Rediscovering New York

Tuesday, August 24, 2021
Facebook Live Video from 2021/08/24 - Two of new York's most Famous Islands

Facebook Live Video from 2021/08/24 - Two of new York's most Famous Islands


2021/08/24 - Two of new York's most Famous Islands

[NEW EPISODE] Two of new York's most Famous Islands

On this week’s show we will discuss two of the City’s most iconic islands, both in Upper New York Bay: Governor’s island and Ellis Island.  My guests will be will be returning Rediscovering New York expert Joyce Gold, Founder of Joyce Gold History Tours,; and Public Historian, Naturalist and Author Mandy Edgecombe,

Tune in for this fascinating conversation at or watch the Facebook Livestream by Clicking Here.

Show Notes

Segment 1

Today’s episode starts off with the introduction of today’s guest and topic. Tonight’s celebrating two city islands. Our host Jeff gets to know guest Mandy, who is a Chicago native and explains her background. She’s a naturalist who is dedicated to sharing urban discoveries. She believes everything she does is connected through applied anthropology. Although it seems contra dictionary, she explains that you have to understand one setting to understand another. She goes through a bit of Governor’s Island history, going back to English colonization times.

Segment 2

Coming back from the break, the podcast goes deeper into Governor’s Islands history throughout the wars. It was often used to store weapons and arms. It was used to train militia and even as a prisoner of war base. Mandy also shares that some remnants from these times are still on the island today. She explains women’s role within the island and how they were kept separate from the men. They skip forward to after the wars and talk about how the island was no longer a war base. The island renovated and the function for it changed. The conversation takes a turn for a more personal story. They talk about the personal connection veterans who used to live there and their families may have with the island.

Segment 3

This segment starts with a few announcements from the show’s sponsors. Jeff introduces the next special guest: Joyce Gold. Joyce first explained how she became interested in the historical sites of New York City. She then goes on to talk about the next topic of the show: Ellis Island. Before it became the famous immigration center, it was a privately owned fort. Before Ellis Island, immigrants had to go through piers and Castle Clinton. Due to the increase in federal immigration laws, the State of New York decided to make Ellis Island the site for immigraion in 1892. Joyce explains how different laws and changes in them affected immigration through Ellis Island and the difficulty of getting into America.

Segment 4

For the final segment, Joyce talks about how strict the rules could be at Ellis Island. Often because of medical reasons, immigrants would be turned away. If there were any suspicions about someone, they would get marked and it would be known that there was something “wrong” with them. Joyce then goes on to explain what Jewish people specifically had gone through with Ellis Island. The episode ends off with Jeff asking Joyce about her tours. She explains what her tours are, her most popular are the ones through the Financial District and the Greenwich Village. She has dozens of different tours that people can sign up for, including public and private tours.


00:03:00.660 --> 00:03:09.840 Jeff Goodman: Hello everyone, welcome to our listeners to the big apple from across the US and around the world i'm Jeff Goodman and you've tuned into rediscovering New York.

00:03:10.380 --> 00:03:15.780 Jeff Goodman: professionally i'm a real estate broker with brown Harris Stevens, but our show is not about real estate.

00:03:16.560 --> 00:03:24.060 Jeff Goodman: rediscovering New York as a weekly program celebrating New York City, its history, its texture its vine its uniqueness.

00:03:24.720 --> 00:03:33.390 Jeff Goodman: And we do it through interviews with historians local business owners nonprofit organizations preservationists locally musicians and artists and the occasional elected official.

00:03:34.170 --> 00:03:41.760 Jeff Goodman: On some shows we bring an individual New York neighborhood to life we explore its history and its current energy what makes that particular into your paper and special.

00:03:42.390 --> 00:03:48.930 Jeff Goodman: On some shows like tonight we showcase and interesting and vital color of the city and its history that's not focused on one particular neighborhood.

00:03:49.500 --> 00:03:57.540 Jeff Goodman: i'm prior episodes you've heard topics as diverse and illuminating as American presidents who came from lived in or who had some interesting history here in New York.

00:03:58.170 --> 00:04:03.300 Jeff Goodman: we've looked at the history of women activists in the suffrage movement in the city, the history of different immigrant communities.

00:04:03.900 --> 00:04:10.650 Jeff Goodman: we've looked at the history of the city's LGBT community and the gay rights movement we've looked at the history of bicycles and cycling pumpkin opera.

00:04:11.280 --> 00:04:18.300 Jeff Goodman: or public library systems, the subway our greatest train stations and even some of our bridges, yes, New York City even has great bridges.

00:04:18.810 --> 00:04:28.230 Jeff Goodman: After the podcast you after the broadcast sorry, you can catch us on podcasts were available on apple spotify Amazon podcasts stitcher Google podcasts and other services.

00:04:28.800 --> 00:04:36.000 Jeff Goodman: Tonight we are celebrating islands were celebrating two islands, right in the middle of New York harbor and Upper New York bay.

00:04:36.660 --> 00:04:45.480 Jeff Goodman: And we are lucky to have two guests who are not only passionate about both of them, but each of them give historical tours of the island islands.

00:04:45.840 --> 00:04:53.940 Jeff Goodman: and bring their own special color to illuminating that part of the islands, history and its present to those lucky enough to go into tours.

00:04:54.540 --> 00:05:05.280 Jeff Goodman: My first guest is mandy edge calm Andy is a new guest to rediscover New York, she is a public historian educator and naturalist focusing on lower Manhattan Sir Jersey city in New York harbor.

00:05:06.000 --> 00:05:12.360 Jeff Goodman: mandy golfer start during college and graduated as a naturalist she became kayak tour guide for liberty state park.

00:05:12.870 --> 00:05:17.850 Jeff Goodman: predict a long dedication to the park took it to the position of Vice President of the Friends of liberty state bar.

00:05:18.450 --> 00:05:27.690 Jeff Goodman: she's also been a federal park ranger for the national park service sites such as the Statue of Liberty Ellis Island the stonewall national monument and governors island surprise, surprise.

00:05:28.170 --> 00:05:32.970 Jeff Goodman: mandy continues to give private tours of those sites today will also continuing to volunteer governors island.

00:05:33.690 --> 00:05:38.580 Jeff Goodman: She was also a supervisor would save Ellis Island when their hospital tours commenced in 2014.

00:05:39.060 --> 00:05:46.740 Jeff Goodman: And, most recently was a docent at the south street seaport museum and for the last five years has been giving history tours around the city and writing for untapped New York.

00:05:47.400 --> 00:06:00.060 Jeff Goodman: She continues to work with on tap New York today, while also hard at work and preservation as a trustee of the Jersey city landmarks can servicing which he has been residing for 15 years mandy edge calm a hearty welcome to rediscovering New York.

00:06:02.880 --> 00:06:03.510 Jeff Goodman: you're muted.

00:06:06.780 --> 00:06:10.080 mandy: Thank you so much happy to be here very happy to be here.

00:06:10.680 --> 00:06:19.140 Jeff Goodman: I always like to ask my guests almost almost all of them were dedicated to helping others discover incredible things about our great city, are you from New York originally.

00:06:19.830 --> 00:06:21.900 mandy: Know i'm from Chicago originally.

00:06:22.230 --> 00:06:23.370 Jeff Goodman: Oh, and what took you hear.

