The Mind Behind Leadership

Thursday, October 1, 2020
Facebook Live Video from 2020/10/01 - Winning Friends Along the Way


2020/10/01 - Winning Friends Along the Way

[NEW EPISODE] Winning Friends Along the Way

Joining us this week is Joe Hart the President & CEO of Dale Carnegie the worldwide leader in professional development, performance improvement, leadership training, and employee engagement.

We'll be exploring the fundamental Principles of Leadership and how approaches may have changed in the last 12 months. We'll also talk about the challenges of heading a Global organization that is being impacted at a local level.

As with millions of other people, the Dale Carnegie Course has had a profound and transformational impact on Joe's life. He is excited to serve as the leader of this tremendous organization and to work with an amazing and talented team to help individuals and businesses unlock their greatness and to perform at their very best.

Tune in for this insightful conversation at or watch the Facebook Livestream by clicking here.

Show Notes

Segment 1

Graham introduces the guest of the show Joe Hart. The conversation begins with Joe discussing how he left an unfulfilling career in law to become the leader of Dale Carnegie. He talks about his transition from a more robust and individualistic practice in his time as a lawyer to heading a less adversarial and more collaborative career path. Joe talks about what he’s learned about business leadership while being the head of Dale Carnegie. He then gives his perspective on the difference of being a CEO and an entrepreneur.

Segment 2

Joe Hart thinks back to winning his Transformative Leader award and how he would describe a transformative leader. He then talks about the impact of having a good team around you. He talks about maintaining focus, forming a strong culture, and leading everyone into a single direction. Joe also shares some advice on building trust and strong, healthy relationships among employees.

Segment 3

The conversation continues with Joe sharing his perspective as a global business leader leading into the pandemic. He explains the mindset he’s had to maintain in order to lead the company through these tumultuous times and changes that he’s found within himself during the global crisis. He also talks about the importance of listening to your gut and making tough decisions when it comes to employees.

Segment 4

Joe talks about equipping your team to be successful in our modern technology-focused world and the jump to digital services. He gives advice to business owners to engage employees during hard times, emphasizing empathy and team-building, also sharing what he feels are some of the more underrated values when it comes to leadership.


00:00:27.150 --> 00:00:32.850 Graham Dobbin: Good evening and welcome to the mind behind leadership live on talk radio dot NYC.

00:00:33.180 --> 00:00:41.130 Graham Dobbin: My name is Graham Dobbin and every week we speak with real leaders and entrepreneurs from a variety of fields about the personal journeys.

00:00:41.490 --> 00:00:48.360 Graham Dobbin: We explore what makes a successful leader the tapes or hurdles that they've got to overcome and obviously gain some real life. Life insights

00:00:48.690 --> 00:00:57.510 Graham Dobbin: Know, tonight we're incredibly lucky we don't just have a leader of a global company. It's a company that's also at the forefront of leadership development.

00:00:57.720 --> 00:01:04.860 Graham Dobbin: For some of the largest businesses in the world. So we have the opportunity to explore both sides, this evening. So, who's my guest.

00:01:05.190 --> 00:01:10.920 Graham Dobbin: I'm against is a Joe Hart, who is the president and CEO of Dale Carnegie training.

00:01:11.310 --> 00:01:21.330 Graham Dobbin: Dale Carnegie training is an organization that the founder of pioneered the performance movement over 100 years ago and has continued to succeed and grow worldwide.

00:01:21.720 --> 00:01:26.040 Graham Dobbin: Through constant research and innovation, building on its founding principles so

00:01:26.370 --> 00:01:34.590 Graham Dobbin: Just to give an idea of the size of this business and Dale Carnegie training is more than 3000 trainers and consultants operating in 200 offices.

00:01:34.890 --> 00:01:48.570 Graham Dobbin: And 86 countries impacting organizations teams and individuals that client list is incredible. For over 400 of the global fortune 500 10s of thousands of small businesses and get this

00:01:48.960 --> 00:01:58.890 Graham Dobbin: 8,000,008 million individuals across the globe. And so, George actually a Dale Carnegie graduate will be exploring that a little bit more

00:01:59.430 --> 00:02:08.520 Graham Dobbin: And it a lot. He actually worked closely with the company as a strategic partner for nearly 10 years before taking the reins, as the President and CEO and

00:02:09.180 --> 00:02:26.730 Graham Dobbin: Joe has helped build to technology businesses and info ally, which is sold in 2005 and I said, health, it also holds a bachelor's degree in political science from University of Michigan and a law degree from Wayne State University Law School. Joe Hart. Good evening. Welcome.

00:02:27.090 --> 00:02:28.350 Joe Hart: A gram. Great to see you.

00:02:28.650 --> 00:02:29.670 Graham Dobbin: Great to see you too.

00:02:30.000 --> 00:02:31.080 Joe Hart: Nice introduction and

00:02:32.010 --> 00:02:44.220 Graham Dobbin: I'm sure you've taken a red, I would say, possibly an unusual route to becoming the president and CEO of, you know, one of the most respected training companies in the world got a bit of an insight there. How did you end up here.

00:02:45.360 --> 00:02:53.220 Joe Hart: It's a, it's actually a pretty incredible journey. I sometimes don't believe it myself, you know, Graham. I started out as a lawyer.

00:02:53.700 --> 00:03:07.530 Joe Hart: And might, you know, I was always very intentional wanted to go right through college, go right through law school become a Warren, a large firm and and I did that I did all those things. And I was a lawyer and 1995

00:03:08.640 --> 00:03:19.590 Joe Hart: While ago I took a Dale Carnegie courses young lawyer, and you know, Graham I all I wanted to do really was to better myself. My dad had talked about the chorus had heard great things about the course.

00:03:20.100 --> 00:03:33.000 Joe Hart: I had no idea what was going to happen. And what happened was that that program really just helped lead me on this path of self discovery it challenged me as you know being a one of our great trainers around vision.

00:03:33.630 --> 00:03:49.740 Joe Hart: And I really started to think to myself about as much as I was a good lawyer wasn't really a happy lawyer and that led me on the path to ultimately leave the practice of law started job there are new to my own

00:03:50.490 --> 00:04:00.510 Joe Hart: Company. And that was an E learning company and and my first client was Dale Carnegie and I developed you learning products programs for Dale Carnegie around the world in

00:04:01.110 --> 00:04:05.100 Joe Hart: The early 2000s, long before early learning was really a thing, so to speak.

00:04:05.970 --> 00:04:20.040 Joe Hart: And ultimately sold the business and work to start another one with some some partners. And then I was recruited Dale Carnegie, so it's been an incredible journey. I consider myself unbelievably you know fortunate and blessed to be here. I'm

00:04:20.220 --> 00:04:22.380 Graham Dobbin: Already thinking you were to litigation attorney.

00:04:23.160 --> 00:04:23.910 Joe Hart: Correct, yeah.

00:04:24.300 --> 00:04:34.020 Graham Dobbin: Okay, so what, what was the change like going for something that would probably be considered adversarial to more collaborative always change like

00:04:34.110 --> 00:04:44.100 Joe Hart: That this is a really insightful question because you know the nature of water right you advocate for your clients and especially the litigation process very contentious.

