Employment Law Today

Tuesday, June 7, 2022
Facebook Live Video from 2022/06/07 - Psychological Safety In The Workplace

Facebook Live Video from 2022/06/07 - Psychological Safety In The Workplace


2022/06/07 - Psychological Safety In The Workplace

[NEW EPISODE] Psychological Safety In The Workplace

The audience will learn how to create a psychologically safe workplace environment, resulting in improved employer/employee communication, employee-to-employee collaboration, productivity and growth. 

The issue of safety seems to be on everyone's mind these days and for good reason. Many employers seek methods and action plans to reduce employee burnout, ease tension between management and workers, and foster balance for the business owners themselves. But first, we need to create an environment of safe boundaries, safe communication, and safe connection. This is where my next guest comes into play. 

Sharon K. Summerfield, Founder of The Nourished Executive, Mentor, Connector, and Wellbeing Coach, will be on Employment Law Today to describe how employers can create a psychologically safe environment in which employees and managers can communicate, learn, heal, and grow. 

We will discuss how these lessons can apply to our personal lives as well. And that's something that we *all* could use right now. 

Tune in for this informative conversation at or watch the Facebook Livestream by Clicking Here.

Show Notes

Segment 1

Eric welcomes his guest, Sharon K. Summerfield, Founder of The Nourished Executive. He also introduces the topic for today's episode, which is about how to create a psychologically safe workplace environment. Sharon says that her career originally started in Neptune Terminals where she started as a receptionist. She mentions not knowing about terms psychological safety, bullying or anything related to this while being with Neptune. She says that management always had their backs and inappropriate behavior was taken seriously. If there was inappropriate behavior, the person involved would have to apologize or the company would never do business with them again. Sharon mentions other fields and places that she has worked in. One thing that she has seen throughout time is people feeling burn out as well as bullying. Sharon went back to school part time and became a Holistic Nutritionist. She then founded The Nourished Executive. Her goals are wanting to help people find ways of harmonizing their lives with the goal of preventing burnout. She defines psychological safety in the work that she does.

Segment 2

Eric and Sharon talk about why psychological safety is a necessary foundation for employers if they want to improve their employees’ connection and productivity in the workplace. Sharon mentions employees' wellbeing is now in the front and center of what's looked at. Understanding that inappropriate behavior for example, won't be tolerated is important especially when working in teams not just in your organizations but even when with multiple organizations. She mentions the Space Shuttle Challenger disaster with NASA where engineers didn't want the launch to happen. She says that because of the lack of psychological safety, they were shut down and opinions were not paid attention to. In these incidents, unfortunately people learn to navigate around these things or learn to not say anything because their opinions are not valued. Eric and Sharon make the pint that mistakes can be shared and it can be a learning experience. Sharon also says that without psychological safety, there is no creativity and innovation.

Segment 3

Sharon talks more about psychological safety and how it isn't something that you can do by having a special coffee machine or a mat room for yoga. Rather, psychological safety has to be part of how you do business. She says that how we treat each other is how we are going to treat shareholders, clients, and more. Psychological safety creates a roadmap in how we value each other. Eric and Sharon discuss the importance of actually “walking the walk” other than just handing out policies. Sharon says that part of psychological safety is being able to say no. She also encourages people to get back to the basics of meeting planning. If 48 hours before a meeting there is still no agenda, decline it. Sharon also talks about speaking up and creating boundaries. She makes the point that asking for time off or taking a break is a strength, not a weakness. They also discuss how employers should model what is better, meaning treating themselves right and treating others respectfully as well. It's important for employees to see this from them too.

Segment 4

Segment 4
Sharon talks about how The Nourished Executive differentiates itself from other coaches and mentors who work with business leaders. She encourages people who she works with to see how they can invest in their selfcare not just once a year, but every day. Maybe it’s getting outside and going for a walk or having a phone call and adding it to your walk. She hopes that we’ll transition more into confidence between team members like employers and their employees. She also mentions another thing to look out for and it’s what she calls “crazy pay” where one gets paid a lot, but it's at the cost of their well being. You can connect with Sharon Summerfield through her website at, Linkedin, Instagram at thenourishedexecutive, Facebook at nourishedexec and Twitter at nourishedexec. Before closing the show, Sharon says to be kind and patient with yourself, and be nourished in all you do.


00:00:42.090 --> 00:00:53.940 Eric Sarver, Esq.: Good evening, welcome to employment law today i'm your host erick sovereign i'm an employment law and business law attorney and I host this live weekly talk radio show in this live video broadcast.

00:00:54.300 --> 00:01:00.900 Eric Sarver, Esq.: Every Tuesday night from 5pm to 6pm Eastern standard time right here on talk radio nyc.

00:01:01.260 --> 00:01:10.620 Eric Sarver, Esq.: Or have guests at discuss some of the most novel and interesting issues and challenges that employers and business owners face during these trying times.

00:01:10.950 --> 00:01:23.130 Eric Sarver, Esq.: And in that regard I love to welcome our guest tonight i'm very pleased to have miss Sharon K summerfield founder of the nurse executives Sharon, welcome to the show it have you.

00:01:23.850 --> 00:01:24.990 Sharon Summerfield: Thank you, great to be here.

00:01:25.740 --> 00:01:36.780 Eric Sarver, Esq.: yeah absolutely I think we have a really important topic tonight and i'd like to just share that with our audience that i'll introduce you and more of a proper background, and then we can go into our discussion that sounds good to you.

00:01:36.990 --> 00:01:37.530 Sharon Summerfield: sounds great.

00:01:38.130 --> 00:01:45.030 Eric Sarver, Esq.: All right, let's do it, so our topic tonight folks is psychological safety in the workplace.

00:01:45.900 --> 00:01:53.910 Eric Sarver, Esq.: it's really I think powerful topic, and these times, you know we talked about the issue of safety, it seems to be on everyone's minds these days.

00:01:54.390 --> 00:02:05.610 Eric Sarver, Esq.: And I think, for good reason, many employers now seeking methods and action plans to reduce employee burnout and to eat tension between managers and workers.

00:02:06.090 --> 00:02:09.120 Eric Sarver, Esq.: And they want to foster balance for the business owners themselves.

00:02:09.780 --> 00:02:20.760 Eric Sarver, Esq.: But first, before we can get to that State, we need to create an environment of safe boundaries safe communication and say connection psychological safety.

00:02:21.240 --> 00:02:28.140 Eric Sarver, Esq.: This is where tonight's guest comes into play i'm joined this evening by, as I mentioned set Sharon summerfield.

00:02:28.770 --> 00:02:39.570 Eric Sarver, Esq.: founder of the nurse executive she is a mentor a connector and author and a well being coach and we'll be talking about a lot today to describe how employers.

00:02:40.050 --> 00:02:50.130 Eric Sarver, Esq.: and business owners can create a psychologically safe environment in which their workers and employees can communicate with each other and with management.

00:02:50.670 --> 00:02:58.050 Eric Sarver, Esq.: And can learn heal and grow so we'll talk about how these lessons can apply in our personal lives as well added bonus.

00:02:58.650 --> 00:03:08.760 Eric Sarver, Esq.: And that's something we all can use right now so with that I also want to tell our audience and listeners tonight more about Sharon about Sharon case number field.

00:03:09.150 --> 00:03:17.400 Eric Sarver, Esq.: Who, as I mentioned i'll say just again is something important to note is the founder of the nurse executive and she's a well being coach.

00:03:17.820 --> 00:03:27.960 Eric Sarver, Esq.: She works with business professionals and their teams sharing strategies to invest and well being and to manage stress, with the goal of preventing burnout.

00:03:29.520 --> 00:03:38.790 Eric Sarver, Esq.: In addition to that sharp in addition to sharon's extensive business background, she is also a registered holistic nutritionist and certified breath coach.

00:03:39.360 --> 00:03:47.010 Eric Sarver, Esq.: Sharon holds multiple certifications in business management project management psychological safety and holistic nutrition.

00:03:47.430 --> 00:03:58.320 Eric Sarver, Esq.: She speaks often about the importance of moving away from work life balance and moving towards a more holistic lens of harmonizing life, where work is one part.

