The Conscious Consultant Hour

Thursday, September 29, 2022
Facebook Live Video from 2022/09/29 - The Pluto Babe

Facebook Live Video from 2022/09/29 - The Pluto Babe


2022/09/29 - The Pluto Babe

[NEW EPISODE] The Pluto Babe


Join Sam and Thea as they discuss how to use these esoteric practices to help us live a happier and more fulfilled life.



This week, on The Conscious Consultant Hour, Sam welcomes Evolutionary Astrologer, Thea Wirsching

Thea is an Evolutionary astrologer based in Long Beach, California.  She has been a practicing astrologer for fifteen years, and her counseling business, "the Pluto Babe," is focused on past-life healing and liberation from shame.  

Thea is also the author of the American Renaissance Tarot, a literary Tarot that looks at how America's political consciousness dovetailed with its spiritual consciousness in the nineteenth century.  

America's esoteric history was the subject of Thea's PhD research at UCLA, where she taught literature for several years. 


Tune in for this enlightening conversation at

Show Notes

Segment  1

Sam reads a section from his book Everyday Awakening entitled The Solution To Misunderstanding is Greater Communication. He shares what inspired the section and how it stems from a misunderstanding with his wife. Sam says all sorts of miscommunicating can happen in a relationship because one was not fully communicating clearly. He adds the only way to solve the issue is by communicating more. Communication is key because there is no opportunity to come together without it. Sam welcomed his guest Thea Wirsching who has been practicing astrology for 15 years based in Long Beach, California. Thea has a counseling business called Pluto Babe which focuses on past life healing and liberation from shame.

Segment 2

Sam and Thea discuss the importance of Astrology and the amount of information you can learn from the practice. Sam asks Thea when she get exposed to spiritual practices and if her interest stems from when she was a child. Thea explains that she was exposed to spirituality as a child, but it was her deep depression that really brought it out of her. She found astrology which gave her an outlet from her traumatic upbringing. She says that astrology is such a great tool for understanding yourself and the conflicts you have with other people. Thea talks about being an evolutionary astrologer and how that main focus is more psychological rather than predictive.

Segment 3

Sam and Thea discuss her new book American Renaissance Tarot which is a "literary Tarot that looks at how America's political consciousness dovetailed with its spiritual consciousness in the nineteenth century." Thea shares her inspiration for the book and the origins of her work. Sam and Thea discuss the current divide in the world and how it mirrors problems from the civil war. Thea explains what is in store for us astrologically. She says America is currently in its Pluto Return which implies there is a lot of negativity going on in the country. People are becoming pessimistic and wary of each other.

Segment 4

Sam asks Thea about past life healing methods and how she uses astrology and tarot to help people deal with past life influences. Sam asks Thea how she blends Tarot reading with Astrology reading or if she keeps it separate. Thea talks about her methods and how she will occasionally combine the two tools. If you want to learn more about Thea you can find more information at her website


00:00:30.230 --> 00:00:59.459 Sam Liebowitz | The Conscious Consultant: Good afternoon. Good morning! Good evening. Wherever you're tuning in from today. Welcome to the consciousness of power. Yes, uh we are uh being not only heard live here on top radio, dot Nyc and stream to uh Youtube live as well, but we're also heard on Kmt: So welcome all Ukmt listeners out there. Thank you for tuning in today. Um, we've

00:00:59.470 --> 00:01:19.100 Sam Liebowitz | The Conscious Consultant: got another wonderful show in store for you today. I've got a wonderful woman. I'm looking forward to talking about kinds of topics that I just love to talk about. But first, of course, we have our little section of my book, Everyday Awakening, and this section is entitled.

00:01:19.110 --> 00:01:26.779 Sam Liebowitz | The Conscious Consultant: The Solution to Misunderstanding is greater communication. It's going to be kind of apropos for what we're going to talk about today.

00:01:27.610 --> 00:01:44.460 Sam Liebowitz | The Conscious Consultant: How good are we are communicating? Do we listen more than we talk? Are we present in our conversations? Do we make assumptions that get us in trouble? Inevitably bad communication leads to misunderstandings.

00:01:44.560 --> 00:01:52.500 Sam Liebowitz | The Conscious Consultant: Learning to avoid assumptions, or at least to verify our assumptions, is a great place to start

00:01:52.770 --> 00:01:57.750 Sam Liebowitz | The Conscious Consultant: communicating. More. Not less is the key

00:01:58.400 --> 00:02:01.079 Sam Liebowitz | The Conscious Consultant: we think we talk enough with people.

00:02:01.370 --> 00:02:03.069 Sam Liebowitz | The Conscious Consultant: But do we really

00:02:03.310 --> 00:02:17.619 Sam Liebowitz | The Conscious Consultant: speaking with people? Is not all about us expressing ourselves? It's about listening to the other person, and truly hearing what they are saying, without judgment or being defensive.

00:02:17.990 --> 00:02:24.269 Sam Liebowitz | The Conscious Consultant: When we project our own interpretation on the on a conversation we may get in trouble;

00:02:24.450 --> 00:02:32.389 Sam Liebowitz | The Conscious Consultant: But if we take the time to verify what the other person is trying to convey, we gain understanding

00:02:32.860 --> 00:02:49.829 Sam Liebowitz | The Conscious Consultant: the times when we make up conversations in our head. What is said often has nothing to do about what is said is nothing to do with reality. The only sure fire solution to avoid misunderstandings is to communicate, often

00:02:49.970 --> 00:02:52.340 Sam Liebowitz | The Conscious Consultant: communicate, frequently

00:02:52.350 --> 00:02:56.119 Sam Liebowitz | The Conscious Consultant: communicate more than you think is necessary.

00:02:56.570 --> 00:03:04.129 Sam Liebowitz | The Conscious Consultant: The better the communication between people, the better the connection, the better the understanding.

00:03:05.020 --> 00:03:10.349 Sam Liebowitz | The Conscious Consultant: There. Some misunderstanding in your life that can be cleared up with more communication.

00:03:10.880 --> 00:03:26.030 Sam Liebowitz | The Conscious Consultant: So I wrote this section a while ago, as most of the sections of my book, and it really came down to just, and I have a feeling. This probably came from a conversation with my wife, where

00:03:26.620 --> 00:03:32.779 Sam Liebowitz | The Conscious Consultant: I thought she meant one thing, she thought She said one thing, and it turned out that it

00:03:32.800 --> 00:03:38.130 Sam Liebowitz | The Conscious Consultant: what was heard and what was said and what was meant were like three different things altogether,

00:03:38.410 --> 00:03:41.680 Sam Liebowitz | The Conscious Consultant: and it really highlighted for me

00:03:41.850 --> 00:03:43.850 Sam Liebowitz | The Conscious Consultant: how important it is

00:03:44.320 --> 00:03:46.060 Sam Liebowitz | The Conscious Consultant: to really check

00:03:46.420 --> 00:03:57.789 Sam Liebowitz | The Conscious Consultant: because we we make these assumptions. I mean, I find I do it, and I see it in other people, too. People make all kinds of assumptions. When we have conversations with people

00:03:57.800 --> 00:04:16.510 Sam Liebowitz | The Conscious Consultant: we assume the other person understands what we're saying. Maybe we're referencing something, and when we think they understand what we're referencing, but they really don't. I mean, there's just all kinds of things that can happen. Misinterpretations that can happen because things weren't

00:04:16.519 --> 00:04:18.710 Sam Liebowitz | The Conscious Consultant: communicated clearly enough.

00:04:20.140 --> 00:04:28.029 Sam Liebowitz | The Conscious Consultant: The challenge is the only way to solve those misunderstandings is to communicate more, not less the

00:04:28.060 --> 00:04:39.969 Sam Liebowitz | The Conscious Consultant: but what usually happens. Someone says something. Someone else takes offense at it. They they, they they get upset, they they clam up and then communication just dies.

