Thursdays 11:00am - 12:00pm (EDT)
WHAT WILL THE AUDIENCE LEARN?
The audience will discover how to move beyond fears to a place of fulfillment in order to live a life that is in alignment with one's core values.
EPISODE SUMMARY:
What happens when personal beliefs collide with family beliefs? In the quest to dismantle racism, people often find themselves in a dilemma, having to decide such things as whether to talk about race at a family gathering, whether to confront a family member about a racists act, whether to go against their family's wishes and have an interracial relationship, and much more. Internally, there can be a ball of confusion, worry, anger, etc. and often there are sacrifices, (personally, socially, psychologically, and spiritually). Yet, when one is committed to living their truth, they realize a need to walk to the edge of the line and push against it.
Join Rev. Dr. TLC and her guest, Sandra Bargman, host of the Edge of Everyday as they discuss how confronting racism pushes up against systems and demands courage and commitment.
https://www.facebook.com/sandra.bargman/
https://www.linkedin.com/in/sandrabargman/
https://www.youtube.com/user/sandraamazon
https://www.talkradio.nyc/shows/the-edge-of-everyday
Tune in for this important conversation at TalkRadio.nyc
00:00:38.210 --> 00:01:07.119 Rev. Dr. Terrlyn Curry Avery: hello, and welcome to the dismantled racism show. I'm your host of ever Dr. Tlc. Our goal less at the show, is to educate, Eradicate and to dismantle racism. And we do that in a number of ways, through our conversations with guests who are so dynamic, and who are working every day to dismantle racism in every way possible, and it starts with just an understanding of
00:01:07.130 --> 00:01:26.000 Rev. Dr. Terrlyn Curry Avery: who we are as individuals, and so we hope that you learn from each guess who's on here some ways in which you can tap into the greatest part of yourself. It began to move throughout the world helping the world to be the world that you want it to be.
00:01:26.010 --> 00:01:31.010 Rev. Dr. Terrlyn Curry Avery: Oftentimes we think that we're looking for someone else to do something.
00:01:31.310 --> 00:01:39.330 Rev. Dr. Terrlyn Curry Avery: and we are truly the ones that we've been waiting for. So I hope that when you listen to the show you can find yourself
00:01:39.560 --> 00:01:50.709 Rev. Dr. Terrlyn Curry Avery: in the guest who appear on the show in words that you have heard over and over again. But you have a new understanding of what those words mean.
00:01:50.830 --> 00:02:09.170 Rev. Dr. Terrlyn Curry Avery: I hope that you will listen with an open heart and an open mind, so that as you go day to day today throughout this world, you'll learn to stand up to speak up and really push against the edges, push against the system
00:02:09.600 --> 00:02:12.930 Rev. Dr. Terrlyn Curry Avery: and marginalization.
00:02:13.080 --> 00:02:25.050 Rev. Dr. Terrlyn Curry Avery: I want you to think deeply about the conversations that you hear throughout the week and ask yourself the question: what does race have to do with this? What does racism have to do with this?
00:02:25.390 --> 00:02:38.300 Rev. Dr. Terrlyn Curry Avery: And one of those conversations I want to just point out before we even get into the meditation. It's been so interesting to hear how people are commenting on Britney Grinder's return home.
00:02:39.300 --> 00:02:45.690 Rev. Dr. Terrlyn Curry Avery: and I might ask us to think about. What is the hostility around her returning home?
00:02:45.830 --> 00:02:47.520 Rev. Dr. Terrlyn Curry Avery: Why shouldn't
00:02:47.580 --> 00:03:05.960 Rev. Dr. Terrlyn Curry Avery: President Biden have fought for her release. What are the issues that are coming up? Is it because she's a woman? Is it because she's a person of color? Is it because She's. Lgbtqi. A. What's going on? We have to be willing to ask ourselves the question.
00:03:06.570 --> 00:03:16.109 Rev. Dr. Terrlyn Curry Avery: because that's when we will find the answer. And that's where we will understand better about who we are and how we're showing up in the world.
00:03:16.240 --> 00:03:23.220 Rev. Dr. Terrlyn Curry Avery: In fact, it will help us to see. Are we truly the person that we believe ourselves to be?
00:03:23.530 --> 00:03:31.510 Rev. Dr. Terrlyn Curry Avery: But we're gonna tap into these conversations today around pushing up against the edge. But we're gonna start, as we always do
00:03:32.170 --> 00:03:33.939 Rev. Dr. Terrlyn Curry Avery: by connecting with our breath.
00:03:34.070 --> 00:03:40.629 Rev. Dr. Terrlyn Curry Avery: So I invite you wherever you are. If you could just ground yourself by planting your feed
00:03:40.780 --> 00:03:44.069 Rev. Dr. Terrlyn Curry Avery: on the floor, and if you're outside listening.
00:03:44.440 --> 00:03:47.070 Rev. Dr. Terrlyn Curry Avery: just plant your feet to the earth
00:03:48.060 --> 00:03:51.750 Rev. Dr. Terrlyn Curry Avery: and connect with your breathing. I invite you to close your eyes.
00:03:52.850 --> 00:03:56.920 Rev. Dr. Terrlyn Curry Avery: and simply just begin to take a few deep breaths in
00:03:57.320 --> 00:03:58.670 and out.
00:04:00.230 --> 00:04:02.940 Rev. Dr. Terrlyn Curry Avery: connecting with your life source.
00:04:03.390 --> 00:04:08.970 Rev. Dr. Terrlyn Curry Avery: your divine wisdom, and connecting with your feelings right in this moment
00:04:09.750 --> 00:04:12.579 Rev. Dr. Terrlyn Curry Avery: what's happening inside of your body?
00:04:13.930 --> 00:04:17.009 Rev. Dr. Terrlyn Curry Avery: What thoughts are you having about
00:04:17.490 --> 00:04:20.949 Rev. Dr. Terrlyn Curry Avery: the discussion that's to come today on the show.
00:04:24.170 --> 00:04:26.420 Rev. Dr. Terrlyn Curry Avery: What does it trigger for you
00:04:27.030 --> 00:04:28.900 Rev. Dr. Terrlyn Curry Avery: to talk about race?
00:04:31.720 --> 00:04:36.420 Rev. Dr. Terrlyn Curry Avery: What happens inside your body when you're challenged to do more.
00:04:38.860 --> 00:04:41.680 Rev. Dr. Terrlyn Curry Avery: So just breathe in and out.
00:04:43.710 --> 00:04:47.380 Rev. Dr. Terrlyn Curry Avery: connecting with where you are with what you've heard
00:04:48.270 --> 00:04:52.429 Rev. Dr. Terrlyn Curry Avery: in the world about race. Just this week alone.
00:04:55.220 --> 00:04:57.539 Rev. Dr. Terrlyn Curry Avery: Breathe in and out.
00:04:58.870 --> 00:05:01.780 Rev. Dr. Terrlyn Curry Avery: and then connect with that part of you
00:05:02.350 --> 00:05:05.530 Rev. Dr. Terrlyn Curry Avery: that recognizes your power.
00:05:06.700 --> 00:05:09.540 Rev. Dr. Terrlyn Curry Avery: your power to heal the world.
00:05:10.150 --> 00:05:12.030 Rev. Dr. Terrlyn Curry Avery: to move the world.
00:05:12.340 --> 00:05:14.179 Rev. Dr. Terrlyn Curry Avery: to change the world.
00:05:16.840 --> 00:05:22.710 Rev. Dr. Terrlyn Curry Avery: breathe in and out, knowing that what you do matters.
00:05:23.270 --> 00:05:25.640 Rev. Dr. Terrlyn Curry Avery: you are not insignificant.
00:05:28.110 --> 00:05:33.629 Rev. Dr. Terrlyn Curry Avery: Breathe in and out and recognize that when you touch one person
00:05:34.430 --> 00:05:37.230 Rev. Dr. Terrlyn Curry Avery: you've essentially touched. A 1,000 people
00:05:40.610 --> 00:05:42.000 Rev. Dr. Terrlyn Curry Avery: breathe in
00:05:42.520 --> 00:05:43.809 Rev. Dr. Terrlyn Curry Avery: and out.
00:05:45.060 --> 00:05:46.910 Rev. Dr. Terrlyn Curry Avery: claiming your power.
00:05:48.890 --> 00:05:51.140 Rev. Dr. Terrlyn Curry Avery: claiming your confidence.
00:05:51.870 --> 00:05:53.599 Rev. Dr. Terrlyn Curry Avery: claiming your commitment.
00:05:56.590 --> 00:05:58.350 Rev. Dr. Terrlyn Curry Avery: Breathe in
00:05:58.850 --> 00:06:00.240 and out.
00:06:03.010 --> 00:06:04.400 Rev. Dr. Terrlyn Curry Avery: and just really
00:06:05.070 --> 00:06:07.490 Rev. Dr. Terrlyn Curry Avery: meditate on these words.
00:06:08.390 --> 00:06:11.690 Rev. Dr. Terrlyn Curry Avery: I am the one that I have been waiting for.
00:06:14.170 --> 00:06:17.520 Rev. Dr. Terrlyn Curry Avery: I am the answer to my prayers.
