Thursdays 11:00am - 12:00pm (EDT)
WHAT WILL THE AUDIENCE LEARN?
The audience will learn ways that all people can heal from racial trauma.
Chattel slavery is one of the most visible signs of racism in America. Unfortunately, many refuse to talk about it and would rather pretend as if it never existed or that we should simply move on. It is impossible to move on or even heal from its pain and structural separation without addressing its significant trauma on enslaved people.
Join Rev. Dr. TLC and Sharon Leslie Morgan, genealogist and multicultural marketing expert, as they discuss how to heal from the trauma of slavery. Sharon is actively involved with Coming to the Table, an organization that promotes linkages between descendants of enslaved people and the families that enslaved them.
Tune in for this important conversation at TalkRadio.nyc
Rev. Dr. TLC invites you to her website SacredIntelligence.com where you can get involved in Dismantling Racism. January 25th begins her next course, a blueprint to ending racism. You can also get yourself a copy of Rev. Dr. TLC’s meditations on popular music streaming services. Rev. Dr. TLC begins the show with a guided meditation. She quotes James Baldwin and says that we are trapped in our history, and our history is trapped in us. But so many of us don’t want to face our history. Rev. Dr. TLC discusses the effects of chattel slavery and how it shaped us into who we are today. She adds how slavery is downplayed in our education and how trauma is dismissed. Rev. Dr. TLC welcomes her guest Sharon Leslie Morgan. She discusses Sharon’s background, accolades, and efforts to dismantle racism.
Rev. Dr. TLC and Sharon both share the same home state, Mississippi. Rev. Dr. TLC talks about the language and the connection they share being from Mississippi. She says she loved growing up in Mississippi and realized when she got older that it wasn’t more racist than anywhere else in America. Sharon is originally from Chicago but migrated to Mississippi to write a book. She loved the area so much that she decided to stay for over thirty years. Rev. Dr. TLC and Sharon discuss how each state needs to face its issues with racism. It is important to recognize life is a continuum, and we are a product of our past. Sharon adds that she will never feel alone because her ancestors are always with her. Rev. Dr. TLC asked Sharon what some of the significant information she found in her ancestry was.
Rev. Dr. TLC and Sharon discuss some of the symptoms and behaviors connected with the trauma of being an ancestor of an enslaved person. Something that stood out to Sharon was the lack of control one has in their life. Slaves lacked control and a sense of hopelessness, which can be reflected today. Sharon also brings up the fact that slaves were treated as property as another way to break their spirits. Another cruel thing slaves had to endure was family separation which still affects African Americans today. Rev. Dr. TLC and Sharon answer questions from the youtube chat. One listener asked if there is any research about the trauma of slavery that survived in the DNA of people alive today and how that trauma may affect the individual. Trauma does indeed pass through generations. Sharon discusses the importance of epigenetics and advises the listeners to read up on it.
Sharon shares her role in Coming to the Table and how she found it to be a source of healing. She was involved for ten years and was very resistant at first. After learning more about the model, she was amazed at its healing use. Coming to the Table has grown and become an outlet for individuals to engage in meaningful conversations. Rev. Dr. TLC asks Sharon how people can get involved with Our Black Ancestry and how they can get involved with Coming to the Table. OurBlackAncestry.com has all the resources you need.
00:00:39.770 --> 00:00:56.550 Rev. Dr. Terrlyn Curry Avery: Happy New Year, everyone, and welcome to the dismantle racism, show where our goal is to uncover, dismantle and to eradicate racism and to create a world where racial equity is the norm. I'm. Your host, the Reverend Dr. Tlc.
00:00:56.790 --> 00:01:10.390 Rev. Dr. Terrlyn Curry Avery: Help that as you are beginning this new year, you have taken stock of what you did in 2,022 to help to dismantle racism. I hope you looked at what you were able to accomplish
00:01:10.400 --> 00:01:23.359 Rev. Dr. Terrlyn Curry Avery: thought about what you could do differently or better, and set some goals for this year, because it takes all of us to really immerse ourselves in the work of dismantling racism.
00:01:23.720 --> 00:01:53.709 Rev. Dr. Terrlyn Curry Avery: I want to invite you, if you would. to please make sure that you go to my website. Sacred intelligence.com. I have multiple ways on there in which you can get involved in dismantling racism. One of the things that I have coming up beginning on January 20 fifth is my next course on a blueprint for ending racism. I want you to take a look at that, and to determine if it's something that you might want to get involved in. I also
00:01:53.720 --> 00:01:59.600 Rev. Dr. Terrlyn Curry Avery: so want to let you know that I've been really busy. So I actually now
00:01:59.890 --> 00:02:18.409 Rev. Dr. Terrlyn Curry Avery: have a companion of meditations to my book on dismantling racism. You can stream it on. I to spotify Amazon Prime anywhere that you stream your music. Go and get your copy of my meditations, because.
00:02:18.420 --> 00:02:26.990 Rev. Dr. Terrlyn Curry Avery: as with the book, it is something to be used to help fortify you for this journey of dismantling racism.
00:02:27.240 --> 00:02:46.370 Rev. Dr. Terrlyn Curry Avery: We all need ways in which we can engage in this work in a healthy way and in a productive way, and we also need mechanisms to keep us grounded in the work. So please do stream my dismantling racism, meditation anywhere. You get your music
00:02:47.390 --> 00:02:52.280 Rev. Dr. Terrlyn Curry Avery: today. I want to invite us into the sacred space.
00:02:52.390 --> 00:02:56.599 Rev. Dr. Terrlyn Curry Avery: as I always do by having us to do a meditation
00:02:57.520 --> 00:02:59.920 Rev. Dr. Terrlyn Curry Avery: to connect us with our breath.
00:03:00.250 --> 00:03:08.489 Rev. Dr. Terrlyn Curry Avery: and as a way of connecting us, and centering us for the conversation that I will be having with my guest in just a few minutes.
00:03:08.590 --> 00:03:12.860 Rev. Dr. Terrlyn Curry Avery: So, wherever you are, I invite you, if you would, to simply just
00:03:13.020 --> 00:03:14.749 Rev. Dr. Terrlyn Curry Avery: close your eyes
00:03:16.310 --> 00:03:19.629 Rev. Dr. Terrlyn Curry Avery: and began to take some deep breaths in.
00:03:21.550 --> 00:03:23.450 Rev. Dr. Terrlyn Curry Avery: and then to exhale.
00:03:25.430 --> 00:03:27.459 Rev. Dr. Terrlyn Curry Avery: Take another deep breath in
00:03:29.320 --> 00:03:31.060 Rev. Dr. Terrlyn Curry Avery: and exhale.
00:03:32.750 --> 00:03:35.619 Rev. Dr. Terrlyn Curry Avery: and just simply begin to breathe.
00:03:36.490 --> 00:03:40.339 Rev. Dr. Terrlyn Curry Avery: connecting with the rise and fall
00:03:40.850 --> 00:03:42.200 Rev. Dr. Terrlyn Curry Avery: of your chest.
00:03:44.600 --> 00:03:48.170 Rev. Dr. Terrlyn Curry Avery: The in and outflow of your breath
00:03:50.680 --> 00:03:52.729 Rev. Dr. Terrlyn Curry Avery: connect with your power
00:03:53.970 --> 00:03:55.679 Rev. Dr. Terrlyn Curry Avery: to divide wisdom.
00:03:57.270 --> 00:04:00.340 Rev. Dr. Terrlyn Curry Avery: their sacred intelligence.
00:04:01.670 --> 00:04:06.279 Rev. Dr. Terrlyn Curry Avery: that part of you that connects you with your own divinity.
00:04:07.770 --> 00:04:12.459 Rev. Dr. Terrlyn Curry Avery: and helps you to make choices that are not only good for you.
00:04:13.230 --> 00:04:16.490 Rev. Dr. Terrlyn Curry Avery: but that are good for all
00:04:16.730 --> 00:04:18.250 Rev. Dr. Terrlyn Curry Avery: humankind.
00:04:21.010 --> 00:04:23.270 Rev. Dr. Terrlyn Curry Avery: Breathe in and out.
00:04:25.230 --> 00:04:27.430 Rev. Dr. Terrlyn Curry Avery: feeling your connectedness
00:04:28.150 --> 00:04:29.340 Rev. Dr. Terrlyn Curry Avery: with family.
00:04:29.830 --> 00:04:31.260 Rev. Dr. Terrlyn Curry Avery: friends.
00:04:31.610 --> 00:04:32.880 Rev. Dr. Terrlyn Curry Avery: community.
00:04:34.010 --> 00:04:35.280 Rev. Dr. Terrlyn Curry Avery: the world
00:04:37.580 --> 00:04:39.330 Rev. Dr. Terrlyn Curry Avery: breathe in and out.
00:04:40.760 --> 00:04:42.270 Rev. Dr. Terrlyn Curry Avery: recognizing that
00:04:42.360 --> 00:04:44.600 Rev. Dr. Terrlyn Curry Avery: you are supported
00:04:46.260 --> 00:04:48.669 Rev. Dr. Terrlyn Curry Avery: by all who came before you.