00:03:58.890 --> 00:04:05.160 Eric Sarver, Esq.: I like that I think that's really powerful Sharon is a lifelong learner a systems thinker, a mentor and connector.

00:04:05.580 --> 00:04:20.160 Eric Sarver, Esq.: And, as she says in creating harmony, we find new ways to blend in the melodic rhythm and the dance of life wow again Sharon i'm really grateful to have you join us whether you read to be a guest on employment law today this evening.

00:04:20.550 --> 00:04:38.100 Eric Sarver, Esq.: it's great to be here sure sure thing you know I often ask my guests Aaron to tell me a little bit of more tell us more about yourself, for example, how did your career initially start out and then what prompted you to become a well being coach and the found a founder of the nurse executive.

00:04:39.150 --> 00:04:49.950 Sharon Summerfield: So my career originally started i'm really at Neptune terminals, which is a cold or cool and potus terminal in North Vancouver.

00:04:50.430 --> 00:05:01.710 Sharon Summerfield: And I was there I started as a receptionist and went into accounts payable I was first person to ever go and not leave there was a lot of firsts that it happened and.

00:05:02.970 --> 00:05:14.940 Sharon Summerfield: i'm, even though I left there in 1990 i'm still in contact with the ladies that I work the closest with who are now on retiring you know more than 30 years later and.

00:05:16.110 --> 00:05:24.660 Sharon Summerfield: Neptune there was no I didn't know anything about terms like psychological safety or bullying or any of that sort of thing because.

00:05:25.440 --> 00:05:40.710 Sharon Summerfield: It was things that we never had to think about we management always had our backs, and if there was inappropriate behavior those people were called up either have to apologize or the company never do business with them again.

00:05:41.280 --> 00:05:52.440 Sharon Summerfield: So I thought all companies were like that, and when I left Neptune move to whitehorse and I quickly learned that no not all companies are like that.

00:05:52.980 --> 00:06:10.710 Sharon Summerfield: So i've worked across the sectors i've worked in education i've worked in health, I worked for an association I worked for not for profits they worked for a large engineering firm and you know as.

00:06:11.700 --> 00:06:20.280 Sharon Summerfield: As roles evolved and things changed, one of the things I saw was many people were burning out.

00:06:20.850 --> 00:06:42.300 Sharon Summerfield: There was, it was it was the burnout there were some things with sadly with bullying, there were sadly things where people were not being included or they would hold a meeting and then change at the ninth hour to exclude other people who are key decision makers part of that meeting.

00:06:43.080 --> 00:06:51.990 Sharon Summerfield: So after I joined electronic health project, I decided, I went back to school part time and became a holistic nutritionist.

00:06:52.470 --> 00:07:02.880 Sharon Summerfield: And it was around that time I found to the nurse executives and with the goal of you know, sharing strategies and helping people learn different ways of.

00:07:03.270 --> 00:07:21.750 Sharon Summerfield: Harmonizing their life with the goal of preventing burnout and you know and and also at that time I didn't i'd never heard the term psychological safety, I actually had never heard that term until two years ago i'd heard about getting people working in their strengths zones.

00:07:22.770 --> 00:07:26.340 Sharon Summerfield: You know, different personality testing about different coaches.

00:07:27.660 --> 00:07:40.080 Sharon Summerfield: You know what people talk about bullying and safe environments and health and safety, but had never heard the word psychological safety until two years ago.

00:07:41.280 --> 00:07:41.670 Eric Sarver, Esq.: hmm.

00:07:42.690 --> 00:07:47.460 Eric Sarver, Esq.: Interesting that background, your couple things you gotta remember, so thank you for sharing.

00:07:47.850 --> 00:07:56.490 Eric Sarver, Esq.: Your history and some of your story with us on the show tonight I like the listeners can be watching the show at home listening and get a sense of who knows, listening to.

00:07:56.940 --> 00:08:07.080 Eric Sarver, Esq.: um yeah you said a couple of things there, if I may just observations, the idea that you started out sort of this during good places very positive work environment.

00:08:07.470 --> 00:08:14.940 Eric Sarver, Esq.: And then went to another positive one or ones over the years, and what I find interesting about that is that often people come on the show.

00:08:15.510 --> 00:08:27.780 Eric Sarver, Esq.: And they found, especially because they were either in a place that was all they knew was toxicity and negative and they they work to find the good over there are coming from a place of the sort of all like.

00:08:28.290 --> 00:08:32.070 Eric Sarver, Esq.: utopian and wonderful and they want to preserve that but I think the fact that you.

00:08:32.430 --> 00:08:42.030 Eric Sarver, Esq.: had both maybe that I imagine might inform like oh Now I know what one is like the other I know this is possible, you know I know we can have what you have Neptune.

00:08:42.780 --> 00:08:51.060 Eric Sarver, Esq.: interesting point and I thought, one of the point which I found interesting to the idea that you know you in different industries there's a commonality like whether it's.

00:08:51.330 --> 00:09:04.350 Eric Sarver, Esq.: education or health, the issue of burnout, just like in law when a lot, whether there's you know in what industry you're in certain Labor laws, involving a toxic workplace or discrimination oh i'm so good to hear that.

00:09:05.610 --> 00:09:06.120 Sharon Summerfield: Well, thank you.

00:09:07.170 --> 00:09:09.600 Sharon Summerfield: yeah many lessons learned along the way.

00:09:11.820 --> 00:09:12.750 Eric Sarver, Esq.: such as life right.

00:09:13.050 --> 00:09:14.280 Sharon Summerfield: Yes, yes.

00:09:15.900 --> 00:09:18.930 Eric Sarver, Esq.: yeah you know hardships and the good things too.

00:09:20.340 --> 00:09:24.990 Eric Sarver, Esq.: So, you mentioned that for the first time, my next question I was wondering about here, Sharon you mentioned.

00:09:25.710 --> 00:09:36.870 Eric Sarver, Esq.: You first heard the term psychological safety couple of years ago and i'm wondering if you can, if you can please define for our audience, how do you define psychological safety in the context of the work that you do.

00:09:37.950 --> 00:09:47.370 Sharon Summerfield: i'm in the work that I do so, I ended up two years ago there's a group on linkedin called the HR strategy Council.

00:09:47.970 --> 00:10:07.800 Sharon Summerfield: And I was part of we call ourselves the small and mighty group on was so we actually wrote a White Paper on psychological safety and so how I just I think the best definition i've come across is in this book The four stages of psychological safety.

00:10:09.270 --> 00:10:17.610 Sharon Summerfield: And I I love this book, because I think it was something really useful that could be used in a team building environment like strategic planning.

00:10:17.940 --> 00:10:33.690 Sharon Summerfield: or rebuilding your team, but what I like about it, is it talks about the for what the condition of psychological safety is really to be included, where it's safe to learn it's safe to contribute.

00:10:34.740 --> 00:10:44.460 Sharon Summerfield: and safe to challenge the status quo, and when you speak up you're not going to be reprimanded or you're not going to be marginalized you're not going to be moved to the side.

00:10:44.970 --> 00:10:59.940 Sharon Summerfield: So I I like to as i'm talking to people and there's been a number of people, particularly over the last two years, when we when they start talking i'm like do you feel included, do you feel it's safe to learn.

00:11:00.360 --> 00:11:01.320 Sharon Summerfield: Do you feel you can.

00:11:01.350 --> 00:11:03.630 Sharon Summerfield: bring up different suggestions.

00:11:03.900 --> 00:11:05.400 Sharon Summerfield: Do you feel trusted.

00:11:06.030 --> 00:11:23.250 Sharon Summerfield: Can you be, can you be your authentic self can you bring as Marcus Buckingham talks and his latest book loving work can you can you bring your red threads do you love 20% of what you do every single day.

00:11:23.850 --> 00:11:29.040 Sharon Summerfield: And can you celebrate that in some way and i'm amazed, how many people can't.

00:11:31.200 --> 00:11:38.430 Eric Sarver, Esq.: yeah absolutely it's a staggering to think how many people don't feel safe in their working environment isn't it.

00:11:39.540 --> 00:11:40.200 Sharon Summerfield: it's scary.