00:06:21.200 --> 00:06:23.260 Rev. Dr. Terrlyn Curry Avery: I am
00:06:23.440 --> 00:06:24.750 Rev. Dr. Terrlyn Curry Avery: powerful.
00:06:28.730 --> 00:06:30.380 Rev. Dr. Terrlyn Curry Avery: Breathe in
00:06:31.200 --> 00:06:32.600 and out.
00:06:35.310 --> 00:06:38.580 Rev. Dr. Terrlyn Curry Avery: recognizing that the power of one
00:06:39.600 --> 00:06:41.729 Rev. Dr. Terrlyn Curry Avery: contributes to the power
00:06:42.020 --> 00:06:43.390 Rev. Dr. Terrlyn Curry Avery: of community.
00:06:46.990 --> 00:06:49.349 Rev. Dr. Terrlyn Curry Avery: Breathe in and out.
00:06:51.140 --> 00:06:55.109 Rev. Dr. Terrlyn Curry Avery: knowing that there are people who've come before you
00:06:56.280 --> 00:06:57.560 Rev. Dr. Terrlyn Curry Avery: who support it.
00:06:57.780 --> 00:07:00.579 Rev. Dr. Terrlyn Curry Avery: Your efforts long before
00:07:00.740 --> 00:07:02.380 Rev. Dr. Terrlyn Curry Avery: you ever began
00:07:03.900 --> 00:07:06.590 Rev. Dr. Terrlyn Curry Avery: your story? Didn't just begin with you
00:07:08.740 --> 00:07:10.920 Rev. Dr. Terrlyn Curry Avery: it years before
00:07:12.070 --> 00:07:13.840 Rev. Dr. Terrlyn Curry Avery: you came to this earth.
00:07:15.830 --> 00:07:19.190 Rev. Dr. Terrlyn Curry Avery: So just breathe in and out, filling that support.
00:07:20.110 --> 00:07:23.669 Rev. Dr. Terrlyn Curry Avery: feeling the support of the universe and the sacred
00:07:23.850 --> 00:07:25.140 Rev. Dr. Terrlyn Curry Avery: source
00:07:25.700 --> 00:07:27.060 Rev. Dr. Terrlyn Curry Avery: that you
00:07:27.330 --> 00:07:28.750 Rev. Dr. Terrlyn Curry Avery: recognize.
00:07:31.030 --> 00:07:33.269 Rev. Dr. Terrlyn Curry Avery: You breathe in and out, knowing that
00:07:34.440 --> 00:07:38.419 Rev. Dr. Terrlyn Curry Avery: I am here to support you in any way that I can.
00:07:40.160 --> 00:07:42.720 Rev. Dr. Terrlyn Curry Avery: and so are the people who are on this show.
00:07:46.010 --> 00:07:47.579 Rev. Dr. Terrlyn Curry Avery: You are not alone
00:07:47.620 --> 00:07:50.200 Rev. Dr. Terrlyn Curry Avery: in this journey of dismantling racism.
00:07:52.530 --> 00:07:54.500 Rev. Dr. Terrlyn Curry Avery: So this breathing in
00:07:55.340 --> 00:07:56.780 Rev. Dr. Terrlyn Curry Avery: and out
00:07:58.310 --> 00:08:00.070 Rev. Dr. Terrlyn Curry Avery: connected with your breath
00:08:03.170 --> 00:08:05.060 Rev. Dr. Terrlyn Curry Avery: connecting with your power.
00:08:07.580 --> 00:08:10.580 Rev. Dr. Terrlyn Curry Avery: You are the one that you've been waiting for.
00:08:13.650 --> 00:08:15.539 Rev. Dr. Terrlyn Curry Avery: I'll take a deep breath in
00:08:17.370 --> 00:08:19.070 Rev. Dr. Terrlyn Curry Avery: and sigh it out.
00:08:20.580 --> 00:08:22.030 Rev. Dr. Terrlyn Curry Avery: and last week.
00:08:26.830 --> 00:08:30.250 Rev. Dr. Terrlyn Curry Avery: a few days ago, I met with
00:08:30.440 --> 00:08:36.730 Rev. Dr. Terrlyn Curry Avery: some course participants, some individuals who had taken my class of blueprint for
00:08:37.220 --> 00:08:43.770 Rev. Dr. Terrlyn Curry Avery: ending racism. Actually, they had taken more than 1 one class. Some of the people were in some of the other classes.
00:08:43.860 --> 00:08:54.659 Rev. Dr. Terrlyn Curry Avery: but we met so that we could talk about. What have you accomplished since taking the class? What are some amazing things that you are doing in your life
00:08:54.680 --> 00:08:57.640 Rev. Dr. Terrlyn Curry Avery: right now, as it relates to
00:08:57.800 --> 00:08:59.750 Rev. Dr. Terrlyn Curry Avery: dismantling racism.
00:09:00.270 --> 00:09:11.399 Rev. Dr. Terrlyn Curry Avery: and I was really pleased to hear how people had integrated the conversation about race into their businesses, how they started to market, perhaps in a different way.
00:09:11.570 --> 00:09:20.290 Rev. Dr. Terrlyn Curry Avery: how those who were living in predominantly white areas had gone out and decided to become a part
00:09:20.510 --> 00:09:30.109 Rev. Dr. Terrlyn Curry Avery: of organizations that were perhaps run by people of color to see how they could help them with their nonprofits. For instance.
00:09:30.480 --> 00:09:38.849 Rev. Dr. Terrlyn Curry Avery: how people has challenged the folks that lived in their households around some of the ways in which they think.
00:09:39.590 --> 00:09:42.150 Rev. Dr. Terrlyn Curry Avery: and what was so powerful about it.
00:09:42.340 --> 00:09:55.790 Rev. Dr. Terrlyn Curry Avery: was understanding. This idea, which I teach all the time is that we're not alone. And sometimes when we're pushing up against the edge of a system. It feels like we're out here by ourselves.
00:09:55.800 --> 00:10:05.920 Rev. Dr. Terrlyn Curry Avery: But in that group we could all look at one another on Zoom, and we came from all over the place on the west coast, the east coast everywhere
00:10:06.120 --> 00:10:10.340 Rev. Dr. Terrlyn Curry Avery: midwest. Actually, we came from all over, and we understood
00:10:11.060 --> 00:10:12.770 Rev. Dr. Terrlyn Curry Avery: There are other people
00:10:12.950 --> 00:10:16.180 Rev. Dr. Terrlyn Curry Avery: who want to see a different world.
00:10:16.550 --> 00:10:23.780 Rev. Dr. Terrlyn Curry Avery: and we were able to get ideas from one another as well. And what was important for me.
00:10:23.970 --> 00:10:26.560 Rev. Dr. Terrlyn Curry Avery: particularly as a facilitator.
00:10:26.890 --> 00:10:27.870 Rev. Dr. Terrlyn Curry Avery: Is that
00:10:28.100 --> 00:10:31.800 Rev. Dr. Terrlyn Curry Avery: this understanding, as I said in my meditation, that
00:10:32.430 --> 00:10:34.450 Rev. Dr. Terrlyn Curry Avery: when I touch one life
00:10:34.990 --> 00:10:39.620 Rev. Dr. Terrlyn Curry Avery: I've now touched thousands of other lives, maybe indirectly.
00:10:40.470 --> 00:10:46.700 Rev. Dr. Terrlyn Curry Avery: But I've touched those lives, and so what would happen if I chose to hide my light?
00:10:47.720 --> 00:10:53.269 Rev. Dr. Terrlyn Curry Avery: They say i'm not talking about this anymore. I'm sick and tired of talking about this.
00:10:53.600 --> 00:10:55.549 Rev. Dr. Terrlyn Curry Avery: I'm not going to speak up
00:10:56.370 --> 00:10:58.509 Rev. Dr. Terrlyn Curry Avery: because I just want to be left alone.
00:10:59.210 --> 00:11:06.410 Rev. Dr. Terrlyn Curry Avery: I want to drink my cup of tea, watch my holiday movies, and I just want to feel good.
00:11:08.700 --> 00:11:10.290 Rev. Dr. Terrlyn Curry Avery: But I understand
00:11:10.470 --> 00:11:12.000 Rev. Dr. Terrlyn Curry Avery: the importance
00:11:12.580 --> 00:11:15.300 Rev. Dr. Terrlyn Curry Avery: of making my mark in the world.
00:11:15.890 --> 00:11:18.730 Rev. Dr. Terrlyn Curry Avery: and I want you to understand that as well.
00:11:19.540 --> 00:11:24.320 Rev. Dr. Terrlyn Curry Avery: You never know how your one conversation with someone
00:11:24.870 --> 00:11:31.509 Rev. Dr. Terrlyn Curry Avery: that's already planting a seed. Soon as those words are out of your mouth, that one conversation
00:11:32.510 --> 00:11:36.070 Rev. Dr. Terrlyn Curry Avery: might be watered by someone else.