00:04:44.490 --> 00:04:55.020 Joe Hart: But, you know, another real breakthrough for me from the Dale Carnegie program was just really around how I interacted with other people and and really developing a level of empathy and appreciation. I just think about

00:04:55.560 --> 00:05:04.350 Joe Hart: You know, I can't say this, you know, maybe for everybody for lawyers, but for me I maybe I've done a little bit arrogant, as a young lawyer and

00:05:05.160 --> 00:05:19.560 Joe Hart: You know, I was really grateful for Dale Carnegie for just helping me see, you know, part of what we do in Dale Carnegie we help help you see something about yourself that you didn't see. And so, you know, once I had that epiphany. I really worked very hard.

00:05:21.300 --> 00:05:29.640 Joe Hart: To apply the Dale Carnegie principles and to not be so adversarial you know I'm saying as lawyers or are you just because it's what we do, you know, but

00:05:30.870 --> 00:05:38.220 Joe Hart: You don't want to Dale Carnegie's principles is, you know, is that the only way to get the best of an argument to avoid it. That's what contrarian from a larger standpoint.

00:05:39.480 --> 00:05:49.080 Graham Dobbin: So, um, so isn't what you thought it would be. Because you to call traditional in 2015, I believe. Yes. Is it is it what you thought it would be.

00:05:50.370 --> 00:05:59.910 Joe Hart: You know in many ways. Yes, certainly. I hadn't anticipated what we're going to be going through right now. So this has been really a requirement for me to

00:06:00.750 --> 00:06:07.560 Joe Hart: To really dig deep and to lead with as much courage as I can and and. But even still, you know,

00:06:08.160 --> 00:06:19.410 Joe Hart: Grand. The reason that I I you know I was the president of a company that I helped start, I would not have left that business probably friend anything other than Dale Carnegie and I left it because

00:06:20.100 --> 00:06:29.490 Joe Hart: It's such an amazing business that had a huge impact on me and and I really wanted to help reawaken the business, if you will, in some sense,

00:06:30.090 --> 00:06:37.530 Joe Hart: Around our branding around our connection around the world, and so forth. And, and I'm very proud of what we've been able to do over the last five years to do that.

00:06:38.460 --> 00:06:53.700 Graham Dobbin: So what what's different than from what you imagine, can you, I mean, obviously, we've got the we've got the current situation that you say we we couldn't predict that in 2015, but is there anything that jumps out. That's really different from when you came into this role.

00:06:55.080 --> 00:07:01.260 Joe Hart: Well, one of the things I'd say is different. Well, maybe a little bit different is

00:07:01.860 --> 00:07:16.350 Joe Hart: You know, we've got operations, you know, all over the world and some and those operations that people who are leading those teams put their heart and soul into the business and I knew that. And, you know, part of what I expected. When I came here was that

00:07:17.580 --> 00:07:22.800 Joe Hart: I knew that there was there was a need to restore trust with a lot of those those teams and

00:07:23.700 --> 00:07:34.470 Joe Hart: You know, maybe that wasn't what i mean i i knew that it was there and I discovered there was a significance to it so that that was really one of the highest priorities. I had we talked about one Carnegie and

00:07:34.980 --> 00:07:52.380 Joe Hart: You know, the, I guess one thing that really stood out the importance of this one. Carnegie mindset. And this is true of any business. I think that you might have 200 to 300 to 100 or 10 locations, but you have to work together as one. One team and and so what one thing that has been

00:07:53.490 --> 00:07:59.070 Joe Hart: Terrific for me is to seeing how awesome it is when our teams really come together and work together as well as they have

00:08:00.030 --> 00:08:07.950 Joe Hart: As a company, we've grown our global accounts significantly. We work with companies that have locations all over the world. So we've got to deliver a seamless and you're part of

00:08:08.400 --> 00:08:18.330 Joe Hart: That yourself so you know what that's like. But I think that that was one epiphany. Is this really just to see and experience the power of global teams working together.

00:08:19.320 --> 00:08:29.730 Graham Dobbin: I'm I'm cubic. I'd like to dig into was linked to kind of lead a global company and the different cultures and everything a little bit later, but one. One question that really jumps to mind know Justin on

00:08:30.240 --> 00:08:41.160 Graham Dobbin: The transfer that you made. So you've gone from attorney to entrepreneur to President and CEO. So what's the difference between being an entrepreneur and being a president and CEO of a business if any

00:08:42.720 --> 00:08:53.250 Joe Hart: You know, it's interesting as an entrepreneur you you do whatever it takes. I remember just very early starting a business from nothing and and

00:08:53.760 --> 00:09:00.150 Joe Hart: And just really the the the harrowing days around that. So you're talking about going from starting from sin thing of debt.

00:09:00.750 --> 00:09:07.680 Joe Hart: Which is nothing and building it to stepping into a company that's now this month 108 years old.

00:09:08.220 --> 00:09:19.260 Joe Hart: You know, so, you know, the companies that I have and I sold that and then, you know, had started another company and so that company also you know that company grew fairly significantly

00:09:19.980 --> 00:09:29.610 Joe Hart: You know, but but we're talking about between with a Dale Carnegie and iconic company with locations all over the world 32 languages that we train and

00:09:30.450 --> 00:09:38.940 Joe Hart: I mean, culturally, that that has been. I mean, I've traveled all over the world and and seeing the power and the impact of of Dale Carnegie, but

00:09:39.360 --> 00:09:43.380 Joe Hart: So, you know, I mean, so the difference has been around.

00:09:44.190 --> 00:09:55.620 Joe Hart: You know the established nature and system. I think another thing RAM, it's harder to move an established company. I think if you asked me about things that were surprises to me, which is one of your first questions.

00:09:56.040 --> 00:10:01.050 Joe Hart: One of the things that has been a surprise is how long it takes, how hard it is sometimes to

00:10:02.160 --> 00:10:16.440 Joe Hart: To really to to move. I mean, I mean accustomed to moving fast having urgency. Let's go. And you know, it's certainly a lot harder when you when you have an organization of this this breath.

00:10:17.310 --> 00:10:24.330 Graham Dobbin: You put on down to, is there any one thing is it, is it just holding it companies, kind of a bowl that people

00:10:24.960 --> 00:10:27.810 Joe Hart: I think so I you know I mean all companies that cultures.

00:10:28.860 --> 00:10:37.890 Joe Hart: Certainly companies that have existed for a long time have long established cultures long established ways of doing things and and even ironically

00:10:38.400 --> 00:10:45.810 Joe Hart: Even a company like ours, where we really teach people about breakthroughs and being flexible and change and so forth.

00:10:46.470 --> 00:10:51.810 Joe Hart: That's something that when I first came here, I don't think that there's been a lot of change in the organization.

00:10:52.380 --> 00:11:01.410 Joe Hart: And, you know, at least dynamic change, you know, and I think about what we've been able to do over the last nine months could not have happened.

00:11:01.800 --> 00:11:13.110 Joe Hart: But for the foundation, the great people that we have in our company that basically hit started in the we were moving faster and really clicking and working together as a global companies a single global company.

00:11:14.280 --> 00:11:21.000 Joe Hart: And in that also I think maybe been a little bit different. I think that before I came. The philosophy was there was a little more

00:11:22.200 --> 00:11:27.000 Joe Hart: decentralization and we're still decentralized, but the idea of working together as one global team.

00:11:28.230 --> 00:11:29.370 Joe Hart: It might have been a little bit different.

00:11:30.090 --> 00:11:34.950 Graham Dobbin: Was there anything special that you needed to do to engage people when you first came into the business.