00:04:40.840 --> 00:04:44.249 Sam Liebowitz | The Conscious Consultant: That's when we get into trouble

00:04:44.410 --> 00:04:48.000 Sam Liebowitz | The Conscious Consultant: it's like once the communication stops it.

00:04:48.490 --> 00:04:58.539 Sam Liebowitz | The Conscious Consultant: Then there's no opportunity to come together. Then there's no way to resolve these misunderstandings or these feelings that just

00:04:58.610 --> 00:05:03.870 Sam Liebowitz | The Conscious Consultant: coming from something that is is not really the inaccurate place.

00:05:05.800 --> 00:05:07.810 Sam Liebowitz | The Conscious Consultant: So really it's

00:05:07.900 --> 00:05:18.930 Sam Liebowitz | The Conscious Consultant: as much as we talk to people. And this is something I've really talked to people about. Most people think they talk a lot to other people.

00:05:19.550 --> 00:05:22.249 Sam Liebowitz | The Conscious Consultant: They think they communicate a lot.

00:05:23.830 --> 00:05:27.120 Sam Liebowitz | The Conscious Consultant: Really, there is a bit of

00:05:27.270 --> 00:05:32.030 Sam Liebowitz | The Conscious Consultant: not enough communication, at least from what I see

00:05:32.990 --> 00:05:44.310 Sam Liebowitz | The Conscious Consultant: and look whenever, whenever there is a disagreement there is, there is a conflict. There are two people who are just like can't seem to come together.

00:05:45.700 --> 00:05:58.630 Sam Liebowitz | The Conscious Consultant: That's the time to communicate more net less. I mean our national natural tendencies to pull back. It's to stop. It's the clam up. It's to shut up at least at least for guys. I don't know about, but at least for guys, that's the tendency

00:05:59.310 --> 00:06:04.180 Sam Liebowitz | The Conscious Consultant: that's like Actually, the worst thing we can do in that kind of a situation.

00:06:05.030 --> 00:06:07.130 Sam Liebowitz | The Conscious Consultant: Whenever there is tension

00:06:07.170 --> 00:06:15.900 Sam Liebowitz | The Conscious Consultant: wherever there seems to be a hurt feeling, or or someone, you know, being reactive to something that was said

00:06:17.290 --> 00:06:19.960 like That's the time where

00:06:20.970 --> 00:06:27.310 Sam Liebowitz | The Conscious Consultant: we need to make the effort to say, Hey, is everything okay? Are you upset.

00:06:28.080 --> 00:06:33.079 Sam Liebowitz | The Conscious Consultant: What was I wrong in what I said, and to check in with the other person or people

00:06:35.610 --> 00:06:41.679 Sam Liebowitz | The Conscious Consultant: so often, we just assume that people understand and know what we meant. And

00:06:43.510 --> 00:06:47.380 Sam Liebowitz | The Conscious Consultant: but the truth is, none of us know what's inside another person's head

00:06:48.270 --> 00:06:56.869 Sam Liebowitz | The Conscious Consultant: that that basic assumption right there that people understand what we meant like That's what gets us in trouble more than anything else.

00:06:58.510 --> 00:07:09.449 Sam Liebowitz | The Conscious Consultant: And so um! And as you see, like my section from last week and the week before from my book this section. It's all about communication. It's all about using our voices. It's all about

00:07:09.880 --> 00:07:11.419 Sam Liebowitz | The Conscious Consultant: really like

00:07:12.940 --> 00:07:15.730 Sam Liebowitz | The Conscious Consultant: getting to that point where

00:07:16.500 --> 00:07:20.409 Sam Liebowitz | The Conscious Consultant: we can not just talk more, but listen more

00:07:21.100 --> 00:07:26.639 Sam Liebowitz | The Conscious Consultant: right. We all know that old adage. We have two years in one mouth, so we should listen twice as much as we speak,

00:07:27.550 --> 00:07:30.070 Sam Liebowitz | The Conscious Consultant: but it's not just about listening.

00:07:30.390 --> 00:07:32.890 Sam Liebowitz | The Conscious Consultant: It's about being present

00:07:33.210 --> 00:07:39.899 Sam Liebowitz | The Conscious Consultant: to hear and to feel what the other person is talking about, and what the other person is saying,

00:07:41.710 --> 00:07:42.750 Sam Liebowitz | The Conscious Consultant: because

00:07:42.870 --> 00:07:45.299 Sam Liebowitz | The Conscious Consultant: we can listen to somebody else,

00:07:45.370 --> 00:07:48.180 Sam Liebowitz | The Conscious Consultant: but we can also not really hear them.

00:07:48.230 --> 00:07:57.099 Sam Liebowitz | The Conscious Consultant: We can be there present physically present, but we might not be emotionally present. We might not really be fully present

00:07:57.130 --> 00:08:04.509 Sam Liebowitz | The Conscious Consultant: to what they're saying, or how they're saying it, or their body language when they're talking, or their intonation,

00:08:06.380 --> 00:08:08.840 Sam Liebowitz | The Conscious Consultant: and so communicating more

00:08:08.850 --> 00:08:12.669 Sam Liebowitz | The Conscious Consultant: communicating more frequently, more often more diligently.

00:08:13.920 --> 00:08:17.830 Sam Liebowitz | The Conscious Consultant: Is it about talking? Yes, but it's more than just talking.

00:08:21.360 --> 00:08:27.280 Sam Liebowitz | The Conscious Consultant: It's learning to really take in the other person fully.

00:08:28.390 --> 00:08:34.280 Sam Liebowitz | The Conscious Consultant: Reflect on that for a moment before we engage, and we speak,

00:08:36.280 --> 00:08:41.729 Sam Liebowitz | The Conscious Consultant: and sometimes it just means we need to take a breath before we respond to something.

00:08:43.309 --> 00:08:45.969 Sam Liebowitz | The Conscious Consultant: Sometimes it just means like

00:08:46.400 --> 00:08:52.070 Sam Liebowitz | The Conscious Consultant: taking a step back and asking ourselves, Hmm. I wonder why they said that,

00:08:52.980 --> 00:08:55.359 Sam Liebowitz | The Conscious Consultant: and not assuming that we know

00:08:55.760 --> 00:09:00.450 Sam Liebowitz | The Conscious Consultant: to try as much as possible to put those assumptions to the side, the

00:09:01.250 --> 00:09:06.599 Sam Liebowitz | The Conscious Consultant: so that we can ask the person if the assumption we have is true.

00:09:07.540 --> 00:09:09.270 Sam Liebowitz | The Conscious Consultant: Are you angry?

00:09:09.280 --> 00:09:12.449 Sam Liebowitz | The Conscious Consultant: No, i'm not angry. Well, you seem a little short with me.

00:09:12.650 --> 00:09:25.410 Sam Liebowitz | The Conscious Consultant: No, i'm not being short. I'm just really tired because I didn't sleep. Last night when I woke up I stubbed my toe, and this and happened, and that happened Then, all of a sudden, we we get the whole story, then we can understand where the person is coming from.

00:09:27.960 --> 00:09:33.260 Sam Liebowitz | The Conscious Consultant: But if we didn't check in with them, we wouldn't have that full context,

00:09:33.800 --> 00:09:41.489 Sam Liebowitz | The Conscious Consultant: and then we would be assuming like they're just upset at us, and then we're thinking, Oh, but we didn't do anything for them to be upset you.