00:04:50.060 --> 00:04:52.700 Rev. Dr. Terrlyn Curry Avery: all who are available to you now
00:04:53.980 --> 00:04:56.540 Rev. Dr. Terrlyn Curry Avery: even the people that you get to meet
00:04:59.420 --> 00:05:04.900 Rev. Dr. Terrlyn Curry Avery: in and out, recognizing that you are not alone.
00:05:06.820 --> 00:05:09.340 Rev. Dr. Terrlyn Curry Avery: But you are significant
00:05:09.550 --> 00:05:12.390 Rev. Dr. Terrlyn Curry Avery: in this work of dismantling racism.
00:05:14.550 --> 00:05:16.510 Rev. Dr. Terrlyn Curry Avery: What you do matters.
00:05:18.200 --> 00:05:19.769 Rev. Dr. Terrlyn Curry Avery: You have the power
00:05:20.040 --> 00:05:22.559 Rev. Dr. Terrlyn Curry Avery: to change the status quo
00:05:23.870 --> 00:05:26.260 Rev. Dr. Terrlyn Curry Avery: one step at a time.
00:05:28.350 --> 00:05:31.070 Rev. Dr. Terrlyn Curry Avery: So just continue to connect with your breath.
00:05:32.410 --> 00:05:34.210 Rev. Dr. Terrlyn Curry Avery: knowing that your breath
00:05:35.120 --> 00:05:36.600 Rev. Dr. Terrlyn Curry Avery: is a simple
00:05:36.810 --> 00:05:39.200 Rev. Dr. Terrlyn Curry Avery: of your very life.
00:05:39.680 --> 00:05:41.280 Rev. Dr. Terrlyn Curry Avery: your essence.
00:05:44.090 --> 00:05:47.320 Rev. Dr. Terrlyn Curry Avery: when you can breathe in and out.
00:05:49.690 --> 00:05:53.089 Rev. Dr. Terrlyn Curry Avery: it just reminds you of who you are.
00:05:55.420 --> 00:05:56.660 Rev. Dr. Terrlyn Curry Avery: a living.
00:05:57.110 --> 00:05:58.689 Rev. Dr. Terrlyn Curry Avery: Divine Being.
00:05:59.760 --> 00:06:01.049 Rev. Dr. Terrlyn Curry Avery: a loving
00:06:01.280 --> 00:06:02.789 Rev. Dr. Terrlyn Curry Avery: Divine Being.
00:06:03.950 --> 00:06:05.270 Rev. Dr. Terrlyn Curry Avery: capable
00:06:07.500 --> 00:06:09.540 Rev. Dr. Terrlyn Curry Avery: of doing what many things
00:06:09.900 --> 00:06:11.449 Rev. Dr. Terrlyn Curry Avery: is impossible?
00:06:14.610 --> 00:06:16.210 Rev. Dr. Terrlyn Curry Avery: Are you in
00:06:16.950 --> 00:06:18.310 Rev. Dr. Terrlyn Curry Avery: and out.
00:06:19.640 --> 00:06:22.679 Rev. Dr. Terrlyn Curry Avery: recognizing that the power of one
00:06:23.640 --> 00:06:25.909 Rev. Dr. Terrlyn Curry Avery: contributes to the power
00:06:26.140 --> 00:06:27.340 Rev. Dr. Terrlyn Curry Avery: of many.
00:06:32.520 --> 00:06:34.390 Rev. Dr. Terrlyn Curry Avery: Just breathe in
00:06:34.790 --> 00:06:36.270 Rev. Dr. Terrlyn Curry Avery: and out.
00:06:37.750 --> 00:06:39.410 Rev. Dr. Terrlyn Curry Avery: giving gratitude
00:06:40.190 --> 00:06:41.710 Rev. Dr. Terrlyn Curry Avery: for who you are.
00:06:44.490 --> 00:06:46.530 Rev. Dr. Terrlyn Curry Avery: and gratitude for the people
00:06:46.620 --> 00:06:47.969 Rev. Dr. Terrlyn Curry Avery: we love you.
00:06:48.050 --> 00:06:49.730 Rev. Dr. Terrlyn Curry Avery: and who you love.
00:06:52.920 --> 00:06:56.299 Rev. Dr. Terrlyn Curry Avery: and gratitude for the gift that you bring
00:06:57.800 --> 00:07:00.210 Rev. Dr. Terrlyn Curry Avery: to this powerful conversation
00:07:00.430 --> 00:07:02.450 Rev. Dr. Terrlyn Curry Avery: on dismantling racism.
00:07:05.010 --> 00:07:06.890 Rev. Dr. Terrlyn Curry Avery: Now take a deep breath in
00:07:09.550 --> 00:07:11.380 Rev. Dr. Terrlyn Curry Avery: inside out.
00:07:14.020 --> 00:07:15.510 Rev. Dr. Terrlyn Curry Avery: and let us begin.
00:07:20.160 --> 00:07:26.400 Rev. Dr. Terrlyn Curry Avery: James Baldwin says that we are trapped in our history, and our history
00:07:26.490 --> 00:07:28.230 Rev. Dr. Terrlyn Curry Avery: is trapped in us.
00:07:29.250 --> 00:07:37.110 Rev. Dr. Terrlyn Curry Avery: And yet so many of us do not want to face our history. We don't want to face our past.
00:07:37.770 --> 00:07:42.569 Rev. Dr. Terrlyn Curry Avery: In fact, we'll say that was in the past. Why do I need to talk about it or bring it up?
00:07:44.370 --> 00:07:52.489 Rev. Dr. Terrlyn Curry Avery: Well, the history of chattel slavery in this country and really beyond. But we'll focus on this country
00:07:53.850 --> 00:07:59.890 Rev. Dr. Terrlyn Curry Avery: is significant to who we are today, and how racism
00:08:00.120 --> 00:08:06.780 Rev. Dr. Terrlyn Curry Avery: is perpetuated institutionally, systemically, and even individually.
00:08:07.750 --> 00:08:09.840 Rev. Dr. Terrlyn Curry Avery: We would rather pretend like
00:08:09.860 --> 00:08:13.699 Rev. Dr. Terrlyn Curry Avery: it Doesn't exist. In fact, even in the history books
00:08:14.330 --> 00:08:16.079 Rev. Dr. Terrlyn Curry Avery: it is downplayed.
00:08:16.380 --> 00:08:19.419 Rev. Dr. Terrlyn Curry Avery: The trauma of it is downplayed.
00:08:20.750 --> 00:08:24.399 Rev. Dr. Terrlyn Curry Avery: people will say when they're teaching Well, it wasn't so bad
00:08:24.800 --> 00:08:27.590 Rev. Dr. Terrlyn Curry Avery: There were good enslavers.
00:08:29.500 --> 00:08:33.130 Rev. Dr. Terrlyn Curry Avery: but until we admit that we have a problem.
00:08:33.289 --> 00:08:40.790 Rev. Dr. Terrlyn Curry Avery: it's impossible to move on, or to heal from the pain and the structural separation
00:08:41.010 --> 00:08:43.459 Rev. Dr. Terrlyn Curry Avery: that exist in this country.
00:08:43.580 --> 00:08:46.699 Rev. Dr. Terrlyn Curry Avery: In fact, even the people who think
00:08:46.730 --> 00:08:49.390 Rev. Dr. Terrlyn Curry Avery: that they are dismantling racism.
00:08:49.770 --> 00:09:05.799 Rev. Dr. Terrlyn Curry Avery: Who will say, I'm not a racist who will say I have black friends, will then go on to say something or to do something where they are perpetuating a system because they have not given it enough thought
00:09:06.120 --> 00:09:08.889 Rev. Dr. Terrlyn Curry Avery: to understand the trauma
00:09:09.320 --> 00:09:10.850 Rev. Dr. Terrlyn Curry Avery: of chattel slavery.
00:09:11.910 --> 00:09:23.299 Rev. Dr. Terrlyn Curry Avery: Most of us think about trauma, and we think about things like fear, anxiety, jumpiness, upsetting memories and efforts to avoid
00:09:23.680 --> 00:09:25.100 Rev. Dr. Terrlyn Curry Avery: reminders.
00:09:25.360 --> 00:09:31.489 Rev. Dr. Terrlyn Curry Avery: We think about those being the symptoms of trauma, and for sure they are the symptoms of trauma.
00:09:32.250 --> 00:09:35.949 Rev. Dr. Terrlyn Curry Avery: but there are also some subtle symptoms
00:09:35.990 --> 00:09:39.430 Rev. Dr. Terrlyn Curry Avery: that exists, and then some that are actually not so subtle.
00:09:40.020 --> 00:09:47.100 Rev. Dr. Terrlyn Curry Avery: Child Slavery has cost each and every one of us. Some of us is more painful than others.
00:09:47.500 --> 00:09:49.360 Rev. Dr. Terrlyn Curry Avery: but there is a cost to us
00:09:49.410 --> 00:09:52.029 Rev. Dr. Terrlyn Curry Avery: at a cost to our society.