00:11:35.490 --> 00:11:41.070 Graham Dobbin: Because obviously coming in from the outside on a really established business, as you see, it's no 108 years old, this one.

00:11:41.190 --> 00:11:41.490 Yeah.

00:11:42.540 --> 00:11:47.280 Graham Dobbin: Wow, what did you do passionately to engage other people

00:11:48.030 --> 00:11:55.500 Joe Hart: You know, grab the first thing and the most important thing was really just listening. I went on what I call a listening tour.

00:11:56.700 --> 00:12:07.830 Joe Hart: Again, that's the heart and soul of our Dale Carnegie principles certainly being a good listener and so forth. But, you know, it really was. I mean, and here's the here's the truth. And this is something I've come to really

00:12:08.610 --> 00:12:15.630 Joe Hart: Internalize you're asking about the difference between entrepreneurship and not and sometimes entrepreneurship, you really feel like you have the answers and you're moving, so forth.

00:12:16.020 --> 00:12:23.130 Joe Hart: It was maybe I was in those days, a little more directive, when I came to Dale Carnegie, I realized that

00:12:23.880 --> 00:12:30.090 Joe Hart: That's not really going to work the person who comes into the business from outside the business Kansas come in and start saying, here's what we're going to do.

00:12:30.720 --> 00:12:35.940 Joe Hart: You have to spend time, you have to understand the people understand the business understand the values build trust.

00:12:36.360 --> 00:12:40.980 Joe Hart: And I just spent a lot of time really talking to people reaching out to people around the world.

00:12:41.580 --> 00:12:50.340 Joe Hart: Just really to listen and say, you know, what do you think of the most important things that we need to do if we did those things. What would the impact and the business be and we put together a plan.

00:12:50.760 --> 00:13:07.200 Joe Hart: At that time, was it was called the foundation plan that was the strategy of the business that guided us for the first four years of my being there and that foundation plan really was very, very significant in terms of, you know, really setting us up for for what has been success.

00:13:07.590 --> 00:13:19.710 Graham Dobbin: But was there a moment when you thought, I've got this is it. No, it's beginning to move. After all, the listening. Was there a moment nearly you can kind of look back and go, that was the time that it began to change for me. Yes.

00:13:20.040 --> 00:13:24.000 Joe Hart: The moment was when I was looked, I talked to people.

00:13:24.480 --> 00:13:32.250 Joe Hart: And and i everyone has different thoughts. But when I would start to see common patterns that was the moment. And I'd say you know it so

00:13:32.520 --> 00:13:43.260 Joe Hart: If I asked you, what do you think we should do, you might say thing. But when you talk to enough people and you start to see what the patterns are then all of a sudden, things started to crystallize and come together and really, this is the this is the most important point.

00:13:43.710 --> 00:13:53.970 Joe Hart: Is that I can't think of an idea I've had that's ever been not been made better by other people, but by working together and talking and listening and being open to the ideas of others.

00:13:54.330 --> 00:14:06.390 Joe Hart: You know, we really can create something much better. And frankly, the people who I was talking to new much more about the business than I did. They have great ideas and it would have been foolish for me not to to listen, but then also to bring in my experience.

00:14:06.420 --> 00:14:08.880 Joe Hart: And my thought to put those things together. Yeah.

00:14:09.090 --> 00:14:13.410 Graham Dobbin: I'm after the break, we'll dig into that a little bit more about the people around you.

00:14:13.740 --> 00:14:20.550 Graham Dobbin: And also have a look at what it's like to to really dig in. With these culture, the different cultures going around the world.

00:14:20.850 --> 00:14:32.190 Graham Dobbin: And the different companies that you're dealing with. You're listening to the mind behind the leadership, we're speaking with Joe Hart, who's the president and CEO of Dale Carnegie. My name is Graham Dobbin. We'll be right back after these messages.

00:16:53.310 --> 00:17:01.920 Graham Dobbin: Welcome back to the mind blank leadership with me grim Dobbin we're speaking with Joe Hart, who is the president and CEO of Dale Carnegie know Joe

00:17:02.220 --> 00:17:19.710 Graham Dobbin: And 2019 I'm going to embarrass you a little bit here. You were awarded a transformational CEO or leaders award. What's it like being a transformational leader of an organization that dedicates itself to creating transformational leaders as that's surely that setting really high expectations.

00:17:20.340 --> 00:17:26.340 Joe Hart: Well, it was an honor to receive the award. Thank you for mentioning that I guess I've really viewed that award honestly as

00:17:27.150 --> 00:17:35.160 Joe Hart: a testament to the organization. I mean, we're an organization Dale Carnegie's all that's all about transformation about bringing the best out in people and breakthroughs.

00:17:35.760 --> 00:17:40.680 Joe Hart: And I feel like you know my role since I've been here really has been about being a catalyst

00:17:41.190 --> 00:17:55.740 Joe Hart: Just like what we do in Dale Carnegie's we help people unlock their greatness and my, my view has been, how do I help this organization and the people here. Just be great and and i think that recognition was one that that really goes to the people of Dale Carnegie

00:17:56.850 --> 00:18:00.960 Graham Dobbin: You mentioned importance earlier about having a good team around you.

00:18:01.620 --> 00:18:14.550 Graham Dobbin: How do you choose a good team when you're looking to change things, but you also want to keep that that history there that they the culture and everything else that goes with it, but you want that movement. So how do you begin to balance that

00:18:15.000 --> 00:18:24.750 Joe Hart: It definitely is a balance. You know, it's the good thing is when I came here, there were there were so many just tremendous people and

00:18:25.470 --> 00:18:33.720 Joe Hart: And really, there are a lot of people that I was able to learn from. And as I was able to bring some people into the organization, part of what I looked at was, what would

00:18:34.530 --> 00:18:43.080 Joe Hart: You know, what do we need to balance this we've got we've got wisdom. We got experience you get insight. You know, the one thing that's been important to me. Graham is really how do we move faster.

00:18:43.320 --> 00:18:45.120 Joe Hart: Right. How do we have a

00:18:45.150 --> 00:18:50.940 Joe Hart: stronger sense of urgency. So part of what I've tried to look at our, our people who have urgency.

00:18:51.780 --> 00:19:00.600 Joe Hart: People who have a passion for the business, certainly in the business that we're in, you have to believe in the greatness and people, we believe, Dale Carnegie

00:19:00.930 --> 00:19:05.640 Joe Hart: Every person has inherent greatness. So I'm looking for someone who's got kind of that that heart, so to speak.

00:19:06.270 --> 00:19:16.530 Joe Hart: And someone has clearly got a strong experience to help complement us so you know what what types of talents. Do we have what types of talents. Do we need, how do we bring those people in and how do we move fast.

00:19:17.550 --> 00:19:28.680 Graham Dobbin: And was just with with Sir, I'm wondering if there's a different way of motivating those new people that are coming into this fast movers and then the traditional people that people who've been there may be a little bit longer.

00:19:30.030 --> 00:19:33.360 Graham Dobbin: Again, how do you, how'd you how'd you balance that different motivation.

00:19:35.190 --> 00:19:41.850 Joe Hart: You know i think it's it's it's a really great questions. I know that are HIV. We're not supposed to great questions. But it's a great

00:19:41.850 --> 00:19:42.300 Question.