00:11:36.280 --> 00:11:38.950 Rev. Dr. Terrlyn Curry Avery: and you will see the fruits
00:11:39.150 --> 00:11:40.530 Rev. Dr. Terrlyn Curry Avery: of your labor
00:11:40.800 --> 00:11:42.029 Rev. Dr. Terrlyn Curry Avery: blast of it
00:11:42.170 --> 00:11:44.450 Rev. Dr. Terrlyn Curry Avery: in the ways in which that person
00:11:44.590 --> 00:11:47.300 Rev. Dr. Terrlyn Curry Avery: starts to have conversations differently.
00:11:47.360 --> 00:11:51.380 Rev. Dr. Terrlyn Curry Avery: or even move in a direction of their thinking.
00:11:51.930 --> 00:11:57.630 Rev. Dr. Terrlyn Curry Avery: And quite frankly, maybe sometimes you won't, see the fruit of your labors. But just know that
00:11:58.460 --> 00:12:00.770 Rev. Dr. Terrlyn Curry Avery: whatever comes out of your mouth.
00:12:01.870 --> 00:12:05.600 Rev. Dr. Terrlyn Curry Avery: if the intent is for justice
00:12:05.820 --> 00:12:12.470 Rev. Dr. Terrlyn Curry Avery: and racial equity to occur, if it comes out of your mouth from this place of knowing this
00:12:13.800 --> 00:12:15.590 Rev. Dr. Terrlyn Curry Avery: a place of wisdom.
00:12:16.460 --> 00:12:23.309 Rev. Dr. Terrlyn Curry Avery: It will not come back to you void. There's absolutely no way that it will come back to you void.
00:12:25.180 --> 00:12:32.850 Rev. Dr. Terrlyn Curry Avery: it will be sprinkled upon the earth, and it will make a difference. We're all interconnected.
00:12:32.990 --> 00:12:38.789 Rev. Dr. Terrlyn Curry Avery: So when you say something, it impacts someone all the way across the world.
00:12:39.430 --> 00:12:42.209 Rev. Dr. Terrlyn Curry Avery: and sometimes you may not even know how
00:12:42.590 --> 00:12:45.890 Rev. Dr. Terrlyn Curry Avery: So just continue to shine your light.
00:12:46.030 --> 00:13:05.359 Rev. Dr. Terrlyn Curry Avery: Just continue to do the work that you're doing to change the status quo. It is so important, and if you don't know how to do it, connect with people like me, who can teach you about how to have discussions on dismantling racism, and I do more than teach you about having the discussions
00:13:05.370 --> 00:13:12.459 Rev. Dr. Terrlyn Curry Avery: teach. I teach you about how to push up against the edge, which is what we're really going to be talking about on today's show.
00:13:12.990 --> 00:13:14.540 Rev. Dr. Terrlyn Curry Avery: How do you keep moving
00:13:14.560 --> 00:13:19.729 Rev. Dr. Terrlyn Curry Avery: when you don't feel like doing it? And why is it important?
00:13:20.850 --> 00:13:23.409 Rev. Dr. Terrlyn Curry Avery: And one of the reasons why it's important
00:13:23.640 --> 00:13:25.870 Rev. Dr. Terrlyn Curry Avery: is because when we are silent
00:13:27.110 --> 00:13:29.570 Rev. Dr. Terrlyn Curry Avery: we see more instances
00:13:29.670 --> 00:13:33.060 Rev. Dr. Terrlyn Curry Avery: of oppression and marginalization to occur.
00:13:33.910 --> 00:13:37.609 Rev. Dr. Terrlyn Curry Avery: and so we must be the ones who speak up.
00:13:38.030 --> 00:13:40.760 Rev. Dr. Terrlyn Curry Avery: and I want to encourage you to do that.
00:13:41.630 --> 00:13:46.119 Rev. Dr. Terrlyn Curry Avery: When we come back we are going to be talking with my guest today.
00:13:46.330 --> 00:13:50.320 Rev. Dr. Terrlyn Curry Avery: Sandra Barkman. Sorry, Bartman.
00:13:51.150 --> 00:13:58.640 Rev. Dr. Terrlyn Curry Avery: and she is the host of the edge of every day, but i'm not going to read her bio until we come back
00:13:59.410 --> 00:14:18.469 Rev. Dr. Terrlyn Curry Avery: because I really want you to know what a dynamic woman she is, and I want to read that bio and just go directly in to what she's been doing to push up against the edge of everyday, as she says in her show. So when we come back
00:14:18.650 --> 00:14:31.059 Rev. Dr. Terrlyn Curry Avery: we're gonna get deep into it, and we're gonna take a look at how she has made a difference in the world and what she does. So this is the dismantled racism show we will be right back.
00:14:34.450 --> 00:14:53.880 www.talkradio.nyc: Are you a business owner? Do you want to be a business owner? Do you work with business owners? I I'm. Steven, fry your small and medium sized business or Smb Guy and I'm. The host of the new show always Friday, while i'd love to have fun on my show. We take those Friday feelings of freedom and clarity to discuss popular topics on the minds of Smbs today.
00:14:54.080 --> 00:15:00.180 www.talkradio.nyc: Please join me at my various special guests on Friday at 11 am. On Talk radio, Dot Nyc.
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00:15:09.100 --> 00:15:28.569 www.talkradio.nyc: I'm. Sam Lebo, it's your conscious consultant, and on my show, the conscious consultant hour awakening humanity, we will touch upon all these topics and more. Listen. Live at our new time on Thursdays at 12 noon Eastern time. That's the conscious consultant hour of weakening humanity.
00:15:28.580 --> 00:15:32.999 www.talkradio.nyc: Thursday's 12 noon on Talk Radio Nyc.
00:15:38.250 --> 00:15:43.319 How are you on edge. Hey, we live in challenging edgy time. So let's lean in.
00:15:43.330 --> 00:16:07.719 www.talkradio.nyc: I'm. Sander, Bargeman, the host of the edge of every day, which airs each Monday at 7 P. M. Eastern time on talk, radio, dot Nyc. Tune in Live with me and my friends and colleagues as we share stories and perspectives about pushing boundaries and exploring our rough edges. That's the edge of every day on Mondays at 7 P. M. Eastern time on top radio, dot Nyc.
00:16:09.900 --> 00:16:15.209 www.talkradio.nyc: You're listening to talk radio, Nyc: uplift, educate, empower
00:16:19.840 --> 00:16:20.810 you.
00:16:22.150 --> 00:16:23.390 you
00:16:23.890 --> 00:16:24.460 you
00:16:24.860 --> 00:16:25.530 you
00:16:25.850 --> 00:16:26.560 you
00:16:28.750 --> 00:16:29.440 okay.
00:16:30.340 --> 00:16:30.910 www.talkradio.nyc: you
00:16:45.330 --> 00:16:55.629 Rev. Dr. Terrlyn Curry Avery: we're back with the dismantle racism. Show my guest today is Sandra Bgeman. And she is an actor and singer, with 35 years plus
00:16:55.640 --> 00:17:13.619 Rev. Dr. Terrlyn Curry Avery: professional experience. she's an author, she's seminary trained and an ordained inter spiritual minister. And she's the host of the edge of every day on top radio. Nyc: it's based on our hit solo show up the same name.
00:17:13.630 --> 00:17:21.060 Rev. Dr. Terrlyn Curry Avery: She is the contributing author of the number one best-selling book on the shoulders of mighty women
00:17:21.200 --> 00:17:37.620 Rev. Dr. Terrlyn Curry Avery: she trained with Al Gore in 2,017, to become a climate reality leader. She found it sacred stages, Llc. In 2,014, with the mission to support seekers on their journey of self to discovery.
00:17:37.960 --> 00:17:45.600 Rev. Dr. Terrlyn Curry Avery: connection to the infinite source, and what it means to walk the edge of being both human and spirit.
00:17:45.610 --> 00:18:03.860 Rev. Dr. Terrlyn Curry Avery: The live CD. Recording of the edge of every day is available on CD baby, and i'm so delighted to have Sandra Barge to join me today on the show, because I love when there are people who are pushing up.
00:18:03.870 --> 00:18:23.139 Rev. Dr. Terrlyn Curry Avery: I guess the edge. And I love also because you are also kindred spirits, being an inter spiritual minister as well, and so welcome. Welcome to the show today, Sandra. Oh, hello, Reverend Dr. Tlc. It is a
00:18:23.160 --> 00:18:25.590 Sandra Bargman | The Edge of Everyday: complete honor to be asked
00:18:25.900 --> 00:18:29.170 Sandra Bargman | The Edge of Everyday: to be a guest on your show. Thank you so much for having me.
00:18:29.190 --> 00:18:44.049 Rev. Dr. Terrlyn Curry Avery: Oh, you're so welcome! It's my delight to have you. And as our listeners could hear, there are so many things that I could talk to you about with your your fabulous bio, and that's only just a little bit of the bio. But you've had an amazing
00:18:44.060 --> 00:19:01.010 Rev. Dr. Terrlyn Curry Avery: life in terms of what you have chosen to do with your life by pushing up against the edge. And so, whether it's climate change, or all the other things that i'm sure you had to push up against, you know, as a woman
00:19:01.020 --> 00:19:07.440 Rev. Dr. Terrlyn Curry Avery: being an an actor and in your profession. So I want to start our discussion today
00:19:07.760 --> 00:19:09.220 Rev. Dr. Terrlyn Curry Avery: about the edge.