00:09:41.500 --> 00:09:54.230 Sam Liebowitz | The Conscious Consultant: Are you upset at me? And when we have this whole conversation inside our head, and all that comes out is like, you know there's no words being exchanged is just being upset at the person. So

00:09:56.990 --> 00:10:00.890 Sam Liebowitz | The Conscious Consultant: your homework this week, should you choose to accept it is,

00:10:01.250 --> 00:10:04.470 Sam Liebowitz | The Conscious Consultant: listen more, communicate more.

00:10:04.810 --> 00:10:10.420 Sam Liebowitz | The Conscious Consultant: If you're having a challenging conversation. Check your assumptions with the other person.

00:10:11.650 --> 00:10:13.020 Sam Liebowitz | The Conscious Consultant: Ask them.

00:10:13.800 --> 00:10:24.670 Sam Liebowitz | The Conscious Consultant: I have a feeling. This is what you're saying, or this is why you're saying it. Is that right, or am I wrong? Don't. Assume you're right, Don't. Assume your assumptions are correct.

00:10:25.360 --> 00:10:26.630 Sam Liebowitz | The Conscious Consultant: Check them.

00:10:27.410 --> 00:10:33.009 Sam Liebowitz | The Conscious Consultant: See if there's at least not one situation one conversation this week

00:10:33.910 --> 00:10:38.490 Sam Liebowitz | The Conscious Consultant: where you find out your assumptions might not have been one hundred percent accurate.

00:10:40.370 --> 00:11:09.470 Sam Liebowitz | The Conscious Consultant: All right. That section of our book is the solution to misunderstanding is greater communication. And of course that comes from my book Everyday Awakening. You are more powerful than you know, which you can find at Www. Dot everyday awakening book, dot com. And if you like me, you can even get it through small local booksellers. You know we're in a major distributor, so you can always ask them to order the book. I love the smaller bookshops that there's not enough of my

00:11:10.030 --> 00:11:23.060 Sam Liebowitz | The Conscious Consultant: um, so. Um! That's that. And now it is my pleasure to welcome to the show. Evolutionary astrologer and Creator be a worsening

00:11:23.070 --> 00:11:50.009 Sam Liebowitz | The Conscious Consultant: via is an evolutionary astrologer based in Long Beach, California she's been practicing astrology for fifteen years, and her counseling business, known as the Pluto Bay is focused on past life, feeling, and liberation for shame. He is also the author of the American Renaissance Tower, a literary Tarot that looks at how America's Political Consciousness dovetailed with its spiritual consciousness. In the nineteenth century

00:11:50.020 --> 00:12:00.240 Sam Liebowitz | The Conscious Consultant: America's Esoteric history was the subject of Thea's, Ph. D. Research at Ucla, where she taught literature for many years. Welcome to the conscious consult, ma are the

00:12:00.250 --> 00:12:12.780 Thea Wirsching: Thank you. I'm so delighted to be here. I really appreciate you having me, and that homework that you gave is very on time for the current. Mercury,

00:12:12.790 --> 00:12:33.340 Thea Wirsching: I didn't make you aware. But we are wrapping up Mercury retrograde, and your advice is awesome because I noticed you even started speaking more slowly when you were modeling. How to listen right that you kind of get into your body. You take a breath, you slow down. So that's heartless thing, right? Not just the

00:12:33.350 --> 00:12:34.420 Thea Wirsching: Oh, yeah,

00:12:34.950 --> 00:12:49.250 Sam Liebowitz | The Conscious Consultant: exactly. Thank you. Thank you for noticing. Yes, ah, I I've heard it said that mercury retrograde is is when you need to re- things like redo re-check

00:12:49.260 --> 00:12:58.510 Sam Liebowitz | The Conscious Consultant: reorganize it's to go back over again. It's not necessarily that, like Oh, communications just don't work. It's about

00:12:59.190 --> 00:13:04.950 Sam Liebowitz | The Conscious Consultant: redouble checking and making sure that communication is flowing properly.

00:13:05.270 --> 00:13:23.190 Thea Wirsching: I like that take, and I would say i'm in the minority in that I tend to enjoy retrogrades, because I find it a time to revisit review. And sometimes that's really pleasurable right to go to read a book that you used to love and and rediscover that so

00:13:23.950 --> 00:13:28.160 Sam Liebowitz | The Conscious Consultant: absolutely absolutely Well, the I have

00:13:28.170 --> 00:13:57.310 Sam Liebowitz | The Conscious Consultant: lots and lots of questions of you. I mean astrology is is one of my favorite topics along with Taro. Um, but we do have our first ah little break that we need to take um. So. Ah, when we come back I just want to ask you I love giving my audience sort of context about sort of how you came to be involved in in esoteric literature. What was it about that? And became so involved in astrology and all the wonderful things. Um. So why don't we talk about that when we come back? Okay,

00:13:57.600 --> 00:13:58.690 Thea Wirsching: that's great,

00:13:58.700 --> 00:14:15.679 Sam Liebowitz | The Conscious Consultant: awesome. So everyone please stay tuned. You're listening to the conscious, consultant hour awakening humanity. We do this live every Thursday here and talk radio at Nyc. And every Wednesday on W. On Kmet, in California, and we'll be right back

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00:16:33.740 --> 00:17:01.179 and welcome back to the conscious consult now awakening humanity. We're speaking this out with the Theo worshing a creative, the American Renaissance tariff. So Thea I'm. Curious. It seems like you've got involved in kind of a lot of spiritual stuff at a fairly young age. I mean, were you sort of exposed to all this stuff as as a kid. Or was this sort of ah an interest that you develop later on?

00:17:01.280 --> 00:17:11.009 Thea Wirsching: Well, I definitely got exposed to it young, but it wasn't in my environment. And actually, what led me to spirituality

00:17:11.060 --> 00:17:17.889 Thea Wirsching: was a deep depression. And so, when I was fifteen I made a suicide attempt, and I was hospitalized,

00:17:17.900 --> 00:17:29.129 Thea Wirsching: and through coming out of that I had sort of a spiritual experience coming out of that, you know. And I just thought what a waste like How stupid that I was ready to end it all,

00:17:29.140 --> 00:17:46.050 Thea Wirsching: and that really put me on a journey toward opening up to the divine. But I also had a lot of family problems, you know. I came out a lot of trauma, and so that's when I discovered astrology. Because I love questions like. Why me, Why do these things happen to me?

00:17:46.060 --> 00:18:00.890 Thea Wirsching: And astrology was just such a great tool for understanding myself and understanding the conflicts I had with other people. So for me it's always been productive of empathy. So, as you were saying in your what a wonderful intro!

00:18:00.900 --> 00:18:15.940 Thea Wirsching: How do I see from someone else's point of view. Astrology is so wonderful for that, and it dovetailed with my psychological healing all along. So I really did, in conjunction with psychology.

00:18:15.970 --> 00:18:22.129 Thea Wirsching: And Then, as I got ready to go to school, I found that, you know just I got exposed to this stuff as a teenager.

00:18:22.330 --> 00:18:25.289 Thea Wirsching: I found that there was no college where I could go study astrology.

00:18:25.300 --> 00:18:41.310 Thea Wirsching: They actually exist. Now, you know, there are some more programs now that are like a traditional education. So I wound up, going into the field of English and literature, and as an undergrad, I wrote a thesis on the writer on Aasman

00:18:41.320 --> 00:18:55.789 Thea Wirsching: Bonnie Sman. There's some different ways to pronounce her name because she was a big fan of astrology as well as Union psychology. So I wrote this great thing, so i'm young and astrology, and I thought, this is so weird. But you say, like you've made a word for it,

00:18:55.800 --> 00:19:14.090 Thea Wirsching: and I just kind of put this idea in my head, hey? Maybe I could keep doing this. So I wound up in graduate school at Ucla, studying literature. But my focus was the history of

00:19:14.100 --> 00:19:29.589 Thea Wirsching: esoterica. The history of the at home, because these things had been so healing for me, and I was having all these wild experiences that I could really explain in an academic way. And so this was kind of my question like, What's my history? How did I get here

00:19:29.600 --> 00:19:31.520 Thea Wirsching: and um

00:19:31.660 --> 00:19:50.290 Thea Wirsching: Ultimately, That's what led me to study the history of esoterica in America, and when you say that people are kind of surprised, they've never heard of that history, they don't know that we have one, and we tend to just think. Oh, it was a Christian country, and that's all. There was not true at all.