00:19:44.850 --> 00:19:48.330 Graham Dobbin: Joe, you can tell me I'm asking great questions. All the I'm good with that. I'm good with that.

00:19:48.480 --> 00:19:55.200 Joe Hart: Yeah, no, I mean it's it's true, though. I mean, I think part of it is, you know, one of my mentors, someone who I

00:19:55.710 --> 00:20:06.480 Joe Hart: I really look up to his manager Allah. Allah. Allah. Allah. Allah was the former CEO of buying and for lead those companies through crisis times help them a verte bankruptcy.

00:20:06.960 --> 00:20:19.260 Joe Hart: Part of what he's really emphasized, to me, is the importance of the important role that the CEO has and really driving culture and and really, you know, casting a vision and and really holding people to

00:20:20.340 --> 00:20:25.320 Joe Hart: You know, zero tolerance for behaviors that are antithetical to the values of the organization. So

00:20:26.100 --> 00:20:33.000 Joe Hart: You know, part of it is you know you cast a value or a vision and you talk about where we're going. You talk about values.

00:20:33.420 --> 00:20:42.360 Joe Hart: And, you know, hopefully people align around that people who don't align around that you know will often say, you know, this really isn't for me and they'll leave or sometimes

00:20:42.720 --> 00:20:55.770 Joe Hart: You know, in some occasions, you know, you might have to ask them to leave. But by and large, I think people want to do great things, and especially people in Dale Carnegie. I've never met a group of people that care so much about

00:20:56.520 --> 00:21:03.060 Joe Hart: really helping individuals and teams and companies and organizations and communities, you know. So when we talk about

00:21:03.750 --> 00:21:14.130 Joe Hart: You know the vision of really taking our Dale Carnegie principles to more people and more companies and more cultures, to the point where Dale Carnegie becomes a verb. People are saying, you nailed it, and so forth.

00:21:14.580 --> 00:21:20.580 Joe Hart: You know, people can get excited about that. People want to be a part of something, you know, big so so it's at the point, Graham.

00:21:21.210 --> 00:21:24.900 Joe Hart: I think it really is the CEOs role to cast a vision.

00:21:25.650 --> 00:21:43.320 Joe Hart: To inspire to focus on on culture and really then to help move the organization in that direction. I've been very fortunate because I think people have just, you know, wanted to go. People want more, and they want to take Dale Carnegie to more people.

00:21:44.160 --> 00:21:58.590 Graham Dobbin: So it's interesting because when you got teams that want more than they're driven to keep going in the understand the culture and the vision and the values are good, but sometimes that's sort of that's also difficult to keep on track. We've got a business here. It's got

00:21:59.640 --> 00:22:11.070 Graham Dobbin: Phenomenal global brand. Um, how would you go about maintaining the reputation, how you want it to be maintained and you know you don't have people going off left right and center and doing their own thing.

00:22:11.820 --> 00:22:17.400 Joe Hart: Yeah, I think there's a couple ways to look at that, you know, part of it is you know just internally within the organization.

00:22:17.700 --> 00:22:28.560 Joe Hart: You know, what are the things that we value and what are the things that we we hold each other accountable to and when we, when we see that those things are violated. You know, how do we how do we behave and

00:22:29.400 --> 00:22:40.290 Joe Hart: You know, I think by and large, we've had people who, and you've got the I mean within, within a global organization, you've got board to conduct in those kinds of things. But you know, I think.

00:22:41.220 --> 00:22:52.440 Joe Hart: Culture, you know, grim culture really is the game changer. I think in any organization. If you look at a company and you say this company is innovative.

00:22:52.710 --> 00:23:02.310 Joe Hart: And you were to take that word and replace it with political that's going to change everything right. I mean, so, so the the adjectives that describe the culture.

00:23:02.910 --> 00:23:09.000 Joe Hart: Will then yield really to the kind of results that that company gets that organization gets so

00:23:09.810 --> 00:23:19.530 Joe Hart: You know, by way of example, we've talked about one Carnegie what what does one Carnegie mean we used to have a lot of conflicts between some of our regional offices, some of our country offices.

00:23:19.920 --> 00:23:25.110 Joe Hart: They might compete with each other when. And so part of what we talked about for years was look

00:23:25.530 --> 00:23:33.060 Joe Hart: You know, we're here to serve. That's our purpose our function is to serve to serve our clients is to serve our team members is to hurt server our shareholders.

00:23:33.450 --> 00:23:45.840 Joe Hart: And and but we're here to serve. And, you know, we should be treating each other. The way that we would want to be treated. And so, I mean, we started talking about those kinds of things. And we started talking about what is one Carnegie mean and

00:23:46.440 --> 00:23:54.540 Joe Hart: You know, there are lots of books that talk about you know go giving and that type of thing. If you want to get you give and that type of thing. And what I found.

00:23:55.020 --> 00:24:09.660 Joe Hart: Is that as our organization has come together more and more as a one Carnegie business it's it's it's self enforcing, so to speak. When people kind of get on the line with that that culture, other people can see it. They notice it and

00:24:10.860 --> 00:24:25.530 Joe Hart: Now, and I'd say, for the most part it it's works pretty well not not completely. I mean, there are occasions where, you know, you have to step in and and take steps, whatever the case might be. But

00:24:26.100 --> 00:24:32.700 Joe Hart: But culture and and frankly, that's the one thing I'd like to keep working on as a company is how do we continue to have a stronger culture.

00:24:33.630 --> 00:24:50.100 Graham Dobbin: Yeah, I mean, I suppose when you've got a global brand like this, and you've got all those cultures, people can do things just with the best of intent bit maybe just steer settle the way I just suddenly thought, I'm wondering, because I'm a lot of the operation is franchised

00:24:50.460 --> 00:24:51.540 Graham Dobbin: Now, throughout the world.

00:24:51.960 --> 00:25:02.760 Graham Dobbin: So I'm just wondering how that how being an entrepreneur, before being the president, the CEO helps you deal with franchisees who are business owners or business unit owners. Yeah.

00:25:02.790 --> 00:25:08.220 Joe Hart: It helped it helped incredibly because you know our franchise owners.

00:25:08.790 --> 00:25:22.620 Joe Hart: You know, put their, their lives, their hearts their souls that are money they wake up every day thinking about the business thinking about their clients but but they're running a business. They're running, you know, usually a small to medium sized business in a market.

00:25:23.670 --> 00:25:33.510 Joe Hart: And and I've done that, you know, and I've got great appreciation for you know what it is that they're doing and what it means to run, you know, that kind of a business so

00:25:34.380 --> 00:25:46.410 Joe Hart: You know, when the economy goes south or you've got, you know, a coven situation and people are thinking about, you know, cash flow and morale. I mean like I live that you know personally so

00:25:47.130 --> 00:25:57.000 Joe Hart: I think that's enabled me to to operate from a place of empathy great empathy and appreciation for our franchise owners and and i hope trust.

00:25:57.480 --> 00:26:04.380 Joe Hart: Because frankly, I've worked very hard to build trust I care about them. I truly love them and what they do and

00:26:04.740 --> 00:26:18.570 Joe Hart: And I'm hopeful that they would say, you know, as a franchise or we've got your back. I mean, we're not perfect to franchise or a franchisee relationship. We got a long way to go, ultimately, to, you know, to being perfect, if you will.