00:11:40.800 --> 00:12:00.570 Sharon Summerfield: um it's it's sad it's really sad because, like when I look back to my experience at Neptune and then you know a number of decades later I joined up a big on infrastructure project on Neptune we had this family, it was it was like a family.

00:12:01.500 --> 00:12:02.820 Sharon Summerfield: It was a we were there.

00:12:03.120 --> 00:12:16.800 Sharon Summerfield: wasn't always roses and sunshine, I mean it was a 24 hour operation and anything that came with thoughts, you know, and more so, it was very busy but it wasn't until I actually joined this big infrastructure project.

00:12:18.000 --> 00:12:28.500 Sharon Summerfield: That That was the first time in several decades that I had that family feel again that we could where you could actually speak up or you could have different suggestions.

00:12:29.460 --> 00:12:39.810 Sharon Summerfield: And that to me was fundamental you know you talk about psychological safety, but we also talk about the importance of having a friend at work.

00:12:41.040 --> 00:12:59.220 Sharon Summerfield: And that family and that support, because sometimes when life is you know these work isn't, as you know, you know, sometimes you have a client that's not that easy to work with that you've got different different different people have different ideas and how you should move forward.

00:12:59.880 --> 00:13:02.220 Sharon Summerfield: And if you don't have psychological safety.

00:13:03.240 --> 00:13:07.050 Sharon Summerfield: You can't it's very difficult to have that conversation in a respectful way.

00:13:08.370 --> 00:13:18.900 Eric Sarver, Esq.: isn't it, you know it's an HR first off thanks for that great work and definition of psychological safety in the workplace, and what I find interesting about that is that.

00:13:19.440 --> 00:13:28.050 Eric Sarver, Esq.: Where there's a lot of talk these days about physical safety in the workplace, having you know secure doors locking doors alarms you know.

00:13:28.620 --> 00:13:44.010 Eric Sarver, Esq.: sort of anti active shooter and for obvious reasons, and that is crucial because I don't think one can feel psychologically safe if there are physically safe, but I think that this the emotional safety and what that means.

00:13:45.060 --> 00:13:55.980 Eric Sarver, Esq.: And why it's so important, is something that I think might even get lost when our company is focusing too much on Okay, you know what's our you know, do we have to hire security guards, we have to do that so i'm glad that we're.

00:13:56.430 --> 00:14:03.270 Eric Sarver, Esq.: Talking about this now, and you know it's funny we believe it or not read our very first commercial break time flies when we're having fun and say interesting guests, but.

00:14:04.410 --> 00:14:12.780 Eric Sarver, Esq.: i've been maybe we'll pick up on this and other questions after the break so i'll just let everyone know you're listening to or watching employment law today.

00:14:13.230 --> 00:14:24.000 Eric Sarver, Esq.: i'm your host employment law generic sovereign my guest tonight miss Sharon summerfield nurse executive stay tuned we'll talk more about how to stop this foundation psychological safety.

00:14:24.330 --> 00:14:37.260 Eric Sarver, Esq.: And the problems that arise, without it, and then the good things happen when you have it, so this is something for the employees out there for employers out there, whether you're just starting out you've been around for a long time stay tuned for the show we'll be right back.

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00:16:52.350 --> 00:17:03.870 Eric Sarver, Esq.: Welcome back to employment law today i'm your host erick solver i'm here tonight with Sharon summerfield founder the nurse executive Sharon to well being coach or connector and a mentor as well, and an author.

00:17:04.290 --> 00:17:16.080 Eric Sarver, Esq.: And our topic tonight for those who are joining us a little bit late breaths is psychological safety in the workplace right, what is it, how do we create it, why do we need it, what are the benefits of it.

00:17:16.410 --> 00:17:20.700 Eric Sarver, Esq.: And Sharon so far really just great hearing about your backgrounds to so far.

00:17:21.030 --> 00:17:35.400 Eric Sarver, Esq.: hearing your working definition of psychological safety in the workplace, I gotta say and just hearing all the other things we're talking about, and this is really I think are helpful topic for our audience of employers and employees so i'm really glad you're here tonight.

00:17:36.960 --> 00:17:38.310 Sharon Summerfield: Thank you it's great to be here.

00:17:38.910 --> 00:17:44.250 Eric Sarver, Esq.: yeah good to have you on the show you know what struck me is like we talked before about.

00:17:44.580 --> 00:17:53.340 Eric Sarver, Esq.: How people often think a safety and safe workplace and they think about you know hiring security expert to to make sure the windows is locking door and.

00:17:53.640 --> 00:18:08.400 Eric Sarver, Esq.: That there's a you know, a way to lock people out who are causing harm, I think this safety in the workplace, I think you'd find this what it is, you know, feel that you can be free to be authentic self right communicate express yourself without you know, fear of.

00:18:09.600 --> 00:18:25.740 Eric Sarver, Esq.: Punishment I was wondering like maybe we can talk a little bit about this next question, which is why is psychological safety, why is it a necessity Sharon a success story foundation for employers, if they want to improve their employees connection and productivity, I think.

00:18:25.920 --> 00:18:29.880 Sharon Summerfield: I You know, as you know, the last two years have really shown us.

00:18:31.320 --> 00:18:43.440 Sharon Summerfield: Employees well being is now front and Center and I I think it's it it didn't just happen in the last two years, there was a lot of things that were leading up to that.

00:18:44.010 --> 00:18:50.310 Sharon Summerfield: And you look at the thing that's really interesting about what I like to talk about with psychological safety.

00:18:50.880 --> 00:19:03.840 Sharon Summerfield: That doesn't get talked about enough psychological safety is actually your competitive advantage, so if you are fostering psychological safety in your organization's and in your teams and.

00:19:04.950 --> 00:19:12.540 Sharon Summerfield: You know, as a lawyer you're going to be working with a variety of different teams, I know, when I worked for ch to him hill a global engineering firm.

00:19:12.960 --> 00:19:30.750 Sharon Summerfield: You know it wasn't just the team in the organization, it was the teams in multiple organizations on multiple projects so having kind of it's almost I don't know quote a contact isn't the right word, but this understanding of how we're going to engage.

00:19:31.230 --> 00:19:52.410 Sharon Summerfield: That we are not going to work we're not going to put up with inappropriate behavior where we are going to be respectful we're going to include people and if someone is being disrespectful we can then have that conversation and get things turned around like something as simple as.

00:19:53.490 --> 00:19:57.840 Sharon Summerfield: onboarding people are talking a lot about onboarding in off 40.

00:19:58.260 --> 00:20:03.930 Sharon Summerfield: And how you onboard and off board has a direct impact on your ability to hold on to people.

00:20:04.470 --> 00:20:04.710 Sharon Summerfield: But.

00:20:04.800 --> 00:20:08.880 Sharon Summerfield: How many people join organizations with the tools to do their job.

00:20:09.450 --> 00:20:10.710 Sharon Summerfield: yeah most of.

00:20:11.280 --> 00:20:20.310 Sharon Summerfield: It takes weeks to get a laptop cellphone credit card if you're traveling all these all these other things.

00:20:20.640 --> 00:20:36.630 Sharon Summerfield: Right that's also part of psychological safety because you're not able to on day one contribute and do meaningful work because they haven't given you the tools to bring you on board so right out of the gate you already feel excluded.

00:20:37.350 --> 00:20:44.700 Eric Sarver, Esq.: hmm interesting point there Sharon I think what companies might miss that you know when they're getting people on boarded and I think.

00:20:45.000 --> 00:20:51.600 Eric Sarver, Esq.: You know one thing I like when I do this show every week is that I know that love these issues that we talked about have.

00:20:52.440 --> 00:20:59.490 Eric Sarver, Esq.: army and employment law respect right approach so safety in the workplace, like you know we employment lawyer has talked to our clients about this.

00:20:59.730 --> 00:21:08.520 Eric Sarver, Esq.: You know in business owners, we say, if you don't have this if you have a bullying workplace or toxicity or harassment or exclusion, you can be setting yourself up for.

00:21:08.880 --> 00:21:13.710 Eric Sarver, Esq.: Contract the discharge claims discrimination claims losses so there's all kinds of like sort of.