00:19:50.300 --> 00:19:59.140 Thea Wirsching: Not yes, it's just. It's always been a wildly experimental country. So that's what the terrible project is all about ringing out some of those ideas.

00:19:59.150 --> 00:20:09.960 Sam Liebowitz | The Conscious Consultant: Gotcha Gotcha. I don't know if you know, Mitch Horowitz, but I had him on my show a couple of years ago, and so he wrote a all about what the Americas are called past and things like that.

00:20:09.970 --> 00:20:13.890 Thea Wirsching: No, he's fantastic. And he actually wrote the Intro to my book. So

00:20:13.900 --> 00:20:22.610 Thea Wirsching: ah, okay, wonderful, wonderful! And actually, you brought up about young and astrology, and I just want to mention,

00:20:22.620 --> 00:20:40.110 Sam Liebowitz | The Conscious Consultant: you know, in the past we've had a wonderful show on our network called Living consciously That was done by Monty Taylor, who was a Youngian astrologer, who was a wonderful astrologer. He did a show with us for over five years. I learned a tremendous amount about astrology and the the depth

00:20:40.120 --> 00:20:52.529 Sam Liebowitz | The Conscious Consultant: of astrology, and how complicated it is like people tend to think of it as just. Oh, this thing you look up in the paper, and you know, on Monday it tells me I should watch out for this, but it's so

00:20:52.540 --> 00:21:21.040 Sam Liebowitz | The Conscious Consultant: rich and so deep, and based on the archetypes and and the planetary bodies, and the myths behind them. Um, That monte really gave me a very deep appreciation for astrology, and unfortunately he he passed away a couple of months ago, and I unfortunately I was on the West Coast at the time. I didn't get a chance to make it to his funeral. But um! He always holds a dear place in my heart. So I I I really do understand when you talk about

00:21:21.360 --> 00:21:28.779 Sam Liebowitz | The Conscious Consultant: like, hey, like there's a lot. You can learn from astrology about ourselves and about the environment that we're in.

00:21:29.580 --> 00:21:36.990 Thea Wirsching: Absolutely. Yeah. And you mentioned that newspaper astrology, which is kind of the bane of every professional.

00:21:37.000 --> 00:21:38.940 Thea Wirsching: It's it's not here

00:21:38.950 --> 00:21:51.980 Thea Wirsching: astrology. And when you introduce me you mentioned that i'm an evolutionary astrologer, and so our focus is a little bit different in that. It is more psychological. It's not predictive.

00:21:51.990 --> 00:22:02.919 Thea Wirsching: We're actually encouraged to not make predictions. And so I tend to give people like a field of choice, you know, like this energies coming in. How do you want to use it?

00:22:02.990 --> 00:22:09.249 Thea Wirsching: Because we do have that choice? And a lot of my work is actually about dealing with the past.

00:22:09.260 --> 00:22:25.610 Thea Wirsching: So we think of astrology as like it's a way to address the future. But I think most people are walking around extremely caught up with the past. This thing happened to me. I'm not over there. Astrology can be a great way

00:22:25.620 --> 00:22:31.990 Thea Wirsching: for integrating these difficult situations in life that might still wrinkle and still bother you.

00:22:32.000 --> 00:22:51.259 Sam Liebowitz | The Conscious Consultant: So i'm curious like, How did you discover working with astrology? Help you to understand why you were suicidal when you were a teenager like, What did you learn about yourself through astrology that helped to make things make sense, or at least at least give context to it.

00:22:51.360 --> 00:22:55.319 Thea Wirsching: Oh, that's a wonderful question. Um, I think that

00:22:55.620 --> 00:23:11.110 Thea Wirsching: the big healing didn't really start to happen until I erased the idea of reincarnation. And so I did have suicidal ideation for a long time, and then, once I got introduced to reincarnation, I realized, Oh, this problem won't Go away,

00:23:11.120 --> 00:23:24.889 Thea Wirsching: which is keep carrying it through lifetimes. And so I've got to deal with it now, and the style I practice evolutionary is also based on reincarnation. And so we have these points in the chart called the lunar notes,

00:23:24.900 --> 00:23:37.789 Thea Wirsching: and the South Node will tell you. This is the type of experience you had in the past life so essentially through that I began to understand that all of life is an education.

00:23:37.800 --> 00:23:56.489 Thea Wirsching: And so even these really difficult experiences of abuse. And you know there are things that I went through. It was all working toward my education for the healing work that I need to do in this lifetime, and you know It's a pretty heady perspective. Don't leave with that with every client right?

00:23:56.500 --> 00:24:03.089 Thea Wirsching: Do a little work to get to that, and it's a process. But But yeah, I think I answered your question Right?

00:24:03.100 --> 00:24:04.890 Sam Liebowitz | The Conscious Consultant: Yeah,

00:24:04.900 --> 00:24:12.089 Thea Wirsching: that I would help you. But so i'm curious. How how did you get known as the Pluto Babe?

00:24:12.100 --> 00:24:22.880 Thea Wirsching: So I actually had a little bit more of a new Age business name, and I was in this marketing class, and the assignment was just do the most extreme version of what you are

00:24:22.890 --> 00:24:32.489 Thea Wirsching: something edgy, and a friend of mine said, Hey, You'd use this phrase the Pluto babe all the time. Didn't you realize This is a great description of you.

00:24:32.500 --> 00:24:44.519 Thea Wirsching: And so Pluto in astrology is the representation of the shadow can be trauma. You know anything we don't like dealing with consciously so I would say, like, in our culture or death.

00:24:44.530 --> 00:24:54.990 Thea Wirsching: We don't do a great job dealing with that money, I think, is a big I mean. People are more likely now to, you know, share their sex lives casually about their bank account right

00:24:55.000 --> 00:25:07.570 Thea Wirsching: right balance. So, anyway, i'm very blunt and forward about these things. I have had to learn how to get very comfortable with shadow material, because it's been such a big part of my healing.

00:25:07.610 --> 00:25:12.679 Thea Wirsching: And so I found that by meeting with this business name, the Pluto Babe,

00:25:12.800 --> 00:25:20.320 Thea Wirsching: the clients who are drawn to me that I work with, they've often gone through really heavy experiences for which they've been,

00:25:21.170 --> 00:25:35.790 Thea Wirsching: and the way I step in with them is just to say, Well, you got the master class in this lifetime right? You got a big piece of shadow work to do because you have more healing to do. But you didn't do something wrong. I think that's the

00:25:35.800 --> 00:25:54.190 Thea Wirsching: yeah thing that people struggle with like. If we had a bad family, what negative experiences happened to us We can feel like Well, Karmaly, I I must be being punished or no. I like deserved this in some way. And so I really try to recalibrate that belief and look at it in a different way.

00:25:54.200 --> 00:25:55.789 Sam Liebowitz | The Conscious Consultant: Yeah, yeah, I find that

00:25:55.800 --> 00:26:19.050 Sam Liebowitz | The Conscious Consultant: very common when when you discuss reincarnation with people is, they think that, like reincarnation is about. Oh, you do something bad. And So then you get punished in the next life, whereas really more, it's, it's really about ah and and education it's really about. Ah, as you say, your evolution um learning to work through things and go to a higher level and then work through things

00:26:19.060 --> 00:26:36.969 Sam Liebowitz | The Conscious Consultant: to a higher level. And sometimes those things we're working through are pretty painful and pretty challenging to work through, but it's not that they're there to hurt us or to teach us a lesson. It's just our natural evolution as a spirit or a soul in a body on a planet.