00:26:18.750 --> 00:26:19.080 Graham Dobbin: But

00:26:19.140 --> 00:26:21.930 Joe Hart: But that's the heart and you know that's what we're trying to do.

00:26:22.740 --> 00:26:32.340 Graham Dobbin: I suppose when intense there, then everything else can come together, it's going to take time, but when it's done with it. Right. So, I mean, you mentioned you mentioned the current times we can

00:26:32.670 --> 00:26:42.360 Joe Hart: Actually catch up because I'm going to catch up. But you're kind of this. There's something in between the conversation that's really important. And that's trust. I think that when you have trust.

00:26:43.200 --> 00:26:54.120 Joe Hart: Me just I think about, you know, just with my wife, there's incredible trust, I can say something which may be might be thoughtless in she might

00:26:54.690 --> 00:27:03.570 Joe Hart: Say, well you know what she may be able to correct me on that. But because there's there's trust, and I apologize if I do something like that but but where there's trust.

00:27:04.290 --> 00:27:13.830 Joe Hart: You know, you really can accomplish so much more. There's that foundation and that's really my goal is to build a strong foundation of trust in every relationship.

00:27:14.790 --> 00:27:22.530 Joe Hart: Again, hopefully I can do that. And we can do that internally with our team members with our franchise owners with our customers.

00:27:23.160 --> 00:27:32.160 Joe Hart: I think about, you know, some of the clients, you know, we've got a New York City office and I guess I shouldn't say the name of this company one very large company and and

00:27:33.240 --> 00:27:47.220 Joe Hart: You know, the, the Stephen holgate who's, you know, your friend has done a great job of building trust so many of our we've got people who build great trust with the client and then the client, you know, really, you can grow together so

00:27:48.390 --> 00:27:57.090 Graham Dobbin: Yeah, and I suppose when when we build trust when things don't go quite right, because they're not always going to go right. That's where we get that that little bit of leeway.

00:27:57.450 --> 00:28:05.970 Graham Dobbin: That's where we get we get, as we say in personal relationships as well as business relationships with I'm just before we go to the break. We've got a couple minutes before the way

00:28:06.480 --> 00:28:13.110 Graham Dobbin: We do you know what's your gauge on whether that trust being built. Then, and it's being developed, how you want to

00:28:14.400 --> 00:28:14.970 Joe Hart: You know,

00:28:16.560 --> 00:28:30.870 Joe Hart: I guess I look at it at the end of the day it ultimately is is interpersonal and just talking to people and asking, you know, what will people come and have a hard conversation with you. Do they trust you to do that. Will they tell you something.

00:28:32.010 --> 00:28:42.270 Joe Hart: You know is there is there a lot of gossip and that type of thing. A lot of times, you know, we've got a franchise owners Association, and we've got a phenomenal relationship with with the

00:28:42.870 --> 00:28:48.480 Joe Hart: International deal card franchise Association. I asked, you know, I mean, so what are you hearing. What are people saying, you know, because

00:28:48.720 --> 00:28:55.050 Joe Hart: If I'm hearing that, that there's a breakdown and trusts like oh my gosh, we got to try to fix that will do what we can. But

00:28:55.860 --> 00:29:07.140 Joe Hart: And it might be a personal reach out if I hear that there's an issue with a particular person and you know let's let's talk about that because our hearts. I think are both in the right place. Sometimes it can be misunderstanding.

00:29:08.310 --> 00:29:14.640 Graham Dobbin: Right after the break, we'll, we'll kind of come more up to date. Just what is like leading an organization through

00:29:14.850 --> 00:29:26.700 Graham Dobbin: The contains that we've got but not just leading organization also helping other companies through you're listening to the main behind leadership. My name is Graham Dobbin we're speaking with Joe heart this evening, and we'll be back right after these

00:31:55.800 --> 00:32:05.820 Graham Dobbin: Welcome back, we're live from New York on the mind behind leadership, we're speaking with Joe heart this evening from added Dale Carnegie organization Joel and

00:32:06.510 --> 00:32:14.280 Graham Dobbin: For Gil different leading an organization, especially a global organization through through a pandemic through Corbett What villain.

00:32:15.900 --> 00:32:19.590 Joe Hart: It's been pretty incredible, to say the least.

00:32:21.390 --> 00:32:32.550 Joe Hart: You know, I've learned a lot about how people, you know, react in this kind of a crisis, both the bad and the good and I think mostly the good

00:32:33.960 --> 00:32:43.470 Joe Hart: You know, just Graham back up because we're a global organization, I started to see in January, what was happening in Asia with their Chinese teams and then

00:32:43.860 --> 00:32:54.180 Joe Hart: You know, in as a business at that time, the vast majority of our business was in person classes, you'd come to a physical classroom and take a class or you go to a company and so forth.

00:32:54.750 --> 00:33:03.780 Joe Hart: And you know, we did have a live online, you know, virtual training operation in North America for about 10 years but it was pretty much North America only so

00:33:04.620 --> 00:33:18.090 Joe Hart: When our classroom started to shut down in in first, China and then throughout Asia and then into Europe and the Middle East, ultimately here and Latin America.

00:33:19.440 --> 00:33:29.640 Joe Hart: You know, I saw the different stages that people went through because their businesses were basically shut down for a period of time, and they were scared, they were

00:33:30.870 --> 00:33:35.070 Joe Hart: You know, just in sometimes just just yeah panicked and what I knew that these are

00:33:35.370 --> 00:33:52.950 Joe Hart: You know, these are people who I mean, again, we teach how to stop worrying and start loving, but the reality is, all of us every single one of us human beings are subject to these these emotions. It's the go through the net the stages of grief. What, what I learned though was that

00:33:54.330 --> 00:34:01.410 Joe Hart: You know, if you do have core values. And I think about the core values that we teach and the principles we teach and Dale Carnegie about how to handle stress.

00:34:02.430 --> 00:34:13.860 Joe Hart: You can bounce back really quickly. And I think about the resilience that I've seen you know one of the court. We've done a lot of global research and resilience and one of the cornerstones of it.

00:34:14.490 --> 00:34:25.050 Joe Hart: Is the ability to have a positive mindset. And this is something Dale Carnegie focused on extensively, which is you can have two people in the exact same situation, the exact same

00:34:25.410 --> 00:34:36.090 Joe Hart: Series of facts. One is miserable and one is is happy one a successful ones not successful, so forth and so, you know, part of what I've learned about other people.

00:34:36.690 --> 00:34:50.010 Joe Hart: I'll tell you this. First, I guess it's just, I've really been inspired by by the courage and the resilience and the agility that our teams around the world have demonstrated and I'm really proud of how everyone is bouncing back

00:34:51.030 --> 00:34:53.460 Joe Hart: For myself, it's been interesting.

00:34:55.020 --> 00:35:03.180 Joe Hart: Because I remember at different points thinking to myself, I should be terrified right now, but I'm not

00:35:04.470 --> 00:35:09.600 Joe Hart: And I think the reason I wasn't in fact there's a quote that I saw that really resonated which was

00:35:10.950 --> 00:35:33.870 Joe Hart: It was. I'm not afraid. I was born to do this and having gone through 911 which was a traumatic time for the country and in my small business, my I started this this almost didn't make it. But we made it, you know, and 2008 2009 brutal, but we made it. And so I felt like coming into this

00:35:35.520 --> 00:35:44.850 Joe Hart: I was very I felt very, very strong. Thankfully, thank God for that. But I also say that what strengthened me and pulled me through his perspective.