00:19:09.370 --> 00:19:16.189 Rev. Dr. Terrlyn Curry Avery: I love that name the edge of every day. It's not like it's something that's
00:19:16.450 --> 00:19:19.410 Rev. Dr. Terrlyn Curry Avery: we face. Monthly or yearly.
00:19:19.600 --> 00:19:37.889 Sandra Bargman | The Edge of Everyday: It could be the edge of every minute. Tell us about every breath. Well, that I I just loved the discovery of the edge, you know, when I was contemplating creating a one woman show is really how I I I came up with
00:19:37.900 --> 00:19:40.000 Sandra Bargman | The Edge of Everyday: the name for the show, but
00:19:40.140 --> 00:19:58.200 Sandra Bargman | The Edge of Everyday: in retrospect it's how I've lived my whole life. I lived on the boundary edges of all of the communities in which I've been a part, and I have never wanted to be in the center of these communities. I'm willing to step into them 150.
00:19:58.230 --> 00:19:59.070 Sandra Bargman | The Edge of Everyday: But
00:19:59.150 --> 00:20:17.259 Sandra Bargman | The Edge of Everyday: I don't want to live there. I want to live on the edges. I want to push those edges. It's, generally speaking, in the center, not in every way, but where the status quo lives, where safety lives, where this is, how we always do it lives.
00:20:17.270 --> 00:20:32.950 Sandra Bargman | The Edge of Everyday: and that is not an int. It's not my nature which I never could have articulated way back when but looking back. That's how I lived my life as an Edge walker, and then to come into the desire to create this one woman show
00:20:33.180 --> 00:20:51.399 Sandra Bargman | The Edge of Everyday: that really was about me. Stepping into my own voice as an actor, as a singer and as an inter faith, inter spiritual minister, and using the power of my voice with all of my talents. What show. Was I going to create? That was kind of my version of preaching?
00:20:51.590 --> 00:21:03.570 Sandra Bargman | The Edge of Everyday: Yes, i'm not a part of any organized religion, and Don't have a congregation per se. So i'm my husband and I are are driving in the cat Skills.
00:21:03.690 --> 00:21:07.340 Sandra Bargman | The Edge of Everyday: and and I just, you know, and we passed
00:21:08.060 --> 00:21:11.209 Sandra Bargman | The Edge of Everyday: an old skeleton of a building.
00:21:11.250 --> 00:21:20.440 Sandra Bargman | The Edge of Everyday: and it was like an old restaurant slash bar slash, and I thought wouldn't that be a great community center and a great
00:21:20.850 --> 00:21:38.339 Sandra Bargman | The Edge of Everyday: like a place to do cabaret, and where I could do what? And I'm contemplating doing this show I could do. You know the show that I want to create there, and he and my husband has well, what would you call it? And I said, just flew out of my mouth. Hadn't thought about this, and I said the edge. I just love that idea about
00:21:39.080 --> 00:21:46.449 Sandra Bargman | The Edge of Everyday: pushing be coming to the edge and and being afraid of the edge, but but finding the courage to jump, and he said, Well, you know
00:21:47.450 --> 00:21:56.260 Sandra Bargman | The Edge of Everyday: the edge effect is a scientific term, the edge effect, that's what I would call it. And I said, oh.
00:21:56.310 --> 00:21:57.239 Sandra Bargman | The Edge of Everyday: tell me what.
00:21:57.310 --> 00:22:01.389 Sandra Bargman | The Edge of Everyday: and he said, it's where to
00:22:02.190 --> 00:22:04.340 Sandra Bargman | The Edge of Everyday: different ecosystems come together.
00:22:04.550 --> 00:22:10.549 Sandra Bargman | The Edge of Everyday: for instance, a forest and a field, and it's that boundary that edge where they meet
00:22:10.700 --> 00:22:12.749 Sandra Bargman | The Edge of Everyday: where we find the most diversity.
00:22:12.800 --> 00:22:32.229 Sandra Bargman | The Edge of Everyday: You know the most. It it the hybrid like. If you think of communities, it's where innovation happens, and of course it happens in nature, where where you find the most chaos, but the most creativity and the the the discoveries are there on the edges. And I thought
00:22:32.300 --> 00:22:37.119 Sandra Bargman | The Edge of Everyday: I I you know, and I used that in the creation of
00:22:37.250 --> 00:22:40.910 Sandra Bargman | The Edge of Everyday: the ideas for the show. Yeah.
00:22:41.020 --> 00:22:56.780 Rev. Dr. Terrlyn Curry Avery: But you find that most people, because I love how you just said like at the edge. There's the chaos. There's the diversity. There's the differences right? Do you find that most people are afraid to walk? Oh, absolutely
00:22:57.300 --> 00:23:04.429 Sandra Bargman | The Edge of Everyday: absolutely afraid are not wired for it are not curious about it.
00:23:04.790 --> 00:23:09.190 Sandra Bargman | The Edge of Everyday: it's it's, you know. I mean, we hey? Listen. We learned that
00:23:09.760 --> 00:23:12.000 Sandra Bargman | The Edge of Everyday: psychologically people are.
00:23:12.120 --> 00:23:31.990 Sandra Bargman | The Edge of Everyday: I'm truly wired for sameness, and some people are wired for deep curiosity and an attraction to diversity and change, and which is to insinuate a comfort level with change that people that want don't want to be on the edge. Don't want to change.
00:23:32.000 --> 00:23:34.959 Rev. Dr. Terrlyn Curry Avery: So so let me ask you, because I love that you went there
00:23:35.210 --> 00:23:44.310 Rev. Dr. Terrlyn Curry Avery: that that people are wired in those ways, so there might be Some people that are listening will find it hard. They'll say, i'm just not wired
00:23:44.320 --> 00:23:56.460 Rev. Dr. Terrlyn Curry Avery: to live there, and so I don't think I can be out there pushing against it and and and working to dismantle racism. Or maybe people are just wired races, and they're not going to change. What would you say
00:23:56.530 --> 00:24:01.619 Rev. Dr. Terrlyn Curry Avery: as an inter spiritual minister, to encourage those people
00:24:01.910 --> 00:24:03.719 Rev. Dr. Terrlyn Curry Avery: to just check out the edge.
00:24:03.830 --> 00:24:07.620 Rev. Dr. Terrlyn Curry Avery: even if it's really comfortable for you. Well, what what would you say to them?
00:24:08.070 --> 00:24:14.630 Sandra Bargman | The Edge of Everyday: Well, I would first and foremost, when it, when people ask me what is my my my tradition?
00:24:14.880 --> 00:24:15.660 And
00:24:15.790 --> 00:24:20.580 Sandra Bargman | The Edge of Everyday: before I say, you know, inter spiritual, I say my tradition is curiosity.
00:24:20.610 --> 00:24:22.070 Rev. Dr. Terrlyn Curry Avery: Hmm.
00:24:22.330 --> 00:24:23.490 Sandra Bargman | The Edge of Everyday: And
00:24:24.040 --> 00:24:26.070 Sandra Bargman | The Edge of Everyday: as a human being
00:24:27.220 --> 00:24:29.360 Sandra Bargman | The Edge of Everyday: I believe that it is
00:24:30.320 --> 00:24:41.489 Sandra Bargman | The Edge of Everyday: our birthright, and and the greatest need to cultivate this curiosity. Now i'm not saying. Everyone needs to walk every single moment of every single day, like I might 150,
00:24:41.500 --> 00:24:59.879 Sandra Bargman | The Edge of Everyday: curiously asking a 1 million questions and exploring and looking at in the shadows, and looking and looking at the light, and doing all the things that I love to do. But but I don't believe that just because a person is quote unquote wired, and psychologically, in the you know the data is beginning to come in on this.
00:24:59.890 --> 00:25:02.450 Sandra Bargman | The Edge of Everyday: I don't believe that that is
00:25:03.150 --> 00:25:17.489 Sandra Bargman | The Edge of Everyday: that that means that people can't step out of their comfort zone a bit and some in some courage around curiosity, and I would my suggestion would be: Take some baby steps.
00:25:17.540 --> 00:25:18.530 Rev. Dr. Terrlyn Curry Avery: Hmm.
00:25:18.640 --> 00:25:23.099 Sandra Bargman | The Edge of Everyday: Find someone with whom you might feel safe
00:25:23.160 --> 00:25:30.289 Sandra Bargman | The Edge of Everyday: to ask some questions and and find someone who
00:25:30.590 --> 00:25:35.819 Sandra Bargman | The Edge of Everyday: is outside, maybe of your your inner circle, that that
00:25:36.160 --> 00:25:38.129 Sandra Bargman | The Edge of Everyday: that you can feel.
00:25:38.550 --> 00:25:43.719 Sandra Bargman | The Edge of Everyday: I mean safety and privacy. With that you know where you can
00:25:44.860 --> 00:25:47.370 Sandra Bargman | The Edge of Everyday: take those first steps into curiosity.
00:25:47.400 --> 00:26:04.659 Rev. Dr. Terrlyn Curry Avery: I love that. I love that curiosity. See, that's another reason why I think we we connect and jive because I've always asked a 1 million questions, and it's like what like that? Doesn't even make sense to.