00:26:36.980 --> 00:26:38.350 Yeah,

00:26:38.360 --> 00:26:50.070 Thea Wirsching: yeah, I like that As another thing I love about astrology is that there's no hierarchy of signs. People get really into the I think, better than an aeries.

00:26:50.080 --> 00:27:02.390 Thea Wirsching: And what comes up in evolutionary astrology is that we have to experience the whole wheel because we reincarnate many times in some lifetimes we have the scorpio experiences,

00:27:02.400 --> 00:27:03.190 Thea Wirsching: all right,

00:27:03.200 --> 00:27:08.390 Thea Wirsching: negative and thorny, maybe, than the tourist experience. For example. So you

00:27:08.400 --> 00:27:19.329 Sam Liebowitz | The Conscious Consultant: Yeah, Yeah, It's funny. You say that like I have a friend who's a triple scorpio and like she like, goes in deep like she doesn't do anything superficially. She's like really, really deep.

00:27:19.500 --> 00:27:46.370 Sam Liebowitz | The Conscious Consultant: And my and my wife's a tourist. So she loves fine things, but it's ah, and and it's really kind of funny when you get to understand sort of the different characteristics of the different signs. And then you read people, if you, they, you learn what their sign is to see kind of how it manifests in their life. It's really like it's. It's so varied, and it's so vast. Yet it's.

00:27:46.440 --> 00:27:52.119 Sam Liebowitz | The Conscious Consultant: It really does, it really is. So Apropos for the people you meet. Isn't it

00:27:52.410 --> 00:28:10.340 Thea Wirsching: It is yeah. And and just also to mention that there is so much complexity that goes beyond sunshine, right? Because you have a moon and a Venus side and a Mercury side. So all of those things are interacting with each other, and that's how we get complexity and nuance. Because robbery,

00:28:10.350 --> 00:28:19.079 Sam Liebowitz | The Conscious Consultant: yes, absolutely. And I mean astrology itself is thousands and thousands of years old. I mean they don't even really know how old astrology is, and so on.

00:28:19.340 --> 00:28:23.689 Thea Wirsching: Exactly. Yeah. I feel really proud to be part of that lineage.

00:28:23.700 --> 00:28:35.950 Sam Liebowitz | The Conscious Consultant: All right. I need to take a quick break when we come back. I would love to talk about your your Tarot deck sort of how that came about, and and and maybe sort of.

00:28:35.960 --> 00:28:49.490 Thea Wirsching: If you're willing to talk to me a little bit about the controversy around it, just as a lesson around how that even itself is a perfect lesson of of where we are and what we're going through today. Okay,

00:28:49.500 --> 00:28:58.650 Sam Liebowitz | The Conscious Consultant: awesome. So everyone, please stay tuned. You're listening to the conscious consultant hour awakening humanity, and we will be right back with the a worship in just a moment.

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00:31:01.720 --> 00:31:16.760 Sam Liebowitz | The Conscious Consultant: and welcome back. So, Thea I mentioned in the beginning that you're the author of the American Renaissance Tarot. Um. What is the American Renaissance Tarot, and and how did they? Even the idea of it come about to you?

00:31:16.770 --> 00:31:24.640 Thea Wirsching: Well, I should say, you know I wrote this Phd dissertation on the history of American Esotericism,

00:31:24.650 --> 00:31:43.670 Thea Wirsching: and I didn't want to write a dry muscular book that fifty people would buy. And so I thought, Well, how do I get this in in the community? But really I just had this vision, this vision where all of the American writers I've been studying showed up as these turn on archetypes. And so the American Renaissance obviously

00:31:43.680 --> 00:31:54.090 Thea Wirsching: is the five great writers of the one thousand eight hundred and fiftys. Whitman, Hawthorne, Melville Emerson and thro is a pretty limited list.

00:31:54.100 --> 00:32:12.979 Thea Wirsching: Yeah, I did was broaden that out, and so I include thirty six writers in this project. And so you asked about the astrology of these times, too. So at that time we had Neptune and Pisces right doesn't not all that significant.

00:32:12.990 --> 00:32:27.690 Thea Wirsching: But Neptune is the planet of spirituality in this side of mysticism, right in Pisces. So all of a sudden, in the one thousand eight hundred and fiftys, we have this mass raising of consciousness in which the abolition movement makes up.

00:32:27.700 --> 00:32:46.850 Thea Wirsching: So you know slavery has been a part of the United States. It's founding at this time, and there had been these isolated movements. But all of a sudden, you know, there's this national feeling, at least, for you know one half of the country that we need to change this. And so that's the consciousness raising that happened politically.

00:32:46.860 --> 00:33:04.290 Thea Wirsching: At the same time, Spiritualism, which is this culture of seances, really takes off, and the evidence we have is millions of people were involved in this. And what's interesting is that now, since two thousand and twelve Neptune has been in Pisces again.

00:33:04.300 --> 00:33:06.790 Thea Wirsching: Okay, So this is the return. We're in it now,

00:33:06.800 --> 00:33:19.989 Thea Wirsching: and and Isn't Neptune, the ruler of Pisces. It is Yeah, it's considered the ruler of ices. So since two thousand and twelve we have had this explosion of interest in astrology, and I was an astrologer before two thousand and twelve.

00:33:21.200 --> 00:33:38.670 Thea Wirsching: No one was speaking with language. Right now there are. You know, these Instagram means about astrology, and it's hilarious, and I have to ask my clients. Now, how much do you know about this because a lot of my clients are buying astrologers. I mean It's just really not that big in the culture.

00:33:38.680 --> 00:33:46.840 Thea Wirsching: So anyway, there's this kind of like twenty from our times now to the the American Renaissance.

00:33:46.850 --> 00:33:50.090 Thea Wirsching: So ask me another question, because I I think I went off on a tangent there.

00:33:50.100 --> 00:34:06.389 Sam Liebowitz | The Conscious Consultant: Yeah, Well, um. So I just wanted to to kind of point out about what you said. It's like we're sort of Astrologically, the country is sort of in the same position. It was during the Civil War, and we're actually the country is almost as divided as it was during the Civil War.

00:34:06.410 --> 00:34:07.810 Sam Liebowitz | The Conscious Consultant: Um!

00:34:08.400 --> 00:34:21.470 Sam Liebowitz | The Conscious Consultant: What comes after this, like like what happened like after the Civil War, and sort of where, astrologically are we going? Because I know there've been so many astrological conjunctions and signs, and like

00:34:21.480 --> 00:34:28.480 Sam Liebowitz | The Conscious Consultant: configurations, that haven't happened for hundreds of years. So this astrologically has been a very busy time. Hasn't it?

00:34:28.679 --> 00:34:32.189 Thea Wirsching: Yeah, I mean, in one sense there's kind of a dark answer.

00:34:32.199 --> 00:34:51.400 Thea Wirsching: Did you question? Because after my he sees pundaries right? And so after this consciousness, reason we did have to undergo a civil war right, which was just dating um for the country's resources, even though of course, it's for a good end. Um, I mean in terms of where we're at right now we are in America's Pluto return.

00:34:51.409 --> 00:35:04.090 Thea Wirsching: And so how I see that manifesting is that there's so much pessimism out there. People are really upset with the country really doesn't matter what side of the spectrum you're on

00:35:04.100 --> 00:35:17.339 Thea Wirsching: a lot of anger and rage. And so I tend to think of this as like a cleansing or something right like. We need to get this shadow material out there

00:35:17.350 --> 00:35:29.829 Thea Wirsching: so that we can heal it. And so anyone who's gone through the process in their own life. It's like you kind of have to hit rock bottom and really see the heavy stuff for your eyes before you can consciously deal with it.

