Employment Law Today

Tuesday, October 13, 2020
Facebook Live Video from 2020/10/13 - Breaking Free From Toxic Patterns With Your Employees 


2020/10/13 - Breaking Free From Toxic Patterns With Your Employees 

[NEW EPISODE] Breaking Free From Toxic Patterns With Your Employees 

With so much Coronavirus uncertainty, many business owners are rethinking their business structure - including their hiring and firing practices. How might the stress from the COVID-19 pandemic push employers into their default personality traits, resulting in unconsciously creating and recreating toxic dynamics with their employees?

Join me, Eric Sarver, and my guest, employment attorney, mediator, conflict resolution specialist, coach and author, Nance L. Schick, Esq., as we explore this topic together.

Tune in for this informative conversation at or watch the Facebook Livestream by clicking here.

Show Notes

Segment 1

Eric introduces the guest of the show Nance Schick. Nance goes into the ins-and-outs of her, Nance primarily working with consulting. She then explains how she attempts to solve workplace issues and how she assists employers with conflict resolution. Nance and Eric discuss the psychology involved in running a workplace, Nance then explaining  the DiSC personality assessment for listeners.

Segment 2

The conversation about the DiSC assessment continues, Nance then breaks down the four quadrants of personality, Eric and Nance also detailing how they apply these concepts in their working lives as employers. They talk about employee engagement, sensitivity, typecasting, and having an awareness about an employee’s mental health.

Segment 3

Eric and Nance run through a couple scenarios of how an employer should deal with personality types clashing. Nance talks about being mindful, especially during these times, of the lives of their employees, observing drastic shifts and changes in their behavior. She discusses the dynamic of having a dominant personality type in the workplace and why each type is completely necessary in a functioning business culture. 

Segment 4

Eric talks about communication, sensitivity, microaggressions and boundaries, Nance illustrating the responsibility of the employers to determine the boundaries and mediate these situations when they begin to escalate. Nance ends the show by leaving her contact information for listeners.


00:00:37.110 --> 00:00:50.670 Eric Sarver Esq: Good evening. My name is Eric Sarver from the law office American soccer player to welcome everybody today to our fourth episode of my weekly talk radio show and video podcast called employment law today.

00:00:51.210 --> 00:01:02.940 Eric Sarver Esq: I have on as my special guest today attorney Nance check but to welcome Nancy to the show. Nancy pleasure to have you. Thanks for agreeing to be guests this evening. How you doing,

00:01:03.720 --> 00:01:05.070 Nance Schick: Good, how are you

00:01:05.460 --> 00:01:14.190 Eric Sarver Esq: Doing pretty well pretty well. Thank you. I just wanted to give your audience a little bit of a flavor of the show for those that might be joining us for the very first time or for those

00:01:14.520 --> 00:01:25.110 Eric Sarver Esq: Repeat folks might be coming back, and then I'd love to introduce you to our audience. I know you have a very interesting background and we've got some really cool topics tonight's discuss that, really, I think,

00:01:25.920 --> 00:01:36.720 Eric Sarver Esq: Be of service and help some business owners out there and managers and employers. So any event, the financial, as I mentioned, employment law today we

00:01:37.470 --> 00:01:45.540 Eric Sarver Esq: Scheduled for 5pm to 6pm on Tuesday. You think that's eastern standard time here on talk radio by NYC.

00:01:46.140 --> 00:01:59.160 Eric Sarver Esq: And in terms of our show tonight. The topic is breaking toxic patterns employer, employee relations and if I could just step back a bit. I think that's a great way to segue into what the show is about

00:01:59.700 --> 00:02:07.050 Eric Sarver Esq: So I've been spending the last 21 years as an employment law business on attorney and in that role. I've helped employers and employees alike.

00:02:07.500 --> 00:02:19.680 Eric Sarver Esq: And it seems to me that during the covert 19 pandemic, with all the different rules and regulations, all that federal, state, and city guidelines that businesses have to follow around

00:02:20.220 --> 00:02:33.360 Eric Sarver Esq: Issue the employment issues of hiring employees and firing employees furloughing creating a safe workplace that it can feel really overwhelming. And so I created the show with three goals in mind.

00:02:33.810 --> 00:02:41.940 Eric Sarver Esq: The first is to educate, to inform you as a business owner out there, or as an employer, a company in any industry, whatever field that you're in.

00:02:42.300 --> 00:02:49.440 Eric Sarver Esq: To understand and know what the employment labor laws require you to do. And by the way, a lot of these employment labor laws.

00:02:49.920 --> 00:02:56.610 Eric Sarver Esq: Far predate the covert 19 pandemic. So I like to talk about those laws, as well as the newer laws, you need to follow.

00:02:57.330 --> 00:03:07.560 Eric Sarver Esq: And then the second goal. The show is to motivate and to inspire a lot of people these days are feeling the stress and anxiety. It's a very natural response, I think, to

00:03:07.980 --> 00:03:11.550 Eric Sarver Esq: Being independent Megaman the first of its kind in over a century.

00:03:12.000 --> 00:03:21.000 Eric Sarver Esq: And so that's going to take its toll on people, including and how they interact with their employees and how they run their business. So I'm going to motivate by having

00:03:21.300 --> 00:03:28.080 Eric Sarver Esq: Special spotlighted guests who are running a business and doing it successfully. What are their secrets, how they doing that.

00:03:28.590 --> 00:03:41.280 Eric Sarver Esq: And then the, the final aspect or goal of the show really is to provide resources and in that regard. I have a special guests each week who will talk about an issue that either related to employment law.

00:03:41.910 --> 00:03:58.320 Eric Sarver Esq: Or that has to do with helping you to run your business, whether it's through cyber security issues, whether it's through marketing, whether it's through video marketing any kind of issue that would be important to you and help you run your business. So with that backdrop in mind.

00:03:59.400 --> 00:04:12.720 Eric Sarver Esq: I'd like to once again welcome Nancy. Nancy L Esquire to the show. And I want to just read a little bit about Nancy. Nancy, I was really impressed by your background, we were introduced.

00:04:13.500 --> 00:04:21.270 Eric Sarver Esq: By email networking through a mutual friend through I'll give a shout out to Nina, how can we, I think we both hold in high regard. So Nina, if you're watching

00:04:23.850 --> 00:04:30.300 Eric Sarver Esq: And then event today. Nancy is employment law tree, she's also an ethno or they just mediator.

00:04:31.200 --> 00:04:38.610 Eric Sarver Esq: And a conflict resolution coach and specialist. She also focused on diversity training and is an author.

00:04:39.240 --> 00:04:46.200 Eric Sarver Esq: And so in some ways that you and I have some very common ground in terms of the Employment Law background terms of conflict resolution.

00:04:46.800 --> 00:05:04.230 Eric Sarver Esq: Compliance diversity training. I wanted to be a little bit about more about you. If I can just touch on your background and feel free to jump in and add or subtract anything. Hopefully not attracted me to be generic but so I'll just say to our listeners tonight that Nance chick.

00:05:05.310 --> 00:05:13.260 Eric Sarver Esq: As an attorney, I mentioned, she's operated a conflict resolution business for the past 17 years, known as third year conflict resolution.

00:05:13.680 --> 00:05:22.740 Eric Sarver Esq: Nancy comes from a background of working with law firms and herself has plenty of law firm as well, but her main focus these days is the conflict resolution business.

00:05:23.490 --> 00:05:35.130 Eric Sarver Esq: Nancy created through to your conflict resolution process in 2006 and it's the basis for her year 2014 published book called DIY conflict resolution.

