WHAT WILL THE AUDIENCE LEARN?
Get first-hand accounts of how racist ideals are upheld in places of worship in both subtle and not-so-subtle ways. Learn ways to recognize racism in religious spaces, and how it can compromise individual and communal spirituality.
EPISODE SUMMARY:
There is a long history of abusing religion in order to justify and perpetuate racism and white supremacy. Rev. Dr. TLC will be joined by licensed minister, Stephane Browder to discuss the spiritual and communal effects of racism in places of worship.
Indoctrinated racism in these settings inevitably affects us as spiritual beings. They will discuss the recognizable manifestations of racism in religious spaces. As believers are we really reflecting the divine in the Earth realm? What is the "right" way to exist in these spiritual environments?
Tune in for this important conversation at TalkRadio.nyc
Rev. Dr. TLC is offering a two-day retreat on October 21st -22nd. You can find more information at her website Sacredintelligence.com. She begins her show with a guided meditation. Rev. Dr. TLC shares the benefits of meditation and breathwork. She introduces the topics for today's episode, which focuses on the connection between racism and religion. Before the break, Rev. Dr. TLC welcomed her guest Stephane Browder who is a licensed minister at New Life Christian Church.
Rev. Dr. TLC asks Stephane how her spiritual side helps navigate racism in the world. Stephane says it's important to have a relationship with God in order to understand his people. As she got older, she realized that she could use her relationship with God to help support people. Rev. Dr. TLC tells Stephane of a time she had to use scriptures to keep her grounded in a work environment. Stephane talks about the rituals that she practices to help keep her grounded. Rev. Dr. TLC and Stephane discuss how their church has been inclusive and diverse over the years.
Rev. Dr. TLC and Stephane discuss the history of black spirituality and how, over the years, black people have accepted Christianity as the main focus. Rev. Dr. TLC encourages her listeners to examine why it is difficult to integrate black people's beliefs as a culture. Stephane explains that we are all so different, but God is in each and every one of us; therefore, we must accept that our differences matter. Rev. Dr. TLC encourages her listeners to break out of their norms and experience God in a different light.
Rev. Dr. TLC talks about the way we judge each other by the color of our skin. She adds that if we can see past color, we can open ourselves up to understanding our limited views in the way we see each other. Rev. Dr. TLC encourages her listeners to explore different churches and meet new people from different cultures. Connect with Stephane if you would like to visit a new church by emailing her at betterplanning@live.com
00:17:43.000 --> 00:18:01.000 use my relationship with God to actually cause me, you know, to grow and to to help people in a better way You know a lot of times when we're young we think education is the key you know, as long as I got that information in education and degree, and you know I I can do some things But what I
00:18:01.000 --> 00:18:02.000 learned is that even that was not enough to help circumvent some really strenuous issues that I was having just in terms of my my work relationship.
00:18:02.000 --> 00:18:14.000 alright.
00:18:14.000 --> 00:18:18.000 And not just how about this? Not even with the clients or the individual families, but the people I work with.
00:18:18.000 --> 00:18:21.000 Okay.
00:18:21.000 --> 00:18:22.000 Yeah.
00:18:22.000 --> 00:18:27.000 Very bad. You guys about like we know when we're working with the clients.
00:18:27.000 --> 00:18:28.000 We know they are coming with their stuff, and that our job to help them navigate the world.
00:18:28.000 --> 00:18:34.000 Yes, yeah.
00:18:34.000 --> 00:18:39.000 But then, when you got people pushing against you like, Lor, so I have to tell you.
00:18:39.000 --> 00:18:40.000 I have to tell you. There's something that happens to me the back of the day when I when I worked with the department, and I just remember there was so much stuff happening with the department.
00:18:40.000 --> 00:18:50.000 Come now.
00:18:50.000 --> 00:18:55.000 I literally. I had to go to a meeting one day, armed with my Scriptures.
00:18:55.000 --> 00:18:56.000 They wrote them down on paper, so that something happened in this meeting, because it was like a big meeting.
00:18:56.000 --> 00:19:05.000 Wow, What? Yeah.
00:19:05.000 --> 00:19:06.000 Yes, come on, not mine. Come on! Yes, that's it.
00:19:06.000 --> 00:19:14.000 I just would flip up the page. Look at my Scriptures and it around me, and for me, me, one of who I am, Who?
00:19:14.000 --> 00:19:15.000 Okay, yeah, it is. And who was covering? Who had about that?
00:19:15.000 --> 00:19:28.000 And who's you? I That's it. Come on, Yeah, yeah.
00:19:28.000 --> 00:19:34.000 Exactly.
00:19:34.000 --> 00:19:35.000 Right? That's the key. And I think I think that that's what helped me to understand is that you know, I realize, and you know Scriptures talk about that.
00:19:35.000 --> 00:19:48.000 Right that all of these people right at the time. I don't know if I was thinking about all these people were also God had their back to but I I definitely knew who at my back any change the tone and the flavor because my attitude was different
00:19:48.000 --> 00:19:57.000 good alright. But what? But you know it's so interesting which this is.
00:19:57.000 --> 00:20:01.000 Why I start out, I whether it's this radio show.
00:20:01.000 --> 00:20:02.000 When I start each of my classes, I start out in a meditative place.
00:20:02.000 --> 00:20:06.000 You, know, Paul always talked about how we really should be okay when trouble finds us, you know that means something, but it don't make me feel good. To Read that. I don't want to hear that Paul
00:20:06.000 --> 00:20:07.000 I love it
00:20:07.000 --> 00:20:11.000 It is not so much to try to crosslytize people to believe what I believe.
00:20:11.000 --> 00:20:12.000 Say, look, ground yourself in who and are for me, who we are, is is directly tied.