00:35:29.870 --> 00:35:46.590 Thea Wirsching: So my home is that you know we do start to see things changing in the way that we talk about these things openly that we integrate these difficult histories that the United States has, and that was part of the inspiration for this hero project.

00:35:46.600 --> 00:35:53.139 Thea Wirsching: It's like, How can we talk about slavery in these difficult histories and not smooth them under the rug?

00:35:53.550 --> 00:35:59.060 Sam Liebowitz | The Conscious Consultant: And you had a bit of a challenge when you came out with the the taro, didn't you?

00:35:59.150 --> 00:36:09.690 Thea Wirsching: I did. Yeah. So a lot of people were upset about the material just based on the images. And the thing is, i'm a writer.

00:36:09.700 --> 00:36:15.660 Thea Wirsching: And so if you can't really read the images out of context, so

00:36:15.880 --> 00:36:24.339 Thea Wirsching: not sure how much I and what would they upset about? What What did it trigger in them that they gave you a hard time about it?

00:36:24.350 --> 00:36:30.159 Thea Wirsching: Yeah, I think just because this this deck does still explicitly with slavery. And so

00:36:30.170 --> 00:36:50.610 Thea Wirsching: I didn't show images of people being enslaved that wasn't the point of it. So instead, I focused on people like Frederick Douglas and Harriet Jacobs, who read these wonderful autobiographies that are very inspiring to read these books and hear about these Americans who are able to overcome the worst circumstances.

00:36:50.620 --> 00:37:00.130 Thea Wirsching: You know that brings me a lot. So I think it was just a misinterpretation of maybe glorifying america's sins

00:37:00.140 --> 00:37:16.459 Thea Wirsching: I was trying to do. I was trying to say, Let's tell the whole history. Let's not just talk about these five white guys who wrote these books, and I'merson. Let's include the whole story, and really look at it honestly, because

00:37:16.750 --> 00:37:40.439 Thea Wirsching: I really think that we have to love America in or articulate. And so this project for me was a love letter to America, but it's for and all. I'm not going to delete. I'm not the censor right? Let's look at what we actually are. And how do we love this messy thing that we are in and evolved from there. And I I do think that's a kind of a Pluto moment right thing in America right now.

00:37:40.450 --> 00:37:46.550 Thea Wirsching: How do we help the homeless? And you know the healing metaphors are perfect, because

00:37:46.840 --> 00:38:03.990 Thea Wirsching: when we find ourselves in our own lives having just made a big mistake, or, you know, just dealing with something we wish we didn't have to deal with. I mean you have to be all in because it's yours and make the best of it and start with where you are so.

00:38:04.000 --> 00:38:07.140 Sam Liebowitz | The Conscious Consultant: And and how long ago did you come out with the Tarot deck?

00:38:07.150 --> 00:38:18.390 Thea Wirsching: So the turn that was actually released in November of two thousand and eleven, two thousand and twenty one. So we're coming up with your anniversary now. So not that long ago.

00:38:18.400 --> 00:38:22.109 Thea Wirsching: Yeah, still less than a year at this point. Yeah,

00:38:23.610 --> 00:38:35.900 Thea Wirsching: I'm: curious, because you've been doing it working with astrology for for fifteen years over fifteen years. Have you seen a shift in general in people's perception of astrology from then to now

00:38:36.130 --> 00:39:00.809 Thea Wirsching: one hundred percent absolutely since Neptune went into Pisces? And so for years I was embarrassed to admit that I was an astrologer, and I actually have two names, an astrologer, because, you know, here I'm, in this academic world. You know where I get a lot of respect. And then, if you tell someone you're an astrologer,

00:39:00.820 --> 00:39:17.310 Thea Wirsching: your eyes, it kind of glaze over like

00:39:18.540 --> 00:39:48.300 Sam Liebowitz | The Conscious Consultant: i'm curious. So so we've talked about How like astrology is not here to like to predict the future or tell us what to do. But it's really here to be a healing tool. I'm wondering if maybe you have an antidote of somebody, someone who came to see you on, and and how like understanding their chart or their return shark like where they were in life, how that really supported them, and moving forward to give our audience a sense of like Oh, like this is a way I can use astrology to really support,

00:39:49.370 --> 00:40:06.500 Thea Wirsching: you know. Wonderful question. So what I find most often is that you know the culture sells us. This kind of one size fits all idea of satisfaction. And so we're all supposed to, you know. Get married and have children, and have a good job and conventional success.

00:40:06.510 --> 00:40:16.019 Thea Wirsching: A lot of my clients just don't care about making money or impressing anyone or getting famous, and then they feel kind of guilty about that

00:40:16.030 --> 00:40:29.540 Thea Wirsching: i'm like. Oh, there's something wrong with me that i'm not wanting to hustle and make all this money. I'd really rather be out in my garden, or with my kids, or developing my spiritual practice. And so I think

00:40:29.550 --> 00:40:38.670 Thea Wirsching: my practice assist people in really accepting what they actually love. They know what they love, but they're worried. There's something wrong with them, or they're not

00:40:38.680 --> 00:40:54.990 Thea Wirsching: cutting it in this capital society, because they don't want to compete. So that's what I hear most often is that it's validating. And so those things that people have doubts with within themselves, i'm able to speak to, and so it can be very powerful when a total stranger says,

00:40:55.000 --> 00:40:56.890 Thea Wirsching: Hey, you're supposed to write that novel.

00:40:56.900 --> 00:41:00.489 Thea Wirsching: I'm like, Oh, wow, look at it.

00:41:00.500 --> 00:41:11.389 Thea Wirsching: So. Um, yeah. And And I think it gets a little trickier with the hard stuff. So if someone has a long-standing issue, you know, long-standing problem with their mother,

00:41:11.400 --> 00:41:15.449 Thea Wirsching: and i'm able to look at that and say, this must be really hard.

00:41:15.460 --> 00:41:19.519 Thea Wirsching: You know this feels difficult. This is an area where you're going to have challenges.

00:41:19.570 --> 00:41:26.689 Thea Wirsching: We don't want to limit anyone. I don't want to, you know. Predict like, hey? This will always be difficult for you. I don't want to,

00:41:26.700 --> 00:41:34.549 Thea Wirsching: but it can't be very healing just to hear like, okay. No wonder I struggle with this. No wonder I I can't over it.

00:41:34.560 --> 00:42:03.230 Sam Liebowitz | The Conscious Consultant: And and astrology like, I know. As As I said, I learned from Monti it it. It's very complex in that there are twelve houses that represent, like twelve different aspects of life. They are all the planets. And then, if you think of sort of the archetypes and the mythology behind the planets, it it can be something very, very rich and something very complicated. It's not really something so simple like. Oh, you're like this, or you're like that

00:42:03.240 --> 00:42:07.539 Sam Liebowitz | The Conscious Consultant: like it really gets into sort of much more detail. Doesn't it?

00:42:07.560 --> 00:42:29.219 Thea Wirsching: Yeah. So um, what you're talking about is this kind of descriptive astrology, which is very popular on the Internet. And other places, too. What I love about evolutionary astrology is that everything is timing. And so when I look at a chart, my first thought is what is the easiest stuff to express, and a lot of times that has to do with with what the culture like.

00:42:29.230 --> 00:42:49.020 Thea Wirsching: So if you know you're you're doing well in school, you'll get a lot of phrase for that from your teachers. If you're really great at drawing, maybe not so much right like you won't, get as much grace for that. So I look at where you have natural strength. And then I look at Okay, here's the stuff that's going to take more time to express.