00:21:14.160 --> 00:21:23.310 Eric Sarver, Esq.: it's like the stick approach it's you know watch out for this negative and, but I want what I hear you talking about and saying is that there are also perhaps some positives.

00:21:23.610 --> 00:21:28.710 Eric Sarver, Esq.: To in terms of productivity or connection just some we've also talked about.

00:21:29.430 --> 00:21:38.220 Eric Sarver, Esq.: When you were leading up to your you know introduction earlier on the show, so I hear what you're saying I think it's an excellent point about just the you know why we need.

00:21:38.640 --> 00:21:53.400 Eric Sarver, Esq.: This foundation psychological safety i'm wondering if, like you see an issue let's say when people are fearful of being like shame the rebuked or this or punished for speaking out, you know what what does that.

00:21:53.820 --> 00:22:01.710 Eric Sarver, Esq.: How does that, like negatively heard I don't hurt the company from a legal point of view I don't think it hurts my terms of productivity and turn over those kind of things.

00:22:02.310 --> 00:22:05.940 Sharon Summerfield: Well, a perfect example of that is NASA and the challenger.

00:22:07.680 --> 00:22:16.860 Sharon Summerfield: Because the engineers didn't want them to move forward, they didn't want the launch to happen, but because of the lack of psychological safety.

00:22:17.400 --> 00:22:27.030 Sharon Summerfield: They were shut down their opinions were paid attention to so a disaster happened, so what happens with psychological safety when it's not safe to speak up.

00:22:27.570 --> 00:22:38.880 Sharon Summerfield: Is people they navigate around things, or they learn, not to say anything because their opinion is not valued so, then they hide the mistakes.

00:22:39.420 --> 00:22:40.020 and

00:22:41.220 --> 00:22:50.010 Sharon Summerfield: They hide the mistakes or they don't speak up, and so the organizations, find themselves in these situations that could have been avoided.

00:22:50.430 --> 00:23:05.340 Sharon Summerfield: yeah so I found was interesting when it was it ch from hell, I had an organizational role and a project role at the same time at the organ organization was you know they weren't winning work, so it was a hard time for them.

00:23:05.850 --> 00:23:06.450 and

00:23:07.740 --> 00:23:12.900 Sharon Summerfield: If you made a mistake at the organizational level you weren't told what that mistake was.

00:23:13.290 --> 00:23:17.010 Sharon Summerfield: And you weren't given the opportunity to fix it, you were just removed.

00:23:18.090 --> 00:23:29.100 Sharon Summerfield: At the same time i'm working on a project in a role where i've thrown so far out of my comfort zone, I can hardly breathe Initially it was a phenomenal learning opportunity.

00:23:29.340 --> 00:23:36.660 Sharon Summerfield: And if you made a mistake, you were told what that mistake was and then you were asked to fix it.

00:23:37.200 --> 00:23:39.210 Sharon Summerfield: So here, I am in these two polar.

00:23:39.360 --> 00:23:51.150 Sharon Summerfield: Opposite cultures exactly the same time, and one is fostering through the psychological safety learning and growth.

00:23:51.450 --> 00:23:52.710 Sharon Summerfield: And then the other one isn't.

00:23:54.060 --> 00:23:58.770 Eric Sarver, Esq.: So true Sharon yeah I think that's a very good point the other challenge of the powerful devil, I was.

00:23:59.250 --> 00:24:05.580 Eric Sarver, Esq.: I must have read that are heard that somewhere along the line over the years, maybe just didn't stick top of mind with like, I think.

00:24:06.030 --> 00:24:12.480 Eric Sarver, Esq.: For our listeners tonight you know if you're out there, listening to the show every week and you run a business, you have employees, you know it's that.

00:24:12.750 --> 00:24:20.670 Eric Sarver, Esq.: so important, I think, to let them know that you know mistakes, it can be shared and and we can be learning experiences, I think.

00:24:21.000 --> 00:24:27.660 Eric Sarver, Esq.: I think, too often, the employers might think well that makes me quote unquote soft or quote unquote not you know in charge, they.

00:24:27.990 --> 00:24:35.580 Eric Sarver, Esq.: But I really do I think i've seen in law firms over the years i've been have my practice for a long time now, but when I first started out.

00:24:36.150 --> 00:24:43.770 Eric Sarver, Esq.: Is that are prominent park avenue for him, I like to joke that they had the prestige of a big firm without the salary that's another story, the other day, but.

00:24:44.880 --> 00:24:53.070 Eric Sarver, Esq.: When I read that in hiding their mistakes because of that same fear and it just does not bode well because eventually.

00:24:53.520 --> 00:25:05.370 Eric Sarver, Esq.: Either something's going wrong and it's not being fixed or something is just there's no chance for growth and and and communication so i'm really glad you're talking about this, you know, like hey, this is what we need.

00:25:06.450 --> 00:25:13.440 Eric Sarver, Esq.: As a foundation right, we need to be able to share, about mistakes and learn from them and have transparency and communications what.

00:25:14.370 --> 00:25:25.020 Sharon Summerfield: Is that right and there's another piece of that too is that without psychological safety, there is no creativity and innovation, because being innovative and creative.

00:25:25.440 --> 00:25:38.910 Sharon Summerfield: And you can't do that if you if you don't feel safe it's really hard to do that, and so what happens in these organizations that you know have more creative, if that is being shut down.

00:25:39.330 --> 00:25:53.490 Sharon Summerfield: Then the resources that are needed to do some of these projects are not articulated correctly, so you end up not with the project to solve the problem you were hoping to do.

00:25:54.240 --> 00:26:07.230 Sharon Summerfield: Because you haven't got all the right pieces together and that's another piece of psychological safety, the ability to speak up you actually get the right resources with the right people in the right area.

00:26:07.710 --> 00:26:11.190 Sharon Summerfield: And what happens is you actually save money.

00:26:13.470 --> 00:26:16.860 Eric Sarver, Esq.: Interesting you save money in terms of.

00:26:16.890 --> 00:26:23.910 Sharon Summerfield: Because i'm sure you've been on on projects for you we're going to try this and then we're going to try this and we're going to try this.

00:26:24.270 --> 00:26:37.050 Sharon Summerfield: And after three tries they bring someone in that a few of the people in the beginning, thought of bringing him, but that was shut down so they bring those people in, and then they find the way forward.

00:26:37.260 --> 00:26:40.800 Sharon Summerfield: But they spent three times as much money because it took them that long together.

00:26:41.250 --> 00:26:49.440 Eric Sarver, Esq.: I say interesting point that combined with like turnover and such but you know mistakes can multiply and if that i've fixed right away.

00:26:49.770 --> 00:26:55.170 Eric Sarver, Esq.: And then you may also want to bring in people that you know, perhaps you maybe were shut down ringing in the first place.

00:26:55.860 --> 00:27:02.310 Eric Sarver, Esq.: I think there's a really that's a sort of an interesting point to you know when you talk about mistakes being covered up or.

00:27:02.700 --> 00:27:11.640 Eric Sarver, Esq.: Shared emerged in the challenge, I think about Y2K and I remember reading somewhere that they were some like I think computer data type you know.

00:27:11.940 --> 00:27:22.740 Eric Sarver, Esq.: engineers and computer scientists who someone I think discovered along the way, many years before we will talk about Y2K that the way things are programmed with the last two digits.

00:27:23.670 --> 00:27:26.160 Eric Sarver, Esq.: Certain I think systems, I don't know the exact details but.

00:27:26.550 --> 00:27:36.270 Eric Sarver, Esq.: That they recognize that hey you know what will happen 1989 when we switch over the year 2000 was good at, and I think they were fearful to bring it up in certain industries.

00:27:36.630 --> 00:27:42.360 Eric Sarver, Esq.: And they're fearful of losing the jobs, but then of course this one unchecked are unspoken about for many years.

00:27:42.840 --> 00:27:45.840 Eric Sarver, Esq.: Until I created like a worse problem you know it's like if you make a mistake.

00:27:46.230 --> 00:27:53.610 Eric Sarver, Esq.: And you don't address it it's like if you leave you know mill down by mistake if you leave it there for an hour and three hours and.