00:05:35.670 --> 00:05:41.850 Eric Sarver Esq: It's also the basis finances online school and which which Nancy just launched last year.

00:05:42.450 --> 00:05:57.180 Eric Sarver Esq: And finally, Nancy helps managers and small business owners to resolve workplace conflicts from worker misclassification penalties can you both know about that from our clients to resolving workplace conflict.

00:05:57.780 --> 00:06:06.120 Eric Sarver Esq: From worker misclassification to hostile work environments. And so while Nancy taking care of those needs for our clients, they can focus on

00:06:06.480 --> 00:06:12.510 Eric Sarver Esq: running their business doing what they do best without the stress of all those issues card in their mind.

00:06:13.260 --> 00:06:22.770 Eric Sarver Esq: And finally, Nancy uses the technique which we're going to get into a little bit this evening, called the DISC assessment to identify personality.

00:06:23.280 --> 00:06:33.060 Eric Sarver Esq: Conflicts personality traits and she coaches or clients to build a conflict resolution skills and Nancy is is what's known as its third year process to facilitate clients.

00:06:33.390 --> 00:06:41.160 Eric Sarver Esq: Interaction with the people who think differently than they do. So there's hope. I summed up nicely what you've described that

00:06:41.790 --> 00:06:55.350 Nance Schick: You know that's that's a lot. That's a mouthful. Right. And it's, it sounds like everything else these days right PPP and you know I know when pandemic and covert and, you know, p, p

00:06:56.730 --> 00:07:06.030 Nance Schick: But it's part of what I do is help people reconcile the many demands that come with running a business. Right. And I think that's

00:07:06.450 --> 00:07:24.060 Nance Schick: Why I have such a diverse background is because I wanted a huge toolbox to make sure that I could come up with very unique and creative solutions for individual businesses and those of us who started our own businesses or even our own law firms right

00:07:25.380 --> 00:07:48.570 Nance Schick: We tend to follow a lot of the traditional path, but we also like to create new paths. So being able to pull from these different tools is is very critical to me being able to serve my clients well and so yeah i think you summed it up fairly well I have a large toolbox.

00:07:49.050 --> 00:07:51.150 Nance Schick: And it really is all about.

00:07:51.480 --> 00:08:04.950 Nance Schick: Finding the tools that work for the client in the moment. And that's what I work with them on with mindset and coaching and a lot of times that's what happens. People come to me with what they think is an urgent legal

00:08:05.910 --> 00:08:20.610 Nance Schick: And I can hear behind that, you know, we, you and I talked about that, about how often, it'll come from a call a call that says I have to fire an employee and I really don't know how to do it. I don't want to do it helped me

00:08:21.390 --> 00:08:26.850 Nance Schick: And I know then that there's a different conversation than me, just giving them the law.

00:08:27.600 --> 00:08:41.880 Nance Schick: Right, because what I hear in that is I'm pained by this. I like my employee, but I can't figure out why they're not succeeding. So that's where we start unpacking everything by looking at personality styles and communication styles.

00:08:42.330 --> 00:08:48.900 Nance Schick: And a lot of times we just need to restructure that relationship and they don't actually need to terminate them.

00:08:50.580 --> 00:08:58.500 Eric Sarver Esq: It's an excellent point. I'm going to hear a lot there. You really covered. I hear about having an arsenal of tools. A lot of tools in your toolbox to help your clients and

00:08:58.830 --> 00:09:07.260 Eric Sarver Esq: I, the way I see it, too. It's like you hire somebody to repair something. And sometimes I'll need a hammer. Other times, I need a screwdriver. But overall,

00:09:07.800 --> 00:09:15.600 Eric Sarver Esq: One tool alone doesn't serve the same purpose as having a number of tools to deal with an issue, and I think I agree with you that I found

00:09:16.170 --> 00:09:26.280 Eric Sarver Esq: You know as an employment lawyer working with business owners working with companies that sometimes they come to me also, as well, what they say. The issue is this employee and there

00:09:26.760 --> 00:09:33.750 Eric Sarver Esq: Is a fear that they might be retaliation claim if we find them and we don't believe there was it how each one and sometimes this is this question of

00:09:34.230 --> 00:09:49.890 Eric Sarver Esq: Trying to get through a conflict, without going to extremes. Other times their termination is warranted, but the the business day not know how to do that appropriately and if this would have used a sledgehammer where maybe you know a more finesse tool might be appropriate.

00:09:50.970 --> 00:09:58.560 Eric Sarver Esq: I found in my time is employment law attorney while I'm not certified as a me 100% done many mediations

00:09:58.860 --> 00:10:06.360 Eric Sarver Esq: And I've really come to find over the years and maybe you found this to that so much of what I do as an employment lawyer involved.

00:10:06.630 --> 00:10:15.540 Eric Sarver Esq: It certainly known the employment labor laws and helping clients with wage and hour issues overtime pay button beneath the surface. It's really about

00:10:16.140 --> 00:10:24.570 Eric Sarver Esq: Finding out what were the whereas the employer for the business owners stuck as I think you kind of alluded to, I mentioned and

00:10:24.960 --> 00:10:35.220 Eric Sarver Esq: Where maybe, is there a personality conflict or whereas there's some issue that they keep repeating so that they're calling on me for the third or fourth time let's say in a three year period.

00:10:35.580 --> 00:10:45.150 Eric Sarver Esq: To fire someone in the same or different slightly similar position and I'm starting to see that, while the names change and went from Susan to Bob, you know, to Fred

00:10:45.600 --> 00:10:51.000 Eric Sarver Esq: To Joe. The, the issue there often I find that clients don't

00:10:51.570 --> 00:10:58.830 Eric Sarver Esq: employers don't often communicate very well with their employees, especially if there's a fear of conflict so they don't tend to

00:10:59.130 --> 00:11:06.840 Eric Sarver Esq: write things down, like they don't write down disciplinary issues and so forth. So also, just to say that I do think it's important to sort of having

00:11:07.410 --> 00:11:17.340 Eric Sarver Esq: A psychological understanding of our clients. Well, of course I'm not a psychologist, per se, but like an armchair psychologist and I really do think that, you know, understanding people's behavior and patterns is key.

00:11:17.910 --> 00:11:27.810 Eric Sarver Esq: On which brings me to an interesting question. You anyone who may have seen your website or seen my various posts about our show tonight. I'm very excited to have you on the show.

00:11:28.890 --> 00:11:45.000 Eric Sarver Esq: Saw that you are involved in a process in terms of assessing you're helping your clients to assess their, their profile there and see their leadership style their personality. It's called the disc D as in David, I see the DISC assessment.

00:11:46.020 --> 00:11:55.140 Eric Sarver Esq: So if I can ask you, Nancy. If you can, if you tell us all. What exactly is the DISC assessment and how might this help business owners.

00:11:55.680 --> 00:12:09.870 Eric Sarver Esq: To gain some awareness of their to their problematic patterns, how might help them to better select in their hiring process and they're managing style. So can you tell us a bit about the DISC assessment so many other Facts are facts.

00:12:10.200 --> 00:12:20.880 Nance Schick: I'll give you the quick synopsis of it. Because obviously there's a lot written on there plenty of books there plenty of different organizations that do the assessment and use it.