00:35:45.360 --> 00:35:55.590 Joe Hart: Which is to say that this is going to end. We all know it's going to end. We've had too many tough experiences in our life. And then we look back and we think back about those. And I kept saying to myself,

00:35:56.580 --> 00:36:03.840 Joe Hart: You know you're leading a global organization. What do you want to see when you look back at this. Do you want to see cowardice. Do you want to see fear he wants to encourage

00:36:04.290 --> 00:36:12.690 Joe Hart: And part of the essence of Dale Carnegie's we can choose how we feel we can choose to be courageous. We can choose to stand up and and I'm and I again.

00:36:13.590 --> 00:36:22.980 Joe Hart: feeds on itself. I was so proud of our teams. So, you know, I learned more about myself and I learned about other people, and sorry for the long answer, Graham.

00:36:23.040 --> 00:36:29.280 Graham Dobbin: Oh, absolutely. I you mentioned earlier when we were talking about trust. It sounded like you were saying.

00:36:29.640 --> 00:36:40.110 Graham Dobbin: You know, there are certain measures that I've got in there. But there's a lot of gut instinct, you kind of know if someone's trusting you. So how much did gut instinct come into making decisions over the, over the last few months.

00:36:41.130 --> 00:36:55.470 Joe Hart: Gut instinct and that's another thing I've learned is, I've gotten much more confident in trusting my gut. In fact, you know, I was talking to one of my kids. The other day I happen to have six kids and

00:36:56.400 --> 00:37:08.670 Joe Hart: For from our teenagers and I was talking to one of them in and she said, you know, if you were to talk to yourself 20 years ago, what would you tell yourself and then what you know now. And one of the things I said was

00:37:09.060 --> 00:37:19.110 Joe Hart: I would have tried to all myself. Trust your gut, because I think sometimes you can overanalyze things. But what I found is that, especially as I've gotten older,

00:37:20.250 --> 00:37:29.520 Joe Hart: You know, the gut is that fat part of us that just very quickly assimilate facts and it spits something on it's all the summation of

00:37:29.970 --> 00:37:34.530 Joe Hart: Of past experiences and good decisions or bad decisions and all these other things and

00:37:35.040 --> 00:37:47.010 Joe Hart: You know, most of the time it's it's right. And in our team did the same thing. I think in a way to trust each other and and sometimes it was it was a gut kind of thing. We made a gut decision.

00:37:47.910 --> 00:37:59.310 Joe Hart: Early on, you know, people so many people thought, hey, if we can get to June, we're going to be fine. All of our classrooms are going to open up again in our gut told us in March.

00:38:00.420 --> 00:38:06.540 Joe Hart: You know, before the North America shut down our gut was this is not going to be short.

00:38:06.960 --> 00:38:22.140 Joe Hart: And all my communication to our network was you need to prepare it, you need to transition, you need to go to live online. You've got to certify your trainers, you've got open, we've got this methodology and I'm grateful that we did that because I mean ultimately

00:38:23.520 --> 00:38:33.840 Joe Hart: You know all the intuition led us to conclude that this is not going to be short and even now as we look ahead, I, I'm still not convinced that this is going to be linear in terms of, yeah.

00:38:33.900 --> 00:38:39.150 Graham Dobbin: Essentially, because just thinking about what you said that you saw this coming in January.

00:38:39.510 --> 00:38:51.900 Graham Dobbin: If. Have you felt like you've been running at the peak, all the way through, because I know regionally. There's been peaks and troughs, and people are district different areas geographically different stages. Do you feel like you've been at the peak, all the way through.

00:38:52.740 --> 00:38:55.920 Joe Hart: It peak in terms of activity or

00:38:56.910 --> 00:39:00.990 Graham Dobbin: Thinking that kind of the impact and the business because you've got, you know, that

00:39:01.470 --> 00:39:12.630 Graham Dobbin: We know when the lockdown came lights in New York, you're looking in the middle of March, but you were seeing this being impacting the business already for two months before. So when we look at it and kind of a micro

00:39:14.340 --> 00:39:22.500 Graham Dobbin: View as we do in say in New York that this has been happening for three or four months and then it's become we're coming back out of it for a couple of months.

00:39:22.860 --> 00:39:33.840 Graham Dobbin: But you've been seeing as globally, kind of a, a high, whether it's been in the Far East, or whether it's been in South America or so. Does it feel like you've been writing that all the way through.

00:39:34.590 --> 00:39:46.260 Joe Hart: Yes, it does. You know, we, it was interesting because what we saw was in China in North America. Here our teams in March, we're saying, oh, maybe this will be two months.

00:39:46.650 --> 00:39:52.980 Joe Hart: But we knew that our teams are starting to shut down in Asia. In late January, early February in March, they still weren't open

00:39:53.310 --> 00:39:58.170 Joe Hart: And the government's were saying you're not going to be open, you know, and in our summer China.

00:39:58.410 --> 00:40:10.830 Joe Hart: Classrooms didn't open until June, they were down for the real close more or less for months and they but they switch to online so that that was what was very important to the business but but no I it's we've been and it's been intense

00:40:12.030 --> 00:40:24.780 Joe Hart: I mean, that my executive team and I for a long time, or meeting, seven days a week, just trying is navigating through crisis. So it was very taxing and even still now i think you know

00:40:26.130 --> 00:40:38.100 Joe Hart: Our human condition seeks for lack of a better word, some normalcy some consistency, you know, and it we've got a little bit at the moment, if you will, but but not much.

00:40:38.910 --> 00:40:48.270 Graham Dobbin: We actually spoke about this on the show. I remember a few weeks ago when Google announced quite publicly that you know their offices. We're going to be closed until the middle of next year.

00:40:48.930 --> 00:40:57.090 Graham Dobbin: I thought right away. That's a good thing. All of a sudden, we've got some certainty because it felt like so many businesses were saying, well, maybe next month, and maybe next month.

00:40:57.360 --> 00:41:06.360 Graham Dobbin: That that was gone, and it gave some some certainty that we needed to deal with what was there no, um, you mentioned that you had. You've had some tough decisions to make.

00:41:07.980 --> 00:41:12.150 Graham Dobbin: What kind of tough decisions have have come your way that you didn't expect during this period.

00:41:13.200 --> 00:41:21.840 Joe Hart: Well, I don't know if there's there's tough decisions. I didn't expect. I'd say you know clearly THE TOUGHEST DECISIONS. We've had to make it better on some of our people.

00:41:22.830 --> 00:41:32.790 Joe Hart: You know when you have a dramatic revenue drop, you've got you've got to figure out, you know, what do you need to do to make sure you're responsibly.

00:41:33.210 --> 00:41:39.330 Joe Hart: running the business because, you know, frankly, the first responsibility of any leader in the business is to make sure that the business continues.

00:41:40.140 --> 00:41:53.010 Joe Hart: To exist and and so we had to make some decisions around, you know, for lows and those kinds of things that were just gut wrenching and I can't tell you that the amount of sleep that I've lost

00:41:53.520 --> 00:42:02.850 Joe Hart: Or had lost, particularly as we're going through that we've been able to bring some of our people back and liked it. My goal is to bring you know everyone back that we can so

00:42:03.840 --> 00:42:12.420 Joe Hart: Which is no thing I really appreciate the patience and the understandings that are people who had but that's. This has been the hardest part about the whole thing has just

00:42:12.840 --> 00:42:23.310 Joe Hart: It's, it's the stress about the people and also for our teams. I mean, to know, you know, our franchise teams have been been forced to make those kinds of decisions.

