that were looking for the solutions. And you also mentioned about how drugs were manufactured using Crispr technology.
00:55:43.910 --> 00:55:57.640 Frank R. Harrison: So actually, that's another echo of patient-centered care. So I can see that Crispr is definitely probably going to be something that's an innovation that will help mitigate the disruptor part of our conversation.
00:55:58.060 --> 00:56:03.110 Frank R. Harrison: There's hope in it, even with what's been being passed in in Congress. Correct.
00:56:03.960 --> 00:56:09.169 Marschall Runge: Yes, absolutely. And I think that there, this will
00:56:09.360 --> 00:56:17.210 Marschall Runge: make investigators who are studying these areas. They'll they'll have to be more innovative to look at other sources of funding. But this is coming along at a time when
00:56:18.410 --> 00:56:23.990 Marschall Runge: for many decades, big Pharma and
00:56:24.140 --> 00:56:30.040 Marschall Runge: a lot of innovation industries has been scientists like David, who trained and then entered
00:56:30.210 --> 00:56:35.169 Marschall Runge: an entrepreneurial field. And so we'll we'll have to figure out how to do that in a different way.
00:56:36.050 --> 00:56:37.739 Marschall Runge: Things change, and you adapt.
00:56:38.880 --> 00:56:59.229 Frank R. Harrison: Well, ladies and gentlemen, I can't believe the show is 1 min to end. So I'm going to say for all of you out there. Please buy this book, the great healthcare Disruption. I don't have the QR. Code anymore for this particular episode. It's amazon.com search, Marshall Runji, search the name of the book.
00:56:59.640 --> 00:57:11.600 Frank R. Harrison: Obviously, Crispr is the big takeaway from this particular episode, and I hate to say this, Marshall, but this is the last of our 4 episodes together. But I will have you back. I promise that.
00:57:12.006 --> 00:57:32.510 Frank R. Harrison: I also thank you, David, for literally bringing me back from a slump when we paid tribute to our Alma Mater, and then also reading this book with such vigilance and helping me mitigate through it. Last week, as Marshall was being disrupted, but appropriately, so appropriately so. But at the same time
00:57:32.510 --> 00:57:57.210 Frank R. Harrison: there's just so much follow up. So, ladies and gentlemen, before we go to our next show, that starts at 6 o'clock. Success with a splash right here on Talkradio, dot Nyc. I want you all to reach out to me at Frank R. Harrison, one@gmail.com. I will give you Marshall Runji's contact information if you have any direct questions for him. And David, would you like to share your email, or would you like me to tell people to go to it?
00:57:57.450 --> 00:58:08.436 David Yang: Sure it's it's just David L. yang@icloud.com. I'm currently unemployed. So I'm using my own personal email. But David L yang@icloud.com for what it's worth.
00:58:08.760 --> 00:58:25.900 Frank R. Harrison: And Marshall. I'm going to use Frank about health to get the word out there on every episode going forward at the same time. I think, David, you and I should be talking about how we talk at the next Stem committee meeting about this. I think it's something that they're all going to want to know more information about. And, ladies and gentlemen, thank you for
00:58:25.900 --> 00:58:39.139 Frank R. Harrison: staying tuned the last 4 weeks, as we've been on the great healthcare Disruption bandwagon. We will be back on my 4th anniversary show next Thursday, and I have a special guest, a referral from
00:58:39.508 --> 00:58:41.250 Frank R. Harrison: The a train to Sedona.
00:58:41.500 --> 00:58:45.329 Frank R. Harrison: and he is also interested in meeting Marshall. So this
00:58:45.880 --> 00:58:53.249 Frank R. Harrison: you indirectly. But and again, Marshall, we will have you back before you. You leave your wonderful job next month.
00:58:53.600 --> 00:58:57.340 Marschall Runge: Thanks and great to great to see both you and David today. Great session.
00:58:57.340 --> 00:59:10.679 Frank R. Harrison: Alright, so thank you, Jesse. Behind the scenes. I hope everything feels better for you get ready for the next show, and I will call you both in a few minutes. All right. Thanks for signing off. See you soon, bye, bye.
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