00:12:21.720 --> 00:12:29.100 Nance Schick: But I, I got my certification from people keys through a coaching Mastery program that I that I'm completing

00:12:29.460 --> 00:12:39.120 Nance Schick: Through Dan Miller. If you're familiar with him. He's an author who wrote a book called 48 days to the work you you love and now he just released the 20th anniversary. I believe the

00:12:39.990 --> 00:12:49.470 Nance Schick: Life and Work you love so I've been working with Dan for a while and got my certification on disk and di SC is

00:12:49.950 --> 00:13:04.230 Nance Schick: For personality styles that similar to what we look at with Myers Briggs. The any a gram. There are so many different personality assessments. But what I like about desk is that it just as a way to

00:13:05.520 --> 00:13:10.560 Nance Schick: Make it simple for people to understand it's not, it is it has a scientific basis.

00:13:10.890 --> 00:13:22.140 Nance Schick: And and you take the online assessment, but I love that it gives you very actionable steps and I'm all about action right because the only way we move from where we are is by taking action. Right.

00:13:23.100 --> 00:13:28.050 Nance Schick: So, d is is for dominant kind of the, you know, the leader style that

00:13:28.620 --> 00:13:41.250 Nance Schick: takes charge their task oriented. They're the just get it done kind of people more extroverted, you'll see them. It's about 3% of the population, actually. So you'll see them. A lot of times and CEO positions.

00:13:41.580 --> 00:13:53.370 Nance Schick: managing partners of law firms right and so on. Then you've got i which is the influencing those are your, your also extroverted people but they're more people oriented.

00:13:53.730 --> 00:14:01.470 Nance Schick: They're your sales people. They are event planners there they wide extroverts that are like, let's make it fun.

00:14:02.100 --> 00:14:13.860 Nance Schick: And then you've got the high as people and and I say this, we say they're high in this because during the assessment, you'll score higher in some areas than other but it doesn't mean you don't have other

00:14:14.220 --> 00:14:23.160 Nance Schick: Aspects of the of the personality style, so don't feel like you're stuck in it. It's not like a horoscope that once you're born, you're stuck with it for your whole life because that was your birthday.

00:14:24.150 --> 00:14:35.070 Nance Schick: It's just a way of using it in conversation to approach someone differently. So the SS a supportive person also people oriented, but different from the either introverted.

00:14:35.640 --> 00:14:53.670 Nance Schick: They're more of the people that say, let's make sure everybody's okay on a project and then you've got the compliant. The see which is the also task oriented like the D, but is introverted and kinda likes to be behind the scene there. The perfectionist your

00:14:54.720 --> 00:14:59.880 Nance Schick: You'll see them in tech there the programmers there the web. Web

00:15:00.510 --> 00:15:11.070 Nance Schick: Developers, they're not necessarily the user experience people that might be more of an eye there. They're the ones on the back end that are working out all the code to make it work. Right. Make the website, though.

00:15:11.490 --> 00:15:18.930 Nance Schick: So what we find is that you know they're there are different fears that come up in personality styles. When people are under stress. And that was

00:15:18.930 --> 00:15:31.500 Nance Schick: Was talking about this is a pandemic. We're starting to see certain personality styles play out because we're all under a lot of stress. And so when it's, yeah.

00:15:31.920 --> 00:15:32.820 Eric Sarver Esq: Oh, I'm sorry. I didn't mean

00:15:34.590 --> 00:15:37.860 Nance Schick: I can talk about this all day. I'd love to talk more about it. We

00:15:38.430 --> 00:15:47.220 Eric Sarver Esq: Take commercial break. But I think that's a great summary, as you were speaking I heard every I pictured various clients in mind, jumping through my in my head so

00:15:47.520 --> 00:15:59.220 Eric Sarver Esq: When we come back, let's talk more about how we can apply this DISC assessment and nano plasma workplace will bring back folks to get commercial break. Please stand by Eric Sabra you would then check on employment law today on talk radio NYC.

00:18:13.080 --> 00:18:14.280 Eric Sarver Esq: Welcome back everyone.

00:18:16.050 --> 00:18:16.800 Eric Sarver Esq: Today here.

00:18:19.980 --> 00:18:20.850 Eric Sarver Esq: Employment Law and business law.

00:18:21.870 --> 00:18:37.020 Eric Sarver Esq: The law office Americans are from here with my special guest tonight. Nancy chick awesome employment law attorney, as well as a mediator conflict resolution specialist trainer fester. I can go on and on. Actually really impressive background and

00:18:38.220 --> 00:18:41.340 Eric Sarver Esq: We were just speaking for those that may have heard before the break about this.

00:18:42.060 --> 00:18:51.300 Eric Sarver Esq: Sort of a personality profile for us to the DISC assessment Nancy talks about the dominant. We are tied interpretive types of supportive type in the compliance.

00:18:51.930 --> 00:19:00.690 Eric Sarver Esq: And what struck me when you were speaking, is that, as I mentioned before, the commercial break. I have clients all those categories. And I say that because

00:19:01.080 --> 00:19:08.340 Eric Sarver Esq: When I'm dealing with different clients, I need to take different approaches. So if I have clients that are very much task oriented. They don't want to know.

00:19:08.760 --> 00:19:17.910 Eric Sarver Esq: All the details to legal theory, even though I love discussing and stuff. And I just like doing what they want to know that the clients really want to understand

00:19:18.780 --> 00:19:25.860 Eric Sarver Esq: Or they want to feel as if they're taking a leadership role. Sometimes I have to talk to a client, they might have an idea that's not in their best interest.

00:19:26.220 --> 00:19:35.130 Eric Sarver Esq: Around employment legal issue and I found that when I can speak to them and show them how they can be in charge by doing something different way.

00:19:35.490 --> 00:19:43.140 Eric Sarver Esq: They become much more receptive. Then he sort of standing as if I'm saying you have to repeat this way. And I say that because that's

00:19:43.950 --> 00:19:55.020 Eric Sarver Esq: What I'm clients but for those out there listening tonight people in the audience. If they run their own business. I wonder how might knowing the sacred employer or manager can be

00:19:56.070 --> 00:20:12.750 Eric Sarver Esq: Knowing and recognizing the personality types in this assessment, I might help with managers say either their leadership style and management style to help to avoid some of the employment conference, the end up often in litigation or arbitration.

00:20:14.490 --> 00:20:21.600 Nance Schick: Well, I think one of the first things is that I work with individuals on determining what their default

00:20:21.870 --> 00:20:34.950 Nance Schick: stylists and I and I frame it that way. Is that your default style is where you go when you're under stress, because that's where a lot of times we find ourselves and our clients in the most trouble right is

00:20:35.370 --> 00:20:43.830 Nance Schick: I think especially right now. We talked about this, the pandemic has just brought so much of this forward, where we're recognizing that

00:20:44.880 --> 00:20:56.850 Nance Schick: We're all under stress. We're all going to our default. So you know the the DS eyes as MCS I can spot them a lot lot more easily right now because we're all dealing with something

00:20:57.540 --> 00:21:10.140 Nance Schick: And and so the first thing is recognizing your own default. And the nice thing about the assessments. It also shows it has three different ways of assessing your default personality.

00:21:10.530 --> 00:21:19.620 Nance Schick: And it will show you how you go to a certain place when you're under stress, but it also looks at how you try to represent yourself to the world.

00:21:20.220 --> 00:21:36.690 Nance Schick: And how you see yourself and we compare those charts. So that's one of the first things I can do is I can look at is the stress that you're under say the pandemic is it causing you to be inconsistent because that alone will cause additional stress.