00:26:04.760 --> 00:26:26.739 Rev. Dr. Terrlyn Curry Avery: even when i'm teaching something like my I I was. I was actually teaching Bible study last night, and we were, you know, talking about a story in there, and had to do with women. And and I said, You know as whether we've been sold to build goods like this? Just dig deeper. Does that make sense? Now I know i'm offending a lot of people right now when I say that. But
00:26:26.750 --> 00:26:35.619 Rev. Dr. Terrlyn Curry Avery: I I just want you to look even critically, even at our sacred text and say, is that in alignment with who you know
00:26:35.680 --> 00:26:49.450 Sandra Bargman | The Edge of Everyday: you know the divine to be, you just fully accept that we're supposed to be these little docile women, you know, like totally well. Oh, that word offend that that drives me insane.
00:26:49.490 --> 00:27:05.430 Sandra Bargman | The Edge of Everyday: I would say, if you feel offended, this is where you have some work internal work to do.
00:27:05.440 --> 00:27:15.660 Sandra Bargman | The Edge of Everyday: For instance, someone can call me whatever they want to call me a witch of this of that a crazy Olympia. Whatever i'm secure, and who I am.
00:27:15.690 --> 00:27:20.520 Sandra Bargman | The Edge of Everyday: you're you're taking offense is actually more about
00:27:20.660 --> 00:27:21.790 Sandra Bargman | The Edge of Everyday: you.
00:27:21.810 --> 00:27:26.060 Sandra Bargman | The Edge of Everyday: Then it is about me. Now, if I have been intentionally cruel.
00:27:26.330 --> 00:27:33.600 Sandra Bargman | The Edge of Everyday: i'm more than willing to hear that, and to apologize and to. But if I've spoken a truth that somehow
00:27:33.930 --> 00:27:35.530 Sandra Bargman | The Edge of Everyday: it's not cruel.
00:27:35.720 --> 00:27:38.470 Sandra Bargman | The Edge of Everyday: simply my truth, and it offends you.
00:27:38.650 --> 00:27:39.560 Rev. Dr. Terrlyn Curry Avery: and then
00:27:39.580 --> 00:27:42.779 Sandra Bargman | The Edge of Everyday: then I would suggest that that's where the internal work lies.
00:27:42.930 --> 00:27:49.649 Rev. Dr. Terrlyn Curry Avery: I love that I I absolutely do, because one of the things that I say to people my questioning.
00:27:49.900 --> 00:27:55.300 Rev. Dr. Terrlyn Curry Avery: my beliefs, what I've learned over the years I I full
00:27:55.760 --> 00:28:01.710 Rev. Dr. Terrlyn Curry Avery: fully embrace who I am from a religious perspective. But my questioning
00:28:02.000 --> 00:28:11.410 Rev. Dr. Terrlyn Curry Avery: what what folks have taught, and the way that they taught it. I said it actually only makes me have a stronger connection with the divine. It doesn't mean.
00:28:11.490 --> 00:28:21.539 Rev. Dr. Terrlyn Curry Avery: Yes, it's called the bobbing. It doesn't make me say, oh, no, I can no longer believe that. No it! And and
00:28:21.850 --> 00:28:27.830 Rev. Dr. Terrlyn Curry Avery: in this place of curiosity. It also helps me to know that there are some things I don't understand.
00:28:27.920 --> 00:28:38.380 Rev. Dr. Terrlyn Curry Avery: but I can seek to understand them, and then there's some things I surrender to right. So we are going to have to take a break, of course, but once come back.
00:28:39.060 --> 00:28:42.070 Rev. Dr. Terrlyn Curry Avery: I'd love to talk with you about
00:28:42.820 --> 00:28:45.250 Rev. Dr. Terrlyn Curry Avery: how you have found being
00:28:45.510 --> 00:28:47.710 Rev. Dr. Terrlyn Curry Avery: a, you know, at the edge.
00:28:47.750 --> 00:28:52.819 Rev. Dr. Terrlyn Curry Avery: And in this place of chaos and diversity, how has it shown up
00:28:52.920 --> 00:28:59.620 Rev. Dr. Terrlyn Curry Avery: just in your day to day understanding of race and racism, because
00:28:59.720 --> 00:29:01.929 Rev. Dr. Terrlyn Curry Avery: I think that some people
00:29:02.490 --> 00:29:18.240 Rev. Dr. Terrlyn Curry Avery: move in and out of these spaces more naturally than others, because we've been talking about the worry. But I also think that sometimes when folks talk about dismantling racism, they really think it has to be this huge thing.
00:29:18.410 --> 00:29:25.520 Rev. Dr. Terrlyn Curry Avery: and I keep saying on every show. It's about starting right within your own self
00:29:25.530 --> 00:29:44.770 Rev. Dr. Terrlyn Curry Avery: and in your community your family. So when we come back from the break, i'd like to continue the conversation and go go more into what it would have been. Some things that you've encountered on the edge of dismantling racism. So we will be right back on the dismantle racism show. Stay, too.
00:29:46.340 --> 00:29:49.799 www.talkradio.nyc: Are you passionate about the conversation around racism?
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00:31:45.870 --> 00:31:58.569 Rev. Dr. Terrlyn Curry Avery: We're back with the dismantle racism. Show my guest today. Sandra Bartman has been talking about Really, how do we engage in a process of curiosity
00:31:58.910 --> 00:32:18.499 Rev. Dr. Terrlyn Curry Avery: and evolving, and she is the host at the edge of every day, and she talks about pushing the edge, pushing the envelope a little bit. So I want to know Sandra as a white woman who pushes up against systems, but in particular
00:32:18.800 --> 00:32:21.199 Rev. Dr. Terrlyn Curry Avery: systems of oppression.
00:32:22.070 --> 00:32:28.210 Rev. Dr. Terrlyn Curry Avery: What's it been like for you what that some of your experiences when you've chosen to
00:32:28.280 --> 00:32:29.850 Rev. Dr. Terrlyn Curry Avery: that go to the center.
00:32:29.940 --> 00:32:37.940 Sandra Bargman | The Edge of Everyday: Yeah. Well, I think for me everything really cranked into higher gear, you know it's not.
00:32:38.450 --> 00:32:45.409 Sandra Bargman | The Edge of Everyday: I lived in a white girl bubble, and grew up in a conservative family, but as sort of the black sheep
00:32:45.650 --> 00:32:49.000 Sandra Bargman | The Edge of Everyday: wise as put my You know.
00:32:49.180 --> 00:32:55.110 Sandra Bargman | The Edge of Everyday: my opinions out there, and but still always skirting around and and and not
00:32:55.620 --> 00:33:05.299 Sandra Bargman | The Edge of Everyday: not necessarily pricking the the the hive with the stick, if you will, but it really cranked into gear with me around
00:33:05.530 --> 00:33:11.430 Sandra Bargman | The Edge of Everyday: 2,013. When I really started deeply paying attention to
00:33:12.740 --> 00:33:31.290 Sandra Bargman | The Edge of Everyday: my entitlement, and white people's entitlement when, when when, and my privilege when they all of the the and it was on social media, all of the the killings, the police killings the brutality that we could I I'll speak for myself. I could finally see that
00:33:31.300 --> 00:33:33.480 Sandra Bargman | The Edge of Everyday: happening on video.
00:33:33.660 --> 00:33:41.719 Sandra Bargman | The Edge of Everyday: I could see it in real time, and then I could watch people in my life that I was close to
00:33:42.850 --> 00:33:46.839 Sandra Bargman | The Edge of Everyday: react to that exactly the opposite that I did
00:33:47.340 --> 00:33:53.850 Sandra Bargman | The Edge of Everyday: that that we're all about the blue, and and I, watching that, and seeing
00:33:54.540 --> 00:34:08.580 Sandra Bargman | The Edge of Everyday: what was revealed in my my family in my closest contacts, was really shattering for me. It's not as if it was a first time it had happened in my lifetime, but it was. It culminated
00:34:09.020 --> 00:34:19.200 Sandra Bargman | The Edge of Everyday: in a way for me that i'm sure had everything to do with the age. I was where we we had come in time. The fact that I you know
00:34:19.330 --> 00:34:26.050 Sandra Bargman | The Edge of Everyday: My mother was gone, and you know my my sense of family was already unraveling, so it was a
00:34:26.190 --> 00:34:42.410 Sandra Bargman | The Edge of Everyday: a culmination of a lot of tendrils coming together. But but since then, and with with you know the rise of trumpism. I mean, it's a daily. I've become uber, political, and uber, aware of the patriarchy, and this.
00:34:42.590 --> 00:34:44.730 Sandra Bargman | The Edge of Everyday: and been very
00:34:45.810 --> 00:35:02.910 Sandra Bargman | The Edge of Everyday: honest with all my friends, who are people of color to you know. Give me, help me. I'm working on this. I'm doing my reading, i'm. I'm asking the questions. I'm speaking up with the people in my life. I'm willing to
00:35:03.030 --> 00:35:19.730 Sandra Bargman | The Edge of Everyday: sit with this chaos. I'm willing to sit with this confrontation. I'm willing to say the hard things. I'm willing to have the courageous conversations, particularly with people in my life that are blood relatives. So what's been? Some of the
00:35:20.240 --> 00:35:32.079 Rev. Dr. Terrlyn Curry Avery: you know, the backlash, if you speaking up, I mean you just talked about being in a Conservative family, and we know what the last several years have been like in terms of people.