00:09:52.270 --> 00:09:54.980 Rev. Dr. Terrlyn Curry Avery: and so we cannot be silent
00:09:55.490 --> 00:10:00.360 Rev. Dr. Terrlyn Curry Avery: about our past. We cannot be silent about our trauma
00:10:01.420 --> 00:10:04.880 Rev. Dr. Terrlyn Curry Avery: today. I'm delighted to have on the show
00:10:04.970 --> 00:10:06.850 Rev. Dr. Terrlyn Curry Avery: someone who has
00:10:07.000 --> 00:10:10.930 Rev. Dr. Terrlyn Curry Avery: been helping in particular people of color
00:10:11.100 --> 00:10:12.550 Rev. Dr. Terrlyn Curry Avery: to heal
00:10:12.840 --> 00:10:17.790 Rev. Dr. Terrlyn Curry Avery: from racial trauma, but also engaged in the conversation.
00:10:18.280 --> 00:10:20.340 Rev. Dr. Terrlyn Curry Avery: I love racial trauma
00:10:20.770 --> 00:10:21.550 Rev. Dr. Terrlyn Curry Avery: with
00:10:21.650 --> 00:10:23.080 Rev. Dr. Terrlyn Curry Avery: all people.
00:10:23.590 --> 00:10:25.840 Rev. Dr. Terrlyn Curry Avery: not just people of color.
00:10:25.900 --> 00:10:31.840 Rev. Dr. Terrlyn Curry Avery: and so i'm delighted today to have as my guest sharon Leslie Morgan.
00:10:31.870 --> 00:10:37.060 Rev. Dr. Terrlyn Curry Avery: She is a genealogist, and a multi-cultural marketing expert.
00:10:37.600 --> 00:10:52.960 Rev. Dr. Terrlyn Curry Avery: And I want to also note that She is a writer and an author. She is the founder of our black ancestry, a peer community for African American family research. She has taken star
00:10:52.970 --> 00:10:57.930 Rev. Dr. Terrlyn Curry Avery: which is strategies for trauma, awareness and resilience training.
00:10:59.120 --> 00:11:16.370 Rev. Dr. Terrlyn Curry Avery: She is also very involved with coming to the table an organization that promotes linkages between descendants of enslaved people and families that enslaved them for the purpose of healing from the trauma of slavery.
00:11:16.380 --> 00:11:24.069 Rev. Dr. Terrlyn Curry Avery: You will note that a couple of weeks ago I had on the show Tom de Wolf, and he talked about his counterpart.
00:11:24.140 --> 00:11:27.229 Rev. Dr. Terrlyn Curry Avery: who facilitates these trainings with him.
00:11:27.970 --> 00:11:36.870 Rev. Dr. Terrlyn Curry Avery: and so i'm delighted that she's come to talk to us, not only about coming to the table, but about our black ancestry.
00:11:37.430 --> 00:11:51.090 Rev. Dr. Terrlyn Curry Avery: She is the co-author of gather at the table the healing journey of a daughter of slavery and a son of the slave trade. When we come back from the break
00:11:51.100 --> 00:12:00.199 Rev. Dr. Terrlyn Curry Avery: we are going to hear from Sharon, Leslie Morgan, who will help us to begin to unravel. How do we heal
00:12:00.560 --> 00:12:02.620 Rev. Dr. Terrlyn Curry Avery: from our trauma
00:12:03.170 --> 00:12:09.479 Rev. Dr. Terrlyn Curry Avery: As a result of chattel slavery in these United States of America
00:12:09.830 --> 00:12:17.159 Rev. Dr. Terrlyn Curry Avery: we will be right back with the dismantle. Racism Shell and my guest today. Sharon, Leslie Morgan.
00:12:20.850 --> 00:12:40.300 www.TalkRadio.nyc: are you a business owner? Do you want to be a business owner? Do you work with business owners. I I'm. Steven Fry, your small and medium sized business or Smb. Guy and i'm the host of the new Show always Friday, while I love to have fun on my show. We take those Friday feelings of freedom and clarity to discuss popular topics on the minds of Smes today.
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00:13:24.670 --> 00:13:29.760 are you on edge, hey? We live in challenging edgy time. So let's lean in.
00:13:29.770 --> 00:13:54.130 www.TalkRadio.nyc: I'm Sandra Bargeman, the host of the edge of every day, which airs each Monday at 7 P. M. Eastern time on talk radio dot Nyc. Tune in, Live with me and my friends and colleagues as we share stories and perspectives about pushing boundaries and exploring our rough edges. That's the edge of every day on Mondays at 7 P. M. Eastern time on top radio, dot Nyc.
00:13:56.150 --> 00:14:01.589 www.TalkRadio.nyc: You're listening to talk radio, Nyc, uplift, educate, and power.
00:14:06.230 --> 00:14:07.130 You
00:14:08.610 --> 00:14:09.820 you
00:14:10.300 --> 00:14:10.870 you.
00:14:11.240 --> 00:14:11.940 you
00:14:12.290 --> 00:14:12.960 you
00:14:15.200 --> 00:14:15.920 okay.
00:14:33.680 --> 00:14:45.320 Rev. Dr. Terrlyn Curry Avery: We are back to get today with my guest, Sharon, Leslie Morgan Sharon. Welcome, welcome, welcome to the show! I am so delighted to have you with me today.
00:14:45.960 --> 00:14:48.030 Sharon Leslie MORGAN: Good morning, and Happy New Year.
00:14:48.480 --> 00:15:13.419 Rev. Dr. Terrlyn Curry Avery: Thank you so much. And, Sharon. I just want to start out by Really, there's a special welcome from for you, because you come from my home State of Mississippi. So it is always great to have a fellow Mississippi on the show, because there's a special language that we have there's a special connection that we have, particularly because
00:15:13.430 --> 00:15:21.130 Rev. Dr. Terrlyn Curry Avery: people often think about Mississippi, and they think the first thing that they say, especially when I was growing up in
00:15:21.400 --> 00:15:31.609 Rev. Dr. Terrlyn Curry Avery: like a youngster young woman in college. It was all Mississippi. That's where I was so racist down there. How did you survive it? And I would just think.
00:15:31.840 --> 00:15:47.660 Rev. Dr. Terrlyn Curry Avery: you know. Yes, there are some bad parts. There are some things that are not so good about it. But I loved growing up in Mississippi, and what I have found is is that it wasn't any more racist than any place else.
00:15:47.670 --> 00:15:53.230 Rev. Dr. Terrlyn Curry Avery: So I really really just want to thank you for being on the show. You might have a different
00:15:53.320 --> 00:16:01.740 Sharon Leslie MORGAN: impression of your time in Mississippi. So no, I absolutely agree. Mississippi is the poster child for all that is wrong with America.
00:16:01.940 --> 00:16:05.109 Sharon Leslie MORGAN: but that's because other States. Don't. Look at what they're doing.
00:16:05.290 --> 00:16:14.379 Sharon Leslie MORGAN: because there are many wonderful things about being here, and I did not grow up here. I grew up in Chicago, but when I moved here
00:16:14.630 --> 00:16:18.080 Sharon Leslie MORGAN: I was just amazed. I didn't plan to
00:16:18.110 --> 00:16:21.170 Sharon Leslie MORGAN: live here. Actually, I came on a visit to write a book.
00:16:21.530 --> 00:16:26.049 Sharon Leslie MORGAN: and I ended up saying because I liked it so much.
00:16:26.240 --> 00:16:27.380 Rev. Dr. Terrlyn Curry Avery: Wow.
00:16:27.510 --> 00:16:28.350 Sharon Leslie MORGAN: yeah.
00:16:28.420 --> 00:16:30.469 Sharon Leslie MORGAN: 3 years now.
00:16:30.940 --> 00:16:41.920 Rev. Dr. Terrlyn Curry Avery: Oh, I love it. I'm glad you do, because again there are lots of wonderful wonderful things. So here that America, because what I also heard you say is that
00:16:42.050 --> 00:16:52.279 Rev. Dr. Terrlyn Curry Avery: each State each place needs to face their own issues, particularly around racism. Yes, we have a a horrible history.
00:16:53.150 --> 00:17:00.739 Rev. Dr. Terrlyn Curry Avery: but we also have a horrible history and some other places to where we need to face, and you have to bloom where your planet is like wherever you are.
00:17:01.010 --> 00:17:07.510 Sharon Leslie MORGAN: You. You said something in the meditation about being a a powerful person.
00:17:07.579 --> 00:17:23.270 Sharon Leslie MORGAN: and you can do things on your own that cumulatively with other people. It ends up being something much bigger. So I've done some really interesting things here. with regard to improving relationships between people.
00:17:23.280 --> 00:17:35.430 Sharon Leslie MORGAN: and it has been incredibly rewarding that I came in as a virtual stranger, and I believe that I've been able to make a big difference in this community through the work that I do that is genealogy related.