00:06:24.450 --> 00:06:27.930 mandy: What took me here was an opportunity that I couldn't pass up.

00:06:29.340 --> 00:06:39.990 mandy: To move here, and so I took that opportunity and continued my studies in environmental science and geology from leaving and degree in anthropology at the University of Cincinnati.

00:06:41.130 --> 00:06:41.400 mandy: Oh.

00:06:42.000 --> 00:06:44.400 Jeff Goodman: Well, I wanted to ask you about about your background.

00:06:45.300 --> 00:06:58.110 Jeff Goodman: Aside from being dedicated to sharing things about the city's history you're also a naturalist one doesn't generally put urban discovery, especially the place like New York in the same basket is nature, how did you become interested in both things.

00:06:58.920 --> 00:07:08.280 mandy: I do believe that everything I do is a applied cultural anthropology so and I don't believe that teaching about one environment.

00:07:09.930 --> 00:07:20.940 mandy: Teaching about history, I feel that there's something missing unless you teach about your local environment and how history affected that and how that affected history.

00:07:21.900 --> 00:07:26.430 mandy: When I was in school my professors said, my geology professors said hey.

00:07:27.360 --> 00:07:30.120 mandy: Lower Manhattan has a bunch of buildings on it, because there's bedrock there.

00:07:30.450 --> 00:07:39.390 mandy: midtown has a bunch of buildings on it, because there's bedrock there that's why they built them beep boop bop that's the end of the story that's absolutely not the end of the story and it's completely untrue.

00:07:40.050 --> 00:07:46.440 mandy: they're happy, it was a happenstance that there was bedrock in lower Manhattan and those buildings were built there because that's where.

00:07:47.010 --> 00:07:55.380 mandy: Manhattan I mean that's where our you know our oldest buildings are older skyscrapers are and they're all built next to each other, because they needed to be next to each other, because we didn't have email.

00:07:56.430 --> 00:08:05.520 mandy: So historically that's why you know lower Manhattan happens to have you know skyscrapers under bedrock midtown grew because of grand central.

00:08:05.970 --> 00:08:23.340 mandy: As creation in 1913 bedrocks they're great awesome it was a train station that was there that built midtown so so so the historical value of just learning about one aspect of the environment, you can't learn one without the other I don't believe.

00:08:24.180 --> 00:08:29.520 Jeff Goodman: Of course New York, we have people you know they look at us from afar, and they see the concrete jungle in Manhattan.

00:08:29.850 --> 00:08:39.600 Jeff Goodman: But there's just so much nature around us, we have so much coastline so much you know we have weapons in the city and that fact this harkens back to when I was in high school back in the 70s.

00:08:40.110 --> 00:08:49.950 Jeff Goodman: It was kind of a new thing my high school midwood high school they had they developed a class in urban ecology and a bunch of US walks took it, it was a lot of fun.

00:08:50.970 --> 00:08:56.430 Jeff Goodman: How did you get to be a park ranger rick governor's island that's something that you don't meet a lot of people who have done before.

00:08:56.940 --> 00:09:08.220 mandy: I had had a background and statue and Ellis as a park ranger and so since that was already on my resume I was lucky enough to be hired at governors island as well.

00:09:09.420 --> 00:09:20.610 Jeff Goodman: And speaking of governors island i'm probably as many people and tourists have not been to governor's island has that have been to liberty island when the Statue of Liberty is and also Ellis Island.

00:09:21.210 --> 00:09:33.210 Jeff Goodman: To me, in some ways it's actually the far more fascinating is it's the biggest and also has the most that you can explore, I mean there were so I was shocked to find like a movie theater there when I was there two summers ago and there was all this stuff to explore.

00:09:34.470 --> 00:09:46.980 Jeff Goodman: What I want to talk about not only the owns history itself, but also its present and for what it is for us today in the 21st century in New York life today, but first let's talk about the history of governors island How did the island get its name.

00:09:48.660 --> 00:09:55.110 mandy: I go governor it took a while for the island to get its name, because if you really want to you know.

00:09:55.770 --> 00:10:14.790 mandy: What year, do we want to say, the history started, we have to be very clear and say colonial Dutch 1633 1637 kind of whatever, but the lenny lenny had been there obviously for hundreds to thousands of years prior to that so just making sure you know, I make that clear.

00:10:16.230 --> 00:10:17.820 mandy: The lengthy.

00:10:18.870 --> 00:10:31.920 mandy: And we can't really get too specific, with tribal names, because the coastal areas in the islands of New York harbor workplace of meeting of many different tribes that actually were located in Finland camps.

00:10:32.400 --> 00:10:38.010 mandy: For most of the winter and would come to the harbor to kind of create defensive alliances harvest oysters.

00:10:39.120 --> 00:10:47.790 mandy: You know, hang out with each other, do whatever the island was called pegging an island, because it was full of nut bearing trees like hickory.

00:10:49.110 --> 00:10:56.430 mandy: and chestnut and not bearing oak pagan act in algonquin, which is what the let it be spoke.

00:10:57.480 --> 00:11:01.770 mandy: means island of nut trees and so when the Dutch got there they called it.

00:11:03.780 --> 00:11:18.630 mandy: notes and island in Dutch, which means nothing island obviously very many nut trees, the English takeover in 1664 to calling it to New York province, they called it, not an island in English by.

00:11:19.380 --> 00:11:27.150 mandy: Throughout this entire time, though, when you had Dutch occupation from 1624 to 1664.

00:11:27.510 --> 00:11:38.850 mandy: The elite ruling class or the rulers of you know, the colony would be called governor general's or Director generals often director generals, but sometimes interchangeably governor general's.

00:11:39.270 --> 00:11:49.560 mandy: When the English took over there, you know ruling class were called governor general's and the island was always thought of not only a place of Defense but a place of leisure.

00:11:49.860 --> 00:11:59.970 mandy: And a place where you know somebody that was aristocratic wanted to have his own private land or private plantation which happened throughout the Dutch days and the English days, so it was kind of.

00:12:01.080 --> 00:12:12.810 mandy: A you know throughout the 1700s people started calling it governors island was it truly a place for private English, you know occupation, yes, at some points in time.

00:12:13.170 --> 00:12:27.330 mandy: But we do have proof from the rats or map of 1767 is when we finally see it being called governors or nothing island, and this is, after the seven years war as Americans call it the.

00:12:27.810 --> 00:12:39.390 mandy: French and Indian war, and we do have proof that the English words air on the island doing military activities because there's documents that say you know Royal British Army governors island battalion.

00:12:39.630 --> 00:12:43.170 mandy: During the seven years war so that's kind of basically when it started.

00:12:43.860 --> 00:12:50.580 Jeff Goodman: we're going to talk a little bit about the island history during wartime but let's go back to the time of the Dutch for for a second.

00:12:51.390 --> 00:13:03.150 Jeff Goodman: people think of new Amsterdam, starting in lower Manhattan the settlement actually started on that island for a year or two didn't it before they decided to start building on the lower tip of what became Manhattan.

00:13:03.600 --> 00:13:06.600 mandy: yeah the settlement settlement started first in wilmington Delaware.

00:13:06.960 --> 00:13:18.480 mandy: Because wilmington Delaware was closest to the Indian trade routes that had already existed before the colonists got there that failed very quickly governors island had always been a place of staging.