00:20:12.000 --> 00:20:19.000 Come. That's it. It's believe. Yes, yeah.
00:20:19.000 --> 00:20:27.000 I don't wanna do this because I think God is everywhere and in here, but who we are is directly tied to our sacred source.
00:20:27.000 --> 00:20:28.000 That's why it's important for me. Each, E.
00:20:28.000 --> 00:20:30.000 Yeah.
00:20:30.000 --> 00:20:34.000 You know most of my guests, I'll say, what's your sacred practice?
00:20:34.000 --> 00:20:39.000 Yes.
00:20:39.000 --> 00:20:40.000 That's that is that listen to to walk, just to have the privilege to be able to walk is one thing, and then, for you to exercise that privilege by walking.
00:20:40.000 --> 00:20:48.000 And it could be but some people could be going for walk on boardwalk
00:20:48.000 --> 00:20:59.000 The yeah.
00:20:59.000 --> 00:21:00.000 Hmm.
00:21:00.000 --> 00:21:05.000 Listen! God honors that you know, and I think that what I have learned over these years is that some of the stuff that I learned about young in church is not necessarily the things that God looks at in me as an individual and that also helps me to remain grounded every morning since I've.
00:21:05.000 --> 00:21:11.000 Yeah.
00:21:11.000 --> 00:21:15.000 Retired Oh, did I mention I was retired. Let me just say that.
00:21:15.000 --> 00:21:16.000 That's it. Everybody.
00:21:16.000 --> 00:21:21.000 Yes. Well, Cargo retired, because we know that when you retire you get busy doing others
00:21:21.000 --> 00:21:23.000 And I. But it's it's my choice now.
00:21:23.000 --> 00:21:24.000 And so now I recognize that in this time of retirement God has been just kind of pushing my spirit to wake up like it to a clock in the morning, and and I'm energized, I want to have conversation with him you know, kind of run through the day of what has happened you know
00:21:24.000 --> 00:21:39.000 That's right.
00:21:39.000 --> 00:21:42.000 just to be able to bless them. I mean, this is my own personal time.
00:21:42.000 --> 00:21:51.000 Then I still have time in the morning. I do not, you know, start my day without I have my own, ritual.
00:21:51.000 --> 00:22:10.000 If you will. That is specific to me. And when that's how you, that it has helped me so much to remain grounded, and and it it helps me to to to be able to to cover with, people and even to pick up energy from people that you know you I probably wouldn't have paid any attention to because
00:22:10.000 --> 00:22:12.000 my mind is going here and there, and all over the place.
00:22:12.000 --> 00:22:21.000 And what do I gotta do now? I'm I'm I'm more, I'm more present, you know, because of how I'm doing things differently.
00:22:21.000 --> 00:22:25.000 Even after a time, and not always been a praying person. That's that's never not been there.
00:22:25.000 --> 00:22:28.000 But there's different levels of it for me right now.
00:22:28.000 --> 00:22:38.000 And so I I really am beginning to understand and appreciate that God appreciates me.
00:22:38.000 --> 00:22:39.000 He appreciates me, and I don't think that I really understood that before, and because I know he appreciates me.
00:22:39.000 --> 00:22:45.000 Oh, hey! Man!
00:22:45.000 --> 00:22:51.000 He He wants me to appreciate his people. That's the key.
00:22:51.000 --> 00:22:58.000 And so when we talk about racism. Now, mind you, you were talking about how you know our churches.
00:22:58.000 --> 00:22:59.000 You know we we find it convenient because they're in our neighborhood.
00:22:59.000 --> 00:23:03.000 That's right. That's right.
00:23:03.000 --> 00:23:05.000 I drive across the bridge to get to that church
00:23:05.000 --> 00:23:10.000 Well, well, well, wait a minute, and I drive an hour and 15 min to pass them.
00:23:10.000 --> 00:23:31.000 Yeah. George: right?
00:23:31.000 --> 00:23:32.000 That's it. And that's exactly what I drive across the bridge, and it's and and let me just say that my church has been.
00:23:32.000 --> 00:23:39.000 You know it's interesting, though. So let's get into that, because even people who drive across the bridge or who drive 45 min to be in a church service. They Often connect with the people who look like them
00:23:39.000 --> 00:23:43.000 You know, over the years known to be. I love that word eclectic, I mean, we've had Latina.
00:23:43.000 --> 00:23:46.000 Hmm.
00:23:46.000 --> 00:23:52.000 We have had persons who are from the native American tribe.
00:23:52.000 --> 00:24:08.000 We've had persons, of course, who are black and brown, I mean we've we've had people from Africa, I mean, we've had a host of different people who joined our church.
00:24:08.000 --> 00:24:09.000 Good.
00:24:09.000 --> 00:24:27.000 And we all celebrate God together. Now I will say that I, a new life is known, for that, you know, for having different cultures in their church.
00:24:27.000 --> 00:24:28.000 Right.
00:24:28.000 --> 00:24:30.000 But what drew me was because I was the familiar with the way that they have church, and how I grew up as an African American female; and even though I grew up Baptist guess what they are not denominational but they still fit, confident
00:24:30.000 --> 00:24:36.000 Right? Well, so interesting cause. Let's talk about this. This idea of how we grow up right?
00:24:36.000 --> 00:24:45.000 Okay.
00:24:45.000 --> 00:24:46.000 Yes, yeah.
00:24:46.000 --> 00:24:50.000 So it's interesting that there there are often stark differences in the ways in which white people worship in the ways, and we little color now that also depends on the denomination because it to a white evangelical or panel costs will charge.
00:24:50.000 --> 00:24:54.000 Absolutely.