00:17:35.460 --> 00:17:44.549 Rev. Dr. Terrlyn Curry Avery: Hmm. Well, we want to jump into the work that you do. That's genealogy related. But what i'd like to do is to really kind of
00:17:44.790 --> 00:18:00.670 Rev. Dr. Terrlyn Curry Avery: to help people to understand why it's important to have something that ground you in this work, and that keeps you going when things are difficult. What sort of practice do you have that that that helps you on the days when you
00:18:00.680 --> 00:18:06.549 Rev. Dr. Terrlyn Curry Avery: feel like this is this is a lot to carry. Do you have something that grounds you
00:18:07.450 --> 00:18:09.910 Sharon Leslie MORGAN: ideology
00:18:10.480 --> 00:18:12.720 Rev. Dr. Terrlyn Curry Avery: wonderful?
00:18:13.530 --> 00:18:14.950 Sharon Leslie MORGAN: It is
00:18:15.290 --> 00:18:17.940 Sharon Leslie MORGAN: important to recognize
00:18:18.170 --> 00:18:19.320 Sharon Leslie MORGAN: that
00:18:19.480 --> 00:18:21.190 Sharon Leslie MORGAN: life is a continuum.
00:18:21.320 --> 00:18:24.799 Sharon Leslie MORGAN: So we are the product of all that came before us.
00:18:24.860 --> 00:18:38.409 Sharon Leslie MORGAN: So when I look, when I, in reconstructing my family and the work that I do for other people in helping them reconstruct their families. We're looking back into the past and finding out what contributed to making me me.
00:18:38.510 --> 00:18:43.100 Sharon Leslie MORGAN: Hmm. My parents, my grandparents, my great grandparents.
00:18:43.250 --> 00:18:51.719 Sharon Leslie MORGAN: my great-great-grandparents, who came from Mississippi and were enslaved here. And so doing the work
00:18:52.340 --> 00:18:53.800 Sharon Leslie MORGAN: grounds me
00:18:54.310 --> 00:19:00.079 Sharon Leslie MORGAN: and inspires me all the time. It is just amazing. I do this work.
00:19:00.250 --> 00:19:14.050 Sharon Leslie MORGAN: and I may reach a point where I get very frustrated because I can't find something and something weird happens like usually at 3 o'clock in the morning, where i'll get this whisper like, Go to the computer.
00:19:14.250 --> 00:19:27.480 Sharon Leslie MORGAN: and i'll find what I was looking for. If the ancestors do want to be found. They want to be acknowledged, and we need to honor them and realize that we stand on their shoulders. They are running through our bloodstream.
00:19:27.510 --> 00:19:30.940 Sharon Leslie MORGAN: and you know it is. It's a really
00:19:31.030 --> 00:19:36.420 Sharon Leslie MORGAN: powerful feeling to realize that because i'm not allowed. Never be alone
00:19:36.570 --> 00:19:38.039 Rev. Dr. Terrlyn Curry Avery: because I have them.
00:19:38.130 --> 00:19:39.330 Rev. Dr. Terrlyn Curry Avery: Hmm.
00:19:39.410 --> 00:19:48.980 Rev. Dr. Terrlyn Curry Avery: Well, you just sent sales you know through me it for a couple of reasons. I want to ask you about
00:19:49.870 --> 00:19:51.280 Rev. Dr. Terrlyn Curry Avery: what's been
00:19:51.710 --> 00:19:55.830 Rev. Dr. Terrlyn Curry Avery: one of the most significant things that you have found
00:19:56.060 --> 00:20:01.840 Rev. Dr. Terrlyn Curry Avery: in your own ancestry that helps you today, and understanding who you are.
00:20:04.700 --> 00:20:06.640 Sharon Leslie MORGAN: Well, the
00:20:06.990 --> 00:20:08.670 Sharon Leslie MORGAN: biggest one
00:20:08.740 --> 00:20:10.360 Sharon Leslie MORGAN: is that
00:20:10.790 --> 00:20:13.420 Sharon Leslie MORGAN: in discovery my enslaved ancestors.
00:20:15.680 --> 00:20:20.380 Sharon Leslie MORGAN: it goes back to one person whose name was Betty Wharf.
00:20:20.630 --> 00:20:23.099 Sharon Leslie MORGAN: who was enslaved as a 9 year old child.
00:20:23.460 --> 00:20:26.030 Sharon Leslie MORGAN: She was taken from her mother and grandmother.
00:20:26.290 --> 00:20:40.009 Sharon Leslie MORGAN: and brought to this county in Mississippi. I live in Knoxbee County, and she grew up on a plantation, ended up being owned by a family named Gap, and had 17 children with the nephew of her owner.
00:20:40.720 --> 00:20:48.330 Sharon Leslie MORGAN: So a lot of the work that I have done is to track all of her 17 children to see what happened with their lives.
00:20:48.560 --> 00:20:57.449 Sharon Leslie MORGAN: and where they went, and the children that they had and what they did, and there are some horrible stories in there. But there are also some incredibly
00:20:58.040 --> 00:21:06.889 Sharon Leslie MORGAN: inspiring stories, because, no matter what they survived like, I said, they made it possible for me to be me.
00:21:06.930 --> 00:21:10.919 Sharon Leslie MORGAN: Yes, so walking that land
00:21:11.240 --> 00:21:15.410 Sharon Leslie MORGAN: and being in connection with that history
00:21:16.080 --> 00:21:25.310 Sharon Leslie MORGAN: really has met a lot to the building of the person that I am. Hmm. Well, you know, I can't imagine.
00:21:25.480 --> 00:21:42.340 Rev. Dr. Terrlyn Curry Avery: because I don't know all of of my family history, but I can't imagine what that was like to actually connect with those 17 families into here the stories, because you know, particularly since we're talking today, even about the trauma
00:21:42.760 --> 00:21:43.680 Rev. Dr. Terrlyn Curry Avery: of
00:21:44.130 --> 00:21:48.239 Rev. Dr. Terrlyn Curry Avery: chattel slavery, you must have heard some very painful
00:21:49.060 --> 00:21:50.430 Rev. Dr. Terrlyn Curry Avery: stories.
00:21:50.810 --> 00:21:51.820 Rev. Dr. Terrlyn Curry Avery: So
00:21:52.550 --> 00:22:03.960 Rev. Dr. Terrlyn Curry Avery: again, the strength to be able to hear those things, the power of being able to digest those things, and then
00:22:04.260 --> 00:22:06.979 Rev. Dr. Terrlyn Curry Avery: be able to
00:22:08.200 --> 00:22:11.009 Rev. Dr. Terrlyn Curry Avery: connect with the resiliency
00:22:11.390 --> 00:22:18.480 Rev. Dr. Terrlyn Curry Avery: of the people is amazing. And so what I'm hearing as you're talking about this is that
00:22:18.630 --> 00:22:25.650 Rev. Dr. Terrlyn Curry Avery: yes, there will be some pain. But we must dig in and keep going, because it also helps to build us up
00:22:26.380 --> 00:22:33.649 Sharon Leslie MORGAN: What they. What we say is that it hurts before it heals, and when I first started doing this.
00:22:33.950 --> 00:22:38.019 Sharon Leslie MORGAN: Well, I won't say, when I first started when I really started digging in
00:22:38.700 --> 00:22:41.919 Sharon Leslie MORGAN: the stories, the horrible stories
00:22:42.280 --> 00:22:44.009 Sharon Leslie MORGAN: we're so awful.
00:22:44.340 --> 00:22:46.189 Sharon Leslie MORGAN: Then it made me really angry.
00:22:46.280 --> 00:22:53.340 Sharon Leslie MORGAN: I could not understand how human beings could do this one another, and
00:22:53.660 --> 00:22:58.500 Sharon Leslie MORGAN: just the the idea of owning another person is horrific enough.
00:22:58.550 --> 00:23:03.290 Sharon Leslie MORGAN: But then the horrible acts, the beating, the lynching, the
00:23:05.050 --> 00:23:07.459 Sharon Leslie MORGAN: cruelty, the deprivation.
00:23:07.840 --> 00:23:09.590 Sharon Leslie MORGAN: the
00:23:12.360 --> 00:23:25.199 Sharon Leslie MORGAN: trying to destroy people's spirit, making them, you know, like an animal, I mean. We were in the record. When you look in the records. Black people are not in human records until after 1,870,
00:23:25.310 --> 00:23:27.410 Rev. Dr. Terrlyn Curry Avery: because we listed as property.
00:23:27.870 --> 00:23:30.809 Sharon Leslie MORGAN: and we would we were.
00:23:30.860 --> 00:23:40.770 Sharon Leslie MORGAN: The intent was to totally dehumanize us, so that you could do anything to us, and that made me incredibly angry.
00:23:41.330 --> 00:23:44.289 Sharon Leslie MORGAN: and I really didn't know what to do with that anger.