00:13:19.230 --> 00:13:27.120 mandy: When these ships were coming in, Henry Hudson and 1609 did not use it as a place for staging but plenty of explorers came in after him.

00:13:27.900 --> 00:13:41.130 mandy: Including Adrian block and Hendrick christiansen in the year 1613 1614 and then again and 1619 and governors island was all was always used as a staging point before they've made their way up to Albany so once.

00:13:41.850 --> 00:13:50.700 mandy: You know they finally brought over the first Wallonia or while loon settlers French Protestant refugees that had no place being in Habsburg Spain anymore.

00:13:51.870 --> 00:13:57.690 mandy: Over they came to governor's island to settle because they kind of just thought they always would the island has.

00:13:57.990 --> 00:14:14.790 mandy: Such amazing defensive properties, you can see your enemies from all sides and it's closer to the entrance of the harbors and lower Manhattan was and lower Manhattan had very dense forest that the colonists were a little worried about what ended up happening was that the.

00:14:16.140 --> 00:14:30.540 mandy: engineer Korean fredrickson he said hey guys governor's island is little tiny and we don't have enough room for our college degrees, so why don't we move over here, which was lower Manhattan and therefore that's where new got it start.

00:14:31.680 --> 00:14:49.080 Jeff Goodman: Well let's forward fast forward at least 150 years after the Dutch settled the area to the revolutionary Warren and more time specifically governors island had some important history during wartime let's take a quick inventory of what happened in.

00:14:49.140 --> 00:14:50.250 Jeff Goodman: A couple of different ways before.

00:14:50.250 --> 00:14:53.340 Jeff Goodman: We take a break what was its significance in the revolutionary war.

00:14:54.540 --> 00:15:11.340 mandy: significance in the revolutionary war general Israel Putnam he had his fame with the battle of bunker hill did create some kind of read out some kind of for in the upland areas of governors island, which is where forte is today.

00:15:12.540 --> 00:15:23.400 mandy: And so what is that it's it's kind of piles of wood and mud, there were some cannons there, and there were there was some fire during the battle of brooklyn from governors island.

00:15:24.090 --> 00:15:32.910 mandy: To an English frigate that would have been you know, in the harbor kind of facing where Castle Williams, would have been built in the future.

00:15:33.210 --> 00:15:40.830 mandy: And so, if archaeologists today we're actually to you know kind of get in there and do some metal detecting in the ground between.

00:15:41.460 --> 00:15:53.100 mandy: Where that battle happened, they could find musket balls from the revolutionary war from the battle of brooklyn was really just it was a short, you know kind of blood, but it but important.

00:15:54.000 --> 00:15:55.680 Jeff Goodman: After independence and before the war of.

00:15:55.680 --> 00:15:59.550 Jeff Goodman: 1812 governors island played a major role in the defense of New York and.

00:15:59.550 --> 00:16:05.700 Jeff Goodman: As harbor and there are the beginnings of of what we can see there today, do you want to talk about the two forces that are running on.

00:16:06.750 --> 00:16:08.070 mandy: yeah I would love to.

00:16:09.240 --> 00:16:20.010 mandy: Reports and so we have Castle Williams Castle Williams get its name gets its name from Jonathan Williams, Jonathan Williams was the grand nephew of Benjamin Franklin.

00:16:20.370 --> 00:16:28.260 mandy: Benjamin Franklin was hanging out in France, a lot during the revolutionary works you just didn't like hanging out with his wife really truly, to be honest.

00:16:29.370 --> 00:16:38.490 mandy: So his grandnephew came there to study fortifications and after the revolutionary war, clearly the fledgling United States wanted to make sure it was much more fortified.

00:16:38.820 --> 00:16:49.560 mandy: than it was during the revolutionary war and, as we know from the battle of brooklyn that is essentially how George Washington got chased into Fort Lee and thank God, he saved his troops, but we.

00:16:50.430 --> 00:16:59.010 mandy: You know, or whoever at the time didn't have really a good enough proper idea or surveying or mapping of brooklyn so.

00:16:59.400 --> 00:17:00.870 mandy: Young Jonathan Williams.

00:17:01.140 --> 00:17:16.590 mandy: Ben franklin's grandnephew went to France to not only study how forts were built, including have all been style forts, which is what Castle Williams is it's a Bob and self worth or i'm excuse me for Jay is of what band style forecast so Williams, is actually.

00:17:17.100 --> 00:17:20.820 mandy: A circular shape for it, which people didn't actually trust at the time.

00:17:21.990 --> 00:17:31.830 mandy: But Jonathan Williams studied in France study build how to build forts and they may also surveyed brooklyn and that's why williamsburg has its name it's named after Jonathan Williams and.

00:17:32.010 --> 00:17:46.020 mandy: Jonathan Williams also built all the other forts in New York harbor New York covers characterized by these four it's built for the war of 1812 because we wanted to make sure that we were protected, since that was kind of like our second war of independence and, to be honest.

00:17:46.890 --> 00:17:57.870 Jeff Goodman: And one of the architects of our with the architect of many of our force now has a Fort named after him wow we're going to take a short break and when we come back we're going to continue our conversation with mandy.

00:17:59.160 --> 00:18:08.550 Jeff Goodman: mandy is a public historian a naturalist and also leads tours for untapped New York we'll talk about that also in the second part of my interview with her will be back in a moment.

00:20:23.910 --> 00:20:29.160 Jeff Goodman: we're back and you're back to rediscovering New York and episode 126 126 episode.

00:20:31.080 --> 00:20:33.360 Jeff Goodman: enjoys was on the first or second guess.

00:20:34.350 --> 00:20:40.650 Jeff Goodman: it's the islands of New York harbor actually to whether we have too many of them to cover one program but we're talking today about governors island.

00:20:40.980 --> 00:20:56.820 Jeff Goodman: And Ellis Island my first guest is public historian educator and naturalist mandy edgecombe mandy one of the many things that you do is lead tours for untapped New York, do you want to take a minute to tell our listeners the tours that they can experience firsthand with you as as leader.

00:20:57.270 --> 00:21:06.510 mandy: Absolutely, I do tours of the brooklyn bridge the subway grand central terminal new Amsterdam governor's island.

00:21:07.530 --> 00:21:13.470 mandy: i'm probably missing some things there's many things on the docket including including Jersey city.

00:21:15.870 --> 00:21:34.770 mandy: Goodness is there is there more there is more my main focus in in terms of my scholarly study is new Amsterdam, though, and my new Amsterdam to her with untapped New York, that is only given by others if i'm sick we're out of town was a Tripadvisor winning tour of 2020.

00:21:35.100 --> 00:21:35.880 Jeff Goodman: Which is well.

00:21:36.060 --> 00:21:37.650 mandy: Which is crazy, you know 2020.

00:21:38.730 --> 00:21:45.090 mandy: But that's a really fun one and grand central is a big big favorite of mine.

00:21:46.290 --> 00:21:52.110 mandy: Ticket but they're they're all fantastic and I just I just the passion just leaks out of me all of.

00:21:52.140 --> 00:22:01.020 Jeff Goodman: That is so obvious you just see the passion for New York district How can people find actually get in touch with you and find out about your tours it untapped New York.

00:22:01.860 --> 00:22:09.870 mandy: They can contact on tap New York directly you, they can always be requested for public or private tours.