00:24:54.000 --> 00:24:56.000 They they get their praise on in those churches.
00:24:56.000 --> 00:24:58.000 Absolutely.
00:24:58.000 --> 00:25:06.000 But is so interesting because often people are free to experience something different.
00:25:06.000 --> 00:25:07.000 So, you know, and you have also, and I maybe have said this on the show as a Presbyterian.
00:25:07.000 --> 00:25:12.000 Yeah.
00:25:12.000 --> 00:25:15.000 It's a predominantly white denomination.
00:25:15.000 --> 00:25:16.000 Pastured my churches, and I pastured black churches.
00:25:16.000 --> 00:25:20.000 It is, Yeah.
00:25:20.000 --> 00:25:22.000 It's completely different. No, I my my first church, I pastor, was a multicultural church, predominantly of African descent, but they were people who were Guy Andese Or from Sierra Leone and I did have a couple of Italian some Dutch people like but but some
00:25:22.000 --> 00:25:42.000 Totally
00:25:42.000 --> 00:25:51.000 of those places where High Church people And so when we talk about High Church, because Presbyterianism, we can be a little bit stoic.
00:25:51.000 --> 00:25:52.000 No, Oh, that's the quote that was it. I will tell you. In the church I, pastor, is definitely not frozen, chosen, but but that particular church the first church I passed through it probably isn't as easy as the church that I pass right now.
00:25:52.000 --> 00:26:06.000 No, not really.
00:26:06.000 --> 00:26:16.000 So there is university across denominations, but by and large most of the white churches that I have been in.
00:26:16.000 --> 00:26:22.000 If I'm preaching, my preaching is also different, and if I say the word, could say a man.
00:26:22.000 --> 00:26:26.000 I was told once by this one password, Did you know you scared them?
00:26:26.000 --> 00:26:35.000 yeah, I'm like, Lord, And so talk to about your experiences.
00:26:35.000 --> 00:26:36.000 We've seen churches collaborate or seeing people enter into those spaces where they can celebrate one another's ways of just understanding.
00:26:36.000 --> 00:26:47.000 Yes.
00:26:47.000 --> 00:26:57.000 I think that for me, growing up, as you know, in a Baptist church, I I went all my life to a Catholic school, and so it was mandatory that you you know you attend services.
00:26:57.000 --> 00:26:58.000 You take religion, and of course I believe that God set me up at a young age, so that I would always be open to what would be different.
00:26:58.000 --> 00:27:10.000 God
00:27:10.000 --> 00:27:17.000 Than what I was used to. Now I I attend by 10 Baptist churches, because it's comfortable for me, and I didn't understand how to come out of that comfort zone, and I think that is always an issue for people not visiting or fellow shipping on sundays or otherwise, in
00:27:17.000 --> 00:27:32.000 Oh!
00:27:32.000 --> 00:27:33.000 Yeah.
00:27:33.000 --> 00:27:38.000 other. You know church events with, you know, other different types of religions, because if you don't know how comfort you comfortable, you're gonna be.
00:27:38.000 --> 00:27:53.000 And so one of the things I recognize that even in in terms of being in a Baptist church is with a little bit of a pinocchio flare, if you will, that I noticed that when some of those people I would we would go to other Churches that might not be as the monstrous as we
00:27:53.000 --> 00:28:02.000 are those people would be so uncomfortable that they felt that they needed to sit in the chairs and say Hallelujah!
00:28:02.000 --> 00:28:03.000 Yeah.
00:28:03.000 --> 00:28:05.000 You know in, or because that's how they were used to praising, even though the church there it is very quiet Oh, they don't know how to praise, you know, so I need I need to be the loud voice when in actuality a lot of times when i've gone into churches and it's
00:28:05.000 --> 00:28:15.000 Alright, right!
00:28:15.000 --> 00:28:20.000 been quiet. People really are absorbing. What? What is being said, what is being felt in the atmosphere.
00:28:20.000 --> 00:28:22.000 That's correct.
00:28:22.000 --> 00:28:26.000 It's because it is not part of their norm to actually express it in such a way.
00:28:26.000 --> 00:28:29.000 hmm.
00:28:29.000 --> 00:28:42.000 And so I've learned I've I've learned that when I go into certain atmospheres I I think it was Paul that says that you know if your brother don't eat me, don't you keep me and so I've learned that I can that God has allowed me to be all things
00:28:42.000 --> 00:28:43.000 to all people. Now that does not take away from who I am, and what I believe.
00:28:43.000 --> 00:28:48.000 That's right. Right. That's right.
00:28:48.000 --> 00:28:49.000 So I okay, that's right. That's right. And and and and we we have to do take a break.
00:28:49.000 --> 00:28:55.000 But how? How are it pressing
00:28:55.000 --> 00:29:05.000 But come back. I want to continue this conversation because it is important for us to know that God can speak to us through multiple ways.
00:29:05.000 --> 00:29:06.000 And it's also important that we figure out whether we're missing out on something by being so.
00:29:06.000 --> 00:29:14.000 Okay.
00:29:14.000 --> 00:29:20.000 You know. Never mind it but we're gonna be right back to continue our discussion with Stephanie Browder.
00:29:20.000 --> 00:29:27.000 This is the dismantle racism show. I'm your host suburban, Dr.
00:29:27.000 --> 00:29:32.000 Are you passionate about the conversation around racism? Hi! I'm Reverend Dr.
00:29:32.000 --> 00:29:37.000 Tlc. Host of the dismantle racism show which airs every Thursday at 11 Am.
00:29:37.000 --> 00:29:57.000 Eastern on top. Radio. Dot Vincent join me and my amazing guest as we discussed ways to uncover this mantle. And Eradicate racism. That's Thursdays at 11 o'clock a M on top radio.in Yc Okay.