00:27:54.000 --> 00:27:59.130 Eric Sarver, Esq.: kind of leave it there for four days you know it's like the smell will get so I think my point is.

00:27:59.520 --> 00:28:10.170 Eric Sarver, Esq.: The psychological safety is such an interesting way to admit like beer problems with the bud, and I think i'm glad we're having this conversation about this, you know really think it's a good point to be discussing today's.

00:28:11.700 --> 00:28:12.360 Sharon Summerfield: completely agree.

00:28:12.960 --> 00:28:15.690 Eric Sarver, Esq.: yeah you know excellent absolutely.

00:28:16.560 --> 00:28:30.900 Eric Sarver, Esq.: And I also seen this feeling of you're talking about how I think people you know can can feel safe to be heard and more creative right that creativity gets shut down when safety shut down I think that's very true a lot of creativity happens.

00:28:31.380 --> 00:28:46.230 Eric Sarver, Esq.: When one feels like they're not going to be judged for being for good idea, no like not like told that stupid or you know or put down, and I think saved, it can be more than just fear of you know angry words are shouting can be fear of.

00:28:47.640 --> 00:28:54.300 Eric Sarver, Esq.: You know, being held up to ridicule or being embarrassed you know among ones coworkers so interesting, I think.

00:28:56.010 --> 00:28:57.060 Sharon Summerfield: It is very interesting.

00:28:57.630 --> 00:29:04.920 Eric Sarver, Esq.: yeah you know sure we leave it on, as always, shocking to say, is where our next commercial break so when we come back.

00:29:05.670 --> 00:29:22.170 Eric Sarver, Esq.: we'll talk more about psychological safety, the foundation for productivity in the workplace and we'll talk with Sharon summerfield about some of the tools and strategies, she used with her clients to build this valuable foundation so stick around you're listening to talk radio nyc.

00:29:23.250 --> 00:29:26.610 Eric Sarver, Esq.: and employment law today and we will be right back.

00:29:31.650 --> 00:29:31.920 Eric Sarver, Esq.: The new.

00:29:32.880 --> 00:29:37.680 gateway to the smoking it airs on talk radio dot nyc every Tuesday night.

00:29:39.360 --> 00:29:45.720 Every episode is dedicated to memorable experiences in the great smoky mountain national park and surrounding areas.

00:29:46.020 --> 00:29:56.850 This show features experts and look closely expound upon the richness of culture, history and adventure and include you in this journey every Tuesday from 6pm to seven on talk radio dot nyc.

00:29:59.610 --> 00:30:13.440 you're passionate about the conversation around racism hi i'm Reverend Dr to see most of the dismantle racism show which airs every Thursday at 11am Eastern on talk radio dot nyc.

00:30:13.890 --> 00:30:25.950 join me and my amazing guests, as we discussed ways to uncover dismantle radical racism that's Thursday at 11 o'clock 8am on talk radio dot nyc.

00:30:30.510 --> 00:30:41.370 Small Business trying to navigate the covert 19 rebated employment laws Hello i'm Eric sovereign climate log business law attorney and host of the new radio show employment law today.

00:30:42.000 --> 00:30:54.600 On my show who have guests, to discuss the common employment law challenges business owners are facing during these trying times tune in on Tuesday evenings from 5pm to 6pm Eastern time on talk radio dot nyc.

00:30:59.460 --> 00:31:08.190 you're listening to talk radio nyc at www talk radio dot nyc now broadcasting 24 hours a day.

00:31:31.980 --> 00:31:40.830 Eric Sarver, Esq.: Welcome back to employment law today again i'm your host erick solder i'm an employment law business law attorney here tonight with my guest Sharon summerfield our guest tonight.

00:31:41.460 --> 00:31:53.370 Eric Sarver, Esq.: sharing is a well being coach and founder the nurture executive it's also certified breath coach and assurance as well and Sharon really great to have this this topic that we're discussing today, this idea of.

00:31:54.690 --> 00:31:58.080 Eric Sarver, Esq.: Psychological safety in the workplace, where we're having this conversation here.

00:32:00.060 --> 00:32:00.390 Sharon Summerfield: Be here.

00:32:00.960 --> 00:32:02.130 Eric Sarver, Esq.: yeah absolutely.

00:32:03.210 --> 00:32:10.530 Eric Sarver, Esq.: One thing that struck me is just the idea that you need certain things in place with the Foundation, this is.

00:32:11.280 --> 00:32:25.200 Eric Sarver, Esq.: What i'm hearing from you and all that you're talking about tonight i'm getting the impression that psychological safety doesn't mean you can put it sort of fifth of six on the list when you're doing team building a productivity hacks I wonder if you can maybe speak to why that is.

00:32:26.370 --> 00:32:33.690 Sharon Summerfield: A psychological safety actually needs to be fostering fostered in your organization isn't it isn't a checklist.

00:32:34.170 --> 00:32:34.920 Sharon Summerfield: It isn't.

00:32:36.000 --> 00:32:41.760 Sharon Summerfield: Like we're going to create a conference room and have yoga mats in it that's not psychological safety.

00:32:43.080 --> 00:33:01.920 Sharon Summerfield: Or have a nap room or we're going to have a special coffee machine now it's not psychological safety so psychological safety has to be part of how you do business and then one of the things I like to say long time before I heard about psychological safety was that.

00:33:03.120 --> 00:33:17.490 Sharon Summerfield: We how we treat each other, our colleagues, is how we're going to treat our stakeholders, our clients and our shareholders so by fostering greater psychological safety.

00:33:18.000 --> 00:33:28.080 Sharon Summerfield: it's almost like we start creating a roadmap, so if we have a value of including people, which is is part of psychological safety.

00:33:28.650 --> 00:33:48.870 Sharon Summerfield: We are going to include the right people to make the decision like if we're setting up a meeting we're losing millions and billions of dollars of our meetings being poorly planned so if we have the right people around the table to make the decision and part of the planning process.

00:33:49.080 --> 00:33:51.810 Sharon Summerfield: on how you so everyone it's safe to learn it's safe to.

00:33:51.810 --> 00:34:06.720 Sharon Summerfield: contribute and it's it's safe to challenge the status quo, which are all the fundamentals of psychological safety we're going to actually improve our decision making and then people will be more present in our meetings and be able to make better decisions.

00:34:07.890 --> 00:34:14.040 Eric Sarver, Esq.: yeah and the challenge is that without fear of retribution or being shut down.

00:34:14.460 --> 00:34:24.330 Eric Sarver, Esq.: And that's interesting an engineer want you make sure, and along with the point you made about how how we treat each other as colleagues example managers managers, how we treat.

00:34:24.690 --> 00:34:31.560 Eric Sarver, Esq.: Our stakeholders on those waters, etc, it has an excellent point and because I was thinking about this before the show tonight thinking about the topic and.

00:34:31.890 --> 00:34:37.320 Eric Sarver, Esq.: You know, thinking about the fact that you know, we need to model as much as we talk, because we can have.

00:34:37.650 --> 00:34:45.000 Eric Sarver, Esq.: Lots of I mean I write employee handbooks and policies as part of my job, so I know they can be all the right words and the policies about.

00:34:45.390 --> 00:34:52.410 Eric Sarver, Esq.: We foster diversity inclusion safety no bullying cetera and that's great and that's important to have communicated.

00:34:52.830 --> 00:35:03.420 Eric Sarver, Esq.: But if people are employees are watching and seeing a different reality than what's in writing, they think oh it's just talk and I think what i'm hearing, maybe is that.

00:35:03.750 --> 00:35:10.500 Eric Sarver, Esq.: We need to walk the walk of psychological safety, not just talk the talk not just have you know, an HR policies headed out.

00:35:10.860 --> 00:35:24.870 Sharon Summerfield: It needs to be because in some organizations HR isn't actually part of the business, and this is also you know another conversation that the HR leaders that are able to you know to influence change.

00:35:25.260 --> 00:35:28.680 Sharon Summerfield: On understand the business in our part of the business.

00:35:29.040 --> 00:35:38.430 Sharon Summerfield: So it's really key that our leaders are modeling if if we believe that psychological safety is a value and.