00:22:11.100 --> 00:22:26.490 mandy: And and more description of the tours that I give are there will be putting some governor's island tours on the docket after this show, so if any listeners are looking to go and learn a lot lot more details.

00:22:28.410 --> 00:22:36.180 mandy: Please see untapped New York it actually does the don't domain name is untapped cities COM, we just changed our name to untapped New York.

00:22:37.740 --> 00:22:44.730 mandy: But please, see the site for that also Jersey city landmarks conservancy I give free tours around jerseys to be for them as well.

00:22:45.750 --> 00:22:50.850 Jeff Goodman: that's actually something that i'd be very interested in seeing I mean Jersey city is literally across the water.

00:22:51.450 --> 00:23:03.090 Jeff Goodman: God is closer to Manhattan and parts of brooklyn and a lot of people might not think that Jersey city has some amazing things to see, especially on a tour was such a dedicated fan of of the place.

00:23:04.170 --> 00:23:16.650 Jeff Goodman: governor's island let's go back to history during wartime it was used by the Federal Government for a purpose during the civil war that most people even most new Yorkers don't even know about you want to talk about that.

00:23:18.930 --> 00:23:25.530 mandy: I think I know what you're asking me during the civil war well from the 1820 1860s it was also.

00:23:27.090 --> 00:23:30.480 mandy: The the headquarters of ordinance or the New York arsenal.

00:23:31.680 --> 00:23:50.970 mandy: The reason it was the New York arsenal was because the oh I do know what you're asking about because it's very easy to obviously pick up arms as ships are going out, but specifically during the civil war was used as a confederate pow camp specifically Castle Williams and that.

00:23:52.230 --> 00:23:55.260 mandy: Certain points in time, you would have had upwards.

00:23:56.460 --> 00:23:58.980 mandy: Of 500 men in the same cell.

00:24:00.300 --> 00:24:13.020 mandy: And in this, and what I mean cell Castle Williams was a Fort but the fort had you know it has different sections to it that just ended up seeming to be really handy to make a prison out of.

00:24:13.620 --> 00:24:25.290 mandy: And so obviously later on, it became the disciplinary barracks of the East for the US army, but it got it started as a pow camp for confederate soldiers.

00:24:25.740 --> 00:24:36.570 mandy: Many of them would die of smallpox every single day their officers would be housed in Fort J because they were officers, so they were considered gentlemen, so they did have quarters that were.

00:24:37.140 --> 00:24:47.400 mandy: More gentlemanly, if you will, and they would go visit their men at about five o'clock every day to try to boost their morale syncing also started out like this, too.

00:24:48.090 --> 00:24:52.740 Jeff Goodman: Oh wow what was the activity on governors island during the First World War.

00:24:54.090 --> 00:24:58.320 mandy: 230 First World War was it was a place of.

00:24:59.430 --> 00:25:09.180 mandy: You know expediting war materiel not you know, not necessarily training so much, but definitely recruitment and the idea of recruitment.

00:25:09.660 --> 00:25:22.560 mandy: And governors island is is a little shifty you would get your papers that you would be recruited at for Jay but you might get train somewhere else do you know the nature of the island being kind of small during World War one, though, there was a.

00:25:23.700 --> 00:25:35.760 mandy: railroad on governors island, something that our good friend Kevin Fitzpatrick is very obsessed with an APP he's the number one expert on the railroad of governors island but.

00:25:36.360 --> 00:25:46.020 mandy: There were a lot of cheap warehouses built so that war material could get out to France into Europe very easily and what you had via.

00:25:46.650 --> 00:25:56.520 mandy: General john purging blackjack Persian he got that name, because he had the wacky idea that women and African Americans should somehow be a part of the American war effort.

00:25:57.000 --> 00:26:11.220 mandy: But what it ended up happening do just to the nature of the times was that a lot of African American Labor stayed on the island, just as, as you know, home Labor essentially and and wasn't out doing any kind of infantry work.

00:26:12.330 --> 00:26:22.980 mandy: So governors island look very different during World War one and governors island had just grown after World War right before World War one because it used to be half as small.

00:26:23.970 --> 00:26:36.870 mandy: Essentially, looks like an ice cream Cone the ice cream part of the Cone is Manhattan schist it's an extension of the bedrock of Manhattan but the rest of it is phil from the lexington avenue line subway the irt.

00:26:37.230 --> 00:26:48.540 mandy: As it was dug out they dumped some of that over there and extended the island and then there was room for a lot of these World War one warehouses for war material to be to be sent out.

00:26:49.020 --> 00:26:51.270 Jeff Goodman: i'll definitely remember that the next time i'm buzzing along.

00:26:51.540 --> 00:26:54.570 Jeff Goodman: or five train deep deep into lexington avenue.

00:26:54.690 --> 00:27:07.680 mandy: And there and we love remnant, so there are some railroad remnants there you don't see the railroad tracks anymore, but by the urban farm, there are some rail remnants from that and the rail was there to get that heavy material from one end to the other.

00:27:08.190 --> 00:27:11.730 Jeff Goodman: and also some significant history in the Second World War yeah.

00:27:12.720 --> 00:27:20.580 mandy: By the Second World War it's just going to be a place of administration there's not there's there's not recruitment there's not training going on, it that's governors island.

00:27:21.120 --> 00:27:26.910 mandy: you're going to have more of your high ranking well there's always been high ranking members there, but just a place of administration, and by that time.

00:27:27.780 --> 00:27:33.150 mandy: You know, women were a part of the war effort, women have been a part of the war effort, since the revolutionary war.

00:27:33.570 --> 00:27:44.940 mandy: But secretly but women were part of the war effort by World War one so definitely by World War Two they were and the wax started out as wac women's auxiliary army corps.

00:27:45.210 --> 00:27:57.720 mandy: And that's a little insulting in and of itself why aren't we just the women's army corps and so that was fought on a don't remember the woman's name that was fought to get that extra a out of there and then the wax are stationed at governors island.

00:27:59.460 --> 00:28:13.410 mandy: They they're also they're building was private and all their commissary and everything that they did was in that same building because they didn't want the women to walk about the island to you know somehow talk to them in.

00:28:13.560 --> 00:28:13.950 Jeff Goodman: Of course.

00:28:14.640 --> 00:28:26.610 mandy: You would all you did an effect, please excuse me if i'm wrong the 15th infantry division was in the building and liggett Hall, which is in the building next to them liggett hall is as long as the Chrysler building is tall.

00:28:27.240 --> 00:28:41.400 mandy: It housed about my I don't think 1500 and 75 men, but you had boyfriends and girlfriends that maybe one in the morning, like visit each other's rooms from the whack building that was right next door to to the infantry guys that were right there.

00:28:41.700 --> 00:28:45.000 Jeff Goodman: wonder if there might have been boyfriends and boyfriends and girlfriends and girlfriends but we'll have.

00:28:45.900 --> 00:28:46.980 Jeff Goodman: A separate separate show.

00:28:46.980 --> 00:28:54.930 mandy: But hey why don't you have a lady, you know if back and especially back in those days, why why aren't we having women, women doing the work at home.

00:28:55.560 --> 00:29:08.670 mandy: Whether it is just doing typewriter work, you know bea Arthur was a whack for the marines and she drove a truck for the marines but she didn't like talking about it, we only found out about it after she passed oh.