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00:31:26.000 --> 00:31:32.000 we're back with my guest today. Stephanie Browder, and we've been talking about religion and racism.
00:31:32.000 --> 00:31:40.000 And something. I want to just go a little bit deeper, you know.
00:31:40.000 --> 00:32:00.000 So one of the ways in which and I can. I can say this, coming from a tradition where we tend to be a little bit, or stoic, or we might be choir in the ways in which we worship some some right because i've gone into some black presentation, churches where we are
00:32:00.000 --> 00:32:07.000 just still like by churches, and people will look around if you say a man.
00:32:07.000 --> 00:32:19.000 One of the things that's interesting to me is that culturally, as a people, as African people, we we had religion before.
00:32:19.000 --> 00:32:22.000 It was The colonizers came in. The missionary. Come in.
00:32:22.000 --> 00:32:33.000 absolutely. That's right spirit. Yes.
00:32:33.000 --> 00:32:38.000 Oh, I love it! Yes.
00:32:38.000 --> 00:32:39.000 Yes.
00:32:39.000 --> 00:32:44.000 It's I ways in which I see race showing up is when we completely just throw our stuff out window and say we have to believe in this religion, and we have to believe in it in the ways in which the colonizers taught us and so we know historically, that when we have been 2 expressive the
00:32:44.000 --> 00:32:50.000 Yes.
00:32:50.000 --> 00:32:53.000 columnizers had something to say about that we know for native Americans.
00:32:53.000 --> 00:33:04.000 Yeah.
00:33:04.000 --> 00:33:05.000 Yeah.
00:33:05.000 --> 00:33:08.000 They would take them to their schools, and they would cut their hairs, and they their hair, and they would actually call them savages right in the same way They've done that with people of african descent.
00:33:08.000 --> 00:33:15.000 And so I think that there's a bit of that's still going on sometimes, and I'm again.
00:33:15.000 --> 00:33:19.000 I don't want any listener to think that we have to poop and holler and do all of that.
00:33:19.000 --> 00:33:20.000 That's not what I'm saying. If that's what you do.
00:33:20.000 --> 00:33:21.000 Yes.
00:33:21.000 --> 00:33:29.000 That's fine. It's definitely once said to me, God is the click that, and and and so got can show up, however, got chooses to right.
00:33:29.000 --> 00:33:30.000 Yes.
00:33:30.000 --> 00:33:34.000 But I do think that there's a place for us as people of color to examine our own ways in which we have in in in which we have just accept it.
00:33:34.000 --> 00:33:47.000 Yes.
00:33:47.000 --> 00:33:53.000 We've accepted this this religion of Christianity without questioning anything.
00:33:53.000 --> 00:33:54.000 Right, right.
00:33:54.000 --> 00:34:02.000 You know, I I think about years ago, when you go into People's Home, especially black people, So we're always gonna have a white up there, right?
00:34:02.000 --> 00:34:03.000 You know also I There's this place where we really need to examine.
00:34:03.000 --> 00:34:13.000 By Christ. Oh, wait, yeah, yes.
00:34:13.000 --> 00:34:14.000 Hmm.
00:34:14.000 --> 00:34:19.000 Why is so difficult for us to integrate our own beliefs as a culture?
00:34:19.000 --> 00:34:20.000 And why is so difficult even for other cultures, or like a white culture?
00:34:20.000 --> 00:34:29.000 Yes.
00:34:29.000 --> 00:34:30.000 This, and not that.
00:34:30.000 --> 00:34:34.000 They say, well, only experience God if I'm doing this, getting quite as opposed to understanding that the Spirit of God might move you do something else right?
00:34:34.000 --> 00:34:38.000 Yeah.
00:34:38.000 --> 00:34:39.000 Now one thing I just kind of want to put out there we that we have talked about, even amongst ourselves, is that God is so big that He expresses himself differently in every single person.
00:34:39.000 --> 00:34:53.000 So What are your thoughts about that
00:34:53.000 --> 00:34:58.000 How because I don't look like you. But God made you.
00:34:58.000 --> 00:35:21.000 I I don't talk like someone else, and yet, you know, even our fingerprints, every single person that lives or is going to live has a different fingerprint, and God is in, that so if God is so big that He can show up differently in all of us as a creation then we
00:35:21.000 --> 00:35:29.000 have to. We have to somehow be able to understand and to accept the fact that are too much.
00:35:29.000 --> 00:35:30.000 You know I I I struggle when people say, Oh, you know I don't see color you.
00:35:30.000 --> 00:35:32.000 Yeah.
00:35:32.000 --> 00:35:35.000 I you better see my color. I I need you to see them, cause I'm beautiful, you know.
00:35:35.000 --> 00:35:37.000 Great! Well, well.
00:35:37.000 --> 00:35:57.000 God made me like this. I It's a wonderful thing that I look the way I do, and and at the same time I need to accept where you are.
00:35:57.000 --> 00:35:58.000 Yeah.
00:35:58.000 --> 00:36:01.000 And so, even as a culture of African-americans in times of in the people of color, and how we come to church, how we just refuse to look, beyond what's right In front, of us, because that is how we have been trained that is how we have been even
00:36:01.000 --> 00:36:07.000 Yeah.
00:36:07.000 --> 00:36:13.000 even even spoken to in church, my leadership to remain them.
00:36:13.000 --> 00:36:14.000 You are not safe, sanctified, and filled the Holy Ghost.
00:36:14.000 --> 00:36:15.000 That's right. That's right.
00:36:15.000 --> 00:36:17.000 If you don't respond this way, it is not so, and and here's the deal.
00:36:17.000 --> 00:36:21.000 Right? Right? That's it.