00:35:38.580 --> 00:35:43.470 Sharon Summerfield: You know, we want to be inclusive and diversity inclusion we don't want to exclude anyone.

00:35:44.070 --> 00:35:53.760 Sharon Summerfield: Our leaders need to be modeling this because if the leaders are modeling it Yes, our teams can try and do it, but they're going to legally be able to go so far.

00:35:54.750 --> 00:36:01.890 Eric Sarver, Esq.: Absolutely, I know, no one, a lot one of you then often HR and supposed to be the first friend here to triage.

00:36:02.340 --> 00:36:10.410 Eric Sarver, Esq.: Employment employee relations issues before it gets to my desk as an employment lawyer, but if he doesn't feel safe Linda organization then there's really not making the.

00:36:11.220 --> 00:36:18.630 Eric Sarver, Esq.: Employees feel safe when they come to them with an issue and employee can read that and pick up on it, I find very quickly.

00:36:19.800 --> 00:36:28.230 Eric Sarver, Esq.: I think one point, you know which takes me there yeah I think this is great, you know i'd love it if you Sharon, if you wouldn't mind, could you kindly.

00:36:28.530 --> 00:36:38.460 Eric Sarver, Esq.: Maybe walk us through so take us through some of the tools and strategies that you use with your client business owners and leaders to help them to enhance psychological safety.

00:36:39.180 --> 00:36:54.450 Sharon Summerfield: One of the things that I hear a lot is an i'll use an example with the last not for profit that I that I was part of but I hear a lot is my calendar is not my own, so the minute someone seeing my calendar is not my own.

00:36:57.030 --> 00:37:12.240 Sharon Summerfield: How can they actually show up as their best selves because part of psychological safety is also being able to say no, because everything we're saying yes to we're saying no to something else, so I was was.

00:37:13.290 --> 00:37:17.760 Sharon Summerfield: working as an executive assistant and there was a director.

00:37:18.480 --> 00:37:27.030 Sharon Summerfield: And she started really micromanaging and there's like when you start noticing behaviors that are not help people normally operate.

00:37:27.360 --> 00:37:39.630 Sharon Summerfield: These are where usually, we need to sit down and have a conversation, so we started this conversation, and one of the things I like to do is like let's see are you getting close to your true priorities, what did those two priorities look like.

00:37:39.870 --> 00:37:57.510 Sharon Summerfield: And what do you think those barriers are so we started having this conversation her staff started dropping by they got involved in the conversation, so we actually found some ways, because in part of being psychologically say you need to be able to delegate to other people.

00:37:57.870 --> 00:38:15.780 Sharon Summerfield: In some cultures, you always have to be seen if you're not seeing they don't believe that you're working and so that wasn't the situation where we were, but that was one of the roadblocks that was stopping her from engaging her stuff more and delegating more.

00:38:16.230 --> 00:38:34.200 Sharon Summerfield: So she started to delegate more and what happened this ended up taking on a whole department wide lens psychological safety was President but we bounced a lot of things that we were doing, and one of the things I really encourage people to do is.

00:38:35.280 --> 00:38:37.140 Sharon Summerfield: Get back to the basics of meeting planning.

00:38:37.770 --> 00:38:43.920 Sharon Summerfield: If you're invited to a meeting and there's no agenda 48 hours prior to the meeting the client.

00:38:45.750 --> 00:38:46.440 Sharon Summerfield: And up.

00:38:46.590 --> 00:39:04.260 Sharon Summerfield: And the other piece is we need boundaries, you know i'm going to allocate you've allocated 45 minutes for this meeting at the end of the 45 Minutes say i'm sorry that's all the time, a house, I need to and part of that is psychological safety because we need to be able to speak up.

00:39:04.830 --> 00:39:05.460 Eric Sarver, Esq.: Because.

00:39:05.610 --> 00:39:08.910 Sharon Summerfield: In a lot of environments, I mean particular encoded.

00:39:09.330 --> 00:39:10.080 Sharon Summerfield: People were.

00:39:10.410 --> 00:39:14.010 Sharon Summerfield: Changing with their meeting started, so they could actually make it to the bathroom.

00:39:16.410 --> 00:39:18.540 Sharon Summerfield: Had the inability to just speak up.

00:39:19.020 --> 00:39:20.490 Sharon Summerfield: And that's that's a really big.

00:39:20.550 --> 00:39:22.290 Sharon Summerfield: piece of psychological safety.

00:39:22.890 --> 00:39:33.750 Eric Sarver, Esq.: The ability to speak up absolutely 100% so it sounds like a tool is your users to help clients business owners management to understand the need for.

00:39:34.110 --> 00:39:41.160 Eric Sarver, Esq.: Those boundaries, including one day at first blush know some people listening right my think i'm going to give people the.

00:39:41.460 --> 00:39:50.070 Eric Sarver, Esq.: ability to decline, a meeting going to be cast anarchy and I think the truth is that sort of a slippery slope catastrophic thinking way to look at things like if I.

00:39:50.430 --> 00:39:57.960 Eric Sarver, Esq.: give people that kind of you know power to be free, you know that'd be great how's everyone sharing down left right, the truth is, I believe most people.

00:39:58.260 --> 00:40:03.360 Eric Sarver, Esq.: want to do their job and do it well and and be successful at it and so they're not going to turn down.

00:40:03.900 --> 00:40:14.760 Eric Sarver, Esq.: Meaning you know you can trust adults right to act like grown ups it's not like you know they're in third grade and you save them, you can eat whatever you want for lunch and they're gonna say candy ice cream in our second rate or something like that.

00:40:14.820 --> 00:40:25.890 Eric Sarver, Esq.: yeah yeah yeah that I think it's an interesting tool there and then think boundaries and free more the calendar, who would have thought that ties into safety, but I see how it does.

00:40:26.370 --> 00:40:34.500 Sharon Summerfield: Well, and there's another piece and coming in, like because I was part of the team to I could see the behavior changing.

00:40:34.920 --> 00:40:42.210 Sharon Summerfield: And we talked about this in the early days of the gateway program so the gateway program was a three plus billion dollar infrastructure project.

00:40:42.630 --> 00:40:51.870 Sharon Summerfield: In the lower mainland in Vancouver and infrastructure projects, you know quite often there's longer hours but typically they don't last for 10 years.

00:40:52.200 --> 00:41:02.460 Sharon Summerfield: So we started having conversations that we need to keep an eye on each other and that's part of it if we need to keep an eye on each other when people are working.

00:41:03.000 --> 00:41:10.590 Sharon Summerfield: We see that you know that their first email say comes in at six o'clock in the morning and they're still sending messages at one at one o'clock in the morning.

00:41:11.880 --> 00:41:17.070 Sharon Summerfield: We need to part of that is having conversations, are you okay i'm worried about you.

00:41:18.180 --> 00:41:24.600 Sharon Summerfield: Do you need to take some time off what can I can I help you with something Can I take something off your desk.

00:41:25.140 --> 00:41:27.720 Sharon Summerfield: and start to normalize that conversation.

00:41:28.050 --> 00:41:33.990 Sharon Summerfield: Because, in reality, asking for help and taking a break, is a strength, not a weakness.

00:41:34.680 --> 00:41:45.360 Eric Sarver, Esq.: hundred percent on that, yes, I agree Harley share with that that's a good point to make, and I think for business owners, whether you listening tonight feel like you don't feel safe.

00:41:45.780 --> 00:41:57.060 Eric Sarver, Esq.: Taking those breaking boundaries for yourself with your partner business partners with your investors with your employees or if you're an employee watching and maybe listening tonight and you feel hey I wish I can do this with my.

00:41:58.320 --> 00:42:06.570 Eric Sarver, Esq.: You know employer, I can set boundaries take breaks it's a good point also you raise your hand about keeping an eye on people noticing those things i'm noticing.

00:42:06.930 --> 00:42:11.490 Eric Sarver, Esq.: You know who's sending emails at 3am and I remember, I had a client once like that she was sent emails that.

00:42:11.880 --> 00:42:24.300 Eric Sarver, Esq.: 3:14am for 26 them and then she would be ready for an ATM call discuss her case or a matter and i'd see your schedule throughout the day and I asked her some point, you know.