00:29:08.730 --> 00:29:09.120 wow.

00:29:11.040 --> 00:29:12.780 Jeff Goodman: After the Second World War.

00:29:14.010 --> 00:29:25.470 Jeff Goodman: governors island was decommissioned is an army base it became a coast guard base but i'd like to we have a couple of minutes left so let's talk about when the island became a national monument and when it started getting open to the public.

00:29:28.110 --> 00:29:36.600 mandy: By 2007 good friend of mine who's still a park ranger at Ellis Island today was sent over to do rudimentary tours.

00:29:38.310 --> 00:29:48.270 mandy: Joyce gold was also doing tours of governors island, then so if she would like to talk about that, when it's her time that would be awesome she has a lot of amazing supplementary and so to.

00:29:49.260 --> 00:30:00.330 mandy: To fill in my gaps, but essentially the National Park service started doing it around 2007 around 2010 you're going to see a governor's Allen becomes the you know.

00:30:01.740 --> 00:30:06.420 mandy: Growing guerrilla style artists haven that it did you know.

00:30:07.560 --> 00:30:26.460 mandy: Bill Clinton made it a national monument George Bush sold it to the city for $1 mayor mayor Bloomberg as Mayor at the time he gives the island to Leslie catch gives you the keys, he says here you go don't Fuck it up excuse my French, but that isn't true state.

00:30:26.520 --> 00:30:29.280 Jeff Goodman: it's okay we're not on the air we're on the Internet, so we can.

00:30:29.550 --> 00:30:30.660 Jeff Goodman: We don't have we don't have any.

00:30:31.440 --> 00:30:41.220 mandy: And so what she did was build that island up to the artists haven, that it was as national park service Rangers are doing tours and not only doing tours but they're also doing.

00:30:42.420 --> 00:30:50.130 mandy: Events where they're shooting off the cannon and dressing up as civil war soldiers Mexican more soldiers and doing reenactments.

00:30:51.300 --> 00:30:57.960 mandy: You know, to show off the you know how amazing the 22 acres between those two forts are.

00:31:00.150 --> 00:31:02.010 Jeff Goodman: One of the great things about governors island.

00:31:02.430 --> 00:31:11.670 Jeff Goodman: Is that, in some ways it's become a an urban park planners dream, they haven't just showcase the history they've added so much there they added the hill the campgrounds.

00:31:11.880 --> 00:31:23.070 Jeff Goodman: there's an arts haven and there's so much new stuff they took down a building and created a meadow it's an extraordinary place we're almost at a time Andy I wanted to ask you about a personal reflection.

00:31:24.180 --> 00:31:33.690 Jeff Goodman: something you have experienced with or former army and coast guard personnel who have come back to governor's island and seeing their former quarters and also seen.

00:31:34.050 --> 00:31:45.900 Jeff Goodman: The evolution of the island and maybe it's transformation for excuse what was it like for some of these service Members to come back and experience in place that they had been once upon a time, I.

00:31:46.200 --> 00:31:50.700 mandy: Shared a lot of tears with these people and you'll you'll have a lot of coast guard members.

00:31:51.150 --> 00:31:59.130 mandy: You know, they were there from 65 to 96 so you'll see more coast guard Members come back and tell you stories about their quarters and their lives there and.

00:31:59.430 --> 00:32:05.670 mandy: And it really makes those houses come alive, I mean these kids grew up there, they have a Facebook page called the governor's island brats.

00:32:06.660 --> 00:32:13.140 mandy: When I was a very new ranger I mean I just started 2016 I had that job for just a few weeks.

00:32:13.440 --> 00:32:26.550 mandy: I was on property called nolan Park, which is where the commanding officers would live all those houses are built army yellow some of the oldest homes on governors island are there, if you visit you'll you'll you know, obviously it's very easy to see.

00:32:27.240 --> 00:32:41.940 mandy: But I had somebody who was a major general in the army and so his his father and he contacted me saw me and he said hey I want to visit my old quarters, and he grew up nolan Park, because his father was a major general so very high ranking as a high ranking yeah.

00:32:43.230 --> 00:32:53.910 mandy: And I said Okay, and so I I radioed my boss my boss said i'm sorry that is a part of the trust of governors island that's the city's jurisdiction, we don't have keys to that house.

00:32:54.390 --> 00:33:02.670 mandy: him and his wife wanted to go into that house, because this man grew up there, not only did he grew up there, but when he was 18 he joined the army himself.

00:33:03.270 --> 00:33:12.510 mandy: And he went off to boot camp and then he was stationed at governors island twice in his army career after that so he'd lived on the island, three times.

00:33:12.900 --> 00:33:18.030 mandy: As an 18 year old man when he went off to boot camp, he said, you know my mother was a good army wife.

00:33:18.420 --> 00:33:27.690 mandy: And I always had to do chores and I didn't do my last chore which was sweeping the back steps and him and his wife are in their 70s.

00:33:28.080 --> 00:33:37.620 mandy: And i'm looking around I don't have keys to get into this House, and so I find it a window that's open and I said, you want to climb in the window with me so you can see your old house and we did we climbed in the window.

00:33:38.280 --> 00:33:49.440 mandy: When we went back to the back steps those steps were covered in paint chips and debris like he had never swept the steps, since he was 18 years old.

00:33:49.860 --> 00:33:53.880 mandy: And we all started crying and I just wish that I could have given him a broom.

00:33:54.240 --> 00:34:11.040 mandy: so that he could have done it and fulfilled that but he didn't need the room, because he got to see those steps, and that was one of the most amazing experiences that I ever had as a park ranger because it's a new monument so therefore I get this first hand primary source.

00:34:11.370 --> 00:34:13.140 mandy: Experience of people that were.

00:34:13.140 --> 00:34:26.700 mandy: Just there that doesn't happen, I can't talk to you know, a member of the zune a tribe right out West that there's a national park site dedicated to because they're gone, but I got to hear that man's story.

00:34:27.180 --> 00:34:29.640 Jeff Goodman: wow that's such a moving story.

00:34:30.660 --> 00:34:40.620 Jeff Goodman: mandy Thank you so much for being my guest on rediscovering New York and this episode on islands in the harbor and specifically governors island everyone my first guest has been mandy.

00:34:41.100 --> 00:34:51.120 Jeff Goodman: mandy is it story an educator and naturalist and she also conducts tours for untapped in New York, you can find out about her offerings and untapped cities calm.

00:34:51.870 --> 00:35:00.030 Jeff Goodman: way to take a break, and when we come back we're going to speak with our second guest about another famous island in New York Ellis Island will be back in a moment.

00:35:03.840 --> 00:35:06.480 About metaphors and how it impacts on your life.

00:37:30.360 --> 00:37:34.830 Jeff Goodman: we're back support for rediscovering New York comes from our sponsors.

00:37:35.550 --> 00:37:45.630 Jeff Goodman: To rod modi working strategist at freedom mortgage for assistance in any kind of residential mortgage to rod can be reached at 718-210-1167.

00:37:46.290 --> 00:37:52.860 Jeff Goodman: and support also comes from Jacqueline hospital interior design specializing in residential and commercial renovation and decorating.