00:36:21.000 --> 00:36:27.000 Tell you as a Baptist everything that I learned growing up was because the the said it from the pool pit.
00:36:27.000 --> 00:36:28.000 It wasn't until I got older. Now mind you, going to a Catholic school, I had to take religion.
00:36:28.000 --> 00:36:36.000 Right.
00:36:36.000 --> 00:36:41.000 That's right.
00:36:41.000 --> 00:36:42.000 Well, and and in in the same, thing in the calendar.
00:36:42.000 --> 00:36:47.000 I had to learn what they learned, but I would dismiss what they taught me, because only what the preachers say was really what the word got with was it.
00:36:47.000 --> 00:36:48.000 Only only what they
00:36:48.000 --> 00:36:50.000 So to. Yeah, remember, couldn't take communion because they work out right.
00:36:50.000 --> 00:36:54.000 Yes, we did That's what they told me. It wasn't until that.
00:36:54.000 --> 00:37:05.000 I'm sorry it wasn't until I really came into the mentorship of Cassada Bunkley, and how to open my mind.
00:37:05.000 --> 00:37:10.000 She told me that when she was young she would go to church, and I hope she does. I'm sure she won't mind me.
00:37:10.000 --> 00:37:11.000 Saying This Well, she would go to church after the preacher preach.
00:37:11.000 --> 00:37:13.000 And so the
00:37:13.000 --> 00:37:16.000 She would go home, and she would read the Bible for herself, said, Oh, my goodness, that's what that's when God begins to have relationship with you, and gives you revelation so that you can then understand what the word.
00:37:16.000 --> 00:37:24.000 That's right.
00:37:24.000 --> 00:37:27.000 Of God is saying to you.
00:37:27.000 --> 00:37:44.000 Exactly, now. So here's something I'm gonna say, which a lot of people are not going to like, but I say it to my members, and I'm gonna say it here, too, if you think about it, if you think about the Bible is actually a Separatist religion to begin with because it starts out with.
00:37:44.000 --> 00:37:45.000 like, okay, these people over here that I love these people over here. I don't.
00:37:45.000 --> 00:37:48.000 Yeah.
00:37:48.000 --> 00:37:53.000 And there are people who write about the God of the oppressed.
00:37:53.000 --> 00:37:54.000 There are people who write about. Well, where was God for those people who were defeated in battle?
00:37:54.000 --> 00:37:58.000 Then
00:37:58.000 --> 00:38:02.000 You see, and if we only think about God in those ways that the you gotta believe it this way, cause this is who God is gonna favor.
00:38:02.000 --> 00:38:07.000 Yeah.
00:38:07.000 --> 00:38:09.000 It keeps us separated. But that's definitely I want to draws back to like, when we think about what happens on the day to day, and we're talking let's say we we talk about white churches versus churches of color what it has been some of the things that you've witnessed in terms.
00:38:09.000 --> 00:38:28.000 Separated.
00:38:28.000 --> 00:38:46.000 Okay, I I I have heard through certain organizations that when people have tried to bring these churches together, that certain churches are uncomfortable with the way, let me just use this as an example that certain white churches would be uncomfortable with certain.
00:38:46.000 --> 00:38:47.000 Black churches, because of how demonstrative they are. Oh, yeah, they preach too long, or they yell when they are praying.
00:38:47.000 --> 00:38:53.000 Of how racism shows
00:38:53.000 --> 00:39:01.000 And you know, basically it doesn't take all that rather than coming from a place of this is different for me.
00:39:01.000 --> 00:39:02.000 And so even though it's different from me now, yet we believe in the same Bible.
00:39:02.000 --> 00:39:11.000 Hmm.
00:39:11.000 --> 00:39:12.000 I wanna
00:39:12.000 --> 00:39:24.000 We believe in the same doctor of that Bible, but because you express it differently, I can't really be in your church, or I can't really be in your in in in your in your space and that is is one of the reasons why God has said to me and given me the vision for the community street
00:39:24.000 --> 00:39:28.000 ministry. What he said to me a beyond anything else.
00:39:28.000 --> 00:39:30.000 Was Stephanie I've given you the vision.
00:39:30.000 --> 00:39:35.000 You wrote it down, but the people have to have a mind to work.
00:39:35.000 --> 00:39:36.000 Right.
00:39:36.000 --> 00:39:39.000 This is not about you. So anything that you do it must include everybody coming together.
00:39:39.000 --> 00:39:45.000 So, even the idea about the community tip revival, which we did a couple of weeks ago.
00:39:45.000 --> 00:39:51.000 It was. It was a collaboration of Listen, Bring to the table what you think needs to happen.
00:39:51.000 --> 00:40:06.000 Thing that was even more important is that God said with this community tent revival when you go out, because our main mission is to go into the Walmart parking lots to stand on the streets to Go into the parks to feed the hungry, to go into you know these different places to to go get
00:40:06.000 --> 00:40:10.000 people, and bring them, instead of waiting for people to come to church.
00:40:10.000 --> 00:40:11.000 So we ask for one volunteer from every single church that to join us monthly and evangelize.
00:40:11.000 --> 00:40:17.000 That's right. That's true.
00:40:17.000 --> 00:40:24.000 And God said, Listen, when you go and evangelize every church that's represented must bring something.
00:40:24.000 --> 00:40:33.000 A pamphlet must bring a card, must bring something that represents their church, because when you pray for someone, you cannot evangelize.
00:40:33.000 --> 00:40:48.000 Tell them that God loves them, and then just leave them out there.
00:40:48.000 --> 00:40:49.000 Yes, right
00:40:49.000 --> 00:40:57.000 This now is a two-edged way of you, now inviting someone to your church, and also leaving them with the hope that whenever they're ready, to join, they have something in their hands
00:40:57.000 --> 00:41:01.000 And I can show how about that How about I have a If you were homeless?