00:42:49.030 --> 00:43:00.989 Thea Wirsching: And so it's not a simple. You have it, or you don't It's like the evolution. So maybe it takes a while to get to your moon placement or your Saturn.

00:43:01.000 --> 00:43:12.490 Sam Liebowitz | The Conscious Consultant: Yeah, Yeah. Someone who's told me once in my chart that like i'll really be hitting my stride when I turn seventy, three, and i'm like what it's gonna take that long. Oh, my God!

00:43:12.500 --> 00:43:27.310 Thea Wirsching: I mean that probably On's name keeps coming up. But you know it's kind of like the patron saint of evolutionary astrology, because I looked up a whole life right? It's not like. When you're thirty five you keep developing, and you keep integrating

00:43:27.320 --> 00:43:54.700 Sam Liebowitz | The Conscious Consultant: right right, and I think that's One of the the lessons for me is that in astrology there's always something more to learn, and there's always something more to gain from it, and that it's not just like, Okay, here's your chart, and here's what your life is going to be like your whole life. It's actually as things move and shift and change. There's something new to work on. There's something new to understand. There's something new to explore about ourselves isn't there

00:43:54.780 --> 00:44:12.659 Thea Wirsching: absolutely. And the natal chart, I think of as a really wonderful novel, like a legendary novel, so you can get a different astrologer's take on it. There's so many of us now, and we all different approaches. So if you wind up consulting an astrologer and you don't like their take,

00:44:12.670 --> 00:44:30.029 Thea Wirsching: get another take. That's what I saw in what? Yeah, because a lot of it's open to the interpretation as well. It's not just the chart. But how does the individual astrologer interpret what they're seeing on the chart. I've learned that you can get very different things from different people who interpret charts differently

00:44:30.040 --> 00:44:33.289 Thea Wirsching: absolutely, and I think it's important to be discerning,

00:44:33.300 --> 00:44:34.189 Thea Wirsching: because

00:44:34.200 --> 00:44:41.459 Thea Wirsching: no one likes to get a fatalistic reading. You know I had one of those when I was young, and it was what inspired me to become an astrologer.

00:44:41.570 --> 00:44:52.950 Thea Wirsching: That's the the astrologer was waving after me. Don't fight it. It's your fate. I don't want to do that to anyone. I don't want to take away. Anyone's toy

00:44:52.960 --> 00:45:06.640 Sam Liebowitz | The Conscious Consultant: got it? Got it? Okay? Um, I need to take, and our last little break of the show goes by so fast when I have such fascinating guests when we come back. I just want to ask you about how you relate astrology and taro together.

00:45:07.050 --> 00:45:22.269 Sam Liebowitz | The Conscious Consultant: So everyone, please stay tuned. You're listening to the conscious consultant hour awakening humanity. You can find us on talk radio and Nyc. And Kmt. And we will be right back with Theo worshing. After this

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00:47:24.830 --> 00:47:32.570 Sam Liebowitz | The Conscious Consultant: So, Thea, you are not only an astrologer, but you also, you know, created this American Renaissance taro.

00:47:32.860 --> 00:47:44.390 Sam Liebowitz | The Conscious Consultant: How do you work? How do you relate sort of tarot to astrology like? If someone comes to you? Do you do both cow reading and an astrology reading, or are they just totally separate things, totally separate tools?

00:47:44.400 --> 00:47:55.589 Thea Wirsching: What a fun question I do occasionally combine them, and so generally my take with astrology is that I look at these really big outer planet cycles.

00:47:55.600 --> 00:48:04.289 Thea Wirsching: Okay, so we're talking about, You know, Saturn, Let's say which has a thirty-year cycle. So if you go through a Saturn event, it lasts for a year or two,

00:48:04.300 --> 00:48:17.920 Thea Wirsching: and so this is the type of astrology I do. You don't see me posting about? Oh, here's the weather, you know. Tomorrow's your day. It's more like, How can you use the Saturn energy constructively,

00:48:17.930 --> 00:48:29.200 Thea Wirsching: and so I love astrology for that. What I love Tarot for is being in the moment. And so that's how I um people make a choice like. Are you interested in doing some

00:48:29.210 --> 00:48:45.410 Thea Wirsching: kind of structural whole life planning, integrating the past? Astrology is great for that, Or are you just in a mess right now, and you need a little reflection. And so I think serial cards to bring out the feelings. To sure. I feel like It's very helpful for that.

00:48:45.420 --> 00:49:01.250 Thea Wirsching: And there actually is a way that astrology and Tyr are technically connected. But it's very noodly, I would say, just for nerds like me. We really like to dive into that. But in this,

00:49:01.260 --> 00:49:08.679 Thea Wirsching: for example, I tried to bring in the astrological signs of the writers when possible.

00:49:08.690 --> 00:49:23.209 Thea Wirsching: So I've got this event coming up at the Harriet Beecher Stowe Center on October twenty ninth, and it's a whole spiritualism weekend right? Speaking of these movements that inspired this project,

00:49:23.220 --> 00:49:32.339 Thea Wirsching: she had a placement in Pisces. I forget what it was, but I've already mentioned that fine thing about mysticism, right? So

00:49:32.420 --> 00:49:50.389 Thea Wirsching: she wrote this novel. That was all about developing confession. That's what Uncle Tom's Cabin is. It's still controversial to this day, but it was about developing compassionate and compassion for those less fortunate than yourself. And so she kind of straddles both ends of Pisces there, right like the

00:49:50.400 --> 00:49:53.459 Thea Wirsching: the spiritual quality as well as um

00:49:54.190 --> 00:49:55.890 Thea Wirsching: the compassion. So

00:49:55.900 --> 00:49:58.890 Thea Wirsching: I think I I trail off. So

00:49:58.900 --> 00:49:59.790 Thea Wirsching: really that.

00:49:59.800 --> 00:50:06.929 Sam Liebowitz | The Conscious Consultant: So I'm: just curious, because you you do tend to focus a lot on past life healing with the astrology, do you?

00:50:06.940 --> 00:50:21.699 Sam Liebowitz | The Conscious Consultant: How does that tend to show up? I mean, we talked about like South Node a little bit, but like, how does the the past life influence show up? And then how do we use astrology or taro to kind of help us deal with those past life influences?

00:50:21.710 --> 00:50:24.460 Thea Wirsching: Wonderful? Yeah, so um,

00:50:24.470 --> 00:50:33.020 Thea Wirsching: it's kind of like, I call it a kind of slice lead through. And so what ends up happening is that i'll tell the past life story, which is a parable,

00:50:33.270 --> 00:50:43.229 Thea Wirsching: and you know, might be something that happened five hundred years ago, you know. Imagine a scenario like that, and then I find that the client says, Well, that's my life now those exact same things.

00:50:43.460 --> 00:51:02.139 Thea Wirsching: And so ah! It can be really useful to learn how to let that go, because if it's a habit, it's very familiar to us, and it might even be a habit of success. And so, when i'm telling the past life story, it's not all doom and glue.

00:51:02.150 --> 00:51:16.779 Thea Wirsching: But sometimes it is a lot of times. It is that it might be a traumatic experience or a disappointment of some kind, but a lot of times it could be. Let's say you were a military general, and so you didn't get to have a personal life.

00:51:16.790 --> 00:51:33.589 Thea Wirsching: And so everything was focused on career and the weight of the community on your shoulders, and for that type of person to to tell them, maybe step down from your responsibilities. And so I worked with someone who was the Ceo of a pretty important company one,

00:51:33.600 --> 00:51:50.339 Thea Wirsching: and she stepped down. And this, you know, did focus on her home and her garden and her children, and it sounds like that would be easy, Right? Oh, how easy! Just give a responsibility! But for her that was massive,

00:51:50.630 --> 00:52:03.989 Thea Wirsching: that this is what's so funny about astrology for me is because I also get people in the opposite situation, and so maybe they have many, many lifetimes of being kind of secluded within the home.