00:21:37.170 --> 00:21:40.770 Nance Schick: Right, so that's that's something that I look for. But then I go to

00:21:40.890 --> 00:21:50.040 Nance Schick: What is the default because that's the, that's the one that you're going, you're going to go to and I can work with right away. And then as we start to balance things out a little bit more

00:21:50.730 --> 00:21:56.970 Nance Schick: We can we can start engaging with other people. But that's what I do in my third year conflict resolution process also is the

00:21:57.240 --> 00:22:08.820 Nance Schick: We always go to get connected with where you are. Before you start engaging with someone else. Because otherwise you're going to create a bigger mess right and we know this, our clients when they're, when they're angry.

00:22:09.480 --> 00:22:16.320 Nance Schick: At an employee more they're angry of vendor or they're just upset with a spouse and maybe bring that to work, right.

00:22:16.680 --> 00:22:23.640 Nance Schick: Yeah, it's going to create a bigger mess. If you're not, if you're not managing it. And so this is this is where I start is let's look at

00:22:24.000 --> 00:22:34.980 Nance Schick: How you're showing up in the world right now with the circumstances, you're dealing with. And then I can. The, the assessment will start to tell you if you're engaging with

00:22:35.430 --> 00:22:44.340 Nance Schick: Someone who like say you're a high D, you're, you're a more dominant personality. You're like, get it done. Let's move on. Give me the give me the short version of this.

00:22:45.510 --> 00:22:55.200 Nance Schick: Relating to somebody like me who's a high as I am, first and foremost going make sure, but it's taken care of. So if you're not taking care of me I shut down.

00:22:56.820 --> 00:23:09.180 Nance Schick: And so knowing that about myself and knowing that that's the way I relate to a D or knowing that d relates to an S that way. It says, I don't need to know all that personal stuff. I don't need to worry about all the people

00:23:09.360 --> 00:23:15.150 Nance Schick: Just do your job done automatically. You start to see it doesn't mean either one of them is right or wrong.

00:23:15.600 --> 00:23:24.750 Nance Schick: It just means we approach a project differently and being able to recognize that we can have different conversations and it will give us different results.

00:23:26.310 --> 00:23:26.970 Eric Sarver Esq: So important.

00:23:28.620 --> 00:23:35.970 Eric Sarver Esq: To know that because it's well first off I see I would imagine that you might find people who have a combination of traits, right. Maybe they're more

00:23:36.300 --> 00:23:41.400 Eric Sarver Esq: Dominant but they also might have time time saving more compliance side around other people that they're with

00:23:41.970 --> 00:23:50.130 Eric Sarver Esq: What I hear you saying is that by helping the say the business owner or the manager or the solo printer or whoever it might be

00:23:50.490 --> 00:23:56.340 Eric Sarver Esq: By helping them to recognize, be aware of how they're showing up personality style and otherwise.

00:23:56.820 --> 00:24:08.190 Eric Sarver Esq: It helps them to either change their approach with certain employees. You can soften and approach redirected approach. I think it's so important because, you know, we see this in employment discrimination cases a lot where

00:24:08.640 --> 00:24:16.080 Eric Sarver Esq: Sometimes an employee is genuinely the victim of discrimination hostile work environment rather despair achievement.

00:24:16.440 --> 00:24:25.560 Eric Sarver Esq: Truly based on a protected clients. They know their, their gender, their sexual orientation that raised and you know contemptible and it does

00:24:26.070 --> 00:24:41.220 Eric Sarver Esq: For sure happen. And I've seen cases like that. And I've worked for employees into situations. I also helped employers to defend them some pieces of into resolve and negotiate those situations, but what I found two is that

00:24:42.030 --> 00:24:50.190 Eric Sarver Esq: There are a lot of oftentimes when an employee might conclude that they're being mistreated based on a protected class.

00:24:50.520 --> 00:24:59.760 Eric Sarver Esq: And it may not be the case. There may be I think when you get down to it. I mean, there may be something we can talk about implicit bias. Now that plays out in the workplace. That's a whole other

00:25:00.150 --> 00:25:09.090 Eric Sarver Esq: Probably hours worth of conversation, but I guess my point is, I've seen times where an employee says, you know, this employer to me because of my

00:25:10.740 --> 00:25:17.280 Eric Sarver Esq: Sexual orientation. My religion and the employers swears is the furthest thing from the truth. And when you look at what's happening.

00:25:17.610 --> 00:25:22.020 Eric Sarver Esq: With performance reviews or interactions, sometimes you do really see there's just two.

00:25:22.440 --> 00:25:29.520 Eric Sarver Esq: Personnel personality stones that are clashing, maybe it's a D and add an s you know there are, do you see in this assessment.

00:25:29.790 --> 00:25:36.720 Eric Sarver Esq: So I think my point is that one thing I think about the work you're doing so important is if you can help to defuse

00:25:37.080 --> 00:25:45.480 Eric Sarver Esq: Some of the conflicts between employers and employees in the workplace, then you've already made huge progress towards perhaps staving off what could be

00:25:45.990 --> 00:25:54.840 Eric Sarver Esq: misconstrued as employment remediation retaliation. You know, it's funny. We often say that say when you look at the end result, you know, people don't usually start

00:25:55.230 --> 00:26:04.140 Eric Sarver Esq: With a lawsuit filed in federal court, that's not usually go to most people. They don't want to go to court, you know, nobody really wants to invite that kind of stress into their lives.

00:26:04.590 --> 00:26:16.650 Eric Sarver Esq: It starts with often miscommunication lack of communication. So what I hear, I hear from you is this this way of assessing personality types. I think it can definitely be a game changer. You know, I mean, it can put

00:26:17.160 --> 00:26:21.480 Eric Sarver Esq: You can put someone's employment law defense attorneys and plaintiffs attorneys out of business. So

00:26:22.530 --> 00:26:24.090 Eric Sarver Esq: The show now. Yes. Thank you so much.

00:26:25.980 --> 00:26:26.220 Eric Sarver Esq: Know, but

00:26:27.030 --> 00:26:29.520 Nance Schick: I think it's around and and and it's and it's

00:26:29.550 --> 00:26:44.520 Nance Schick: One of those things that we've joked about in the in the alternative dispute resolution realm for a while, is that, you know, a lot of litigation attorneys have said you know ADR they see it as already declining revenue.

00:26:45.960 --> 00:26:46.980 Nance Schick: Rate, but

00:26:48.240 --> 00:26:52.950 Nance Schick: I, I always respond to that with. Have you met people

00:26:54.600 --> 00:27:03.900 Nance Schick: I'm not concerned that we're going to resolve every conflict in the world. It's just part of how we are and I talked about that as part of my third year process also is that

00:27:04.290 --> 00:27:12.690 Nance Schick: I'm not saying go out and create conflict, but it's going to occur. And that's what we need to grow. So I'm not as afraid of it. That's also why I built

00:27:13.170 --> 00:27:31.020 Nance Schick: Conflict resolution skills, right, because I think we've been trained to to think that we can just avoid all conflict which is a little silly and not very productive right because you think about all the things that have caused us to grow and change and become who we are. So

00:27:32.070 --> 00:27:42.660 Nance Schick: Embrace embrace it, to a certain degree. You don't have to like it. There's a difference between embracing it and liking it. So what I teach people to do is just accept what is

00:27:43.350 --> 00:27:55.710 Nance Schick: You know, get out of the talk about what happened, you know, when I hear the past a lot of past language, a lot of past tense verbs and attuned to listening to that because I realized, somebody stuck in something that

00:27:56.340 --> 00:28:04.200 Nance Schick: We can't change. I can't change the past, but what I can do is listen for how they're talking about right now what they want and need

00:28:04.860 --> 00:28:12.810 Nance Schick: And that's where we go with the disc to and then during the pandemic, we have. We were actually talking about this. And one of my my training calls earlier today.