00:41:01.000 --> 00:41:05.000 I'm telling the community tent revival in that park was phenomenal.
00:41:05.000 --> 00:41:10.000 People that have more than one person come to them from different churches.
00:41:10.000 --> 00:41:11.000 They felt so special. God, you love me Enough that this person's inviting me to the party, this person's inviting me to the party.
00:41:11.000 --> 00:41:18.000 And people. Then they they come, and they see that there are multiple ways of worshiping, and so
00:41:18.000 --> 00:41:20.000 This person's invited, and they're from different places.
00:41:20.000 --> 00:41:21.000 So let me ask you, when when you brought this group together, did you?
00:41:21.000 --> 00:41:27.000 How special.
00:41:27.000 --> 00:41:28.000 Absolutely so now, even though. And let me say this so. The Church. This is so funny because the churches that came I cannot even say they are totally white.
00:41:28.000 --> 00:41:37.000 Have we 8 churches coming together? Did
00:41:37.000 --> 00:41:38.000 Hmm.
00:41:38.000 --> 00:41:45.000 How about that? Will tell you that some of them have pastors who are white, but they're congregation also.
00:41:45.000 --> 00:41:46.000 Have people, of color.
00:41:46.000 --> 00:41:54.000 Hello, okay? Yeah. Yeah. Yeah.
00:41:54.000 --> 00:41:55.000 so So here's the interesting thing, and that's where we see the racism shows up when we don't understand how racism is permeated.
00:41:55.000 --> 00:42:05.000 So, so so that now the churches that I've reached out to that were just white, have not heard that response yet.
00:42:05.000 --> 00:42:21.000 It. It. What we do is we can't see how it keeps us from reaching out to the other, because I imagine that all those searches even the ones that are predominantly white, because this we all have some information pews that failed.
00:42:21.000 --> 00:42:22.000 So, that's another conversation. So why not come out to this also?
00:42:22.000 --> 00:42:27.000 Come on! Come on.
00:42:27.000 --> 00:42:36.000 What we have to understand is that there's there's a socioeconomic thing in here as well, like a lot of people don't know anything about a revival, and they're, like, why would I come for the people who are going to be there what's the expectation are you expecting
00:42:36.000 --> 00:42:41.000 Right, right.
00:42:41.000 --> 00:42:45.000 that is only gonna be people of color there. Well, we need to reach out, because, look you and I both know for a while I attended another church.
00:42:45.000 --> 00:42:52.000 That's it
00:42:52.000 --> 00:42:53.000 Yes.
00:42:53.000 --> 00:43:01.000 That you attended, and and it was very spirited. Let me for about 2 or 3 years, and that would not.
00:43:01.000 --> 00:43:02.000 We have a conversation with you where I said, You know what's happening. This is right.
00:43:02.000 --> 00:43:07.000 Yes.
00:43:07.000 --> 00:43:08.000 Yeah, I remember.
00:43:08.000 --> 00:43:12.000 Here is a lot for me like. If you said you said, that's why God is eclectic.
00:43:12.000 --> 00:43:17.000 And then I did up going to a predominantly white church, because it was more of the truth.
00:43:17.000 --> 00:43:18.000 Addition that I was used to, and so a white church never knows whether even a black person is going to come to your church and try to go.
00:43:18.000 --> 00:43:26.000 Absolutely.
00:43:26.000 --> 00:43:30.000 Hallelujah! Blah blah blah! No, no!
00:43:30.000 --> 00:43:39.000 That's great.
00:43:39.000 --> 00:43:40.000 Yes.
00:43:40.000 --> 00:43:43.000 But what what what I will say is for everyone out there to don't allow the ways in which you worship keep you from experiencing God in another way.
00:43:43.000 --> 00:43:49.000 Absolutely.
00:43:49.000 --> 00:43:53.000 Yes.
00:43:53.000 --> 00:43:54.000 Yes.
00:43:54.000 --> 00:44:00.000 It's gonna change you to that way for ever. But there is the freedom being able to say, I can experience God in different ways, and when we are so focused it has to be my color.
00:44:00.000 --> 00:44:07.000 My my culture. We miss out, we miss, or my denomination exactly.
00:44:07.000 --> 00:44:08.000 we miss out on the ways in which we can bless another neighborhood.
00:44:08.000 --> 00:44:14.000 Yes, yes, or my denomination. You miss out
00:44:14.000 --> 00:44:16.000 You know, you know. Look this
00:44:16.000 --> 00:44:20.000 And how? How about how about we miss out on how big God is?
00:44:20.000 --> 00:44:29.000 Exactly. Exactly. Okay, Have a church that collaborates with us even for mission.
00:44:29.000 --> 00:44:33.000 They They they collaborated because they. This is one of the things they do, they said.
00:44:33.000 --> 00:44:38.000 We know our community is different, and there's a need in your community.
00:44:38.000 --> 00:44:39.000 And so, while we are not physically there with you, we want to put C money into your church, and then we want to talk about.
00:44:39.000 --> 00:44:45.000 How about that? We narrow weekend down
00:44:45.000 --> 00:44:47.000 You know the ways in which you know you all. Are being a Matthew 25 church right being in the hungry boat.
00:44:47.000 --> 00:44:51.000 Awesome.
00:44:51.000 --> 00:44:58.000 What. So it took them, though reaching across the line to say, Look, this is something we need to do now.
00:44:58.000 --> 00:45:06.000 Mind you, it's about more than just putting money out there, cause I talk about that I'll find these people who just throw money. But they're wanting to know how's it coming.