00:42:24.870 --> 00:42:32.100 Eric Sarver, Esq.: You know so on so yeah how are you are you getting enough sleep enough rest, you know because I thought this might lead to you.

00:42:32.580 --> 00:42:38.340 Eric Sarver, Esq.: know some kind of burnout and, sadly, you know years later, did, and I think she's a lot healthier now.

00:42:39.270 --> 00:42:48.090 Eric Sarver, Esq.: But you know i'm an attorney of her so I don't feel unsafe in pointing that out it's a point of concern, but I think it's important that.

00:42:48.540 --> 00:43:00.480 Eric Sarver, Esq.: You know, employers feel they can actually asked that question and an answer in a way that's not sort of accusatory or shame, which is sort of like a concern right that's going to mean.

00:43:01.800 --> 00:43:09.390 Sharon Summerfield: a place of caring and that's why you know, investing in the relationship from that place of inclusion and.

00:43:09.390 --> 00:43:11.250 Sharon Summerfield: Wanting to help each other.

00:43:11.640 --> 00:43:12.900 Sharon Summerfield: But it's also a great.

00:43:12.900 --> 00:43:19.110 Sharon Summerfield: way to one of the things I talked about is when was the last time you booked your annual vacation for the rest of the year.

00:43:19.650 --> 00:43:30.630 Sharon Summerfield: Look at and then look at who can cover some of your work while you're away so you can actually have that break and not think or talk about work and then that can actually start feeding into succession planning.

00:43:31.440 --> 00:43:32.010 Eric Sarver, Esq.: hmm huh.

00:43:33.180 --> 00:43:35.970 Eric Sarver, Esq.: yeah you've got hours of.

00:43:37.260 --> 00:43:44.760 Eric Sarver, Esq.: personal growth and balance in there and and I keep hearing about there's a communication I five points all this right is.

00:43:45.120 --> 00:43:50.850 Eric Sarver, Esq.: That what people feel i'm hearing open or comfortable around and being open comfortable sharing.

00:43:51.420 --> 00:44:08.310 Eric Sarver, Esq.: what's really going on for them the workplace, and I think you know, we need to model that not just said, but actually like living model for your employees, you know, not all like parenting and I think you know, I have a two year old son to an almost three in the summer in August, but.

00:44:09.330 --> 00:44:14.850 Eric Sarver, Esq.: And I know I learned from people that kids will watch you as much as I listened to you so.

00:44:15.300 --> 00:44:21.930 Eric Sarver, Esq.: know and they'll watching how you add another lesson once, when I was on that six months ago I think my son was like almost two and a half and.

00:44:22.320 --> 00:44:25.170 Eric Sarver, Esq.: He was trying to get the iPad to work as he's a tech genius and I love it.

00:44:25.740 --> 00:44:33.960 Eric Sarver, Esq.: And I heard them go off this little voice oh come on man and I thought we were to get that from and then I I thought about all the times like when i'm.

00:44:34.350 --> 00:44:41.280 Eric Sarver, Esq.: on the phone with verizon getting cut off four times come on man well when i'm on you know at a light and someone like didn't.

00:44:41.730 --> 00:44:49.260 Eric Sarver, Esq.: a traffic jam and i'll come on man and i'm not talking to him, but he hears that and I remember, was a big lesson you like wow.

00:44:49.590 --> 00:45:05.250 Eric Sarver, Esq.: You know i'm always careful what I say, but I have to really watch like my own attitude, and I think that's maybe what employers not infantilize our workers, but hey if your employer listening, you know, make sure your workers like she you treating yourself well and she not as well.

00:45:05.910 --> 00:45:12.210 Sharon Summerfield: yeah you have to take care of yourself first put the oxygen oxygen mask on yourself before you can help someone else.

00:45:12.720 --> 00:45:19.380 Eric Sarver, Esq.: So true Shan toto we know we actually our third much rain and it does go so quickly, and I hope you audiences.

00:45:20.580 --> 00:45:34.140 Eric Sarver, Esq.: is also enjoying this interesting fast paced conversation so we're just going to implement lunch today with my guest our guest tonight Sharon summerfield on talk radio nyc stick around we'll be right back.

00:45:38.100 --> 00:45:38.670 hey buddy.

00:45:38.730 --> 00:45:49.290 it's coming at the nonprofit sector connected coming at you from my attic each week here on talk radio dot nyc I hope the program will advocate for nonprofits impact us.

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00:47:03.930 --> 00:47:12.360 Listening to talk radio and yc at www talk radio dot nyc now broadcasting 24 hours a day.

00:47:34.740 --> 00:47:35.940 Eric Sarver, Esq.: Welcome back folks.

00:47:37.200 --> 00:47:48.450 Eric Sarver, Esq.: Welcome back to employment law today i'm your host erick Sabra i'm still employment law business law attorney and still here with our guest tonight, our guest Sharon summerfield the nurse executive.

00:47:49.350 --> 00:48:01.830 Eric Sarver, Esq.: Sharon talking about this issue of knowing establishing maintaining psychological safety in the workplace and just really great conversation so far and I had to say.

00:48:02.910 --> 00:48:03.690 Sharon Summerfield: It enjoying it.

00:48:04.230 --> 00:48:09.360 Eric Sarver, Esq.: Great I don't have to say I will say, I want to say is really read something, you know that expression always make you laugh a bit, but.

00:48:10.050 --> 00:48:23.100 Eric Sarver, Esq.: So you know i'm wondering, maybe in our sort of last question here to discuss if you can tell us like How does a nurse executive differentiate itself from other well being coaches and mentors who work with business leaders.

00:48:24.090 --> 00:48:24.570 um.

00:48:25.680 --> 00:48:37.980 Sharon Summerfield: I I, you know as we were talking about putting you have to put the oxygen mask on yourself first and I really encourage people we hear all about you know the books on burnout throw.

00:48:38.880 --> 00:48:45.420 Sharon Summerfield: All these people say you got to self care self care self care, but so curious is something that you schedule once a year.

00:48:45.840 --> 00:48:53.700 Sharon Summerfield: And I really encourage people that i'm talking to working with they look at ways that they can invest in their self care each and every day.

00:48:54.120 --> 00:49:01.680 Sharon Summerfield: Maybe that's something is adding transition time between your meetings, maybe it's you get outside and go for a walk.

00:49:02.100 --> 00:49:18.750 Sharon Summerfield: Or maybe you have a phone call that you turn into a walking meeting, but you find those ways to nourish your well being so, I like to use the lens of be nourished and all you do, are you actually involved in work that is nourishing you.

00:49:19.530 --> 00:49:20.580 Sharon Summerfield: Or is it.

00:49:21.150 --> 00:49:33.720 Sharon Summerfield: suck for lack of a better word sucking the life out of you, because we've all been involved in work at that, like that, at some point in our lives, so the lens of you know, be nourished and all you do.

00:49:34.860 --> 00:49:50.400 Sharon Summerfield: Is is one of the ways I like to differentiate myself and it's looking at the whole person it's not just looking at what they're eating the supplements they're taking how is looking at all these different components and also their relationship with technology.

00:49:50.970 --> 00:49:51.360 Sharon Summerfield: and

00:49:51.690 --> 00:50:03.510 Sharon Summerfield: You know, when it comes to psychological II and how we're engaging with our teams are we actually having a conversation around what the core hours are going to be where we're going to work with our team.

00:50:04.440 --> 00:50:11.790 Sharon Summerfield: and defining what a true emergency looks like we've got all these tools to connect and we've got our cell phones we've got our messaging from all.

00:50:12.300 --> 00:50:27.120 Sharon Summerfield: All these different platforms we've got email, but what is a true emergency and how are we going to connect with each other when that true emergency comes up and unless we actually define that.

00:50:28.350 --> 00:50:41.880 Sharon Summerfield: It can turn into almost anything and that's where the psychological safety piece comes into place is that my hope is we're going to transition away from this idea, I have to see you.

00:50:42.330 --> 00:50:52.260 Sharon Summerfield: I need to log into your computer to see that you're actually working to i've hired you because I know you've got the skills and the expertise.