00:52:04.000 --> 00:52:21.040 Thea Wirsching: And having all this like interpersonal knowledge from having focused on family. And i'm saying, we've got to get on to community now, and you have to somehow distill this wisdom. You've learned and offer it to the community as a gift, and so it's. It's funny. I find that i'm giving like these opposite one

00:52:21.050 --> 00:52:37.460 Thea Wirsching: in the same week oftentimes. But it's It's generally familiar to people i'm not kind of spinning out on. Oh, of how cool was your past life. It really gets to the emotional heart of things like what was the emotional quality of the past life.

00:52:37.470 --> 00:52:39.589 Sam Liebowitz | The Conscious Consultant: Hmm. Hmm.

00:52:39.600 --> 00:52:42.109 You know, I know there there are a few sort of

00:52:42.360 --> 00:52:56.119 Sam Liebowitz | The Conscious Consultant: myths. I'll call them around astrology, though Maybe they're truisms as well like. I've heard one someone said that like the day you die, and this life will be the day you're born in your next life.

00:52:56.560 --> 00:52:58.289 Thea Wirsching: I have actually

00:52:58.300 --> 00:52:59.890 Thea Wirsching: never heard that before.

00:52:59.900 --> 00:53:01.189 Sam Liebowitz | The Conscious Consultant: Oh, you never heard that.

00:53:01.200 --> 00:53:14.970 Thea Wirsching: No, I mean it's interesting, but it yeah, or about how like through lifetimes, we kind of go around the the wheel of of starting with like the first

00:53:15.040 --> 00:53:18.689 Thea Wirsching: sign of the of an astrology is

00:53:18.700 --> 00:53:30.250 Sam Liebowitz | The Conscious Consultant: his ares, and the last one is pisces, so it's kind of like. If you're born in Pisces, then you're near the you like sort of at the end of this evolutionary cycle,

00:53:30.260 --> 00:53:43.190 Thea Wirsching: I mean. I think people love to look to um modalities like astrology to figure out how they're doing well, or how they can feel like they're They're well on their path. But

00:53:43.200 --> 00:53:59.830 Thea Wirsching: I don't really subscribe to any kind of hierarchy like that you're not more spiritually aligned if you're pisces versus the Ur. And again, people love to look for those. But my word is the Pluto Bay appearance exploding

00:53:59.840 --> 00:54:06.590 Thea Wirsching: some of those ideas that I don't know if it is, people love to believe that it's their last lifetime.

00:54:06.600 --> 00:54:11.689 Thea Wirsching: Yeah, yeah, I think you're near the end.

00:54:11.700 --> 00:54:29.390 Sam Liebowitz | The Conscious Consultant: Yeah. And it's so funny because that there are some people I know who are like. Oh, after this lifetime that that's it. I'm. I'm like i'm gone. I'm i'm heading back to source, and i'm like. But then I know all these other like psychic people who say like spirits like, can't wait to get into a body like

00:54:29.400 --> 00:54:40.350 Sam Liebowitz | The Conscious Consultant: there's so much fun with being alive like. Why do you want it constantly escaping to, and just go back to spirit? Um. We just got a couple of minutes left. I just want to ask you I mean looking at.

00:54:40.680 --> 00:55:00.769 Sam Liebowitz | The Conscious Consultant: I don't know for for the world or for the the country sort of the the astrological sort of places of where we're at, because things seem to be so chaotic and so bizarre right now, like where, in a very general sense, would astrology say, we're going.

00:55:01.700 --> 00:55:07.290 Thea Wirsching: Oh, it's such a big question, and it honestly is not my forte, and so I know

00:55:07.300 --> 00:55:11.490 Thea Wirsching: it's called It's called mundane Astrology, right? We're doing the astrology of the world.

00:55:11.500 --> 00:55:15.690 Thea Wirsching: Yeah, I i'm very much the psychologist kind of once

00:55:15.700 --> 00:55:16.689 Thea Wirsching: one.

00:55:16.700 --> 00:55:30.320 Thea Wirsching: Okay, But I I did want to come back to something else you said about, you know, wanting to wanting this to be the last lifetime. I mean it. It feels like, there's an ego attachment. Yeah. And so when people say that i'm like,

00:55:30.330 --> 00:55:44.510 Thea Wirsching: well, if it was really your last lifetime, you probably wouldn't be worried about that right you can to to others. I'm kind of focusing on the good that you can do while you're here instead of like, where you are in the hierarchy.

00:55:44.520 --> 00:55:49.389 Thea Wirsching: Yeah, I mean, it's your question, right? Like we all want to hear something reassuring.

00:55:49.400 --> 00:55:56.500 Thea Wirsching: Yeah, things going to get better. And I really think that's up to the individual and the individual's perception.

00:55:56.510 --> 00:56:10.189 Thea Wirsching: You know, if you work on yourself and you're able to bring positivity and light to whatever situation you're in. That's the experience that's going to get reflected back to you. And if we could all do that right,

00:56:10.200 --> 00:56:12.390 Thea Wirsching: that kind of feature we're going to have. So

00:56:12.400 --> 00:56:12.990 Sam Liebowitz | The Conscious Consultant: Yeah,

00:56:13.000 --> 00:56:37.330 Sam Liebowitz | The Conscious Consultant: Exactly. Exactly. And it's all as they say. It's all an inside job, and that you know these days. It's so funny you can talk to two different people who live right next to each other, and one it's like the world's falling apart. It's going to hell. It's like everything. And then the other one's like, Oh, man, things are great. They're better than they've ever been before. And so it's like, we're living almost in two different worlds. Well, yeah, we're we're coming to the end of our time together.

00:56:37.340 --> 00:56:46.530 Sam Liebowitz | The Conscious Consultant: Such a pleasure to have you on the show. If people want to learn more about you, where can they go, How can they find you? How they can get in touch with you?

00:56:46.640 --> 00:57:14.170 Thea Wirsching: Okay, Great. So you can find my website, the Pluto babe, dot com um i'm also on Instagram at the underscore Pluto under for Babe. Um, You're interested in the teroty. I haven't it far as the noble and bucks a million. But you can also look at American Renaissancerocom. I'm. Also on Instagram at American Taro and uh, to schedule a reading with me. Just shoot me an email, and we go from there

00:57:14.380 --> 00:57:20.590 Sam Liebowitz | The Conscious Consultant: all right. Wonderful? Well, thank you so much. The I really appreciate you. Taking the time to come on the show this week

00:57:20.600 --> 00:57:22.790 Thea Wirsching: I was delighted to be here. Thank you so much.

00:57:22.800 --> 00:57:43.500 Sam Liebowitz | The Conscious Consultant: You're welcome. You're welcome, and of course thank you, my loyal listeners for tuning in. I do see. Ah, I do have one comment on the the Facebook live. Thank you for tuning in um, and next week I don't believe I have a guest next week. It's going to be one of those. Me only shows because it's the first show of the month, so I feel

00:57:43.510 --> 00:58:09.909 Sam Liebowitz | The Conscious Consultant: tuning in. I'm not quite sure what i'll be talking about next week, but i'm sure it'll be something fun. Don't forget. Stay, tuned later today on talk radio that Nyc: we have Frank about health at five Pm. New York time, and then tomorrow. Of course, we have our business shows, philanthropy and focus, and always Fridays and Monday. Of course we start over again on Monday, even with Sandra Bardman's show the edge of every day.

00:58:09.920 --> 00:58:17.800 Sam Liebowitz | The Conscious Consultant: Well, thank you all for tuning in. I hope you enjoyed this show and got something out of it, and we will talk to you all next week.

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