00:37:53.370 --> 00:38:04.710 Jeff Goodman: Jacqueline can be reached at 3474821 700 you can like this show on Facebook and you can also follow me on instagram and Twitter my handles on all three are Jeff Goodman nyc.

00:38:05.400 --> 00:38:11.100 Jeff Goodman: If you have comments or questions or if you'd like to get our mailing list, please email me Jeff at rediscovering New York that nyc.

00:38:11.730 --> 00:38:20.070 Jeff Goodman: One of the note before we get to our second guest, even though rediscovering New York is not a show about real estate when i'm not on the air, I am indeed a real estate agent our amazing city.

00:38:20.520 --> 00:38:27.660 Jeff Goodman: Where I help my clients buy sale lease and run property if you or someone you care about is considering a move into an oval within New York.

00:38:28.080 --> 00:38:35.160 Jeff Goodman: I would love to help you with all those real estate needs, you can reach me and my team at 646-306-4761.

00:38:35.730 --> 00:38:41.310 Jeff Goodman: Well, our second guest is no stranger to rediscovering New York, and of course i'm referring to Joyce gold.

00:38:42.000 --> 00:38:52.080 Jeff Goodman: Joyce is a recognized expert and educator in New York, history and for over 40 years has been guiding to your person visitors are like to rave reviews through private walking tours as well as tours open to the public.

00:38:52.860 --> 00:39:00.990 Jeff Goodman: Choices published to guidebooks from windows, to the World Trade Center or walking guide through the history of lower Manhattan and from trad stream to Bohemia.

00:39:01.350 --> 00:39:07.980 Jeff Goodman: A walking guide through the history of Greenwich village choice has contributed entries to the encyclopedia of New York City, and if this wasn't enough.

00:39:08.460 --> 00:39:18.450 Jeff Goodman: The New York Times is called Joyce quote the diane of New York City tour guides it's a level of recognition than any tour guide would not only want but probably fight for and maybe even die for.

00:39:18.870 --> 00:39:23.520 Jeff Goodman: We welcome back to rediscovering New York Driscoll so it's a hearty welcome back to the Program.

00:39:27.420 --> 00:39:28.080 Jeff Goodman: you're muted.

00:39:28.800 --> 00:39:30.180 Joyce Gold: Thank you Jeff great to be.

00:39:31.080 --> 00:39:33.480 Jeff Goodman: You are very welcome it's always great to have you.

00:39:34.350 --> 00:39:45.450 Jeff Goodman: it's been a couple of months since you've been on the show real briefly how did you get involved in the work that you do specifically bring into your history to life for people who were lucky enough to experience New York through through your eyes and your tours.

00:39:45.990 --> 00:39:53.340 Joyce Gold: Well, it all began one day that changed my life I was a computer analyst at the Federal Reserve Bank downtown.

00:39:54.060 --> 00:40:02.520 Joyce Gold: And I just picked up 100 year old book about old New York at discussed, because the city basically started down there it discussed.

00:40:03.090 --> 00:40:22.500 Joyce Gold: sites that streets that I passed every day coming from the subway and it started making my daily life much more interesting I wanted to open the workers to have that experience as well, and so i've been reading about the city studying about the city talking about the city of sex.

00:40:22.800 --> 00:40:27.420 Jeff Goodman: hmm and Ellis Island is one of those places that you give tours of.

00:40:28.590 --> 00:40:36.120 Jeff Goodman: Ellis Island was the gateway that millions of immigrants came through to enter into the United States, and I think we actually both have relatives who did.

00:40:36.330 --> 00:40:37.590 Jeff Goodman: So came through Ellis Island.

00:40:38.790 --> 00:40:42.090 Jeff Goodman: First, for whom is Ellis Island named had we get its name.

00:40:42.450 --> 00:40:54.510 Joyce Gold: Well, it seemed to Samuel unless he was the last private owner of the island, but in 1808 Federal Government for purchase what was in a three acre spot in harbor.

00:40:54.990 --> 00:41:12.450 Joyce Gold: from his errors and they pay $10,000 for the three acres in 1808 unbelievable money because they wanted to use it to help defend the harbor against the potential British invasion becomes the war of 1812.

00:41:13.950 --> 00:41:23.070 Jeff Goodman: Before Ellis Island became the immigration Center that it was famous for what were some of its previous uses before that.

00:41:24.210 --> 00:41:24.840 Joyce Gold: Oh, what was.

00:41:25.500 --> 00:41:30.090 Jeff Goodman: What was on there, what what was there before the federal government turned it into the immigration Center.

00:41:30.450 --> 00:41:44.550 Joyce Gold: Well, it was privately owned, it was a fourth for gibson there remains a foreign countries are still there and that's what it was mainly used for that time it didn't become an immigrant landing station until 1892.

00:41:45.990 --> 00:41:50.880 Jeff Goodman: Where did immigrants come from through when they got to New York before Ellis Island.

00:41:51.900 --> 00:41:57.630 Jeff Goodman: opened actually more specifically what you know what where would immigrants have been processed in New York before Ellis Island open.

00:41:58.020 --> 00:42:03.240 Joyce Gold: Well, there were two main spots that they might have landed in and come into the harbor.

00:42:03.750 --> 00:42:16.020 Joyce Gold: Through one was peers until 1855 the boat dock you got off the pure basically anybody who wanted to rip you off could because you had no idea about a lot of the new country.

00:42:16.410 --> 00:42:31.350 Joyce Gold: That you are entering and that was until 1855 that year in New York state took over immigration in town and they use Castle Clinton still in the southern tip of the island and Arc.

00:42:32.280 --> 00:42:42.450 Joyce Gold: 8 million people came through Castle Clinton it's an 1855 to 1890 that's where well to do women went to get there, made right off the boat.

00:42:42.960 --> 00:42:55.350 Joyce Gold: And that's where, again, people will want to some extent now in the late 1880s the federal government started passing laws, having to do integration.

00:42:55.740 --> 00:43:13.800 Joyce Gold: The State didn't feel that they could handle all the regulations so from 1892 92 tonight from 1892 to 92 the ever got landing station was a new bike pure but in 1892 that's when silence.

00:43:15.690 --> 00:43:23.880 Jeff Goodman: Did the experience of immigration chat and of course we, we know that big famous building with a with a big hall Ellis Island, which was built.

00:43:24.720 --> 00:43:36.030 Jeff Goodman: right before it opened as as an immigration Center did the opening of Ellis Island changed the experience for immigrants coming into New York coming to the United States through New York.

00:43:36.690 --> 00:43:48.450 Joyce Gold: Well, they were they were rejected, more 2% of the people, ended at Ellis Island are sent back, not necessarily to where they have started, but to where they got the boat.

00:43:48.840 --> 00:43:59.430 Joyce Gold: To which they might have walked 1500s of miles before they got the boat, they often have no money, and they will check for medical purposes for political purposes.

00:44:00.060 --> 00:44:11.160 Joyce Gold: For mental purposes, and so there was a lot of fear, it became known as the island tears because maybe you would be rejected, you wouldn't really know in advance.

00:44:11.460 --> 00:44:16.770 Joyce Gold: Maybe a member of your family will be rejected, you know in advance and then what would you do about it.

00:44:17.190 --> 00:44:29.040 Joyce Gold: So there's a very scary place that Castle Clinton really haven't been Castle Clinton at the time was called Castle garden or Castle garden that something pronounced it.