00:28:13.320 --> 00:28:23.520 Nance Schick: Is how people are kind of going to their defaults during the pandemic and how recognizing the default of your employees, for example.

00:28:23.910 --> 00:28:37.530 Nance Schick: Can actually help you recognize. For example, let's say, let's say for example that you're you're good employee who has really been on top of everything is now working from home.

00:28:38.580 --> 00:28:47.970 Nance Schick: And they're they're your top salesperson etc etc. Right. They're always out there hustling bringing in lots of new business for you all. Now they're working from home.

00:28:48.540 --> 00:28:58.260 Nance Schick: That's your extrovert and you've now put them at home, whether they're not engaged with people on a daily basis. They are not ambling that well.

00:28:59.010 --> 00:29:13.830 Nance Schick: Right. And so what will happen is they'll start to worry about. Do people still like them. Are they being rejected and so they'll start to act out in different ways, is they'll start to push people away if they think they're failing.

00:29:14.280 --> 00:29:16.200 Nance Schick: So you might not hear from them.

00:29:16.830 --> 00:29:29.550 Nance Schick: The way that you used to and and as an employer. If you're not aware that that's part of how people work. You might just start thinking that employees squaring off and it's time to fire them right

00:29:29.850 --> 00:29:36.240 Nance Schick: Right, if you recognize you just need to reach out and engage with them. You can make a big difference, you know,

00:29:37.140 --> 00:29:37.830 Eric Sarver Esq: I was about to ask

00:29:37.980 --> 00:29:50.070 Eric Sarver Esq: For a concrete example that you send an epidemic. And I thought about the work from home scenario how that might impact people's personalities clashing, and I think that's a perfect example you gave about the extra that saves working from home.

00:29:51.300 --> 00:30:00.240 Eric Sarver Esq: I'm extroverted person so I can see that the there's a basic meme going around. It was like check on your extrovert friends were not okay. And it's kind of interesting. So

00:30:00.570 --> 00:30:08.820 Eric Sarver Esq: You know, I definitely would love to get more into this topic about how employers. Now they have this awareness and put a plan of action in place.

00:30:09.240 --> 00:30:13.200 Eric Sarver Esq: Especially during the pandemic when they have virtual workers. Are people afraid to come back.

00:30:13.860 --> 00:30:22.770 Eric Sarver Esq: We are enjoying the commercial break. And I will use that as a perfect time frame I check on my end. So everyone please stay tuned. I didn't hear with

00:30:23.550 --> 00:30:36.870 Eric Sarver Esq: Attorney a mediator and conflict resolution specialist Nance L Schick Esquire here on employment law today on their sovereign loft Erica solder on talk radio NYC. We'll be right back to ground.

00:33:01.560 --> 00:33:14.370 Eric Sarver Esq: Welcome back to our show tonight with my guests and a lot of turning, as I mentioned mediator conflict resolution specialist, Nancy. Welcome back to the show. Thanks again for being here. It's really

00:33:15.840 --> 00:33:26.790 Eric Sarver Esq: Just assessment be getting into people's personality profile, especially in the workplace where we can understand so deconstruct people's go to default

00:33:27.510 --> 00:33:35.910 Eric Sarver Esq: Biggest cabinet, if you will, of behavior and how that can be on the phone and I can create a domino effect, right. So if you're a manager or an employer.

00:33:36.270 --> 00:33:46.770 Eric Sarver Esq: And you're a senior employees a certain way, maybe very dominant personality here with the word compliant personality type, and your clashing, it could start the domino effect where

00:33:47.370 --> 00:33:57.360 Eric Sarver Esq: Do you might even be unknowingly unwittingly creating a hostile work environment accused of that, you know, we've seen like liability issues that come up all the time.

00:33:57.840 --> 00:34:04.530 Eric Sarver Esq: I'm sure as attorneys in this regard. So just to kind of backtrack that we discussed the DISC assessment and how

00:34:05.160 --> 00:34:15.270 Eric Sarver Esq: You help your clients that I ever thought that she for a specific example. And you even perfect one that I was thinking about, which is, you know, people watching this tonight people listening to the show.

00:34:15.690 --> 00:34:19.920 Eric Sarver Esq: They are small business, even though the restaurant. Maybe its architecture firm.

00:34:20.460 --> 00:34:30.630 Eric Sarver Esq: employees working home. So I'm just curious like using DISC assessment. Suppose you had a situation where, let's say an extroverted personality type

00:34:31.200 --> 00:34:49.350 Eric Sarver Esq: Was underperforming are not performing as well and your client was the manager employer. So to try maybe browbeating them because their dominant personality type to try to get them to to comply. And so then you have like right up some wondering like how, how might we are, how am I, you

00:34:50.670 --> 00:34:58.320 Eric Sarver Esq: Say, use some of these the awareness that the your clients enough and making a plan of action.

00:34:58.650 --> 00:35:05.490 Eric Sarver Esq: I know we talked about, like, there's awareness of the situation and it was acceptance of that expression, then there's a plan of action. So how do you

00:35:06.120 --> 00:35:18.750 Eric Sarver Esq: Can you tell us a bit about maybe example like the using the example you gave like you have the employer and the employee is home and different personality types clashing, how am I you help them with assessment to repost your employees.

00:35:19.920 --> 00:35:29.580 Nance Schick: Well, the first thing that I have to do is, you know, be aware that I actually am a combination. You mentioned that, too. And that's something to be aware of is knowing that

00:35:30.030 --> 00:35:41.310 Nance Schick: You know, for example, I'm an STI and everything, but a day for you. So I'm everything but the dominant, but I can be right and so you've learned that in certain situations, you'll respond differently.

00:35:41.760 --> 00:35:50.310 Nance Schick: But in this situation, if you know that your default is to go to the D, the dominant and you're the. You're the one that's, you know, let's just automatically to

00:35:50.640 --> 00:36:00.510 Nance Schick: Get it done crank out that work I'm focused on the task. I don't want to hear about why you're not getting it done and I just want to see it done and I want it on my something on my desk that shows it's done.

00:36:00.930 --> 00:36:08.010 Nance Schick: If you're doing that right now with someone who is more people focused and using that I example.

00:36:09.090 --> 00:36:16.890 Nance Schick: They're going to start withdrawing and when an eye is withdrawing what they're really doing is they're they're trying to avoid rejection

00:36:17.880 --> 00:36:26.670 Nance Schick: So if you're coming at them as a D and again we're assuming this is an employee who's probably been performing well and you're seeing a shift.

00:36:26.970 --> 00:36:30.780 Nance Schick: It's a different situation if maybe that's been an ongoing problem and

00:36:31.230 --> 00:36:41.220 Nance Schick: That's a whole different situation where people are now using the pandemic as an excuse to get rid of what they consider a problem that they probably should have been dealing with before. That's a whole different show

00:36:43.560 --> 00:36:50.040 Nance Schick: We're talking about getting getting into this before it becomes a plane before it becomes a major action.

00:36:50.820 --> 00:36:57.510 Nance Schick: So looking at it from that standpoint is that, you know, if you start to see your extrovert.

00:36:57.990 --> 00:37:05.160 Nance Schick: Not engaging anymore, you know, suddenly the person who was always getting people together after work, you're not hearing from them.