00:23:44.990 --> 00:23:46.900 Sharon Leslie MORGAN: And through the
00:23:46.990 --> 00:23:56.249 Sharon Leslie MORGAN: a long process getting involved with coming to the table, taking the straw, the star program and doing
00:23:56.360 --> 00:24:06.649 Sharon Leslie MORGAN: other things that I do, I was able to channel that anger into something that is productive. So i'm not such an angry person anymore.
00:24:07.330 --> 00:24:12.129 Sharon Leslie MORGAN: I feel great sadness. There are times when I cry
00:24:14.150 --> 00:24:15.180 Sharon Leslie MORGAN: but
00:24:15.540 --> 00:24:23.229 Sharon Leslie MORGAN: it's now it is just more inspirational. It is more realizing the resilience.
00:24:23.750 --> 00:24:28.129 Sharon Leslie MORGAN: and how people got through it, and feeling very proud about that.
00:24:28.280 --> 00:24:32.469 Sharon Leslie MORGAN: So now my emotions are are different.
00:24:32.820 --> 00:24:39.210 Rev. Dr. Terrlyn Curry Avery: So talk to me a little bit then, because, as you are talking about
00:24:40.290 --> 00:24:41.580 Rev. Dr. Terrlyn Curry Avery: the
00:24:41.630 --> 00:24:53.419 Rev. Dr. Terrlyn Curry Avery: horrible treatment of enslaved people just like when Tom was on the show, I can. There's a visceral feeling that's there. It's not anger, but you can feel it in your body
00:24:54.800 --> 00:24:55.800 Rev. Dr. Terrlyn Curry Avery: and
00:24:56.010 --> 00:24:58.469 Rev. Dr. Terrlyn Curry Avery: talk to me about how you
00:24:58.520 --> 00:25:17.820 Rev. Dr. Terrlyn Curry Avery: help people who are going back and looking at their own ancestry, because it's important that we do that. But some people don't want to do that, because not everyone is going to engage in a process of coming to the table or taking these extra classes. So the average person
00:25:18.130 --> 00:25:21.300 Rev. Dr. Terrlyn Curry Avery: who wants to know about their ancestry.
00:25:21.440 --> 00:25:23.279 Rev. Dr. Terrlyn Curry Avery: how do you help them
00:25:23.310 --> 00:25:28.940 Rev. Dr. Terrlyn Curry Avery: to deal with the pain of going back looking into their family history.
00:25:29.750 --> 00:25:33.390 Sharon Leslie MORGAN: Well, I think the big part of it is that
00:25:34.050 --> 00:25:41.810 Sharon Leslie MORGAN: genealogy is looking for a name, a date in a place, and that's that's a pretty
00:25:42.660 --> 00:25:44.350 Sharon Leslie MORGAN: The raw.
00:25:44.390 --> 00:25:45.760 Sharon Leslie MORGAN: No detail.
00:25:46.830 --> 00:25:52.430 Sharon Leslie MORGAN: What you really want to do is to reconstruct people. So you resurrecting a person.
00:25:52.890 --> 00:26:03.920 Sharon Leslie MORGAN: So you don't just want a name of date in a place you want to know what kind of person was this? What things did they endure and survive for my ancestors
00:26:04.000 --> 00:26:10.279 Sharon Leslie MORGAN: becoming enslaved and being brought to Mississippi as a 9 year old child.
00:26:10.430 --> 00:26:12.949 Sharon Leslie MORGAN: makes me think of my granddaughter.
00:26:15.280 --> 00:26:23.449 Sharon Leslie MORGAN: How in the world I cannot imagine that happening to my granddaughter. But then, when, as I am resurrecting Betty.
00:26:23.920 --> 00:26:36.250 Sharon Leslie MORGAN: I am seeing what incredible resilience and strength it took for her to survive that, and then to survive having 17 children, someone that she
00:26:36.840 --> 00:26:41.229 Sharon Leslie MORGAN: could not have loved. I mean you can't you? She never, never had a choice.
00:26:41.610 --> 00:26:47.070 Sharon Leslie MORGAN: but she made something of her life. She ended up having land. She ended up
00:26:47.400 --> 00:26:49.209 Sharon Leslie MORGAN: having a business.
00:26:49.230 --> 00:27:05.640 Sharon Leslie MORGAN: She ended up being just a very strong person, which gave me a lot of insight on me now, and it's like, okay. Now we know why i'm so stubborn, and it has a lot to do with. Why, I do what I do. And
00:27:05.910 --> 00:27:14.959 Sharon Leslie MORGAN: so when i'm helping others, that's what i'm trying to get them to do, it's like you want to resurrect the person, so that you have a whole person.
00:27:15.170 --> 00:27:27.709 Rev. Dr. Terrlyn Curry Avery: not just a name, a date, and a place. Yes, yes. Well, we have to take a break sharing. But when we come back I would love for you to talk about what some of
00:27:28.020 --> 00:27:30.270 Rev. Dr. Terrlyn Curry Avery: the trauma is
00:27:30.530 --> 00:27:31.480 Rev. Dr. Terrlyn Curry Avery: of.
00:27:31.760 --> 00:27:44.149 Rev. Dr. Terrlyn Curry Avery: You know people who have ancestors who were enslaved like, you know we can think about the noticeable trauma. But what are some of the things that we might experience day to day
00:27:44.320 --> 00:27:49.040 Rev. Dr. Terrlyn Curry Avery: that are actually the result of the trauma of slavery, you know.
00:27:49.300 --> 00:27:59.180 Rev. Dr. Terrlyn Curry Avery: there's a book post-traumatic slave syndrome where you know there's a lot of talk in there, but I would love for you to just highlight, for I guess the trauma
00:27:59.370 --> 00:28:09.999 Rev. Dr. Terrlyn Curry Avery: of chattel slavery, and then how we began to heal by it. So we're going to take a quick break, and we'll be right back with the dismantle. Racism show. I'm your host, the Reverend Dr. Tlc.
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00:29:48.410 --> 00:29:49.030 Thank you.
00:30:11.000 --> 00:30:22.230 Rev. Dr. Terrlyn Curry Avery: We're back with the dismantle racism. Show my guest today is Sharon, Leslie Morgan, and I want to just remind you all to please. If you have questions.
00:30:22.290 --> 00:30:38.779 Rev. Dr. Terrlyn Curry Avery: please put your comments in as you're watching us on Youtube. You can also go to my Facebook page. If you have comments there, please make sure that you put your comments in your questions, and we want to know that you are listening to us. I often get comments, actor.
00:30:39.020 --> 00:30:51.380 Rev. Dr. Terrlyn Curry Avery: You might have your questions as well, and our guest today again, is Sharon Leslie Morgan, who is the founder of our black ancestry, and who is a genealogist, and before the break
00:30:51.390 --> 00:31:07.629 Rev. Dr. Terrlyn Curry Avery: i'd ask Sharon to come back and talk to us about what are some of the symptoms? What are some of the behaviors that are connected with trauma of being the ancestor of an enslaved person.
00:31:10.490 --> 00:31:17.010 Sharon Leslie MORGAN: I think maybe the 4 top things that really stand out for me
00:31:17.880 --> 00:31:21.980 Sharon Leslie MORGAN: was the total lack of control over your life.
00:31:22.310 --> 00:31:34.329 Sharon Leslie MORGAN: You do not have freedom of movement, you do not have, you cannot make decisions for yourself. You do not this, you can't decide anything about anything.
00:31:36.670 --> 00:31:37.650 hmm.
00:31:37.680 --> 00:31:39.779 Sharon Leslie MORGAN: The lack of control
00:31:40.430 --> 00:31:41.700 Sharon Leslie MORGAN: is
00:31:42.220 --> 00:31:45.619 Sharon Leslie MORGAN: what all human beings have. At least you have control of yourself.
00:31:45.720 --> 00:31:48.370 Sharon Leslie MORGAN: and we didn't have control of ourselves.
00:31:48.640 --> 00:31:54.339 Sharon Leslie MORGAN: and I think that is something that is reflected today. There is sort of a hopelessness
00:31:54.370 --> 00:32:00.710 Sharon Leslie MORGAN: that people have some of the violence that I see in the black community with the kids
00:32:01.550 --> 00:32:07.030 Sharon Leslie MORGAN: trying to figure out what is going on with them, and I think that the whole
00:32:07.610 --> 00:32:09.490 Sharon Leslie MORGAN: paradigm of their life
00:32:10.040 --> 00:32:11.280 Sharon Leslie MORGAN: has.
00:32:11.430 --> 00:32:21.870 Sharon Leslie MORGAN: They lack control, and there is a sense of hopelessness, and there's no sense of future. So you do things that you don't realize the consequences.
00:32:22.380 --> 00:32:24.840 Sharon Leslie MORGAN: The other would be the dehumanization.
00:32:25.220 --> 00:32:30.150 Sharon Leslie MORGAN: making a person, not a person, but a piece of property.
00:32:30.570 --> 00:32:35.080 Sharon Leslie MORGAN: and doing everything possible to break their spirit.
00:32:35.580 --> 00:32:40.160 Sharon Leslie MORGAN: And so I, that is another one that is huge.