00:35:32.090 --> 00:35:45.560 Sandra Bargman | The Edge of Everyday: you know, and people not even recognizing that race has something to do with it. Right? That racism has something to it. So what's what's that been like for you that blows my mind. The idea that people can be immune to the idea of that that race is a part of it.
00:35:45.750 --> 00:35:52.970 Sandra Bargman | The Edge of Everyday: Well, it's been horrible. it's been very heartbreaking and and
00:35:53.240 --> 00:35:54.049 Sandra Bargman | The Edge of Everyday: but
00:35:54.780 --> 00:35:57.769 Sandra Bargman | The Edge of Everyday: but i'm not someone that
00:36:00.060 --> 00:36:17.010 Sandra Bargman | The Edge of Everyday: I am not wired to be quiet, and I am not someone that can just agree to disagree, because to me, you know, and and that that's such a political thing to say we, we'll. We'll just have to agree to disagree. Well.
00:36:17.080 --> 00:36:22.579 Sandra Bargman | The Edge of Everyday: you know what I can agree to disagree on our economic policy with China.
00:36:23.850 --> 00:36:38.960 Sandra Bargman | The Edge of Everyday: but I cannot agree to this disagree when it comes to human rights when it comes to my body, when it comes to systems of oppression that you are unwilling to take a look at. Every every single white person knows this.
00:36:38.970 --> 00:36:57.080 Sandra Bargman | The Edge of Everyday: you know, and so to pretend that that they're not a part of this story boggles my mind. Now, Some might call that ridiculously naive. I don't call that naive. I wonder you know what i'm imagining for you. Is that
00:36:57.410 --> 00:37:18.019 Rev. Dr. Terrlyn Curry Avery: a part of why you have to speak up is because internally you can't live with yourself if you don't. I mean, that's I like. I can feel your passion through the this. If I was jumping out like that, like you're really serious about what you're saying, and I think that a lot of times people don't understand that the cost
00:37:18.470 --> 00:37:30.890 Rev. Dr. Terrlyn Curry Avery: of racism to individuals particularly, I think. well not. I think I know from the research I've done, and from other folks who talk about this, the cost of racism for white folks
00:37:30.900 --> 00:37:42.449 Rev. Dr. Terrlyn Curry Avery: can often be psychological and emotional, because there's an internal battle that's going on. And so, if there's a fear to speak up, you're still already
00:37:42.550 --> 00:37:53.310 Rev. Dr. Terrlyn Curry Avery: sacrificing something and dealing with something emotionally, anyway. So why not step out? Why not speak up exactly. It's going to eat you from inside?
00:37:53.500 --> 00:37:55.799 Sandra Bargman | The Edge of Everyday: Well, and I just
00:37:56.300 --> 00:38:01.219 Sandra Bargman | The Edge of Everyday: I I mean, you know you can tell from my passion, and you can. My, I am.
00:38:02.600 --> 00:38:18.190 Sandra Bargman | The Edge of Everyday: I wouldn't say that, you know confrontation, you know I've cracked a joke in my family contract. It's like, you know. Confrontation is like a a great drug, and that's really, you know that sounds really sassy, and to some extent. It's kind of true that I
00:38:18.420 --> 00:38:28.010 Sandra Bargman | The Edge of Everyday: I am somebody that wants to go it. Okay. Why, why do you believe that and get a little confrontational. But the truth of the matter is is that
00:38:28.700 --> 00:38:31.250 Sandra Bargman | The Edge of Everyday: I've I've always spoken up
00:38:31.550 --> 00:38:44.680 Sandra Bargman | The Edge of Everyday: it was not as as aggressively as I do in at this age and in this time. But but through all my life, and I've shared this with you in in
00:38:44.730 --> 00:38:50.840 Sandra Bargman | The Edge of Everyday: in our pre-chats you know. When I was in college I grew up. I I knew 5 people.
00:38:51.270 --> 00:38:53.700 Sandra Bargman | The Edge of Everyday: Hi black people in in my school.
00:38:54.040 --> 00:39:00.690 Sandra Bargman | The Edge of Everyday: in my lovely little Pittsburgh suburban lifestyle, and you know.
00:39:00.720 --> 00:39:06.080 Sandra Bargman | The Edge of Everyday: just was what it was. It wasn't like I even. You know my parents didn't talk about things, and
00:39:06.760 --> 00:39:07.850 Sandra Bargman | The Edge of Everyday: you know they were
00:39:07.890 --> 00:39:14.110 Sandra Bargman | The Edge of Everyday: politically motivated, and it was, you know past the the sixtys, and and so
00:39:14.630 --> 00:39:21.309 Sandra Bargman | The Edge of Everyday: you know it, wasn't a lifestyle. They weren't that way. They weren't activists and involved, and
00:39:22.210 --> 00:39:29.769 Sandra Bargman | The Edge of Everyday: and so I get to college, and it's a whole new world, and I'm an actor. I went to Carnegie Mellon University in Pittsburgh, and you know i'm
00:39:30.540 --> 00:39:37.479 Sandra Bargman | The Edge of Everyday: learning about everything and out in the world about Lgbtq and and
00:39:37.550 --> 00:39:39.740 Sandra Bargman | The Edge of Everyday: all of it, and curious, and
00:39:39.860 --> 00:39:43.999 Sandra Bargman | The Edge of Everyday: like a sponge and loving it. And one of my
00:39:44.080 --> 00:39:46.569 Sandra Bargman | The Edge of Everyday: college boyfriends was a black man.
00:39:46.720 --> 00:39:47.589 Rev. Dr. Terrlyn Curry Avery: Hmm.
00:39:47.650 --> 00:39:48.589 Sandra Bargman | The Edge of Everyday: And
00:39:48.930 --> 00:39:49.859 Sandra Bargman | The Edge of Everyday: you know
00:39:50.130 --> 00:39:57.579 Sandra Bargman | The Edge of Everyday: we finally got to a place where I wanted to talk about it at home, and I shared it with my family and my parents and
00:39:58.420 --> 00:40:04.839 Sandra Bargman | The Edge of Everyday: I. My father, takes me out to dinner, and and he calmly, and I had no idea that
00:40:05.090 --> 00:40:12.640 Sandra Bargman | The Edge of Everyday: I know my parents are racist. And this is this is the the the privilege and the entitlement and the blinders.
00:40:12.700 --> 00:40:14.369 Sandra Bargman | The Edge of Everyday: And my father
00:40:14.640 --> 00:40:20.500 Sandra Bargman | The Edge of Everyday: basically threatened to pull his portion of funding for my college education.
00:40:20.570 --> 00:40:23.489 Sandra Bargman | The Edge of Everyday: and I was blown away.
00:40:23.580 --> 00:40:25.819 Sandra Bargman | The Edge of Everyday: I had no idea.
00:40:26.810 --> 00:40:32.450 Sandra Bargman | The Edge of Everyday: you know. Of course, I didn't say anything to him, because you know what. When am I i'm 19 years old, but but
00:40:32.960 --> 00:40:37.130 Sandra Bargman | The Edge of Everyday: I I pushed back, and I because I was so shocked.
00:40:38.030 --> 00:40:43.009 Sandra Bargman | The Edge of Everyday: But that was the first real door opening for me, and
00:40:44.500 --> 00:40:46.129 Sandra Bargman | The Edge of Everyday: you know.
00:40:46.880 --> 00:40:51.800 Sandra Bargman | The Edge of Everyday: Oh, go ahead. Well, no, I was just going to say I didn't step out of the relationship. It took its natural.
00:40:51.950 --> 00:40:53.980 Sandra Bargman | The Edge of Everyday: course, and we ended up
00:40:54.040 --> 00:40:57.909 Sandra Bargman | The Edge of Everyday: breaking up. But you know it was not because of my father.
00:40:58.030 --> 00:41:10.230 Sandra Bargman | The Edge of Everyday: and and this is not to say my father was a horrible human. He was just a product of his times, and not a curious person. Well, I think people are products of their time, and and
00:41:10.670 --> 00:41:22.519 Rev. Dr. Terrlyn Curry Avery: people have to recognize their own prejudices. And so one it's because it's easy kind of to say, Well, this is what's happening now, right? But it's also a need to fit in
00:41:22.550 --> 00:41:23.970 Rev. Dr. Terrlyn Curry Avery: right. I like that.
00:41:24.130 --> 00:41:41.380 Rev. Dr. Terrlyn Curry Avery: but and that my father had that, and I did not. That's what I was just about to say, because I don't want our audience to walk away thinking, Well, it's just what's happening during our time. We we have to be the one. Yes, exactly. We are the we are the ones who are going to say no
00:41:41.390 --> 00:41:50.379 Rev. Dr. Terrlyn Curry Avery: right. And what I have found, particularly when I teach at one of the local colleges. And when we're talking about race and class.