00:37:05.700 --> 00:37:23.010 Nance Schick: Something's going on right just reach out to them. They are Pete their people oriented. And if you're if you're a D. Maybe you still want to just hear isn't getting done. And that's fine. Ask the questions, but you're probably going to have to reach out to engage with that employee.

00:37:24.300 --> 00:37:31.590 Nance Schick: And as the leader. This is the other thing I work with with employers on is if you're the manager of a leader. It's really on you.

00:37:32.970 --> 00:37:40.740 Nance Schick: To engage with the employee and give them right and you know this, Eric, you and I, you mentioned it earlier in the show. It's on you.

00:37:41.100 --> 00:37:51.390 Nance Schick: To lay out the standards. And I think that's another big problem that we see as employment attorneys is we see that employers hire somebody

00:37:51.990 --> 00:38:07.050 Nance Schick: And they give them the the job description if maybe a lot of times they're not even that it's like we're going to give you the title. We're going to assume you know everything that that means in our business right even though you've been here 30 seconds now.

00:38:07.500 --> 00:38:13.830 Nance Schick: We're going to give you a whole bunch of work and you're just going to magically do it perfectly. So especially right now.

00:38:14.430 --> 00:38:20.040 Nance Schick: We have to be mindful that circumstances have changed, and it may take more employee engagement.

00:38:20.460 --> 00:38:28.830 Nance Schick: I noticed that in my classes as a teacher, I'm teaching online now. Right. I'm not doing as much live like we're doing right now.

00:38:29.280 --> 00:38:37.800 Nance Schick: And that means a lot more hand holding for my students in order to get them the same things that I that I would have been able to give them in the classroom.

00:38:38.250 --> 00:38:55.710 Nance Schick: So it's just accepting that and starting to recognize that you have different tools that you can use. So being a dominant personality is not bad you if you just recognize how that tends to function and how it tends to come into conflict with people who have a different approach.

00:38:57.150 --> 00:38:57.570 Nance Schick: Doesn't mean

00:38:57.990 --> 00:39:03.600 Nance Schick: Any of them are wrong. It just means you have to recognize them and we need all of them, like we need the dominant

00:39:03.630 --> 00:39:10.800 Nance Schick: We need the influencer, we need the supporter and we need that compliance person we need them all. Yeah, so

00:39:12.540 --> 00:39:17.370 Eric Sarver Esq: That we really all these different personality types don't have to necessarily

00:39:18.240 --> 00:39:30.720 Eric Sarver Esq: By their nature clash, and often they they're very similar, you know, if you notice, I mean, we're talking about business owners and employees employment situations, but it's really got in the world. I mean, I found that some people, some of the best friendships.

00:39:31.890 --> 00:39:42.000 Eric Sarver Esq: Friendships I've had in my life for people who might have a very different personality type, you know, maybe I'm a little more in the extroverted energetic side. So my hyper

00:39:42.510 --> 00:39:53.340 Eric Sarver Esq: Energetic and then my friends might be much more but a very laid back, low key, you know, more quiet Titan. So I think it can be a very symbiotic relationship as long as there's a given to take

00:39:53.700 --> 00:40:01.560 Eric Sarver Esq: And understanding and respect for each one's personality and if anything you're talking about that, in that context, because again,

00:40:01.920 --> 00:40:13.230 Eric Sarver Esq: What we're talking about on the show from from players for business owners could just easily get into family relationships and friendships. So really it's good to have this. It's kind of a

00:40:14.850 --> 00:40:29.610 Eric Sarver Esq: Very useful tool. I mean, more than one level, I guess, an interesting thought comes to mind about when in the process of a conflict, might you introduce this DISC assessment.

00:40:30.420 --> 00:40:47.490 Eric Sarver Esq: In other words, would it be early on and let's say with your clients starting to see a conflict arising, would it be more towards the time on a conflict is escalating or I think I guess, but I want. I'm just curious like your field know any here how you might use

00:40:48.930 --> 00:40:54.210 Nance Schick: I've used it in a couple of different ways. Not surprisingly, I'm going to give the lawyers answer of it depends.

00:40:55.890 --> 00:41:13.290 Nance Schick: Right. And so, you know, I can get. I can give a couple of examples that that lay it out fairly clearly I in, for example, a mediation, I, I would not have normally done that, during a mediation, but we we had a breakdown with the two parties.

00:41:14.070 --> 00:41:18.510 Nance Schick: Some information came out that I wasn't expecting that, of course, they were privy to but

00:41:19.050 --> 00:41:25.350 Nance Schick: Then it came out during the mediation and I realized that some of their personal, personal past was getting in the way.

00:41:25.710 --> 00:41:35.250 Nance Schick: Of them communicating and how they ever seen each other based on their past and not fully recognizing the interactions that caused the end of their relationship.

00:41:35.700 --> 00:41:46.170 Nance Schick: Now coming into the workplace. So I offered it in that circumstance to just give them a breakthrough in the way they were relating to each other so that we could proceed more effectively with the mediation.

00:41:47.430 --> 00:41:54.810 Nance Schick: In a different context. I had been approached by an organization that had an entire department that wasn't getting along.

00:41:56.130 --> 00:42:04.980 Nance Schick: I'm sure it wasn't as dramatic as they said, I'm sure there were alliances being built, which is sometimes dangerous to right. We want to pull alliance toward the

00:42:06.000 --> 00:42:12.000 Nance Schick: The goals of the department. And so in that situation. They had called me to say let I want you to mediate

00:42:12.510 --> 00:42:17.160 Nance Schick: And I said 17 people is going to be really difficult to have mediation.

00:42:17.430 --> 00:42:29.010 Nance Schick: So, so why don't we start with doing a DISC assessment and we did the and do the individual assessments, so that each person in the in the department got a feel for how they're communicating

00:42:29.370 --> 00:42:33.450 Nance Schick: And then we can take. There's a group one that you can also do that gives

00:42:33.990 --> 00:42:44.910 Nance Schick: It gives an assessment of your entire group and how they interact so you suddenly find out that you have for high D people or five high as people

00:42:45.600 --> 00:42:57.090 Nance Schick: And and if you if you start to understand the dynamics. You can see why your DS might aligned together your seeds might align together and so on. And these alliances that were being built.

00:42:57.540 --> 00:43:04.530 Nance Schick: Weren't breaking down because we needed everybody to come together as a team. So there. Those are the two ways I primarily use it.

00:43:05.550 --> 00:43:19.560 Nance Schick: If I'm coaching someone, a lot of times they come and they asked for that as the first step because they know that they're stuck and and and they don't know why. So they said maybe having some insight about how I show up in the world will help me.

00:43:20.700 --> 00:43:28.710 Eric Sarver Esq: That's a really good point. And essentially how you can use this assessment both early on and also later on. It could be a mediation stage when a conflict.

00:43:29.130 --> 00:43:34.530 Eric Sarver Esq: You know, really come to a head or it can be, you know, pretty much earlier preventively practically, which I think is always

00:43:35.160 --> 00:43:42.600 Eric Sarver Esq: ideal way to go. I represented clients employers who have been defending against suits from or frivolous lawsuits from

00:43:42.960 --> 00:43:52.290 Eric Sarver Esq: You know, employees. They hired. And again, it's the same type of employee, the hiring over and over again. It's a hostile employee or it's a very passive aggressive employee and so often offer them.

00:43:52.740 --> 00:44:01.650 Eric Sarver Esq: The canal, where the defensive mode and now we're in either a potential litigation or mediation, but if they can back it up the pit. Right. We can walk it back.