00:32:40.280 --> 00:32:41.590 Sharon Leslie MORGAN: because
00:32:41.630 --> 00:32:46.409 Sharon Leslie MORGAN: claiming your humanity and acting in a humane way.
00:32:46.860 --> 00:32:57.300 Sharon Leslie MORGAN: and having a moral compass that says, You know what's right what's wrong? And you know, how do I live my life?
00:32:57.740 --> 00:33:02.420 Sharon Leslie MORGAN: The last one would be, and this is a very short list.
00:33:02.750 --> 00:33:09.420 Sharon Leslie MORGAN: The last one would be the family separation, because the whole family structure was totally disrupted.
00:33:10.090 --> 00:33:17.269 Sharon Leslie MORGAN: What happened as a result of the system of slavery was that the European system for
00:33:17.620 --> 00:33:21.739 Sharon Leslie MORGAN: tracking a family doing. Genealogy was based on your
00:33:22.030 --> 00:33:25.700 Sharon Leslie MORGAN: paternal line. So people are tracked through men
00:33:26.240 --> 00:33:28.079 Sharon Leslie MORGAN: that was changed
00:33:28.280 --> 00:33:40.899 Sharon Leslie MORGAN: during slavery, so that slave owners can control women, and their quote issue. So that is what made it the woman and all of her children into perpetuity.
00:33:41.030 --> 00:33:43.330 Sharon Leslie MORGAN: and They' having no
00:33:43.360 --> 00:33:50.199 Sharon Leslie MORGAN: men, were totally out of the picture. They were just reduced to being studs. Women were baby makers.
00:33:50.220 --> 00:33:52.530 Sharon Leslie MORGAN: and something to profit off of.
00:33:53.020 --> 00:33:59.660 Sharon Leslie MORGAN: And so the disruption of the family, which I think, continues in many ways today.
00:33:59.930 --> 00:34:01.480 Sharon Leslie MORGAN: it's another
00:34:02.130 --> 00:34:03.190 Sharon Leslie MORGAN: traumatic.
00:34:03.300 --> 00:34:22.099 Rev. Dr. Terrlyn Curry Avery: and I think sometimes we don't it. It's an unconscious thing that we don't even realize with this whole disruption of family, and how you know some people it doesn't even matter whether it's the United States or other countries where they just want to talk about the multiple children
00:34:22.110 --> 00:34:34.830 Rev. Dr. Terrlyn Curry Avery: that they have by all the different women that they have, I mean, some of this carries over, and not just those individuals, but even within our own family, some of the ways in which we interact
00:34:34.840 --> 00:34:50.420 Rev. Dr. Terrlyn Curry Avery: with our loved ones, where we treat them. Some of the ways in which we're fearful about them, engaging in certain activities. I mean part of that is around the unconscious things that we learn during
00:34:50.489 --> 00:34:55.989 Rev. Dr. Terrlyn Curry Avery: enslavement that have been passed down, even when we don't allow our children to explore
00:34:56.170 --> 00:35:11.659 Sharon Leslie MORGAN: and get out. Something has been repeated over and over again for centuries. This is not something that happened for a week. This is something that happened through generations, because, remember, after slavery, now you have the campaign of terror that
00:35:12.510 --> 00:35:21.830 Sharon Leslie MORGAN: the lynchings, the brutality that went on the sharecropping system. So the people were still basically enslaved.
00:35:21.900 --> 00:35:23.370 Sharon Leslie MORGAN: The fact that
00:35:23.450 --> 00:35:26.730 Sharon Leslie MORGAN: people who are incarcerated today slavery is legal.
00:35:26.770 --> 00:35:33.409 Rev. Dr. Terrlyn Curry Avery: Yes, for people who are incarcerated right, it is still legal, and that
00:35:33.500 --> 00:35:35.759 Sharon Leslie MORGAN: the cumulative effect of all that
00:35:36.020 --> 00:35:48.139 Sharon Leslie MORGAN: is that it adds up to the trauma has just continued and been repeated and added to, and it is, creates a continuing cycle of abuse.
00:35:48.670 --> 00:35:58.379 Sharon Leslie MORGAN: I have been abused. I will abuse others that commonly happens, and unless you make a conscious decision. And you're not going to do that.
00:35:58.570 --> 00:36:00.410 Sharon Leslie MORGAN: it's. It's
00:36:00.940 --> 00:36:04.399 Sharon Leslie MORGAN: normal that you can the cycle until you stop it.
00:36:04.650 --> 00:36:09.759 Rev. Dr. Terrlyn Curry Avery: That's right. That's right. And I could go on and on, and talk about some other ways in which I think.
00:36:09.770 --> 00:36:25.059 Rev. Dr. Terrlyn Curry Avery: that we continue to be enslaved. But I want to just take a moment, because I have a question from the arc, and the question is, I've read research on trauma passing through DNA.
00:36:25.110 --> 00:36:37.309 Rev. Dr. Terrlyn Curry Avery: Do you know of any research about the trauma of slavery surviving in the DNA of people alive today. If so, how may that trauma cost issues?
00:36:37.950 --> 00:36:43.149 Sharon Leslie MORGAN: Okay, there is a field of city that is called epigenetics.
00:36:43.200 --> 00:36:47.640 Sharon Leslie MORGAN: and it has proven that yes, trauma passes through generations.
00:36:47.740 --> 00:36:52.700 Sharon Leslie MORGAN: So in the studies that they have done, it has been found that people who.
00:36:52.910 --> 00:36:57.240 Sharon Leslie MORGAN: like Jewish people whose ancestors went through the holocaust
00:36:57.580 --> 00:37:10.229 Sharon Leslie MORGAN: Chinese people who went through the cultural Revolution
00:37:10.310 --> 00:37:22.729 Sharon Leslie MORGAN: a lot more reading on this. There's a really good documentary a. BBC. Documentary but the top. The keyword is epigenetics, i. G. E. And E. T. I. C. S.
00:37:23.150 --> 00:37:30.700 Sharon Leslie MORGAN: And yes, it is. It's an important field of study. It continues to be developed. But yes, it is true that it passes on.
00:37:30.720 --> 00:37:46.569 Rev. Dr. Terrlyn Curry Avery: Hmm. And we also know that I believe that it takes somewhere between 8 to 12 generations for trauma to be healed. So it does mean that we have to do our work and
00:37:46.580 --> 00:38:00.300 Rev. Dr. Terrlyn Curry Avery: doing our work sometimes is really facing and understanding the truth of what we've been through in history. Who our family is. It's just like when you go to the doctors, and they ask you about your family history
00:38:00.310 --> 00:38:14.770 Rev. Dr. Terrlyn Curry Avery: in order for them to be able to give you the best help that they can. Medically they have to know your history, and I think it's the same with us. I want to just ask you we were talking a lot about the trauma for
00:38:15.220 --> 00:38:19.420 Rev. Dr. Terrlyn Curry Avery: people of color in particular, black people, as it relates to enslavement.
00:38:19.580 --> 00:38:20.220 but
00:38:20.410 --> 00:38:29.089 Rev. Dr. Terrlyn Curry Avery: talk a bit about some of the trauma for white people, or for people who are the descendants of enslaved
00:38:29.170 --> 00:38:32.149 Rev. Dr. Terrlyn Curry Avery: people. What are some of the cost
00:38:32.270 --> 00:38:34.729 Rev. Dr. Terrlyn Curry Avery: of chattel slavery
00:38:34.860 --> 00:38:37.069 Rev. Dr. Terrlyn Curry Avery: to the ways in which
00:38:37.220 --> 00:38:40.189 Rev. Dr. Terrlyn Curry Avery: white people show up in the world today?
00:38:41.190 --> 00:38:46.349 Sharon Leslie MORGAN: Well. What you have to understand is the trauma affects everybody. It affects the person who is the victim.
00:38:46.440 --> 00:38:53.609 Sharon Leslie MORGAN: It affects the person who is the perpetrator. It affects the people who are by standards. So everyone is touched
00:38:53.670 --> 00:38:55.080 Sharon Leslie MORGAN: by these events.
00:38:55.300 --> 00:38:58.639 Sharon Leslie MORGAN: It was interesting when I found out
00:38:58.720 --> 00:39:00.509 Sharon Leslie MORGAN: that there was
00:39:00.900 --> 00:39:05.039 Sharon Leslie MORGAN: a huge incidence of alcoholism
00:39:05.390 --> 00:39:11.079 Sharon Leslie MORGAN: mental health issues drug addiction during slavery.
00:39:11.720 --> 00:39:13.790 Sharon Leslie MORGAN: because slaveholders.
00:39:14.580 --> 00:39:18.389 Sharon Leslie MORGAN: I think they knew that they were doing some something that was wrong.
00:39:18.520 --> 00:39:30.199 Sharon Leslie MORGAN: and it did affect them, and we don't tend to think about that part. I didn't think about that part at first, but then it's like it's really logical, because
00:39:30.260 --> 00:39:36.760 Sharon Leslie MORGAN: if I hit you and I if I hurt you, that affects me, it wounds me as a person.