00:45:06.000 --> 00:45:07.000 What are you doing? They're excited about it because it helps them with their ministry as well.
00:45:07.000 --> 00:45:12.000 Yes.
00:45:12.000 --> 00:45:13.000 Yeah, okay.
00:45:13.000 --> 00:45:24.000 C. Now broadcasting for 20 a day
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00:46:49.000 --> 00:47:19.000 You're listening to, and Yc. Www. Like radio dot and see broadcasting 20 more hours a day
00:47:20.000 --> 00:47:23.000 we're back with my guest today, Stephanie Browder.
00:47:23.000 --> 00:47:34.000 We have been talking about religion and racism, and really we miss out when we do not call the color fine.
00:47:34.000 --> 00:47:48.000 We miss out on different ways as we've talked about of experiencing God, different ways of understanding that and different ways in which we can manifest God.
00:47:48.000 --> 00:48:02.000 To people. Look across the color line So I'm wondering, Stephanie, as we as we kind of think about our our hesitation for doing so, oh, I want to go back to something before I ask you this question.
00:48:02.000 --> 00:48:03.000 You know, we we talked about how sometimes we can be very spirited in the the ways in which we worship God, and what it reminded me of was how they're oftentimes that work people will.
00:48:03.000 --> 00:48:22.000 okay, sure.
00:48:22.000 --> 00:48:23.000 Hmm! That's good.
00:48:23.000 --> 00:48:26.000 I think that when people of color are expressive that we're angry, we were to come to church and see how we worship.
00:48:26.000 --> 00:48:37.000 Yes, yes.
00:48:37.000 --> 00:48:38.000 Yeah.
00:48:38.000 --> 00:48:41.000 You know, we just expressive times when I might be pretty preaching, and I'm expressive, and it just could be the spirit within that absolutely has taken over because I've allowed it to happen see when I preach in white churches I actually remind myself to contain it because they do the exaggerate your
00:48:41.000 --> 00:48:49.000 Yeah, alright.
00:48:49.000 --> 00:48:50.000 yes.
00:48:50.000 --> 00:48:53.000 audience, to be able to speak in a way that people can hear.
00:48:53.000 --> 00:48:58.000 So the spirit might move me differently in those spaces, because I know that there's a message.
00:48:58.000 --> 00:49:15.000 That I have to carry out. But the point that I was trying to make is is if cross the color line and we see how people show up, we see how we talk to one another right because there are times when people will think that we're angry because they see Us.
00:49:15.000 --> 00:49:16.000 Talking to each other, in a very exciting way, and we're not.
00:49:16.000 --> 00:49:20.000 Hmm.
00:49:20.000 --> 00:49:21.000 Absolutely.
00:49:21.000 --> 00:49:41.000 And oh, we're just expressing differently. So I think that what happens is that when we can plus that column line, it opens us up to on understand our limited views of the ways in which we think each other and helps us is people, of color when we cross that line to be able to
00:49:41.000 --> 00:49:42.000 say, when I'm talking about someone, and they're not expressing much.
00:49:42.000 --> 00:49:46.000 Absolutely.
00:49:46.000 --> 00:49:50.000 It's doesn't mean that they aren't involved or listening.
00:49:50.000 --> 00:49:55.000 Yeah, right. And so I think it. It helps to dismantle in that way.
00:49:55.000 --> 00:49:56.000 But my question for you is, What do you think that we could do to help heal this separation that we see in churches, or to bring people together?
00:49:56.000 --> 00:50:12.000 Right, oh, and absorbing right
00:50:12.000 --> 00:50:35.000 Well, first and foremost, I think that we have to be willing and available to show up, and what I mean by that is, you started us off talking about being grounded when when you show up with a lot of different stuff in your mind about it how something is going to be doesn't that.
00:50:35.000 --> 00:50:36.000 Make you anxious and nervous, and so I have found that when we make ourselves available this is so funny.
00:50:36.000 --> 00:50:43.000 Do you have any ideas for us
00:50:43.000 --> 00:50:50.000 Can I just tell you this word metron. It just keeps coming around, and it means your sphere of influence.
00:50:50.000 --> 00:51:11.000 Now when you, when you open yourself up, and and your your intentional intentional about showing up as what God has called you to be, you call people into your metron, into your sphere, of influence Now, what happens as result of that is people that you never thought that would ask you can you would you like coming to
00:51:11.000 --> 00:51:17.000 this church event with me. Would you? Would you like to? Would you like to join me in church?
00:51:17.000 --> 00:51:20.000 People will start to do that because you have now presented yourself as being open.
00:51:20.000 --> 00:51:24.000 Hmm.
00:51:24.000 --> 00:51:28.000 You have now presented yourself as being available to hear from a different perspective. Why?
00:51:28.000 --> 00:51:30.000 Hmm.
00:51:30.000 --> 00:51:33.000 Because you You're intentional. Now. You're you're you're showing up.
00:51:33.000 --> 00:51:36.000 Hmm.
00:51:36.000 --> 00:51:37.000 Hmm.
00:51:37.000 --> 00:51:47.000 You're on purpose to what God has called you to be, and guess what you now open up doors, avenues for people to feel comfortable to say, Join me, and when you show up, and when you go.
00:51:47.000 --> 00:51:56.000 Guess what? Take that same, that same thought process with you to be available that no matter how different this seems to be I am not going to be anxious.
00:51:56.000 --> 00:51:57.000 I am not going to be nervous. I'm gonna expect difference.
00:51:57.000 --> 00:52:03.000 Yeah.
00:52:03.000 --> 00:52:04.000 Yeah, yeah, that's beautiful. Because you know what I also find is that sometimes people really want to come to those other spaces.