00:44:29.490 --> 00:44:45.300 Joyce Gold: And I think you had to be in pretty bad shape to be rejected there but at Ellis Island, there were many reasons for which you feel rejected they asked you have almost two dozen questions, and if you answer wrong that might be in the two American immigration.

00:44:45.930 --> 00:44:51.660 Jeff Goodman: wow well after Ellis Island open choice did all immigrants who came into New York come through the island.

00:44:52.350 --> 00:44:56.130 Joyce Gold: Well, if you came on a first, second class ticket you didn't go to Ellis Island.

00:44:56.580 --> 00:45:08.700 Joyce Gold: The ship the transatlantic ship my just drop off people without law so more likely they will take everybody to the canard pill or the like stuck to the German American line here.

00:45:09.180 --> 00:45:18.150 Joyce Gold: And they figured if you could afford a first or second class passage you we're not going to be a ward of the state, you are not going to be the problem in the UK.

00:45:18.810 --> 00:45:33.810 Joyce Gold: But what usually happens is at that peer third class steerage passengers were put on the boat and taken to silent, unless they pay $5 and then sometimes they will not be taken so part of the occasionally that.

00:45:35.760 --> 00:45:48.570 Jeff Goodman: Of course, there are other ports of entry, in fact, my great grandmother from Avellino in Italy came through Boston she didn't come through New York, I think that those you settle the air how we're other ports of entry different from New York and Ellis Island.

00:45:48.810 --> 00:46:04.710 Joyce Gold: galveston was another big poor people, depending on what part of the country they went to or what ship, they could get went there, and in some cases i've seen requirements were less stringent and that might also have been another reason people into reports.

00:46:06.060 --> 00:46:11.700 Jeff Goodman: And to New York have more immigrants coming in through Ellis Island, then, then, then these other port cities did.

00:46:12.120 --> 00:46:16.620 Joyce Gold: Oh, very much 12 million people came through Ellis Island between.

00:46:19.740 --> 00:46:32.040 Joyce Gold: And when the feds finally stopped using it completely in the 1950s, a total of 17 know come through and no other entry port was near those numbers.

00:46:32.490 --> 00:46:39.450 Jeff Goodman: So still immigrants coming into the United States as early as as late as the early 1950s would still come in through Ellis Island.

00:46:39.960 --> 00:46:53.670 Joyce Gold: Well, the laws change in a big way in 1924, which is why that 12 million so 1924 before that time you were brought to about a mile and a quarter from mainland of Manhattan.

00:46:54.060 --> 00:47:05.250 Joyce Gold: Before they decided whether you're going to stay something much more humanitarian was passed in 1924 it said, you took all the medical information and other information.

00:47:05.550 --> 00:47:17.130 Joyce Gold: To the American representative in your home country, and if you got on a ship or a plane, you could be assured that will be allowed to come in so that's why the dates can be closed.

00:47:17.880 --> 00:47:18.270 wow.

00:47:19.530 --> 00:47:21.390 Jeff Goodman: different experiences and different times.

00:47:22.710 --> 00:47:35.490 Jeff Goodman: we're going to take a short break and when we come back, we are going to continue our fascinating conversation with Joyce golden tourists called history tours about Ellis Island another of the team of silence in New York harbor will be back in a moment.

00:50:06.210 --> 00:50:25.440 Jeff Goodman: we're back and we're back to rediscovering New York and our 126 episode on the famous islands in New York harbor my guest is Joyce gold of choice cold history tours Joyce can you believe we're at 126 episode already you were my first guest on the history of New York.

00:50:27.090 --> 00:50:29.460 Jeff Goodman: Wave episode one way that was like almost three years ago.

00:50:30.750 --> 00:50:33.150 Jeff Goodman: Almost seems like yesterday you're still muted, by the way.

00:50:41.640 --> 00:50:48.510 Jeff Goodman: we'll be back to Ellis Island how well did the new immigration Sandra hand Center handle the crush of immigrants.

00:50:49.530 --> 00:50:55.680 Joyce Gold: Well, it was different at different times it wasn't a steady stream for example during the war World War one.

00:50:56.040 --> 00:51:08.430 Joyce Gold: Very few people came in, there was an economic depression, which happen periodically in the city, very few people came in 19 71.3 million people came through.

00:51:08.820 --> 00:51:18.120 Joyce Gold: And that was really overcrowded they had designed the place to handle about half a million people a year and this one's a lot more than that, more than twice as many.

00:51:18.450 --> 00:51:27.450 Joyce Gold: Sometimes the ship reading the immigrants will just be anchored in the harbor overnight, because they couldn't accommodate side was quite a crush.

00:51:27.780 --> 00:51:44.070 Jeff Goodman: Well, you mentioned that there was a rejection rate of people getting off the boat into Ellis Island coming into the US of about 2% and some of that was due to health reasons contagion, what was the medical check like it ellison.

00:51:44.820 --> 00:51:53.850 Joyce Gold: Well, you walked up 37 steps and they were going to often know that that was already start on it, there was a medical officer at the top.

00:51:54.240 --> 00:52:01.050 Joyce Gold: We see how you're breathing you're holding your side if you're wearing a hat, perhaps to cover a terrible wound.

00:52:01.530 --> 00:52:07.950 Joyce Gold: And if there was a question about the physicality they will put a chalk mark on the back of your shirt.

00:52:08.520 --> 00:52:17.070 Joyce Gold: Different charts marks for different things to be further checked 30 feet down at the core of the curve, there was another health officer.

00:52:17.520 --> 00:52:28.080 Joyce Gold: And you might have more than one chalk mark on the back of you, and then you would be taken by yourself, without a lawyer, without a friend or family member to be examined.

00:52:29.610 --> 00:52:36.540 Joyce Gold: So it was quite quite rigorous, the most feared, of all the help officers was called the I man.

00:52:37.080 --> 00:52:44.610 Joyce Gold: Using a button hook, the kind that you use to button high, but choose the open the lid of the open your eyes.

00:52:45.090 --> 00:52:50.370 Joyce Gold: of your eye he left, and if you had any bumps there, that means you have truck coma.

00:52:50.910 --> 00:52:59.640 Joyce Gold: something totally gone in this country, but still in parts of Africa, it does it still regions because I needed an antibiotic to end it.

00:53:00.000 --> 00:53:13.680 Joyce Gold: What if you had these bumps you had a coma it was incurable at the time that was very contagious cause blindness and you would be out, you might have any idea that you have this element.

00:53:15.450 --> 00:53:26.220 Jeff Goodman: Earlier, you talked about people getting taken advantage of on the peers and also it Castle Williams and people got off the boat was there much corruption on Ellis Island itself.

00:53:26.580 --> 00:53:38.130 Joyce Gold: there definitely was a lot, especially at first, because the feds handle part of the process, but then they sold concessions, to say the company that sold the.

00:53:38.670 --> 00:53:45.240 Joyce Gold: tickets are in country to the money changers people to the dining room facility.

00:53:45.750 --> 00:53:57.210 Joyce Gold: and two other aspects to the women shambling people and they will really try to gouge out the immigrant to might not have any idea of the kind of currency or what the price should be.

00:53:57.600 --> 00:54:11.820 Joyce Gold: But in 1901 Teddy Roosevelt becomes President and he very shortly after brings in a Wall Street timing for your little Williams, who put out the message that if you abuse the immigrant, you will be out of here.