00:39:36.980 --> 00:39:42.989 Sharon Leslie MORGAN: and that's again one of those things where you consciously have to stop the cycle
00:39:43.320 --> 00:39:44.549 Sharon Leslie MORGAN: so.
00:39:44.580 --> 00:39:49.449 Sharon Leslie MORGAN: and you do have to realize that it it it it affected everybody.
00:39:49.510 --> 00:40:18.949 Rev. Dr. Terrlyn Curry Avery: Hmm. I think. Thank you for sharing that, because i'm sure that that surprises people. I actually I don't know that I had ever heard that there was a huge incident of alcoholism or drug addiction. But again, if you kind of think about consciously, you really the cognitive dissidence that has to go on in your mind to own another person, and to treat another person with such disdain and hatred, when you know in your sole being
00:40:19.040 --> 00:40:28.049 Rev. Dr. Terrlyn Curry Avery: that you are hurting another sacred individual, I mean my goodness, You know to tell us, then how do we
00:40:28.090 --> 00:40:35.750 Rev. Dr. Terrlyn Curry Avery: heal from this? I know, understanding our history, and where we come from. But what are some things that we can do to heal.
00:40:36.660 --> 00:40:39.619 Sharon Leslie MORGAN: The first thing that you have to do is to confront it.
00:40:39.960 --> 00:40:44.600 Sharon Leslie MORGAN: So when you've experienced something that is traumatic.
00:40:45.130 --> 00:40:50.430 Sharon Leslie MORGAN: you have to look at it, examine it in a truthful way.
00:40:50.800 --> 00:40:53.729 Sharon Leslie MORGAN: So as we speak about slavery.
00:40:53.940 --> 00:41:03.190 Sharon Leslie MORGAN: we have to. We have to go back and and get it when put it up, and as uncomfortable as it may be, you really have to look at it.
00:41:03.570 --> 00:41:14.340 Sharon Leslie MORGAN: and that will give you some insight into why you do things that you do the way you know the way that you live your life today.
00:41:14.390 --> 00:41:17.079 Sharon Leslie MORGAN: so that is the first step.
00:41:17.390 --> 00:41:24.190 Sharon Leslie MORGAN: and then you want to engage in productive activities that
00:41:24.560 --> 00:41:29.700 Sharon Leslie MORGAN: contribute to your healing an example I got involved with coming to the table.
00:41:29.870 --> 00:41:35.180 Sharon Leslie MORGAN: I associate myself with other people who have similar interests.
00:41:35.690 --> 00:41:41.750 Sharon Leslie MORGAN: we are able to have conversations and have like a healing support group
00:41:41.880 --> 00:41:43.429 Rev. Dr. Terrlyn Curry Avery: that
00:41:43.600 --> 00:41:47.450 Sharon Leslie MORGAN: that leads you to activities like
00:41:47.560 --> 00:41:52.549 Sharon Leslie MORGAN: I. Now I work with the Historical Society here, and i'm able to
00:41:52.620 --> 00:41:57.279 Sharon Leslie MORGAN: share what I know and help people here
00:41:57.520 --> 00:41:58.970 Sharon Leslie MORGAN: who
00:41:59.570 --> 00:42:06.369 Sharon Leslie MORGAN: who didn't even realize some of the things that they do that are racist and that are
00:42:06.610 --> 00:42:07.470 Sharon Leslie MORGAN: awful.
00:42:07.600 --> 00:42:09.680 and
00:42:10.210 --> 00:42:11.919 Sharon Leslie MORGAN: so you confront it.
00:42:12.180 --> 00:42:15.320 Sharon Leslie MORGAN: You find ways to channel it.
00:42:16.120 --> 00:42:17.160 Sharon Leslie MORGAN: and
00:42:17.480 --> 00:42:28.900 Sharon Leslie MORGAN: you must act so. You can't just passively sit around and say, oh, well, okay. Well, now I got it. You have to work work it. You have to work through it. You have to
00:42:28.970 --> 00:42:35.629 Sharon Leslie MORGAN: do something and make your contribution to the Federal healing of us all.
00:42:35.920 --> 00:42:51.480 Sharon Leslie MORGAN: And Basically, that's it. And you just have to make conscious decisions all along the way that you're going to do that, that you're not going to be passive, and you're not going to let your anger, you know, consume you, and you are not going to be apathetic.
00:42:51.950 --> 00:42:54.429 Sharon Leslie MORGAN: You are going to be active
00:42:54.800 --> 00:42:59.439 Sharon Leslie MORGAN: in your life, your personal healing and your interaction with your community.
00:42:59.490 --> 00:43:10.520 Rev. Dr. Terrlyn Curry Avery: Hmm. I love that because a lot of times. I think people particularly think that in their efforts to become woke or to
00:43:10.530 --> 00:43:30.410 Rev. Dr. Terrlyn Curry Avery: achieve racial equity, they think if they take a class or 2 that they're fine, or it it just their consciousness alone will help them. But the active part is what people don't understand, because it's so easy to slip into this like you said there were people who were surprised that their behavior was racist.
00:43:30.540 --> 00:43:35.449 Rev. Dr. Terrlyn Curry Avery: but you won't know, unless you engage in the process. We have to take another
00:43:35.680 --> 00:43:45.730 Rev. Dr. Terrlyn Curry Avery: quick break, and when we come back i'd like to hear a little bit more about your work with coming to the table, so we'll be right back with the dismantle racism. Show
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00:45:50.840 --> 00:46:04.609 Rev. Dr. Terrlyn Curry Avery: We're back with my guest today. Sharon Leslie Morgan. talking about chattel slavery, the trauma that's related to it, and sharing several times during the show you've mentioned coming to the table.
00:46:04.620 --> 00:46:13.190 Rev. Dr. Terrlyn Curry Avery: tell us a little bit about your work in coming to the table, and how you found it to be a source of healing.
00:46:14.730 --> 00:46:17.240 Sharon Leslie MORGAN: Well, I've been involved with group now for
00:46:17.330 --> 00:46:18.859 Sharon Leslie MORGAN: about 10 years.
00:46:19.540 --> 00:46:21.429 and originally
00:46:22.160 --> 00:46:25.440 Sharon Leslie MORGAN: I was very resistant.
00:46:25.750 --> 00:46:27.229 Sharon Leslie MORGAN: but they.
00:46:27.400 --> 00:46:31.969 Sharon Leslie MORGAN: It was explained to me that they had developed this model for healing historical harm.
00:46:32.210 --> 00:46:34.870 Sharon Leslie MORGAN: So slavery, the trauma of slavery.
00:46:35.090 --> 00:46:38.370 Sharon Leslie MORGAN: is historical harm. So how do you do that?
00:46:38.760 --> 00:46:40.879 Sharon Leslie MORGAN: And so
00:46:41.190 --> 00:46:42.379 Sharon Leslie MORGAN: I went
00:46:42.920 --> 00:46:45.140 Sharon Leslie MORGAN: and was amazed
00:46:45.520 --> 00:46:46.359 Sharon Leslie MORGAN: at
00:46:46.720 --> 00:46:52.620 Sharon Leslie MORGAN: this model, and how it was being used for healing.
00:46:52.970 --> 00:46:54.480 Sharon Leslie MORGAN: I'm in a call.
00:46:56.100 --> 00:46:59.960 Sharon Leslie MORGAN: So I continue to engage with them.
00:47:00.640 --> 00:47:08.149 Sharon Leslie MORGAN: And one thing that impressed me greatly was that this was everybody. This it wasn't just black people.
00:47:08.820 --> 00:47:14.390 Sharon Leslie MORGAN: There are white people who are the descendants of enslavers
00:47:14.540 --> 00:47:28.230 Sharon Leslie MORGAN: who want to make connection with people who are descendants of people that were enslaved by their ancestors. And one thing that I realized is that part of my problem in being angry was that I never had anybody to confront.
00:47:28.290 --> 00:47:34.829 Sharon Leslie MORGAN: I never had anybody that I could say. I really pissed off about what happened. Okay.
00:47:35.210 --> 00:47:38.150 Sharon Leslie MORGAN: And this group allowed me to do that
00:47:38.220 --> 00:47:48.139 Sharon Leslie MORGAN: because these were people who really wanted to engage. They realized that their ancestors did something that was awful, and they wanted They want to make amends in some kind of way.
00:47:48.830 --> 00:47:54.990 Sharon Leslie MORGAN: They're not personally responsible today. They are not enslaved, but they have inherited this legacy
00:47:55.350 --> 00:47:56.310 Sharon Leslie MORGAN: that
00:47:56.860 --> 00:48:08.939 Sharon Leslie MORGAN: they need to be healed as well, so that really inspired me to continue so. Now, coming to the table has grown. That was at the very, very earliest days.
00:48:09.110 --> 00:48:14.499 Sharon Leslie MORGAN: and now it has grown to be many chapters all over the United States.