00:41:50.400 --> 00:42:08.079 Rev. Dr. Terrlyn Curry Avery: I have a lot of students because it's predominantly White College, who will talk about never ever having a a white person in their class, never having a white teacher. And then there'll be those students who will say, oh, I can remember when I brought a black friend home.
00:42:08.670 --> 00:42:13.119 Rev. Dr. Terrlyn Curry Avery: and what my parents said, and they they start thinking back on it
00:42:13.190 --> 00:42:22.570 Rev. Dr. Terrlyn Curry Avery: because they just took it as oh, well, my parents, when they would say, Well, what do you guys doing downstairs? Or they would make other statements
00:42:22.930 --> 00:42:33.469 Rev. Dr. Terrlyn Curry Avery: that they would normally say if they were a white friend. And these are the things when people think that they live in this world, and that they are not racist.
00:42:33.550 --> 00:42:44.130 Rev. Dr. Terrlyn Curry Avery: they've really got to start examining. What are your stereotypes? What are your thoughts? How are you? How are you really showing up? Because
00:42:44.820 --> 00:42:58.040 Sandra Bargman | The Edge of Everyday: people will still say, Well, i'm not a racist, even though they don't want their daughter to go out with a black man. Right? Oh, exactly! And I and I invite I I ask all of my friend. Please
00:42:59.290 --> 00:43:28.310 Sandra Bargman | The Edge of Everyday: let me know if I have just said something, or or bring something to my attention that I have somehow had a blinder on. I work very, very hard to understand the course of history to now engage in the you know. Please don't even get me started. We have to go to break about, you know, not teaching the history of right. You know what it's so funny I love when I have another a host on the show we're we're like trying to mind the breaks for
00:43:28.360 --> 00:43:37.200 Rev. Dr. Terrlyn Curry Avery: one another, and we do have to take a break. We are going to be right back to finish up our conversation with Sandra Bardman. We'll be right back.
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00:45:42.190 --> 00:46:02.430 Rev. Dr. Terrlyn Curry Avery: we're back with the dismantle racism show, and you know what I just want to give a shout out to my daughter Ruby, because she selected the music for this show, and my guests are always grooving to the music when we come back from Bre, so I want to just give her a a shout out, and to thank her for being involved in
00:46:02.440 --> 00:46:14.579 Rev. Dr. Terrlyn Curry Avery: my show. Sandra! Let's go back to something for a moment, because before the break, we were talking about being a product of our time, and also the need to understand history.
00:46:14.850 --> 00:46:20.309 Rev. Dr. Terrlyn Curry Avery: and I want us to just take a moment to see how deeply ingrained
00:46:20.790 --> 00:46:35.640 Rev. Dr. Terrlyn Curry Avery: white supremacy is in our language and in our system, and sometimes we don't know you're right. We're a product of it, which is why we have to be curious. So before the break.
00:46:35.650 --> 00:46:41.699 Rev. Dr. Terrlyn Curry Avery: They were at some point before our last in the middle of our last segment. You use the word black sheet.
00:46:42.550 --> 00:46:44.050 Rev. Dr. Terrlyn Curry Avery: and whatever
00:46:44.100 --> 00:46:50.149 Rev. Dr. Terrlyn Curry Avery: Yes, so I was the black sheep of of the
00:46:50.420 --> 00:46:53.610 Rev. Dr. Terrlyn Curry Avery: it's a common thing that we've all used
00:46:53.680 --> 00:47:09.570 Rev. Dr. Terrlyn Curry Avery: because it does me like the we we're we're talking about the one who is different right? But usually we're talking about different, almost in a deviant way. That's how other people see us right? So if we think about, why is it that a black sheep
00:47:09.720 --> 00:47:20.249 Rev. Dr. Terrlyn Curry Avery: is the one that's the deviant one. Oh, for our language is that if you look up in the dictionary, white.
00:47:20.440 --> 00:47:49.310 Rev. Dr. Terrlyn Curry Avery: you will see everything that's related to pure and goodness angelic, and then yes, and if you had, black is Satan, and that so? So what we have to begin to do this These are the simple things we can just say, let me do a teachable moment right here, right? And that's what I want. My guests and my listeners to know. Pay attention to your tapestry. Pay attention to how
00:47:49.320 --> 00:47:59.980 Rev. Dr. Terrlyn Curry Avery: white being right is what's shown in the backdrop of society. Start questioning. I love love that You say curiosity.
00:48:00.440 --> 00:48:02.120 Rev. Dr. Terrlyn Curry Avery: Start questioning. What
00:48:02.460 --> 00:48:09.580 Rev. Dr. Terrlyn Curry Avery: what do we say that? And so it's. It's a little thing, but it's a big thing.
00:48:09.670 --> 00:48:15.279 Rev. Dr. Terrlyn Curry Avery: It's absolutely so. I want to talk about? You know.
00:48:16.000 --> 00:48:32.200 Rev. Dr. Terrlyn Curry Avery: You talked about the words confronting your your family, or your friends about things, and for me I come again. Mine is always from the teachable moment. And of course, when I come I try to come from a place of love.
00:48:32.640 --> 00:48:34.379 Rev. Dr. Terrlyn Curry Avery: Talk to me about
00:48:34.700 --> 00:48:45.910 Sandra Bargman | The Edge of Everyday: How do you engage again? There's you know it's funny. You bring this up because I this is a point I wanted to make. If there's an edge between for me, between
00:48:46.520 --> 00:48:54.760 Sandra Bargman | The Edge of Everyday: how am I confrontational. And how am I doing this in a way that sparks with love and kindness.
00:48:54.890 --> 00:48:57.889 Sandra Bargman | The Edge of Everyday: which is not niceness per se.
00:48:57.930 --> 00:49:05.309 Sandra Bargman | The Edge of Everyday: Kindness and niceness are 2 different things, but in in a way that is expansive.
00:49:05.340 --> 00:49:17.209 Sandra Bargman | The Edge of Everyday: Yes, and is is not cool. I don't want to embarrass. I don't want to, but I also don't. You know I don't want to shy away from it. If it's someone I don't know
00:49:17.260 --> 00:49:28.259 Sandra Bargman | The Edge of Everyday: I don't want to. I want to stand there in my power and say, saying that word is not okay with me, and you know I don't have to be like
00:49:29.220 --> 00:49:37.530 Sandra Bargman | The Edge of Everyday: when I say confrontational, I don't need to be aggressive or cruel, but but I do have to stand in my power.
00:49:37.550 --> 00:49:40.919 Sandra Bargman | The Edge of Everyday: and and even with people in my own life.
00:49:41.140 --> 00:49:44.119 Sandra Bargman | The Edge of Everyday: you know. Now, granted people in my
00:49:44.180 --> 00:49:48.770 Sandra Bargman | The Edge of Everyday: I so many of my family members. I don't speak with a lot anymore.
00:49:49.180 --> 00:49:54.310 Sandra Bargman | The Edge of Everyday: unfortunately, and I rest assured that they would all say that They're not racist, and yet
00:49:55.190 --> 00:49:59.209 Sandra Bargman | The Edge of Everyday: and yet they they are. They are for a regime that
00:49:59.320 --> 00:50:01.229 promotes oppression.
00:50:01.320 --> 00:50:02.610 Rev. Dr. Terrlyn Curry Avery: and they have
00:50:02.720 --> 00:50:07.239 Sandra Bargman | The Edge of Everyday: potentially no idea how they are part of the system, and how they benefit from it.
00:50:07.330 --> 00:50:11.600 Rev. Dr. Terrlyn Curry Avery: And you know, can I just pause just for a second.
00:50:12.400 --> 00:50:30.980 Rev. Dr. Terrlyn Curry Avery: because you just said something that that is deeply profound in the sense of not speaking to your family, because they do X, y, and Z, and that's a fear for a lot of people, and i'm sure there's sadness that comes with that. So what would you tell our listeners? How
00:50:31.030 --> 00:50:33.839 Rev. Dr. Terrlyn Curry Avery: how can our listeners could cope
00:50:33.990 --> 00:50:36.849 Rev. Dr. Terrlyn Curry Avery: with that sadness and fear of losing
00:50:36.940 --> 00:50:39.140 Rev. Dr. Terrlyn Curry Avery: close people.
00:50:39.720 --> 00:50:41.049 Sandra Bargman | The Edge of Everyday: Well, I think
00:50:44.290 --> 00:50:48.400 Sandra Bargman | The Edge of Everyday: Well, it's so much to unpack with it. I I think
00:50:50.440 --> 00:50:52.569 Sandra Bargman | The Edge of Everyday: at the end of the day
00:50:52.760 --> 00:50:55.649 Sandra Bargman | The Edge of Everyday: I always get to.
00:50:57.600 --> 00:51:00.509 Sandra Bargman | The Edge of Everyday: If we are this far apart.
00:51:00.840 --> 00:51:01.629 Hmm.
00:51:02.760 --> 00:51:04.999 Sandra Bargman | The Edge of Everyday: How close have we been?
00:51:05.950 --> 00:51:07.129 Rev. Dr. Terrlyn Curry Avery: Wow!