00:54:12.420 --> 00:54:25.980 Joyce Gold: That did a lot to help things but not completely, for example, if you wanted to go from New York to Detroit and they sold you a ticket via mobile Alabama you might not be aware, but it has to pay what took place was.

00:54:26.550 --> 00:54:28.890 Jeff Goodman: um can take a really long route to get there.

00:54:30.120 --> 00:54:42.330 Jeff Goodman: let's talk about an organization that was active at the time and that service that helped immigrants, it was the H is the Hebrew immigrant aid society What was it in, why was it needed.

00:54:43.020 --> 00:54:43.200 Joyce Gold: Well, I.

00:54:43.350 --> 00:54:44.010 Jeff Goodman: wanted to.

00:54:44.490 --> 00:54:54.660 Joyce Gold: know was one of a number of religious and ethnic organizations that help the immigrant but high us came on the scene when if.

00:54:55.140 --> 00:55:03.780 Joyce Gold: A Jewish immigrant died on LSA would give it a Christian burial and high US stock that I made sure they have a Jewish burial.

00:55:04.170 --> 00:55:11.790 Joyce Gold: Also, people were detained on Ellis Island kosher they will be very little of the food and highest put in kosher kitchen.

00:55:12.180 --> 00:55:19.470 Joyce Gold: And after that many of the people who have been thought too sick to come to America got much got well and were admitted.

00:55:19.980 --> 00:55:31.800 Joyce Gold: A high us today still very active in the world, it is the largest immigrant settlement organization and deals with people not only Jewish people and helps them Russia or.

00:55:34.560 --> 00:55:42.150 Jeff Goodman: versus a striking statue in the harbor near the ferry peer part of the statues shows a man in the water what's the story of that stature.

00:55:42.420 --> 00:55:48.660 Joyce Gold: Well that's called the merchant marine statue in the merchant marine is military organization doing more time.

00:55:49.440 --> 00:55:59.910 Joyce Gold: In 1942 the USS muskegon was get a job and suffering and man on the German submarine photograph the ship going down.

00:56:00.270 --> 00:56:16.410 Joyce Gold: That photograph is the subject of this, it shows a shake a ship sinking just off of the coast of the battery three men on the sinking ship are trying to help one of their colleagues in the water, get out.

00:56:17.100 --> 00:56:33.510 Joyce Gold: it's a true story all the men died and veterans and merchant believe paid for that statue the sculptor is marisol she actually lived in a building I used to live in in soho and is one of the great art sculptors of America today.

00:56:34.800 --> 00:56:40.800 Jeff Goodman: Does Ellis Island have records that people can go to to see a family members actually came through.

00:56:41.820 --> 00:56:51.270 Joyce Gold: Well, they do have a website, and you can look it up, I think Ellis or COM I think it's dot org and you can look it up mormon.

00:56:51.780 --> 00:57:02.400 Joyce Gold: The mormon church help you find a lot of those records that are accessible, but you know as i've said a million people came through Castle garden before Ellis Island.

00:57:02.910 --> 00:57:10.380 Joyce Gold: And those records were kept in the wooden building that precedes the present one on the island, there was a fire, they are in.

00:57:10.920 --> 00:57:24.000 Joyce Gold: 1997 and all those records were not in smoke, so they don't have access to the best of my knowledge of the Council Clinton years, but the website and they will help you do it on the.

00:57:25.830 --> 00:57:33.420 Jeff Goodman: Information well Joyce we are almost at a time, we have a minute left and I committed a cardinal sin at the beginning of the second.

00:57:34.920 --> 00:57:37.530 Jeff Goodman: segment with you, I didn't ask you about your tours I.

00:57:37.530 --> 00:57:50.220 Joyce Gold: almost always do so over coven I designed six more tours and I do tours of over 45 neighborhoods, which to me, is it was weird as how many times you've had that show.

00:57:50.730 --> 00:58:07.290 Joyce Gold: i've added a lot of new tours and I have my most popular probably have to do with Greenwich village, I have 35 different tours of Greenwich village my most popular, I will be giving this year to the public on Halloween it's my macabre Greenwich village.

00:58:07.620 --> 00:58:10.170 Jeff Goodman: Who i've taken that that's a great one of the people on that.

00:58:10.770 --> 00:58:15.150 Joyce Gold: And the financial district having written guidebooks to both of those neighborhoods.

00:58:15.660 --> 00:58:21.780 Joyce Gold: But the financial district, I have a Hamilton version I have a revolutionary war Parish and I have a lot of different versions of it.

00:58:22.320 --> 00:58:30.390 Joyce Gold: And I do a lot of ethnic tours that are on my public schedule if somebody likes me at choice at.

00:58:30.780 --> 00:58:42.630 Joyce Gold: Joyce gold history tours I will send them my schedule which starts the 11th of next month, and those are tours they can just show up there about diving 15 different routes on that.

00:58:43.170 --> 00:58:53.970 Joyce Gold: And my menu, what I do our private tours and my website, which can be a little daunting because there's so much on it will tell people the choices of private tours as well.

00:58:55.110 --> 00:59:03.930 Jeff Goodman: And that's Joyce cold history tours COM Joyce Thank you so much for being a wonderful returning guests to rediscovering New York it's always good to have you.

00:59:04.350 --> 00:59:05.640 Joyce Gold: Great to be with you, thank you.

00:59:06.150 --> 00:59:13.440 Jeff Goodman: Well, everyone we've just finished this week's journey we visited governors island and Ellis Island in New York harbor, but of course didn't have.

00:59:13.710 --> 00:59:25.080 Jeff Goodman: A lot of time to talk about those two islands i'd encourage everyone to find out more about them, or more specifically visit them, and you can do them yourselves and do them through private tour companies like with Jason with mandy.

00:59:25.590 --> 00:59:32.100 Jeff Goodman: If you have comments or questions about the show if you'd like to get an A mailing list, please email me Jeff at rediscovering New York that nyc.

00:59:32.580 --> 00:59:37.770 Jeff Goodman: You can like us on Facebook and also follow me on instagram and Twitter my handle is they were Jeff Goodman nyc.

00:59:38.310 --> 00:59:46.020 Jeff Goodman: Once again i'd like to thank our sponsors this evening to rod modi Morgan strategies to freedom mortgage and also Jacqueline hartford interior design.

00:59:46.470 --> 00:59:51.120 Jeff Goodman: One more thing, before we sign off i'm Jeff Goodman a real estate agent and brown Harris Stevens in New York City.

00:59:51.510 --> 00:59:57.210 Jeff Goodman: And whether you're selling buying leasing or renting my team and I provide the best service and expertise in New York City real estate.

00:59:57.600 --> 01:00:03.000 Jeff Goodman: To help you, with your real estate needs, you can reach us at 646-306-4761.

01:00:03.870 --> 01:00:10.320 Jeff Goodman: Our producer is Ralph story or our production assistant is kyle mcallister, who is also our engineer this evening Thank you so much kyle.

01:00:10.800 --> 01:00:22.380 Jeff Goodman: Are special consultant is David Griffin of landmark branding stay tuned at 8pm right here on talk radio dot nyc for coffee talk excel with Kevin barbero thanks for listening everyone, we will see you next time.

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