00:48:14.530 --> 00:48:26.979 Sharon Leslie MORGAN: and engaged in some really meaningful work in doing the action and being involved in their communities and doing things actively to dismantle racism that is
00:48:27.630 --> 00:48:35.220 Rev. Dr. Terrlyn Curry Avery: connected back to slide. Right? Hmm. I love that. And and and what I love about it is
00:48:35.920 --> 00:48:43.739 Rev. Dr. Terrlyn Curry Avery: you saying? It gives us a place to be able to confront what has happened in this history, but it also gives
00:48:44.520 --> 00:49:09.919 Rev. Dr. Terrlyn Curry Avery: people Were descendants of enslaved people. It's not about coming to beat them up, but it gives them an avenue of saying, how can I heal? How can I not just walk around in guilt and shame, or say that was then but to be able to heal. I know that when Tom was on the show he talks about, he talked about the the powerful work that the 2 of you were doing together, and one of the things that
00:49:10.410 --> 00:49:12.899 Rev. Dr. Terrlyn Curry Avery: I asked Tom about when he
00:49:13.380 --> 00:49:22.060 Rev. Dr. Terrlyn Curry Avery: shared with me that his family was responsible for really enslaving
00:49:22.240 --> 00:49:25.399 Rev. Dr. Terrlyn Curry Avery: a large number of individuals.
00:49:26.330 --> 00:49:35.510 Sharon Leslie MORGAN: It actually I had a visceral response. They were as much enslaved as it. Actually, the rules only owned 2 people.
00:49:36.240 --> 00:49:40.870 Sharon Leslie MORGAN: What they did was they were slave traders. Exactly so they
00:49:41.290 --> 00:49:46.709 Sharon Leslie MORGAN: transported. They were involved in the transatlantic slave trade, and they
00:49:46.760 --> 00:49:55.270 Sharon Leslie MORGAN: went to Africa, bought people. They were based in Rhode Island. They went to Africa, they bought people, and they brought them
00:49:55.560 --> 00:50:11.250 Sharon Leslie MORGAN: to this side of the world and sold them, and they got we wealthy doing that exactly, and when he told me that it just so, I mean, I knew it before the show. We had talked about it, but but hearing him say it on the show, and to talk about the number of people.
00:50:11.560 --> 00:50:28.339 Rev. Dr. Terrlyn Curry Avery: I had a visual response to it. And so I was asking him, what was it like for him to hear that this would happen, and his family, and what's it like for him, presenting at coming to the table. So what is it like for you
00:50:28.400 --> 00:50:37.400 Rev. Dr. Terrlyn Curry Avery: to be in that space where you are presenter? You have to hold space and facilitate these things, or even as a participant
00:50:37.920 --> 00:50:41.210 Rev. Dr. Terrlyn Curry Avery: hearing these stories a bit
00:50:42.810 --> 00:50:43.990 Sharon Leslie MORGAN: well. The thing that
00:50:44.250 --> 00:50:45.750 Sharon Leslie MORGAN: it feels good
00:50:46.040 --> 00:50:48.050 Sharon Leslie MORGAN: is to see that
00:50:48.630 --> 00:50:51.539 Sharon Leslie MORGAN: the number of people who are actually interested
00:50:51.780 --> 00:50:59.350 Sharon Leslie MORGAN: in doing something, because we've reached the point of such a decision in relationships between the races
00:50:59.450 --> 00:51:05.680 Sharon Leslie MORGAN: that something has to happen is, you know it's you. We can't have this explosive situation on forever.
00:51:06.380 --> 00:51:14.419 Sharon Leslie MORGAN: And so it's really gratifying when i'm talking to an audience, and people really are interesting, interested.
00:51:14.650 --> 00:51:18.140 Sharon Leslie MORGAN: and what I have to say when I first met Tom
00:51:18.210 --> 00:51:19.879 Sharon Leslie MORGAN: I actually didn't like him
00:51:21.490 --> 00:51:23.969 Sharon Leslie MORGAN: because he's like the picture perfect a white man.
00:51:24.780 --> 00:51:41.639 Sharon Leslie MORGAN: and he it has taken time. But by going on the journey, when we wrote the book, and spending so much time together, and meeting each other's families, and engaging this exercise that was based on genealogy.
00:51:41.650 --> 00:51:46.499 Sharon Leslie MORGAN: we really have come to be very, very close and very special friends.
00:51:46.770 --> 00:51:49.820 Sharon Leslie MORGAN: because he is really motivated
00:51:49.980 --> 00:51:53.189 Sharon Leslie MORGAN: to doing things
00:51:53.430 --> 00:52:01.469 Sharon Leslie MORGAN: as our other people. In coming to the table. There are descendants of Thomas Jefferson who wrote the Declaration of Independence.
00:52:01.550 --> 00:52:19.209 Sharon Leslie MORGAN: and imagine the cognitive distance there where you're creating a country where white people are entitled to the rights and privileges of citizenship. But on that's one side and the other side is that we we're building an economy based on slavery. And so those people are not entitled
00:52:19.290 --> 00:52:34.419 Sharon Leslie MORGAN: so to have descendants of some of the founding fathers involved with coming to the table has been interesting, because now they we have reached a generation where they are interested in changing the paradigm.
00:52:34.430 --> 00:52:43.079 Sharon Leslie MORGAN: and realizing, as we said Earlier trauma affects everybody all sides the perpetrator of the victim and the bystander.
00:52:43.150 --> 00:52:55.539 Sharon Leslie MORGAN: So everybody has to be in this boat. I cannot heal by myself. There is another side to it. It takes me you and a whole bunch of other people.
00:52:55.560 --> 00:53:21.109 Rev. Dr. Terrlyn Curry Avery: Because you can't you don't. You can't do it in a vacuum, and that's why we have to do what we can. And and and I would love to get into Thomas Jefferson a little bit more. But because to talk about. That's all right where you're supposedly in love with Sally. Him in that You're enslaving her and her children. I mean it's it's it's a lot. It's a lot, but
00:53:21.120 --> 00:53:36.980 Rev. Dr. Terrlyn Curry Avery: exactly his wife's half sister. Yes, yes, it is just the craziest thing, and then they make a movie about it because they're supposedly in love with one another. She's 13, I mean, really. But here's the thing
00:53:37.370 --> 00:53:47.579 Rev. Dr. Terrlyn Curry Avery: I want to ask you, because we have to end. How can people get involved with our black ancestry. And how can they get involved with coming to the table?
00:53:48.250 --> 00:53:55.350 Sharon Leslie MORGAN: Okay, if you go to the our black ancestry website www our black ancestry.com.
00:53:55.400 --> 00:53:57.849 Sharon Leslie MORGAN: You'll find links to all of these things.
00:53:58.070 --> 00:54:02.109 Sharon Leslie MORGAN: So there are several public pages that are free.
00:54:02.380 --> 00:54:17.280 Sharon Leslie MORGAN: and the re. Those resources are right on the front page. So you find a link for our Facebook group. The website is kind of static. It's a collection of links to other information that is elsewhere. It's not like ancestry.com.
00:54:17.830 --> 00:54:26.289 Sharon Leslie MORGAN: Okay. So if you click on the Facebook, Icon, you can join our group on Facebook, we have 36,000 people.
00:54:26.380 --> 00:54:30.349 Sharon Leslie MORGAN: and this is a active Peer research group.
00:54:30.630 --> 00:54:44.830 Sharon Leslie MORGAN: and we approve people before they are allowed to join. So we know they are interested in genealogy, and this very lively, everyday conversation that goes on with peers, and they talk about their issues.
00:54:45.150 --> 00:54:49.949 Sharon Leslie MORGAN: how they're doing with their family research. So that's really good.
00:54:50.090 --> 00:55:05.470 Sharon Leslie MORGAN: and there is a link for DNA testing, and there is a link for coming to the table.
00:55:05.480 --> 00:55:35.169 Rev. Dr. Terrlyn Curry Avery: You've shared a lot of information with our so fast it did it, did. That's why I always tell people we have to have a part too. in fact, Tom says that 2 of you should come on the show together. So we have to make that happen as well. I want to thank my listeners for tuning in today. Please do right to me. Let us know what you think of the show. Let me know who you'd like to have
00:55:35.180 --> 00:55:49.029 Rev. Dr. Terrlyn Curry Avery: as a guest on the show, and maybe we can try to get them on as well. Please stay, too, for the conscious consultant hour with, say i'm leaving with where he helps you to walk through the life with the greatest of ease enjoy.
00:55:49.080 --> 00:55:56.130 Rev. Dr. Terrlyn Curry Avery: May today you tap into that sacred part of you that allows you to make choices to manifest your greatness.
00:55:56.580 --> 00:56:12.900 Rev. Dr. Terrlyn Curry Avery: while helping others to do the same. Know that we are all one, and we exist because of one another, make it a priority to share love, hope, peace, compassion Today be well, be safe.
00:56:12.930 --> 00:56:16.449 Rev. Dr. Terrlyn Curry Avery: Be encouraged until next time, Bye. For now.
00:56:17.710 --> 00:56:18.710 Sharon Leslie MORGAN: thank you