00:42:24.120 --> 00:42:35.400 Joe Hart: You know it when you see someone you care about struggling that's that's painful, but I, and that's why I'm just, I'm so thrilled and so grateful.

00:42:36.060 --> 00:42:47.700 Joe Hart: To see how our teams are recovering and making it through it and and are starting to grow and we've got a number that are really, really doing well and

00:42:48.120 --> 00:42:52.770 Joe Hart: I that I think that the opportunity for us as a business as painful as this has been

00:42:53.610 --> 00:43:03.660 Joe Hart: You know, we're going to come out far stronger as a business. We're more capable as a business. We're able to meet our customers where they are, whether it's in person live online blended

00:43:04.110 --> 00:43:13.740 Joe Hart: We're investing in our digital focus strategy and really moving very very quickly and to have a an even more comprehensive tool set so

00:43:15.000 --> 00:43:24.750 Joe Hart: You know, I mean, for every unprecedented crisis, there is unprecedented opportunity and I really think we're going to, you know, come out of this restaurant.

00:43:25.740 --> 00:43:37.290 Graham Dobbin: Again, we've got a couple of minutes to go till we have a break. Just before then. What, if anything, would you do, it's maybe an unfair question, but what would, what would you do differently if anything, just over the last few months.

00:43:39.540 --> 00:43:41.160 Joe Hart: You know, I think.

00:43:42.330 --> 00:43:46.260 Joe Hart: I'm not sure that there's anything I would do differently over the last few months.

00:43:47.970 --> 00:43:57.960 Joe Hart: I think is I look back I think about how to businesses prepare for crisis and a year ago.

00:43:58.650 --> 00:44:07.020 Joe Hart: We had done an economic analysis and we started to prepare for what we thought might be a very significant recession.

00:44:07.470 --> 00:44:18.930 Joe Hart: And I remember talking to a CFO about the models that we were running. You know what would happen if you're down. I mean, if we look at 2001 or 2008 you might be down 15% or something like that. You come back. But, you know,

00:44:19.650 --> 00:44:36.420 Joe Hart: I think, in hindsight, you should run to models that are a little more catastrophic, although this was pretty unprecedented but but thankfully we had prepared enough and we had, you know, saved and we're very prudent in terms of how we were running things so

00:44:37.290 --> 00:44:46.410 Graham Dobbin: back from the break. I'm just going to kind of get some ideas from what you felt kind of advice would you give to business owners and how to keep teams engaged and and also

00:44:47.820 --> 00:44:55.560 Graham Dobbin: Obviously, Dale Carnegie's famous for the How to Win Friends and Influence book. I'm really keen to know if if there's a book that your heart is ready to write

00:44:56.010 --> 00:45:12.630 Graham Dobbin: Or what what what's going to be your influence to adding to something like that. So my name is Graham Dobbin we're on the mind behind the leadership live on talk radio dot NYC. We're in New York. Tonight we're speaking with Joe Hart, we will be straight back after these

00:45:20.250 --> 00:45:20.460 In

00:47:36.150 --> 00:47:46.050 Graham Dobbin: Welcome back to the mind behind leadership, we're speaking with your heart this evening, Joe, where we've focused on Dale Carnegie's an organization about how that's come through and

00:47:46.530 --> 00:47:53.880 Graham Dobbin: What's been happening, what kind of influences Dale Carnegie had on other companies, helping them come through kind of what's happening at the moment.

00:47:54.750 --> 00:48:01.650 Joe Hart: And like I think I again I am proud of what we've been able to do to help other companies because I think so many companies, number one.

00:48:02.790 --> 00:48:12.750 Joe Hart: have dealt with their own internal stress and worry and how do they manage that people are scared and so forth. And a lot of our teams have done great jobs. We've got a program called

00:48:13.080 --> 00:48:17.760 Joe Hart: Effective communication and human relations chorus, which is essentially an online.

00:48:18.510 --> 00:48:25.740 Joe Hart: Iteration of our Dale Carnegie course that's been hugely popular, but a lot of that's been about equipping people for dealing with these times.

00:48:26.100 --> 00:48:35.040 Joe Hart: And another thing is that, you know, we have programs on how to how to sell in a virtual world, how to lead teams in a virtual world, how to

00:48:35.280 --> 00:48:47.940 Joe Hart: You know, build culture in a virtual all these different things. I mean, so those are programs that we've developed many of them over 10 years and they're very, very strong and very effective transformational courses that will help companies navigate

00:48:49.020 --> 00:48:55.590 Joe Hart: these difficult times. How does, how do you equip your team to be successful in a online world.

00:48:56.160 --> 00:49:03.510 Graham Dobbin: Is there anything that you would kind of any quick tips that you would give business owners, where the maybe need to focus

00:49:04.140 --> 00:49:14.160 Graham Dobbin: I mean, one of the things, again, we've discussed this several times on this show is the teams that have left the offices. See, in March or not. The teams have got know it may be the same personnel, but

00:49:14.880 --> 00:49:26.970 Graham Dobbin: It's not the same. And it's unlikely to ever be the same again because of because of what's happened. So is there anything that you would give and business owners some advice for or were they were, they should put their energy

00:49:27.180 --> 00:49:36.360 Joe Hart: Yeah, I think one of the most important things is that business owners business leaders have to have an intentional strategy around their people. And what I mean is,

00:49:38.070 --> 00:49:45.960 Joe Hart: It starts with empathy and understanding that it's a different environment that people are working in, you know, we've talked a lot

00:49:46.590 --> 00:49:53.820 Joe Hart: About how you might have your kids are going to Virtual School. They've got those kinds of stresses, you've got fear of coke and all these different things but but

00:49:54.300 --> 00:49:58.830 Joe Hart: But how do you engage me we've encouraged our teams to

00:49:59.700 --> 00:50:05.850 Joe Hart: Often we've helped me to breakout sessions that are just about social and connecting people and trying to get some of that that kind of

00:50:06.150 --> 00:50:16.320 Joe Hart: Interpersonal collateral back but but those things don't happen unless you're intentional and really it starts with the leaders just is there was a plan to build teams.

00:50:17.070 --> 00:50:25.380 Joe Hart: When companies where people were together this that doesn't go away. You still have to work, maybe more, so have to work on your team building and

00:50:26.130 --> 00:50:35.640 Joe Hart: In helping people that you feel valued and appreciated. And again, that has to be an intentional strategy. It's just, it just doesn't happen by accident, particularly people are busy.

00:50:36.390 --> 00:50:49.920 Graham Dobbin: You're talking about developing other people. But let me jump back in there. I know you went quietly around the process of becoming a trainer last year so certified Dale Carnegie true to yourself. Why is that important to you.