00:44:02.010 --> 00:44:12.210 Eric Sarver Esq: And look at the situation. Why is this person, why is my client hiring the same type. And if it's the fact that there may be say and I can resolve, you know,

00:44:12.780 --> 00:44:20.850 Eric Sarver Esq: S. Who wants to be a D 123 dominant person and they're trying to or they're reliving some old conflict with an employee can

00:44:21.330 --> 00:44:29.130 Eric Sarver Esq: Be a game changer. You know, I think my philosophy of my clients is that the more harmonious and the more transparent and more communicative

00:44:29.640 --> 00:44:37.740 Eric Sarver Esq: Of an environment that you create in the workplace, right, you have transparency, harmony and communication, the less likely that you'll have

00:44:38.220 --> 00:44:45.240 Eric Sarver Esq: Implicit bias and discrimination and micro aggressions creep in. And that's what leads to, you know, there's the termites that he away the wood.

00:44:45.570 --> 00:45:00.480 Eric Sarver Esq: Which is the foundation of your employment, you know, setting exam. Okay. He is a metaphor. Another speaking engagement, probably in a couple weeks. But for now, we're going to take a brief commercial break. So everyone please stick around. I'm here with Nance chick.

00:45:01.500 --> 00:45:11.070 Eric Sarver Esq: Third year and listening and also her employment law practice as well here on employment law today on talk radio dot NYC. We'll be right back.

00:47:31.650 --> 00:47:47.490 Eric Sarver Esq: Welcome back here again with Nancy. I'm an attorney conflict resolution specialist from third year conflict resolution also instructor in compliance and diversity training specialist and Nance, welcome back to the show.

00:47:48.600 --> 00:48:00.660 Eric Sarver Esq: We talked a lot about right unpacking the personalities of employers business owners managers, how we can help people become aware of their pattern to break those patterns and how that can lead to

00:48:01.320 --> 00:48:10.530 Eric Sarver Esq: foster a more harmonious workplace and I guess we I think you and I know as long journeys that as I mentioned before the break, I believe that the more animal. Yes.

00:48:11.010 --> 00:48:19.560 Eric Sarver Esq: And the more transparent communication. The workplace at the less likely to chance of micro aggressions or bias rejuvenation can begin.

00:48:19.980 --> 00:48:29.430 Eric Sarver Esq: Fun. That's a double edged sword about transparency and communication. And so that leads me to think about a topic that I think is relevant for employers.

00:48:29.940 --> 00:48:38.430 Eric Sarver Esq: during the pandemic, as do it boundaries. Right. Why don't want to hear you talking about has to do with knowing and understanding the limits of respecting personal boundaries.

00:48:38.970 --> 00:48:45.030 Eric Sarver Esq: And with a pandemic, it seems as if you know a lot of people's personal and business lives have been very blended

00:48:45.390 --> 00:48:53.910 Eric Sarver Esq: Right. You're on a zoom call with your staff and you see people's kids in the background running by over here, someone's, you know, husband or wife talking or you see that, you know,

00:48:54.450 --> 00:48:59.580 Eric Sarver Esq: Maybe they got their guitar in the background. Oh, you play guitar. But even just some little thing, you know, there's

00:49:00.510 --> 00:49:06.720 Eric Sarver Esq: A lot, I think, a little bit less than a separation from the employer, the business person shows up the employee.

00:49:07.080 --> 00:49:13.500 Eric Sarver Esq: And private life. So I wonder what how do you handle and address or what advice do you give us a to your clients.

00:49:14.040 --> 00:49:23.190 Eric Sarver Esq: And a business owner who might be perhaps unknowingly as a personal question that their employees, especially now since we're also virtual role so

00:49:23.790 --> 00:49:33.990 Eric Sarver Esq: In this weird space where people are there's less formal often on calls there. So yeah, what are your thoughts about that in terms of identifying those issues.

00:49:35.730 --> 00:49:40.350 Nance Schick: It's interesting. I, it doesn't normally show up immediately as

00:49:40.410 --> 00:49:41.550 The employer.

00:49:42.990 --> 00:49:48.210 Nance Schick: coming to me and me saying, oh, I now know that you do and it used that in that circumstance.

00:49:48.720 --> 00:49:59.100 Nance Schick: It's probably that there's been some sort of complaint. Right. Usually it's an internal complaint that someone felt that an employer manager co worker was

00:49:59.910 --> 00:50:08.310 Nance Schick: asking too many personal questions and I've been in that situation myself. And so at that point, even though I've been telling

00:50:09.090 --> 00:50:21.120 Nance Schick: The, the viewers today and the listeners that if you're the employer. It's on you to set to lay the foundation for the key performance indicators and the job right.

00:50:22.530 --> 00:50:27.540 Nance Schick: But if it's about your comfort level with sharing your personal information.

00:50:27.990 --> 00:50:36.930 Nance Schick: That's on you. The employer or the employee, right, that's, that's where you need to set the boundaries. But I can also understand that conflict of being afraid.

00:50:37.200 --> 00:50:51.720 Nance Schick: Not to play the game. I've been in that situation, you know, where I had an employer that used to hold our staff meetings at the bar and demand that we have a we have a drink with him right um you know as Employment Lawyers yeah the bells are going on and whistles.

00:50:57.630 --> 00:51:09.750 Nance Schick: So, so it's definitely something to be aware of and and I know where I'm usually going to see this is is with the personality type that I am, which is the high s

00:51:10.170 --> 00:51:19.740 Nance Schick: I'm so people oriented and probably your high. I also right so people oriented that sometimes we blend the work and the personal

00:51:20.460 --> 00:51:31.410 Nance Schick: And there's nothing wrong with that. I am not a person that that thinks it's realistic to try and, you know, carve out some sort of box that you fit in and and we're seeing this, like you said, with the pandemic because

00:51:31.770 --> 00:51:36.960 Nance Schick: You know you're learning so much about people just by what's behind them. And as you would call Randy.

00:51:38.220 --> 00:51:38.970 Nance Schick: And so

00:51:39.570 --> 00:51:44.820 Nance Schick: More of the from the mindset, but be aware that if your people oriented.

00:51:45.810 --> 00:51:55.350 Nance Schick: But knowing everything about them might not be even. It might make make you very comfortable and make you feel closer to them. It might not be the same for them.

00:51:55.740 --> 00:52:00.090 Nance Schick: And that's what we're talking about with the DISC assessment is looking at things from both sides.

00:52:00.540 --> 00:52:09.510 Nance Schick: Right, recognizing our own tendencies, but the assessment will also show you how you might interact with other people and make them uncomfortable.

00:52:10.320 --> 00:52:18.660 Nance Schick: And then it'll give you some steps that you can take to not do that to reach out and and and extend the hand.

00:52:19.050 --> 00:52:29.220 Nance Schick: That brings them into your world on your level and you can have a different conversation. So if you know that you're you've got somebody that asked a lot of personal questions.

00:52:30.060 --> 00:52:34.830 Nance Schick: You can privately. That's another thing is do it privately, especially if you know you're dealing with a high

00:52:35.280 --> 00:52:40.230 Nance Schick: S or a high see who's more introverted, they're not going to be want to be called out right

00:52:40.590 --> 00:52:44.910 Nance Schick: And of course, a dominant person is is has a fear of being taken advantage of.

00:52:45.150 --> 00:52:56.640 Nance Schick: Money, so they're if they feel like you're manipulating them in some way that's going to blow up in your face. So it's like it's really learning about the different dynamics and not making anybody feel bad about who they are.