00:52:04.000 --> 00:52:12.000 And at the same time I'm going to absorb and hear what God has to say to me about being in this environment.
00:52:12.000 --> 00:52:15.000 But don't know where to go. You know I've had.
00:52:15.000 --> 00:52:16.000 Yeah.
00:52:16.000 --> 00:52:20.000 I want somebody to say to me recently, like I want to go to a black church, and I'm had like when my wife friends will come, and they'll spend some time with me a few days so like yay I want to go, because I know that for for them there's this opening up that they have to
00:52:20.000 --> 00:52:34.000 Hey!
00:52:34.000 --> 00:52:48.000 say, wait a minute. I want to worship like that. I want to be in that space, but I know that I can't do it over here, and other thing I think that happens is sometimes People just want to come because they see the theatrics on Tv right let me let me Yeah, I think I
00:52:48.000 --> 00:52:53.000 Oh, yeah, Oh, the Tyler perries
00:52:53.000 --> 00:52:55.000 just want to be a part of all that, and it may not be.
00:52:55.000 --> 00:52:56.000 Right. That's right.
00:52:56.000 --> 00:53:07.000 It may not be that way. What but I think that they also come with saying, there's the freedom in the way that I can express, or just be in cause.
00:53:07.000 --> 00:53:09.000 Absolutely.
00:53:09.000 --> 00:53:12.000 Now I have to when you're in of that spirit that that that spirit Okay, you can't help but to just get involved in it.
00:53:12.000 --> 00:53:18.000 Come on, name Shane!
00:53:18.000 --> 00:53:19.000 Yes.
00:53:19.000 --> 00:53:22.000 Now sometimes people will still sit like this, and I mean, even people of color.
00:53:22.000 --> 00:53:23.000 You're gonna still because they're just not allowing it.
00:53:23.000 --> 00:53:25.000 Right.
00:53:25.000 --> 00:53:32.000 But but here's the thing you can come, and it doesn't mean that you're gonna end up shouting all over the place Where?
00:53:32.000 --> 00:53:33.000 No, yes.
00:53:33.000 --> 00:53:47.000 Well, something different, awake. So what I want to do is just to invite those people who our interested and go into a different church to say, Hey, can I come to church, or just go because here's the thing.
00:53:47.000 --> 00:53:53.000 Absolutely.
00:53:53.000 --> 00:53:54.000 Kip not, can I? Can I put something out there? The Community Street Ministry?
00:53:54.000 --> 00:53:58.000 If you just show up, going to, you know, Say.
00:53:58.000 --> 00:54:08.000 We have access to several different churches into London County. We would love if I could put our my email better planning at live.com email and say, You know, I'm interested in one of these charges.
00:54:08.000 --> 00:54:15.000 Please.
00:54:15.000 --> 00:54:20.000 I would love to connect with you different churches, It's not just about my church.
00:54:20.000 --> 00:54:21.000 We'll have a conversation by email so that I can say to you, Listen, Here are a couple of churches in the area.
00:54:21.000 --> 00:54:25.000 Hello, cool. Yeah.
00:54:25.000 --> 00:54:30.000 Let God direct you, because this is an experience that you don't want to miss.
00:54:30.000 --> 00:54:42.000 There's also there's a a group of churches that come together called Arise, look out for that.
00:54:42.000 --> 00:54:43.000 Hmm! Hmm! I love love love that you are broadening this.
00:54:43.000 --> 00:54:48.000 Those are different churches around the State of Connecticut that invite the Holy Spirit to be in charge of their lives.
00:54:48.000 --> 00:55:03.000 and and here's the thing that I want to say to people It's not even so much about proselytizing you or saying you've got to be at this one place really about helping you, to know that you are something greater Then the the limited box.
00:55:03.000 --> 00:55:04.000 That you put yourself in, and then off the box, that the one cool puts you in.
00:55:04.000 --> 00:55:15.000 Absolutely not
00:55:15.000 --> 00:55:16.000 Yes, yes, it has
00:55:16.000 --> 00:55:22.000 But I think until we can figure out, even from a religious place, because religion has also been used, enslaved us into enslave all of us in many ways.
00:55:22.000 --> 00:55:23.000 Yes.
00:55:23.000 --> 00:55:39.000 you know, with with some of our thoughts and our beliefs, there are some valuable things that we can take from religion, and we can call across the the racial barrier Stephanie, I really want to thank you for being my guest I want to add if you have any words of
00:55:39.000 --> 00:55:45.000 Thank you. Thank you for asking me
00:55:45.000 --> 00:55:49.000 inspiration or a blessing that you would like to leave with our audience today.
00:55:49.000 --> 00:56:10.000 So on today. I declare and decree that because you have heard these words and you were interested in dismantling racism, that you see God bigger than what you've seen him in your past, and that you would allow holy Spirit to enter into your heart for you to be more open to recognize God in all
00:56:10.000 --> 00:56:27.000 of His beauty and all of his creation. In Jesus name Amen.
00:56:27.000 --> 00:56:28.000 Wedding
00:56:28.000 --> 00:56:37.000 Thank you so much for for offering this blessing to folks, no matter who you are, what your beliefs are, your religious beliefs, whether you're Muslim Hindu, whatever you are, just know that you are grounded in something bigger than yourself which connects all of us together, so thank you so
00:56:37.000 --> 00:56:41.000 much Stephanie, for being my guest. Thank you to my listeners.
00:56:41.000 --> 00:56:46.000 Love to hear from you. So if you have any comments, please reach out at sacred intelligence.
00:56:46.000 --> 00:56:50.000 Dot com send us a message to let us know what you think of.
00:56:50.000 --> 00:57:20.000 Today's show. I want to just encourage you to go forth and be your best self.
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