00:50:50.970 --> 00:50:57.090 Joe Hart: It was important for a few reasons. One is I think about Dale Carnegie a lot is his successor

00:50:57.570 --> 00:51:03.750 Joe Hart: And and there's nothing more important than then then the training that happened in the classroom and the trainers and

00:51:04.440 --> 00:51:10.020 Joe Hart: And frankly, the trainers are just so important to me, our trainers are methodology is

00:51:10.590 --> 00:51:21.240 Joe Hart: So unique and our people are so special. In terms of what they do. I'm look I have a lot of gratitude for what a trainer did in my life and I've taken our programs and these programs are phenomenal so

00:51:21.600 --> 00:51:31.560 Joe Hart: I wanted, and I want to understand it and I want us to in our products and you know really what is that makes makes what we do so special and it was it was powerful. It was humbling.

00:51:31.950 --> 00:51:47.730 Joe Hart: And it was hard to go through that process, my gas Graham. I mean you for what you and our trainers went through. It's like, oh my gosh, like I mentioned, you know, this is a two weekend four Day weekend kind of consecutive type of thing and

00:51:48.780 --> 00:51:50.850 Joe Hart: After the first weekend I was ready to

00:51:51.990 --> 00:51:58.920 Joe Hart: Like, I'm done. Yeah, this is, this is, this is horrible so hard, you know, but it has to be because we have a high standard.

00:52:01.200 --> 00:52:03.870 Graham Dobbin: So without the surprise just about how intense it was

00:52:04.830 --> 00:52:07.770 Joe Hart: I'd say that that was one surprise, it was luck.

00:52:08.400 --> 00:52:21.750 Joe Hart: You know, you can take the boy out of the lobby. You can take the lot of the boy, and what I mean is, I'm I am by nature, very prepared very, very prepared. So I worked very hard to prepare for what we call our DNA experience.

00:52:22.140 --> 00:52:31.470 Joe Hart: And I went in there. Fairly confident and I went out of their recognizing that I didn't know as much as I thought I knew. So, so that was, that was a surprise and

00:52:31.830 --> 00:52:42.810 Joe Hart: But you know what it was, again, it's, you have to raise the bar and and the our Carnegie master the person who took us through that, you know, really helped me and all of us raise the bar.

00:52:44.400 --> 00:52:56.280 Graham Dobbin: We mentioned earlier. I'm a book that I'm sure most people know how to win friends and influence people, you're the head of the organization that did not come from. And is it a book and Joe Hart.

00:52:58.410 --> 00:53:08.580 Joe Hart: So the How to Win Friends book is one of the best books ever written and and certainly is one of the, you know,

00:53:09.060 --> 00:53:19.920 Joe Hart: couple books best books I've ever read attended, you know, Ted, a huge impact on me. So, so you know it's it's a little humbling to think about writing a book in the shadow of that book.

00:53:21.270 --> 00:53:31.620 Joe Hart: You know, having said that, you know, I mean, I, I've learned a lot on my journey and and I do feel that I've got some valuable things to share

00:53:32.190 --> 00:53:43.590 Joe Hart: So yeah, at some point, maybe I can see doing the book, I will tell you, I don't have any any manuscripts sitting at my desk here, anything like that but it's something that I would I would aspire to do

00:53:44.670 --> 00:53:48.630 Graham Dobbin: We had Dr. Tony Alessandra on last week and he's written 13 books.

00:53:49.170 --> 00:53:51.780 Graham Dobbin: On ages and it's just still going with it and

00:53:52.170 --> 00:54:01.860 Graham Dobbin: It seems to have a method and he's so he's made it really easy. So, apart from Dale Carnegie, which is probably the obvious, who do you look up to him and business.

00:54:02.400 --> 00:54:03.390 Joe Hart: Who do I look up to.

00:54:03.420 --> 00:54:13.680 Joe Hart: Yeah. Yeah, I would say that the person I look up to more than anyone elses Li, like I mentioned him earlier and you have gotten to know him personally and he's been really a

00:54:14.310 --> 00:54:18.300 Joe Hart: mentor to me I he had developed a system for running

00:54:19.260 --> 00:54:27.810 Joe Hart: Bowling for running forward. He is essentially given me that system to use for Dale Carnegie. It's called the working together management system. In fact,

00:54:28.110 --> 00:54:36.480 Joe Hart: You know, I had breakfast with him in February and Arizona. When I was on vacation and he came in and he gave me this book and

00:54:36.990 --> 00:54:49.470 Joe Hart: And then I said, What's this Allen and he said this is this is everything I know right here is it's it's as long as Thomas. And I'm like, so it's it's he is

00:54:50.310 --> 00:54:58.710 Joe Hart: He's a humble leader. He's an effective leader. He's a transparent leader. He's all about bringing people together about putting people first.

00:54:59.670 --> 00:55:16.590 Joe Hart: He's a Dale Carnegie person in the sense that the How to Win Friends book had a huge impact on his thinking he attributes. A lot of his success to to Dale Carnegie. And I think if I could be even remotely like him. I would be successful, but

00:55:16.890 --> 00:55:29.670 Graham Dobbin: Which I've got a couple of minutes, the land that I showed us has flown by I suppose what whatever last questions would be, what do you see is one of the most underrated leadership skills or traits or qualities, you've mentioned things like being humble and transform them.

00:55:30.390 --> 00:55:31.410 Joe Hart: Yeah, I would say.

00:55:33.000 --> 00:55:47.610 Joe Hart: I would say that that's, you know, and again, I'll go back to Alan and we've talked. We've talked about leadership and I'd asked him one point about what he sees as the keys to leadership and he talked about humility loving service. And I think a lot of times people do talk about service.

00:55:48.630 --> 00:55:53.970 Joe Hart: You know, being a servant leader is a term that's out there, and I certainly subscribe to that.

00:55:55.020 --> 00:56:01.110 Joe Hart: You know, but when you do talk about humility. I think a lot of our Dale Carnegie principles are founded on the idea of humility.

00:56:01.710 --> 00:56:15.480 Joe Hart: That you Graham, you know, I want to appreciate you. I want to listen to you. I want to, you know, Dale Carnegie always embraced Ralph Waldo Emerson quote that every person I meet is my superior in some way in that I learned from him or her right so so

00:56:16.110 --> 00:56:30.660 Joe Hart: The leader has an incredible amount to learn from the people that he or she leads and and certainly I feel very strongly that an honor to be able to work with and learn from the people in Dale Carnegie

00:56:31.860 --> 00:56:35.520 Graham Dobbin: I'm Joe hot, it's been an absolute pleasure.

00:56:36.750 --> 00:56:40.830 Graham Dobbin: It sounds like it's been a real roller coaster over, over the last few months, but certainly

00:56:41.580 --> 00:56:50.700 Graham Dobbin: You've given us some insights and some ideas on what's not just happened with the new organization, but also how other business leaders can move things forward.

00:56:51.030 --> 00:57:03.090 Graham Dobbin: And can kind of deal with the uncertainty that comes within the change that comes with in business at any point in time. So Joe, thanks for your time this evening, and we'd love to have you on again at some point.

00:57:03.780 --> 00:57:11.700 Graham Dobbin: Hopefully in different circumstances when we're talking about how do we deal with change and living economies, so your heart. Thank you for your time this evening.

00:57:12.060 --> 00:57:14.040 Joe Hart: Thank you, Graham. Great to see you. Great to be with you.

00:57:14.340 --> 00:57:23.310 Graham Dobbin: I'm so join us again next Thursday for the money behind leadership. If you've enjoyed the show, please share it with with with your contacts all around.

00:57:24.360 --> 00:57:27.450 Graham Dobbin: We'll be back next week at seven o'clock. Good night.

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