00:51:07.370 --> 00:51:10.350 Sandra Bargman | The Edge of Everyday: Wow! That I,
00:51:11.590 --> 00:51:16.299 Sandra Bargman | The Edge of Everyday: The heartbreak and the heartache that I feel around
00:51:16.370 --> 00:51:17.839 Sandra Bargman | The Edge of Everyday: human rights.
00:51:18.040 --> 00:51:23.059 Sandra Bargman | The Edge of Everyday: and the willingness to evolve humanity
00:51:23.150 --> 00:51:26.049 Sandra Bargman | The Edge of Everyday: and versus the unwillingness.
00:51:26.070 --> 00:51:27.009 Sandra Bargman | The Edge of Everyday: And
00:51:28.200 --> 00:51:34.250 Sandra Bargman | The Edge of Everyday: And there's also I have experienced in my own family inner circle.
00:51:34.600 --> 00:51:36.959 Sandra Bargman | The Edge of Everyday: There is a contempt
00:51:37.470 --> 00:51:38.810 towards me
00:51:39.090 --> 00:51:42.780 Sandra Bargman | The Edge of Everyday: Hmm. Towards for being the curious one
00:51:44.040 --> 00:51:57.090 Sandra Bargman | The Edge of Everyday: for being the one that says the difficult things. I'm not even challenging someone per se. I'm just saying a big, fat truth that can to our earlier point
00:51:57.250 --> 00:52:01.750 Sandra Bargman | The Edge of Everyday: feel offensive. If you haven't done your internal work
00:52:02.430 --> 00:52:03.799 Sandra Bargman | The Edge of Everyday: so
00:52:05.240 --> 00:52:06.299 Sandra Bargman | The Edge of Everyday: to get
00:52:06.670 --> 00:52:09.460 Sandra Bargman | The Edge of Everyday: dig down into the nitty gritty of it, it's
00:52:09.590 --> 00:52:12.460 Sandra Bargman | The Edge of Everyday: it's a lifestyle that I don't.
00:52:12.920 --> 00:52:16.580 Sandra Bargman | The Edge of Everyday: I I don't feel nourished by.
00:52:16.770 --> 00:52:19.539 Sandra Bargman | The Edge of Everyday: and blood is not thick enough for me.
00:52:19.810 --> 00:52:25.690 Sandra Bargman | The Edge of Everyday: Wow! To to to be a part of that I mean, you know I can stay in touch. But i'm not gonna.
00:52:26.950 --> 00:52:31.140 Sandra Bargman | The Edge of Everyday: And and and and i'm always here. And if you're curious, come to me.
00:52:31.220 --> 00:52:33.919 Sandra Bargman | The Edge of Everyday: Hmm. But i'm not going to lay down.
00:52:34.070 --> 00:52:34.970 Hmm.
00:52:35.170 --> 00:52:37.149 Sandra Bargman | The Edge of Everyday: To make to make you comfortable.
00:52:37.210 --> 00:52:38.779 Rev. Dr. Terrlyn Curry Avery: Right? So
00:52:39.250 --> 00:52:51.500 Rev. Dr. Terrlyn Curry Avery: wow! Seems like like this is such a powerful, you know, part of of this process of dismantling racism. And of course, as you know, we're getting short on time here.
00:52:51.510 --> 00:53:08.069 Rev. Dr. Terrlyn Curry Avery: But what would you tell? What's the inner work, because you've mentioned that several times you've mentioned about other people needing to do their inner work, so they won't be offended. But what is the inner work that you have to do in order to live on the edge of everyday and push them out.
00:53:10.190 --> 00:53:12.860 Sandra Bargman | The Edge of Everyday: Oh, well, I
00:53:17.730 --> 00:53:21.010 Sandra Bargman | The Edge of Everyday: I have to be deeply in alignment with
00:53:23.810 --> 00:53:26.529 Sandra Bargman | The Edge of Everyday: what feels most expansive for everyone.
00:53:26.760 --> 00:53:27.609 Hmm.
00:53:29.220 --> 00:53:30.779 Sandra Bargman | The Edge of Everyday: I cannot
00:53:31.430 --> 00:53:34.800 Sandra Bargman | The Edge of Everyday: claim something by denying someone else
00:53:36.810 --> 00:53:39.150 Sandra Bargman | The Edge of Everyday: and not everyone may feel that way.
00:53:39.480 --> 00:53:41.850 Sandra Bargman | The Edge of Everyday: So my internal work
00:53:41.870 --> 00:53:44.580 Sandra Bargman | The Edge of Everyday: is to always stay true to that.
00:53:45.640 --> 00:53:47.380 Sandra Bargman | The Edge of Everyday: and I have
00:53:47.540 --> 00:53:58.309 Sandra Bargman | The Edge of Everyday: back to our my original story. I've been an Edge Walker my whole life. I felt on the edge of my own family from the time I popped out of the womb.
00:53:58.920 --> 00:54:01.439 Sandra Bargman | The Edge of Everyday: so I have not fit in
00:54:02.680 --> 00:54:03.450 Sandra Bargman | The Edge of Everyday: ever.
00:54:03.630 --> 00:54:04.430 Hmm.
00:54:04.660 --> 00:54:07.970 Sandra Bargman | The Edge of Everyday: So I, My internal work
00:54:08.810 --> 00:54:09.669 Sandra Bargman | The Edge of Everyday: is
00:54:09.830 --> 00:54:13.430 Sandra Bargman | The Edge of Everyday: finding comfort in my relationship.
00:54:13.580 --> 00:54:16.429 Sandra Bargman | The Edge of Everyday: my edge with spirit and humanity.
00:54:16.500 --> 00:54:17.770 Rev. Dr. Terrlyn Curry Avery: Hmm.
00:54:17.940 --> 00:54:24.869 Sandra Bargman | The Edge of Everyday: I cannot look to anyone. I cannot look to my husband at the end of the day. It's my relationship with myself
00:54:24.980 --> 00:54:28.039 Sandra Bargman | The Edge of Everyday: and with spirit as I define it.
00:54:28.190 --> 00:54:29.160 Rev. Dr. Terrlyn Curry Avery: Yeah.
00:54:29.400 --> 00:54:31.230 Rev. Dr. Terrlyn Curry Avery: yeah, thank you.
00:54:32.510 --> 00:54:42.519 Rev. Dr. Terrlyn Curry Avery: Andrew. Thank you for that. Our time has gone much too quickly, and what I hear you saying, and all of this is, be true to yourself.
00:54:42.980 --> 00:54:44.709 Rev. Dr. Terrlyn Curry Avery: Do your work
00:54:45.040 --> 00:54:57.339 Rev. Dr. Terrlyn Curry Avery: so that you're able to walk the edge and live in alignment with, your connectedness with, the the the divine and God of your understanding.
00:54:57.600 --> 00:55:02.619 Rev. Dr. Terrlyn Curry Avery: and with yourself, if you would. I want you to tell folks
00:55:02.630 --> 00:55:25.549 Sandra Bargman | The Edge of Everyday: how they can get in touch with you, and if you could give us just a 30 min, you know. Blessing! I would a 30 min or a 30 s you can find me at Sandra Bargeman, B. A. R. G. M. A. n.com that's my website. I have my Youtube channel is Sandra Bargeman.
00:55:25.560 --> 00:55:35.439 Sandra Bargman | The Edge of Everyday: On the edge of every day you can find clips from my show. You can get it at CD. Baby and Amazon. Com
00:55:36.200 --> 00:55:37.569 Sandra Bargman | The Edge of Everyday: a prayer.
00:55:39.980 --> 00:55:45.310 Sandra Bargman | The Edge of Everyday: you who are as vast as the universe, and you who are as personal as a heartbeat.
00:55:47.790 --> 00:55:49.759 Sandra Bargman | The Edge of Everyday: give me the courage
00:55:54.530 --> 00:55:55.980 to be vulnerable.
00:55:57.650 --> 00:55:59.430 Sandra Bargman | The Edge of Everyday: to always share
00:55:59.490 --> 00:56:01.149 Sandra Bargman | The Edge of Everyday: what's in my heart.
00:56:01.780 --> 00:56:03.539 Sandra Bargman | The Edge of Everyday: even when it's not easy.
00:56:05.100 --> 00:56:09.030 Sandra Bargman | The Edge of Everyday: even when I might be afraid. Let me set down the armor.
00:56:13.540 --> 00:56:14.839 and so it is.
00:56:14.870 --> 00:56:20.560 Rev. Dr. Terrlyn Curry Avery: And so it is. Thank you so much to my guests, Andrew Barchman today, and
00:56:20.600 --> 00:56:30.850 Rev. Dr. Terrlyn Curry Avery: to you and listeners for being here. Please go to Sacred intelligence.com. I'll pick up a copy of my book on Dismantling Racism, check out the courses
00:56:30.860 --> 00:56:41.050 Rev. Dr. Terrlyn Curry Avery: that I am offering, and I also just put out a CD. Of my meditations you can find on itunes, spotify wherever you stream your music at.
00:56:41.340 --> 00:56:45.519 Rev. Dr. Terrlyn Curry Avery: Stay tuned for the conscious consultant hour with Sam Lieber with.
00:56:45.860 --> 00:56:50.470 Rev. Dr. Terrlyn Curry Avery: Be well be safe. Be encouraged until next time. Bye, for now.
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