00:52:57.780 --> 00:53:13.800 Nance Schick: And telling them that they have to change and become someone else because we're all different. So it's just a tool for us to learn new skills so that we can come together in different ways, because again we need all of these personality types on our team to get things done.

00:53:14.790 --> 00:53:26.790 Eric Sarver Esq: Right. You know, I've had cases in the past where defending an employer or there was a potential case. And often, I found that when I say whether it was dominant personality and just took our view is that the

00:53:27.570 --> 00:53:32.580 Eric Sarver Esq: DIFC dominant eyes introverted so supportive and see is compliant, is that right today.

00:53:33.000 --> 00:53:34.830 Nance Schick: Actually is influencing

00:53:34.980 --> 00:53:42.990 Nance Schick: Influencing because you're here. So some seeds are both introverted and your dominant and here. So your D and I are more extroverted

00:53:43.500 --> 00:53:45.060 Eric Sarver Esq: Okay, here's my hair reading couldn't be there.

00:53:46.860 --> 00:53:49.860 Nance Schick: I'm giving you a lot of information in a short period so

00:53:49.950 --> 00:53:55.170 Eric Sarver Esq: It's really helpful information. I think for our viewers and listeners to know you, too. So I appreciate that. I think that

00:53:55.800 --> 00:54:05.880 Eric Sarver Esq: In that regard to when you have employers sometimes that are overly intrusive, it could lay the groundwork for explanation claims, especially if it's a man and a woman.

00:54:06.540 --> 00:54:15.750 Eric Sarver Esq: Interacting and then they create an unknowingly no charge environment, somebody may feel that somebody is, you know, trying to, you know, stay

00:54:16.590 --> 00:54:23.760 Eric Sarver Esq: Firm with them or groom them and it could create all kinds of problems, and it may not be on the person's mind whatsoever. But I think it's important

00:54:24.120 --> 00:54:33.120 Eric Sarver Esq: So what I hear you say it through your company you help not only with the resolution of conflict if the people who did not come to you first, but also you help them.

00:54:33.750 --> 00:54:42.660 Eric Sarver Esq: People practically to recognize and set healthy boundaries in the workplace, which is so crucial during this time I think during coldly because of a distrust.

00:54:42.960 --> 00:55:00.750 Eric Sarver Esq: They're all under which makes us go to our default settings and be because of the blurring boundaries. And so I think you know with that I wanted to give you some space to to wrap up, and to tell our viewers and our listeners tonight. That's how they might get in touch with you.

00:55:02.160 --> 00:55:15.360 Eric Sarver Esq: We've got a couple minutes or so before the shows and tonight. I'm just wanting to see, can you maybe you have a smartphone want to share it with I think I believe you had a slide that you said to me, and

00:55:16.440 --> 00:55:35.190 Eric Sarver Esq: I will try to locate that slow. I don't see if my zoom skills are, I want to share your slide with the screen. Hold on one second here. Let's see if I can get that going. In the meantime, why don't you tell our viewers, like how they can reach out and contact you.

00:55:37.290 --> 00:55:53.940 Nance Schick: So my primary contact is is through my still through my law firm website at and as in Nancy s CH IC K my last name la So Nancy right Nancy and and check law com is my email address that's Nancy, with an e.

00:55:56.010 --> 00:56:04.950 Nance Schick: So that's probably the easiest way I have some more information about the disk on the website. I also have a YouTube channel I occasionally talk about this.

00:56:05.280 --> 00:56:14.340 Nance Schick: I talked regularly about 30 or conflict resolution and how to listen differently. I have as matter of fact I was recording a video right before our show today about

00:56:15.060 --> 00:56:22.380 Nance Schick: Not only why it's important. This is the follow up to why it's important to listen differently. But how do you do that, right, because we have all these

00:56:22.710 --> 00:56:34.200 Nance Schick: tag lines and everything out there and they sound so good and they make nice hashtags and we share them and Yay, we feel like we're in the movement right and then it comes time to take action.

00:56:36.030 --> 00:56:42.510 Nance Schick: And that's again why I really like the disc is because it gives us a lot of different ideas for

00:56:43.140 --> 00:56:54.330 Nance Schick: How we as individuals can take actions within the way that we tend to function in the world. So if we're more if we're more introverted being asked to go out and March.

00:56:55.020 --> 00:56:58.770 Nance Schick: Or speak in an event might not be that comfortable for us.

00:56:59.760 --> 00:57:12.000 Nance Schick: Right and and and that those see personalities. They want to be perfectionist and stay behind the scenes and get this, you know, get the system together. So we don't want to ask them to go out and do sales.

00:57:12.510 --> 00:57:20.940 Nance Schick: Right, and so it's just recognizing that you know it's okay that people are who they are sometimes training will change that, but

00:57:21.000 --> 00:57:24.750 Nance Schick: But we also need to be aware that sometimes you just don't have the right fit for the

00:57:24.750 --> 00:57:29.670 Nance Schick: Right, the right job. Right. And rather than making that person a demon.

00:57:30.780 --> 00:57:48.510 Nance Schick: And firing them right and inviting a lawsuit. We want to just look at each other as human beings with different personalities and skills and experiences wants, needs, etc. And we really can use all of this to come together and I even terminated employees.

00:57:49.740 --> 00:57:55.680 Nance Schick: Where it was a joint resolution where we were. We both recognize it just wasn't working out.

00:57:57.090 --> 00:57:58.080 Nance Schick: And we're still friendly.

00:57:59.400 --> 00:58:01.230 Nance Schick: That's a great way to end things

00:58:01.770 --> 00:58:02.730 Eric Sarver Esq: It really is, you know,

00:58:03.420 --> 00:58:12.270 Eric Sarver Esq: People don't always realize that you know you can have a warm, you know, I would say fuzzy like sounds almost like a negative connotation, but a very warm

00:58:12.630 --> 00:58:20.970 Eric Sarver Esq: And positive outcome. And that actually is when even for the importance know some employers want to go in and sort of fight.

00:58:21.330 --> 00:58:29.790 Eric Sarver Esq: When they have a conflict. And often, you know, it's the old you catch more flies with honey, you know, where does the story of the wind and the sun trying to blow the person's

00:58:30.570 --> 00:58:40.710 Eric Sarver Esq: Get the person's either cut off right and the Sun God warns them, they take it off the wind is blowing harshly. So, I mean, I think we covered a lot there. Again, your website. My apologies. I'm trying to get your

00:58:42.210 --> 00:58:47.610 Eric Sarver Esq: Slide to flash on the screen, but it's if people want to reach its WWW dot

00:58:49.740 --> 00:58:50.250 Nance Schick: Dot com

00:58:50.760 --> 00:59:03.120 Eric Sarver Esq: So, n CH IC K Le and your name again is Nancy. Nancy. Oh shit, I will be sure to post that on for the series of the early stages so people know we have

00:59:03.840 --> 00:59:07.680 Eric Sarver Esq: This will be on talk to NYC and also to be on Facebook. So

00:59:08.640 --> 00:59:25.770 Eric Sarver Esq: We have to wrap up for the evening, but I really want to thank Nance shake for appearing on tonight's episode of employment law today breaking toxic patterns and employer, employee relations, folks. Tune in Wednesday or Tuesday nights on here tonight 5pm 6pm with dynamic guests like Nancy

00:59:26.910 --> 00:59:35.340 Eric Sarver Esq: talk radio NYC and I thank everyone for joining us and I wish you all a very, very pleasant evening, Nancy. Thank you, truly. Thank you so much.

00:59:35.430 --> 00:59:36.030 Nance Schick: Thank you.

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