00:50:52.620 --> 00:51:01.110 Sharon Summerfield: To do this work, maybe it's a contract role, maybe it's an organization role, but I trust you I trust you to do the work.

00:51:01.620 --> 00:51:14.670 Sharon Summerfield: And we're focused on the outcomes not the amount of time you're sitting in front of the screen so i'm hoping we're going to transition to more of that and that's a key piece of psychological safety.

00:51:16.080 --> 00:51:23.520 Eric Sarver, Esq.: yeah the vote of confidence right, I trust you I believe your confidence, confidence in us, so I don't need you to prove to me that you're.

00:51:24.090 --> 00:51:29.730 Eric Sarver, Esq.: Actually, showing up by you know clocking in clocking out every time you leave to take a break over coffee or.

00:51:30.600 --> 00:51:41.160 Eric Sarver, Esq.: You know I think a lot of firms either moving away from some of those strict build our requirements for their associates and i'm you know my firm's little different situation but.

00:51:42.240 --> 00:51:53.640 Eric Sarver, Esq.: I may have to build to build clients and show revenue stream, but the idea of like a minimum if people are getting the work done in less than that time producing the results.

00:51:54.120 --> 00:52:07.710 Eric Sarver, Esq.: A lot of friends, I think, are looking at that I noticed that the generations to a lot of recruiters and people in HR and notice that the thing generational demands are changing, and I think for the better, they say that the newer generations of people in the workforce, one more.

00:52:08.820 --> 00:52:17.160 Eric Sarver, Esq.: I guess trust faith high quality of work if they have to choose that over more money and more dollar signs of their paycheck they'll choose that so.

00:52:18.030 --> 00:52:27.870 Eric Sarver, Esq.: that the people wouldn't want both and can have both, but I think you know you're talking about this very key thing like you know the whole person approach right that's the one and.

00:52:28.680 --> 00:52:32.520 Sharon Summerfield: Then the cost of some of these these I call it danger pay.

00:52:33.450 --> 00:52:35.010 Sharon Summerfield: because sometimes you know.

00:52:35.040 --> 00:52:48.300 Sharon Summerfield: yester getting paid a lot of money, but if it's at the cost of your well being right then you're putting in all these crazy hours you how can you be present, with your family, like you, are with your son and noticing that he's catching up.

00:52:48.690 --> 00:52:51.720 Sharon Summerfield: he's asking on these little faces these little phrases that you're saying.

00:52:52.140 --> 00:52:55.710 Sharon Summerfield: they're going to be too tired to actually notice.

00:52:57.840 --> 00:53:04.740 Eric Sarver, Esq.: yeah and that's where the whole person approach comes in doesn't how you and your in your family role, are you feel safe.

00:53:05.280 --> 00:53:19.020 Eric Sarver, Esq.: Are you creating safety, how you and your work role it's like you can't just say it's what we can always say it's just one of the other and you weren't with sounds like you work with people in all aspects of their life, I heard you say, like the comprehensive as a nurse executive approach.

00:53:19.050 --> 00:53:29.820 Sharon Summerfield: yeah and and it's also we can apply some of these skills within our within our families and within our personal relationships, I mean even simple things like the use of jargon.

00:53:31.410 --> 00:53:32.880 Sharon Summerfield: I remember when I went to go work on.

00:53:32.880 --> 00:53:34.470 Sharon Summerfield: electronic health project.

00:53:34.920 --> 00:53:35.340 Sharon Summerfield: and

00:53:35.400 --> 00:53:38.550 Sharon Summerfield: They had so many acronyms and so much jargon.

00:53:38.760 --> 00:53:41.460 Sharon Summerfield: Except me a month to figure out what they were saying.

00:53:42.330 --> 00:53:43.710 Sharon Summerfield: So that's actually.

00:53:43.800 --> 00:53:44.910 Sharon Summerfield: A form of exclusion.

00:53:46.110 --> 00:53:46.890 Eric Sarver, Esq.: Yes.

00:53:46.920 --> 00:53:55.170 Sharon Summerfield: So if we're we're bringing people together and think about family situations where a couple of people are talking and no one else can contribute.

00:53:57.240 --> 00:53:59.310 Sharon Summerfield: we've we've excluded other people.

00:54:00.840 --> 00:54:03.990 Sharon Summerfield: So how can we, how can we foster that in a different way.

00:54:05.460 --> 00:54:09.540 Eric Sarver, Esq.: Absolutely Sharon, I think, so what i'm hearing there is definitely a distinguishing.

00:54:10.620 --> 00:54:16.650 Eric Sarver, Esq.: aspect of what you do because i've heard people talk about doing this type of work in going into the workplace.

00:54:17.280 --> 00:54:22.590 Eric Sarver, Esq.: or going into the home life, you know the family dynamic but i'm hearing your approach of of.

00:54:23.190 --> 00:54:36.630 Eric Sarver, Esq.: sort of approaching this from all angles and making sure people feel safe at work, because if you're not going to dream, a dream UN show up in your personal life and if you're not taking care of yourself, personally, you might not be able to shop for your work either.

00:54:37.980 --> 00:54:45.390 Eric Sarver, Esq.: really great stuff you know, believe it or not, we about three minutes away from the end of our show time again fine yeah really does go.

00:54:46.200 --> 00:54:58.110 Eric Sarver, Esq.: So I want to turn the MIC over to you to give us like say you know, a couple minutes of just how do people contact you any website any workshops going on, like whatever you want to promote the floor is yours.

00:54:59.250 --> 00:55:13.380 Sharon Summerfield: So you can my website is nourished you can reach out to me on linkedin instagram instagram on that nourished executive.

00:55:14.070 --> 00:55:27.570 Sharon Summerfield: Facebook is nourished exec and Twitter is nourished exactly as well, so i'm i'm probably more active on linkedin so anyone that wants to reach out.

00:55:28.200 --> 00:55:36.210 Sharon Summerfield: Please talk about different ideas around psychological safety and ways that you can be nourished and all you do this has been an absolute joy.

00:55:36.600 --> 00:55:53.880 Sharon Summerfield: To spend time with you Eric and you know we really just kind of skim the surface on on psychological safety, so what I like to say to people be kind with yourself patient with yourself and be nourished and all you do.

00:55:55.800 --> 00:56:01.620 Eric Sarver, Esq.: Thank you, Charlotte you know really I think wise words there to take away the great to have those parting words in the show and yeah.

00:56:02.010 --> 00:56:11.370 Eric Sarver, Esq.: I think you know you shared your website Facebook linkedin all those you know I think really helpful to have, and I want to thank you for for being on the show tonight.

00:56:11.940 --> 00:56:21.600 Eric Sarver, Esq.: Talking about this topic with such authenticity and you know just sharing your experiences it really I think helps our audience can listen, I hope that people can.

00:56:22.020 --> 00:56:38.220 Eric Sarver, Esq.: Take in what Sharon saying what we're talking about here and recognize that this is a process, and I think life's a process, you know and i'm glad that you have that you know people know any any upcoming events that you might have and for the next week or so.

00:56:38.760 --> 00:56:51.750 Sharon Summerfield: Not not at this point um, but we are heading into summer so not not at this point, but I will I tend to share things that are coming up on social media.

00:56:51.930 --> 00:56:52.710 Sharon Summerfield: And also.

00:56:52.830 --> 00:57:10.440 Sharon Summerfield: put them on our website, but i'm in a trade show the end of September i'm here on Vancouver island and and I will, if anyone's listening from Vancouver island so so yeah but, please, to share any upcoming events in the coming weeks.

00:57:10.920 --> 00:57:18.960 Eric Sarver, Esq.: Thank you, Sharon we're at a time, but I would just say thank you once again share us on field for being on the show stay tuned for getting me to the smokies great show at 6pm.

00:57:19.320 --> 00:57:31.170 Eric Sarver, Esq.: You listening to talk real nyc and i'm your host of employment law today, my name is Eric sovereign tune into women today, Tuesday nights and 5pm 6pm right here on talk really nyc so once again Sharon Thank you so much for being.

00:57:31.200 --> 00:57:32.550 Sharon Summerfield: Thank you, thank you.

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